Fair compensation? Carnival offers $500

[Kevnzworld]

The recent Carnival Triumph engine failure makes the subject of cruise ship maintenance relevant. Last year an Azamara cruise ship had a similar mishap.

The Carnival ship has been without power and most toilet function for four days. Besides the obvious fare refund, Carnival is offering the passengers $500.

Given that most of the passengers missed at least four days of work, and have suffered to some degree for four days , this hardly seems adequate.

Should there be a cruise ship passenger bill of rights? The airline legislation certainly diminished the frequency of airlines keeping loaded planes on the tarmac for hours...http://www.scribd.com/doc/116260087/Air-Passenger-Bill-of-Rights-DOTC-DTI-JAO-No-1-2012

What is fair?

[Orator]

Kevin:

I believe that there should be a "Passengers Bill of Rights". The cruise contracts were written by the lines to protect them not their passengers. It would be interesting to read what posters might want to have included in such a document. I guess all the lawyers,who I'm certain will be lined up at the pier, and the Courts will determine "fair compensation".

[CrasyLynne]

Why is this on the Celebrity forum?

[ilovetexas]

They are getting a bit more than that. It's $500 plus:

 

"As previously announced, all 3,143 guests on board will receive a full refund of the cruise along with transportation expenses and reimbursement of all shipboard purchases during the voyage, with the exception of gift shop, art purchases and casino charges. All passengers will also receive a future cruise credit equal to the amount paid for this voyage."

 

So, this cruise paid for, another one paid for, most on-board expenses, all non-reimbursed travel expenses, plus the $500. That said, is it enough? I don't know. I will say that this can't really be compared to sitting on a tarmac for hours. That's just poor planning by airlines and airports. This may be something far more egregious, nor not. Either a systemic lack of policies and procedures to keep vessels safe from fire or just an unfortunate accident. I don't think companies should be punished for accidents.

 

If it's more than that, well that's another story. But we already have laws on the books we can take advantage of in cases of negligence and I'm not in favor of adding more that aren't necessary. Just my opinion.

[Orator]

Why is this on the Celebrity forum?

 

I think that the OP is making a valuable contribution by asking about a Passenger Bill of Rights.The subject is relevant to all of us who cruise regardless of the carrier. What might happen in the Carnival case may impact future responses on all lines, including Celebrity.

[Roxymax]

The recent Carnival Triumph engine failure makes the subject of cruise ship maintenance relevant. Last year an Azamara cruise ship had a similar mishap.

The Carnival ship has been without power and most toilet function for four days. Besides the obvious fare refund, Carnival is offering the passengers $500.

Given that most of the passengers missed at least four days of work, and have suffered to some degree for four days , this hardly seems adequate.

Should there be a cruise ship passenger bill of rights? The airline legislation certainly diminished the frequency of airlines keeping loaded planes on the tarmac for hours...http://www.scribd.com/doc/116260087/Air-Passenger-Bill-of-Rights-DOTC-DTI-JAO-No-1-2012

What is fair?

 

 

Interesting thread starter....I may be off base with my response, but transparently a cruise line is for vacationing while airlines are for trasport of the public. With crusing as a vacation experience, we should not need a bill of rights. We can use our disposbale spending on any type of vacation we want. I don't care to change Carinval. Carinval has to change itself. Why should the whole cruise industry have to be so regulated because of one line with recurring problems?

 

Now to address the treatment of the those unfortunate passengers: I would look at that as a contract issue, and I am sure that if a passenger is not satisfied with the compensation being offered that they do have legal means to attempt to get restitution.

 

Further, the CDC can have some influence if sanitation has become a probelm.

 

The cruiselines are also members of a Cruise Industry Association. Therefore, there are already avenues in place to address your BILL OF RIGHTS idea: The link for the Cruise Line International Association (CLIA) is: http://www.cruising.org/regulatory/industry-welcome

[TKS]

I find it interesting that the majority of the "debacles" in cruising the last few years, including the Costa Concordia and the ship stranded off Mexico a couple years ago have all belonged to Carnival's holding company.

 

Not sure I'd want another free cruise from them as compensation.

 

At the very least the company should be having some serious safety audits by the authorities in the various countries Carnival serves as well as meaningful internal audits. I realize Carnival is the largest cruise company in the world, so the number of accidents and incidents is likely to be higher without having a higher percentage of problems than smaller lines, and because most of Carnival's ships are huge, those incidents get a lot of press. However, Canival's problems the last few years should be a warning to all cruise lines that safety, crew training and accident planning are vital.

 

I've read a lot on threads of several lines, X included, about the deteriorating quality of the cruise experience (food, service, maintenance of ships, etc.) over the last few years. If the cruise lines deteriorate to the level of the airlines (:eek:) a passenger's bill of rights may not be necessary. Passengers will simply vote with their dollars - and companies that are spending up to a billion dollars on new builds will find their ships unfilled and unprofitable if they do not heed passengers concerns. It's hard to travel without ever flying today, but cruising is a choice that can be changed easily if passenger expectations are not met.

[cherylroslyn]

The recent Carnival Triumph engine failure makes the subject of cruise ship maintenance relevant. Last year an Azamara cruise ship had a similar mishap.

The Carnival ship has been without power and most toilet function for four days. Besides the obvious fare refund, Carnival is offering the passengers $500.

Given that most of the passengers missed at least four days of work, and have suffered to some degree for four days , this hardly seems adequate.

Should there be a cruise ship passenger bill of rights? The airline legislation certainly diminished the frequency of airlines keeping loaded planes on the tarmac for hours...http://www.scribd.com/doc/116260087/Air-Passenger-Bill-of-Rights-DOTC-DTI-JAO-No-1-2012

What is fair?

Hey Kevin.....

 

Good post, I think it is relavant to any cruiser on any line. When I read the article this morining I thought they just upped their offer by an additional $500.00.

 

I really don't think there is any amount of money that could make it "worth it" to go through those horrible conditions, but obviously this wasn't a choice made by Carnival or the passengers.

 

I am praying for all of them.

 

With that said, I believe a full refund, a full future cruise credit equal to that paid for this cruise, hotel accomodations, full refund of charges made on ship, $500.00 or $1000.00 and transportation expenses, is a generous offer and that is about as good as you are going to get in these circumstances. Remember the surviving Concordia passengers were only offered about $14,000.00.

[Kevnzworld]

I'm not addressing a legal liability or negligence question, ie Costa.

But if there was a passenger bill of rights, a contract not written by the cruise company, maybe cruise lines would place a greater emphasis on maintenance and contingency planning.

I was on a Regent cruise in the Mediterranean a few years back when a power failure occurred. We were adrift for 24 hours before the ship was repaired.

I think that a basic cost per day per passenger might change the way these " mishaps " are prepared for and handled.

[shoelover536]

I've read reports that the same ship had several previous instances of mechanical trouble. But carnival kept sending it out anyway. Not acceptable.

[Orator]

I'm not addressing a legal liability or negligence question, ie Costa.

But if there was a passenger bill of rights, a contract not written by the cruise company, maybe cruise lines would place a greater emphasis on maintenance and contingency planning.

I was on a Regent cruise in the Mediterranean a few years back when a power failure occurred. We were adrift for 24 hours before the ship was repaired.

I think that a basic cost per day per passenger might change the way these " mishaps " are prepared for and handled.

 

We live in a bottom line driven economy. If paying damages would cost less than fixing the problem you can bet that the problem wouldn't be fixed.

[fishycomics]

;)maybe there was no room over in the carnival section. Lol:eek:

 

more to the story then meets the eye

[A Sixth?]

Hey Kevin, glad our cruise toilets worked BBC#1 eh? :D:D

[Karynanne]

I wonder if there will be future litigation involving those passengers that have or will incur health issues due to the conditions onboard the Carnival ship?

[tunaman2011]

Kevin:

I believe that there should be a "Passengers Bill of Rights". The cruise contracts were written by the lines to protect them not their passengers. It would be interesting to read what posters might want to have included in such a document. I guess all the lawyers,who I'm certain will be lined up at the pier, and the Courts will determine "fair compensation".

 

Greetings

 

I am sure there will be lots of lawyers lining up but in this case the road is very bumpy for them. The cruisers are on a foreign flagged vessel and the incident occurred in international waters. They may find great difficulty getting any US based count to take jurisdiction. Even if a count can be convinced, the cases will be under maritime law.

 

Cruise ship companies have many things stacked in their favor is situations such as this.

 

Good Sailing

Tom

[Orator]

Greetings

 

I am sure there will be lots of lawyers lining up but in this case the road is very bumpy for them. The cruisers are on a foreign flagged vessel and the incident occurred in international waters. They may find great difficulty getting any US based count to take jurisdiction. Even if a count can be convinced, the cases will be under maritime law.

 

Cruise ship companies have many things stacked in their favor is situations such as this.

 

Good Sailing

Tom

 

Hi Tom:

I believe you're spot on. Cruise lines put legal fences all around their operations.

[teajak]

Why is this on the Celebrity forum?

Because it could possibly affect any of us cruising no matter what cruise line.

[Orator]

CNN will be interviewing an attorney who specializes in these types of cases. We be on right after the break.

 

Hickey (attorney) says governed by Martitime Law, but could sue for "Mental Anguish". Said they could sue in Miami, FL. He indicated the legal requirements for anguish and asserts that this case meets the threshold (my words).

[Durkman]

I've read a lot on threads of several lines, X included, about the deteriorating quality of the cruise experience (food, service, maintenance of ships, etc.) over the last few years. If the cruise lines deteriorate to the level of the airlines (:eek:) a passenger's bill of rights may not be necessary. Passengers will simply vote with their dollars - and companies that are spending up to a billion dollars on new builds will find their ships unfilled and unprofitable if they do not heed passengers concerns. It's hard to travel without ever flying today, but cruising is a choice that can be changed easily if passenger expectations are not met.

This is a good point, and also consider that when costs/corners are being cut on passenger services you can bet costs are being cut elsewhere as well--services that the passengers cannot perceive are probably the first to be cut.

 

And while most of the notable accidents the last few years have been on Carnival and its entities, let's not fool ourselves into thinking that this exact same thing couldn't happen on any other ship/line, including X, and that those cruise lines could/would respond any differently than Carnival did. Just like any activity, there is a risk of something tragic happening, thankfully that risk is low no matter which cruise line you go on.

[Alg63]

First off, i am pleased i was not on that cruise. I am sure it is awful. I feel sympathy for all those on board.

 

Someone quoted On USA Today stated "I only paid $350 for this cruise, how is $500 going to get me another one". I think this says a lot, whichever way you interpret it.

IF Carnival is found guilty of negligence, or of failing to respond in a timely matter, then i can understand people screaming for compensation. However at this time there is no proof of that .. Yet.

 

The title of this thread is misleading and exactly how rumors get started. At no point was there only an offer of $500. Right now it is that, plus all prepaid expenses, plus a refund, plus a free future cruise (ok they may not want it but it is there). Plus transportation home.

 

I cannot understand why a tug with bilge pump and generator (for the bilge pump.. not the whole ship) was not hooked up. Then again i am not an engineer. I cannot understand why some people are being reported to have taken 8 sandwiches leaving none for others. What happened to preparing individual trays, one per person. Surely meetings were held and these things discussed and explained.

 

However ... All this aside. This is another reason people should take insurance. Because S*** happens. excuse the pun.

 

I am sure attorneys have already drafted a class action lawsuit and will be waiting at the pier.

[Kevnzworld]

The title of this thread is misleading and exactly how rumors get started. At no point was there only an offer of $500. Right now it is that, plus all prepaid expenses, plus a refund, plus a free future cruise (ok they may not want it but it is there). Plus transportation home.

.

 

I included the cruise refund in my post. The compensation for the five days at sea with no electricity and toilets is $500 though.

If the costs to the cruise line for these types of mishaps was higher, there would be more advance planning, equipment/ generator redundancy, logistical support.

Carnival and its subsideraries have maybe a dozen ships in the Caribbean during the season.

It was cheaper to tow these miserable people for five days at one mile an hour to Mobile Al and pay them $500.

A cruise ship passenger bill of rights would address this.

[Cruising89143]

The biggest issue that I have with this whole situation is that this ship had known propulsion issues leading up to the fire. Did that have anything to do with what happened? Don't know but it causes one to think that maybe Carnival should have pulled the ship from service until they could fully check it out. I also agree that cruisers need consumer protection from the cruise lines. Who knows what will happen due to the amount of publicity that this incident has had over the last few days.

[caladezi]

A bill of rights would be a great idea but do you realize who would pay for that? The cost of something like that would have to be passed on to the customer and therefore increase prices. Most of the Carnival customers are in their camp because they are a low end line. If laws were put in place where a line had to insure against everything, who do you think would pay?

[midwestchick]

First of all, I was not aware of Azamara having a ship fire...when did that happen? :eek: I'm not sure I would have booked our last cruise had I known that.

The $500. and a free cruise is a joke. :rolleyes: I wonder how many of those people will ever step foot on another Carnival ship. I've read far too many negative things about Carnival.....I would never book a cruise with them.

I feel so badly for all the passengers and the crew...it's really a horrible thing. It will be interesting to see how all of this unfolds in the coming days. They are due back in port around midnight and now they have to worry about their journey home. I'm sitting here shaking my head...I cannot even begin to imagine what they went through.

[flames9]

Hate to say it..ships break down, 10 years in the Navy...there is a lot of stuff that takes place down below you probably don't want to know about. These ships sail and sail. I feel bad for these people, but there are people in this world that would love to be in their position.