Leaving a cruise early

[fragilek]

just a small point on this.

 

A company cannot change it's contract with you after you have signed the contract. Any new/change can only be applied to new contracts.

 

Thus the new change can only be applied to passengers booked after the small print was changed. I would challenge a company who tried to retrospectivly apply that change to previous bookings- go higher up the food chain and say that your passing the issue to your lawyer as the situations is causing you so much stress (stress & lawyer =compensation claims- they know that and if it is allowed by law they uill probably back down).

[rickechambers1@aol.com]

just a small point on this.

 

A company cannot change it's contract with you after you have signed the contract. Any new/change can only be applied to new contracts.

 

Thus the new change can only be applied to passengers booked after the small print was changed. I would challenge a company who tried to retrospectivly apply that change to previous bookings- go higher up the food chain and say that your passing the issue to your lawyer as the situations is causing you so much stress (stress & lawyer =compensation claims- they know that and if it is allowed by law they uill probably back down).

 

Ridiculous...shameful advice. Sounds like issue is solved. Fyi in Aruba they have US customs...when you enter the country at the airport you fill out an Aruba entry form that is matched up when you leave...have spent many months vacationing there over a dozen times and find customs there to be very thorough.

[fragilek]

Ridiculous...shameful advice. Sounds like issue is solved. Fyi in Aruba they have US customs...when you enter the country at the airport you fill out an Aruba entry form that is matched up when you leave...have spent many months vacationing there over a dozen times and find customs there to be very thorough.

 

What you are saying has no link to the fact that the cruise contract they signed up for has changed after they bought their cruise. This is not allowed by law!!! If they had already looked into leaving and it was allowed when they booked no company can change the booking conditions after you book. If they could then they would be free to do what they want.

 

Shameful how exactly - I would not like to be in the position of buying things and then conditions linked to the purchase being changed. If those changes meant I was out of pocket then yes I would do something about it.

[jaxfl]

You know it is funny that the ship can leave you at a port because you did not get back in time but you as a free USA citizen cannot on you own free will get off the ship and go back to the USA even with your passport in hand....crazy.

[fragilek]

This new rule also seems to be in direct conflict with their new 100% guarantee- either leaving is or isn't possible- can't be both

[Big_G]

This new rule also seems to be in direct conflict with their new 100% guarantee- either leaving is or isn't possible- can't be both

 

You beat me to it.

 

Passenger: "I hate my cruise and want to take advantage of your new guarantee and leave earlier."

Carnival: "That's fine sir but you can't. Read your contract. Thanks for choosing Carnival. Next!"

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[zzrobot]

You are missing the point, with the 100% guarantee, Carnival would officially release you paper work wise to customs, meaning they would allow you to leave, by just leaving the ship at Aruba, they would not give the release. I can't chance that, without a definitive letter in hand showing permission.

[EnTnSA]

How exactly are they going to stop you? They dont own you, you are paying them to take you on a cruise, you should be able to leave whenever you feel like it.

 

That is like paying for dinner at a restaurant and they wont let you leave until you eat everything on your plate.

 

I fail to see what they could do about it if you grabbed your things and left the ship.

[fragilek]

You are missing the point, with the 100% guarantee, Carnival would officially release you paper work wise to customs, meaning they would allow you to leave, by just leaving the ship at Aruba, they would not give the release. I can't chance that, without a definitive letter in hand showing permission.

 

I am not suggesting just leave that would be crazy, I said get legal advice if carnival will not discuss/help !!!- what we were trying to say -is go back and discuss with carnival again as they CANNOT change terms and conditions after you book- that is the law. If they have changed their working practice and introduced a new contract, you are entitled to any out of pocket expenses that their change has created, or they must make an exception for you (you would get that in writing of course).

 

Leaving the ship CAN be done but does not suit them as it creates work, fine for future bookings but must not be applied retrospectively without consultation and recompense where required.

Edited September 18, 2013 by fragilek

[Tapi]

Carnival phone rep today told me they change the rule May 2013 forbidding leaving....

 

You need to call back and ask to talk to someone higher than the phone rep. Have Carnival's contract and the Passenger Vessel Services Act handy for reference. You are NOT violating any federal laws by disembarking in Curaçao and it doesn't seem like you're violating any rules in Carnival's contract either. The referenced $300 fine is for PVSA violations and you are not, even remotely, doing so. I think that the Carnival phone rep was severely confused.

Edited September 18, 2013 by Tapi

[cruiseonthebrain]

It would be a shame if she got off the ship with a carryon and passport and missed boarding time back on the ship. ;) I guess she would just have to find a way to the airport and have her mother pack up the stuff she left behind.

 

 

This is exactly what I was thinking!

[B&EMAC]

It really isnt a Carnival policy. It has to do with the Jones Act. We did it. We told them when we were getting on the ship and that we would be departing one day early. We had to attend a wedding. Three days into the cruise, they called us and told us if we got off we could be fined $400 each.

 

We told them that we would not have boarded had we known that this was going to be an issue. We were very clear at check in that we were leaving early and the person serving us even checked with his supervisor.

 

When we got off, we had to report to Customs and Homeland Security. We got off in Martha's Vineyard. We explained our situation. They were very kind and helpful. We followed their specific instructions and they allowed us to leave and catch our plane.

 

What they also told us is that the Cruise Lines do it all the time and are fined each and every time they do it. $1500.

 

We did receive a fine of $700 each from Homeland Security. We had our lawyer write a letter in response to this fine. (the officers in Martha's Vineyard indicated that this would happen and that once we explained our situation, the fine would probably be dropped and they would consider this to be a warning. We did receive a letter clearing us and the fine removed.

 

The exceptions to this law are the issue of health and illness. I have experienced this as well when my mother was taken off a ship with a mild heart attack. This is also complicated but permissible under the Act and I am sure our departure involved more than 100 crew to make it happen. Not as simple as one would think.

 

So you will have to weigh your options.

[zzrobot]

Yes, you are correct about the Jones Act, but my example does not pertain to the Jones Act. That Act again, only has to do with 2 US ports, my problem was one US port, Miami and one foreign port, Aruba.

[thinfool]

It really isnt a Carnival policy. It has to do with the Jones Act. We did it. We told them when we were getting on the ship and that we would be departing one day early. We had to attend a wedding. Three days into the cruise, they called us and told us if we got off we could be fined $400 each.

 

We told them that we would not have boarded had we known that this was going to be an issue. We were very clear at check in that we were leaving early and the person serving us even checked with his supervisor.

 

When we got off, we had to report to Customs and Homeland Security. We got off in Martha's Vineyard. We explained our situation. They were very kind and helpful. We followed their specific instructions and they allowed us to leave and catch our plane.

 

What they also told us is that the Cruise Lines do it all the time and are fined each and every time they do it. $1500.

 

We did receive a fine of $700 each from Homeland Security. We had our lawyer write a letter in response to this fine. (the officers in Martha's Vineyard indicated that this would happen and that once we explained our situation, the fine would probably be dropped and they would consider this to be a warning. We did receive a letter clearing us and the fine removed.

 

The exceptions to this law are the issue of health and illness. I have experienced this as well when my mother was taken off a ship with a mild heart attack. This is also complicated but permissible under the Act and I am sure our departure involved more than 100 crew to make it happen. Not as simple as one would think.

 

So you will have to weigh your options.

 

Your account is interesting but the OP has a scenario that has nothing to do with the PVSA or the Jones Act.

[snownyet]

The jones act or customs isnt going to leave a person stranded on an island after they "missed the ship" wink wink.

[winddawn]

[quote name='EnTnSA']How exactly are they going to stop you? They dont own you, you are paying them to take you on a cruise, you should be able to leave whenever you feel like it.

That is like paying for dinner at a restaurant and they wont let you leave until you eat everything on your plate.

I fail to see what they could do about it if you grabbed your things and left the ship.[/QUOTE]
It isn't necessarily that they physically stop you, but they can charge you a fee if you do leave. And that is because they can be charged a fee by the government due to cabotage laws, and then Carnival in turn charges the passenger to recoup the money. Here is one example of that on Carnival's website:

[url]https://www.goccl.com/~/media/Files/Irman/bookccl/booking_procedure/TheJonesAct_ThePassengerServicesAct.htm[/url]

Additionally, the country that you debark in may have laws about how you may move about. For example, Mexico can require a Mexican Tourist Card if you plan to leave the ship. Since they require that in advance of your travel, you could be in violation of the law if you just up and walk away from your cruise in Mexico. If you were to experience some type of unforeseen event while on your cruise, like becoming suddenly ill, Carnival works with the local authorities to accommodate you. But that is only for emergent situations and doesn't cover you simply walking away from the cruise.

So if the ship gets ready to leave the port at the scheduled time, and you haven't returned to the ship, Carnival will notify the local authorities that you didn't return. So the situation can be very different than simply walking out of a restaurant. There are immigration and customs laws to consider.

[mz Miami]

U can leave with ur luggage once u are back on by boarding time I did that in the Bahamas last month but u have to get permission from the ship itself to clear custom ..all u have to do is get off the ship with one luggage n don't go back that's all ..but the ship will be paging u ha ha just play crazy u don't know where she is lol

[Biffer1997]

[quote name='jaxfl']You know it is funny that the ship can leave you at a port because you did not get back in time but you as a free USA citizen cannot on you own free will get off the ship and go back to the USA even with your passport in hand....crazy.[/QUOTE]

What happens if you miss the ship? Do they charge the fee then? Would they charge it if it was foreign port or just a US port?

For instance, on my upcoming Hawaii cruise, if I were to miss the ship at the last port...(mind you I have booked Carnival's excursion to ensure this doesn't happen!) would my account be charged the Jones Act fee since I left from Long Beach to Hawaii? How do people who miss the ship get their things back?

What happens if I miss ship at one island and have to fly to meet the ship? Is there a fee for that? Edited March 7, 2014 by Biffer1997

[Shmoo here]

[quote name='Biffer1997']What happens if you miss the ship? Do they charge the fee then? Would they charge it if it was foreign port or just a US port?

For instance, on my upcoming Hawaii cruise, if I were to miss the ship at the last port...(mind you I have booked Carnival's excursion to ensure this doesn't happen!) would my account be charged the Jones Act fee since I left from Long Beach to Hawaii? How do people who miss the ship get their things back?[/QUOTE]

If the ship is foreign flagged (Carnival is), and transports a passenger from one US city to a [U]different[/U] US city, without a distant foreign port stop, there is a fine assessed (usually $300 per person) to the ship. They pass that fine on to the passenger by way of their onboard account.

BTW, a distant foreign port is any port that is NOT in North America, North America, Central America, the Bermuda Islands, or the West Indies (including the Bahama Islands, but not including the Leeward Islands of the Netherlands Antilles, i.e., Aruba, Bonaire, and Curacao). [I]19 CFR § 4.80a(a)(2).[/I]

Oh, and it's the Passenger Vessel Service Act (PVSA). Not the Jones Act. They both basically say the same thing, but the PVSA relates to passengers, the Jones Act applies to cargo.

[Biffer1997]

[quote name='Shmoo here']If the ship is foreign flagged (Carnival is), and transports a passenger from one US city to a [U]different[/U] US city, without a distant foreign port stop, there is a fine assessed (usually $300 per person) to the ship. They pass that fine on to the passenger by way of their onboard account.

BTW, a distant foreign port is any port that is NOT in North America, North America, Central America, the Bermuda Islands, or the West Indies (including the Bahama Islands, but not including the Leeward Islands of the Netherlands Antilles, i.e., Aruba, Bonaire, and Curacao). [I]19 CFR § 4.80a(a)(2).[/I]

Oh, and it's the Passenger Vessel Service Act (PVSA). Not the Jones Act. They both basically say the same thing, but the PVSA relates to passengers, the Jones Act applies to cargo.[/QUOTE]

If ports in North America are not considered "foreign", how is the ship able to go from Long Beach to Vancouver via Hawaii? By definition, there will be no foreign port visited.

[Shmoo here]

[quote name='Biffer1997']If ports in North America are not considered "foreign", how is the ship able to go from Long Beach to Vancouver via Hawaii? By definition, there will be no foreign port visited.[/QUOTE]

Ports in North America are not considered DISTANT foreign ports. They are considered NEAR foreign ports.

For a foreign-flagged ship to transport passengers from one US port to a DIFFERENT US port, they must call at a distant foreign port. The closest distant foreign port along this cruise would be Fanning Island (about a 3 day trip south west of Hawaii).

Because the cruise is from Long Beach (US port) to Vancouver (foreign port). It's not one US port to another US port. For a cruise that begins and/or ends in a US port/foreign port combination, any foreign port works, including the disembarkation port.

[Biffer1997]

Thanks Shamoo! I appreciate you answering my questions. :-)

[Shmoo here]

[quote name='Biffer1997']Thanks Shamoo! I appreciate you answering my questions. :-)[/QUOTE]

You're welcome.
















[FONT="Comic Sans MS"][COLOR="RoyalBlue"][SIZE="2"]Shmoo :o[/SIZE][/COLOR][/FONT] Edited March 7, 2014 by Shmoo here

[Family Travel Story]

[quote name='fragilek']I am not suggesting just leave that would be crazy, I said get legal advice if carnival will not discuss/help !!!- what we were trying to say -is go back and discuss with carnival again as they CANNOT change terms and conditions after you book- that is the law. If they have changed their working practice and introduced a new contract, you are entitled to any out of pocket expenses that their change has created, or they must make an exception for you (you would get that in writing of course).

Leaving the ship CAN be done but does not suit them as it creates work, fine for future bookings but must not be applied retrospectively without consultation and recompense where required.[/QUOTE]

As a matter of contact law, if carnival makes a promise or representation in their initial contract and you rely to your detriment upon said representation, and you suck for damages as a result of your detrimental reliance, then you may have a valid claim under the legal theory of promissory estoppel.

Sent from my SGH-T989 using Forums mobile app

[awhcruiser]

[B]Was the cruise booked before or after she found out about having to go back to work? Personally I would not want to book a cruise that I could not finish.[/B]
[quote name='zzrobot']Spoke again with Carvival, they do not allow it. The problem if you just leave at the port, this one would be Aruba, and fly home is that customs will give you problems. You came by a ship, that ship controls you custom wise, and they will not release you and communicate that to Aruba customs. Big headaches.
Interesting , I called Royal, and they still do allow it.
My daughter will stay for the whole cruise. Delta charged 200.00 to change a one way ticket, highway robbers........[/QUOTE]