Smoking Policy (More...)

[cruisin'girl]

Two years ago I ended up in the medical center twice for Albuterol treatments because of the excessive smoking and poor ventilation on the Veendam. The last two days of our trip were compromised and I was on meds for two additional weeks.. I wrote an extensive letter to HAL but I did not receive any response. I also incurred medical expenses onboard and at home. The medical center nurse and physician empathized but said they had no corporate input on the smoking decisions. They said certain cruises have a worse mix of smokers and this particular cruise was bad.

I did not sail again with HAL for two years but we did go back recently for an itinerary we wanted.

Since you cite "excessive smoking and poor ventilation" as contributing to your medical problems on board the Veendam you must have been spending a lot of time in the casino as it is the only indoor space where smoking is allowed. Your choice, of course, but being that it is not a secret that it is a designated smoking-allowed area and you were already having breathing problems it probably would have been smart to stay out of there. There are only a very few outdoor areas where smoking is allowed and they are easily avoided and poor ventilation would not referred to by the doctor in regard to the exterior of the ship to begin with. Where did you run into this "excessive smoking" problem?

[sjbj]

Many non-smoker posters in the plethora of threads on the subject not only don’t accept the “policy compliant issue” but also disregard that smokers also have “feelings” and get darn tired of being berated, lectured and generally made to feel as if they are the scourge of the earth.

 

And yet you still smoke. Sounds like a major addiction to me

[fm6175]

This is ridiculous . People smoke . I smoke occasionally . On my veranda . I don't flick butts over the rail . If I'm in the casino or at the bar I'm considerate of people around me . I pay top dollar for my suite and spend plenty while on board . One of the reasons I sail HAL is because I like to have an occasional smoke on my balcony . Get over it folks .

 

 

Sent using the Cruise Critic forums app

[regnig]

And yet you still smoke. Sounds like a major addiction to me

 

Oh really do I? And you make this assumption based on what? Your statement certainly comes across as mighty judgmental based on nothing. Just because I haven’t voiced the same condemnation as some other non-smokers does not mean that I’m a smoker. Did it ever occur to you that perhaps I’m just a considerate non-smoker who chooses not to partake in the dictatorial rhetoric of others?

My purpose for posting on this thread in the first place was only in an attempt to lower some of the vitriolic dialogue that was bound to ensue. Your post proves I wasn’t too successful with that.

[hal lover]

Since you cite "excessive smoking and poor ventilation" as contributing to your medical problems on board the Veendam you must have been spending a lot of time in the casino as it is the only indoor space where smoking is allowed. Your choice' date=' of course, but being that it is not a secret that it is a designated smoking-allowed area and you were already having breathing problems it probably would have been smart to stay out of there. There are only a very few outdoor areas where smoking is allowed and they are easily avoided and poor ventilation would not referred to by the doctor in regard to the exterior of the ship to begin with. Where did you run into this "excessive smoking" problem?[/quote']

 

SO TRUE!!

 

I quit smoking almost 7 months ago and I have yet to be in any situation that has cigarette smoke that I can not get away from.

[cruz chic]

For what?:confused: What does a non-smoker do that impacts on a smoker? Sorry but that makes no sense.

 

Well the top two that usually get thrown out are perfume wearing and over eating at the buffet. I'm surprised we haven't heard about it yet:rolleyes:.

Edited November 18, 2013 by lorekauf

[startwin]

Well the top two that usually get thrown out are perfume wearing and over eating at the buffet. I'm surprised we haven't heard about it yet:rolleyes:.

 

Yeah but.... smokers are also guilty of those two things, as well! In fact, probably more so - smokers have been known to overload on the perfume because a) they have a lesser sense of smell, or b) they are covering the smell of the smoking.

Guess where this thread is going now.......:D

[chrispb]

And yet you still smoke. Sounds like a major addiction to me

 

 

So? I think most smokers will admit to being addicted to cigarettes - you are not saying anything new.

[catl331]

And I heartily agree with the poster who said if there had not been complaints, there would still be smoking in the dining room!

Amen! Before smoking was banned in FL restaurants we had to endure too many meals where people lit up a new cigarette between courses! DH was sometimes one of them until he quit 35 years ago. He realizes now how inconsiderate it was, but really didn't think much about it at that time because there were many more smokers everywhere.

[alwaysfrantic]

When smoking was banned in Virgina (tobacco country) restaurants, smokers predicted all restaurants would go out of business without their business.

 

I still wait just as long for a table as I ever did.

[sammiedawg]

My issue two years ago on the Veendam did not involve any time in the casino. However there were heavy smokers in there and smoke was bleeding into other areas of the ship especially the Exploration cafe, the open promenade decks and cabin hallways. So many were smoking in their cabins that the hallways reeked including the hallway to the medical center. The nurse agreed with me the smoke haze outside the clinic was disgusting. This all occurred during the timeframe of multiple mechanical issues on the Veendam. There were definite ventilation issues on board this 12 day cruise, people's air conditioning did not work.

One month later the ship came under fire for inspection issues and the ship was eviscerated on cruise critic. Apparently some money was invested and mechanical issues improved.

Trust me I do everything possible to avoid smoking areas. And it has been years since I spent even one quarter in any casino. I had no choice to walk through the casino on the way to the dining room and other areas of the ship. I had no choice to walk down smokey corridors. The promenade deck was ruined by heavy balcony smokers including pipe and cigar use. The exploration cafe was ruined by smoke.

I have done more than 25 cruises and never experienced anything like this. It is well documented in scientific research that second hand smoke can be deadly.

Edited November 18, 2013 by sammiedawg

[Fouremco]

So? I think most smokers will admit to being addicted to cigarettes - you are not saying anything new.

Whichever side of the smoking issue you stand on, one thing is clear: you're all addicted to Cruise Critic smoking threads! Not me, of course... ;)

 

[YubaSutter]

For what?:confused: What does a non-smoker do that impacts on a smoker? Sorry but that makes no sense.

 

They whine and complain too much.

[startwin]

They whine and complain too much.

 

Good lord. Very mature, I must say.

[Aussiepair]

If I choose to go up to a designated smoking area, I expect to have to deal with smoke.

But when I pay $1000 or more for a private balcony, I have no way of knowing whether I will have inconsiderate smokers for neighbors. Yes, it's a HAL policy, but for me, right now, it's simply a gamble. We will chance it - once.

 

 

It is a gamble my wife and I took with HAL on a 4 week cruise out of Venice.

 

First 2 weeks were great but the second 2 weeks we had a gentleman that spent the entire 2 weeks on his balcony smoking cigars. It was the balcony in front of ours and the smell was so bad there was no way we could use our balcony even while cruising, smoke smell we could put up with but not cigars.

 

We tried to get another cabin, but was unsuccessful even though the ship was not fully booked.

 

We complained to HAL when we returned home and were offered an upgrade on our next cruise with them. We took it up this year and were UPGRADED from a guaranteed ocean view to an ocean view cabin under the kitchen cleaning station.

 

We will probably not sail with them again but if for some reason we did there is no way we would pay for a balcony.

 

Hope you have better luck than we did but if you don't then make sure you complain straight away, you will have a much better chance of being moved then.

[Hlitner]

Not sure this has been mentioned, but effective Jan 1, 2014, RCI is joining most of the industry by banning all smoking on passenger balconies. For smokers, the options for balcony smoking are really becoming limited. Other then on HAL, I believe smokers can still smoke on MSC and Carnival balconies. One wonders how long these lines will continue to fight the world-wide no-smoking trend?

 

Hank

[startwin]

Not sure this has been mentioned, but effective Jan 1, 2014, RCI is joining most of the industry by banning all smoking on passenger balconies. For smokers, the options for balcony smoking are really becoming limited. Other then on HAL, I believe smokers can still smoke on MSC and Carnival balconies. One wonders how long these lines will continue to fight the world-wide no-smoking trend?

 

Hank

 

I believe HAL will follow suit, because - in their own words - they are standardizing with the rest of the industry.

[frankc98376]

Not sure this has been mentioned, but effective Jan 1, 2014, RCI is joining most of the industry by banning all smoking on passenger balconies. For smokers, the options for balcony smoking are really becoming limited. Other then on HAL, I believe smokers can still smoke on MSC and Carnival balconies. One wonders how long these lines will continue to fight the world-wide no-smoking trend?

 

Hank

 

Add to the smoking list NCL and Seabourn's Suites.

Again I will say, I'm not a smoker and have never had a problem on my balcony.

It really all boils down to dollars. I'm confident HAL has tracked the spending patterns of those that request an ash tray for their balcony and found the same patterns as Nevada. Smokers tend to drink and gamble heavier- non smoking casinos have tried and failed. If revenue would increase by eliminating smoking every casino would be non smoking tomorrow- the savings in maintenance and insurance premiums would be huge.

I worked in the Executive Offices of a major casino in Nevada in the mid 80's and saw study after study about smoking vs non smoking. We had people on the floor discreetly tracking spending at the smoking and non smoking sections. We would have loved to have made the entire complex smoke free but the dismal earnings from the non smoking areas made it clear it couldn't happen. Receipts plummeted in a restaurants that changed to non smoking.

I live in Washington State and several years ago the smoke free laws passed. Sadly, many privately owned casinos failed as the Tribal Casinos allowed smoking and business skyrocketed for them. We have a small Tribal Casino in our area that was basically just a small bingo "tent". Since the law passed they have become a major destination resort with huge casino, restaurants, hotel and convention center.

The Health Department kept saying "business will get better" but for the small non tribal casinos and many small restaurants and bars it never did and they closed.

I remember when smoking was allowed pretty much anywhere on the ship then most relegated it to the port side of public rooms. I saw one suggestion that smoking be allowed on balconies on only one side of the ship- makes sense to me. HAL caters to a heavy international clientele and many countries still have high numbers of smokers.

Edited November 23, 2013 by frankc98376

[startwin]

Add to the smoking list NCL and Seabourn's Suites.

Again I will say, I'm not a smoker and have never had a problem on my balcony.

It really all boils down to dollars. I'm confident HAL has tracked the spending patterns of those that request an ash tray for their balcony and found the same patterns as Nevada. Smokers tend to drink and gamble heavier- non smoking casinos have tried and failed. If revenue would increase by eliminating smoking every casino would be non smoking tomorrow- the savings in maintenance and insurance premiums would be huge.

I worked in the Executive Offices of a major casino in Nevada in the mid 80's and saw study after study about smoking vs non smoking. We had people on the floor discreetly tracking spending at the smoking and non smoking sections. We would have loved to have made the entire complex smoke free but the dismal earnings from the non smoking areas made it clear it couldn't happen. Receipts plummeted in a restaurants that changed to non smoking.

I live in Washington State and several years ago the smoke free laws passed. Sadly, many privately owned casinos failed as the Tribal Casinos allowed smoking and business skyrocketed for them. We have a small Tribal Casino in our area that was basically just a small bingo "tent". Since the law passed they have become a major destination resort with huge casino, restaurants, hotel and convention center.

The Health Department kept saying "business will get better" but for the small non tribal casinos and many small restaurants and bars it never did and they closed.

I remember when smoking was allowed pretty much anywhere on the ship then most relegated it to the port side of public rooms. I saw one suggestion that smoking be allowed on balconies on only one side of the ship- makes sense to me. HAL caters to a heavy international clientele and many countries still have high numbers of smokers.

 

 

All our casinos here are non-smoking - and thriving. They keep building new ones.

[jtl513]

I saw one suggestion that smoking be allowed on balconies on only one side of the ship- makes sense to me.

There aren't nearly enough smokers to fill a side on any cruise, even in Europe. And if there were, there would be many non-smokers who would complain that their favorite cabin is on the designated smoking side. Edited November 23, 2013 by jtl513

[Fouremco]

Add to the smoking list NCL and Seabourn's Suites.

Again I will say, I'm not a smoker and have never had a problem on my balcony.

It really all boils down to dollars. I'm confident HAL has tracked the spending patterns of those that request an ash tray for their balcony and found the same patterns as Nevada. Smokers tend to drink and gamble heavier- non smoking casinos have tried and failed. If revenue would increase by eliminating smoking every casino would be non smoking tomorrow- the savings in maintenance and insurance premiums would be huge.

I worked in the Executive Offices of a major casino in Nevada in the mid 80's and saw study after study about smoking vs non smoking. We had people on the floor discreetly tracking spending at the smoking and non smoking sections. We would have loved to have made the entire complex smoke free but the dismal earnings from the non smoking areas made it clear it couldn't happen. Receipts plummeted in a restaurants that changed to non smoking.

I live in Washington State and several years ago the smoke free laws passed. Sadly, many privately owned casinos failed as the Tribal Casinos allowed smoking and business skyrocketed for them. We have a small Tribal Casino in our area that was basically just a small bingo "tent". Since the law passed they have become a major destination resort with huge casino, restaurants, hotel and convention center.

The Health Department kept saying "business will get better" but for the small non tribal casinos and many small restaurants and bars it never did and they closed.

I remember when smoking was allowed pretty much anywhere on the ship then most relegated it to the port side of public rooms. I saw one suggestion that smoking be allowed on balconies on only one side of the ship- makes sense to me. HAL caters to a heavy international clientele and many countries still have high numbers of smokers.

Totally the opposite in Ontario. Despite dire predictions of doom and gloom from the owners, restaurants, bars and casinos have thrived since smoking was banned.

 

In any event, I'm not sure that you can compare casinos on a cruise line like HAL to those of Vegas. While there may be exceptions, and I'm sure I'll hear them here in due course ( :) ), people travel to Vegas to gamble in the casinos, but few book cruises for the express purpose of gambling.

[frankc98376]

Canada seems to be ahead of the US in terms of "ex-smokers". I have heard the taxes are very high up there and I'm guessing the tobacco education is better. I see signs in stores advertising a "special" on cigarettes at $7.50 per pack. I'm amazed anyone still smokes for that price- in my former smoking days I smoked 2 or 3 packs a day. I'd need to re-fi the house to smoke now :)

[Fouremco]

Canada seems to be ahead of the US in terms of "ex-smokers". I have heard the taxes are very high up there and I'm guessing the tobacco education is better. I see signs in stores advertising a "special" on cigarettes at $7.50 per pack. I'm amazed anyone still smokes for that price- in my former smoking days I smoked 2 or 3 packs a day. I'd need to re-fi the house to smoke now :)

I've not seen any comparative stats for the US and Canada on the whole smoking issue, but all is good if we both continue to make strides in the right direction. You are right about prices: DW and I were both heavy smokers once upon a time, but we'd certainly be challenged to both smoke and cruse today! :)

[boss neil]

.......enuff....enuff....enuff...enuff

 

we have heard all of you, that complains about smokers....

 

How about learning a few things from the bible............

 

"he, who is without sin...cast the first stone"

 

.............................please the subect is boring..................

[frankc98376]

.......enuff....enuff....enuff...enuff

 

we have heard all of you, that complains about smokers....

 

How about learning a few things from the bible............

 

"he, who is without sin...cast the first stone"

 

.............................please the subect is boring..................

 

Actually I don't smoke (used to) but am married to a smoker and will certainly NEVER cast a stone- have plenty of my own "sins" :)