Women In Shorts MDR - Casual Night

[luckyprincess]

I think there is a big difference between wearing different types of clothing and wearing clothing at all in the MDR, come on. Lol, seriously? Why not just piss on your table? There is no rule against it, so it must be exactly the same as wearing shorts, right? We are the US (mostly). We are very puritanical and don't suffer nudity well. Do you realize how many fainting couches would be needed? Listen, if you look good, please by all means go sans clothing to dinner so I have dinner and a show! But for the most part, CLOTHING is expected. You would be daft or trolling to think otherwise. I mean, if you know you need to book a specialty cruise to go without clothing onboard then you know that it's not accepted in society. All clothing is - although I'd say the older set would want things to be very formal all the time. Dressing for dinner used to be a big deal. Now most people I know and myself go out to eat a few times a week. There is a plethora of restaurants to visit in my area and even the very finest (Michelin starred, if you will) are great with designer jeans, a fancy top and heels. Sorry, it's the way of the world. And dressy shorts like the ones I posted? Very current and acceptable ANYWHERE in NYC that isn't a tourist trap I think.... and I know it's snobby but if it isn't NY times or Michelin rated I don't think it's some swanky, amazing place..

[nascar junkie]

I guess some people can't read or understand American english. IT IS NOT A RULE! IT IS SUGGESTED ATTIRE. If I'm barefoot, then there is a rule and it is enforced. If I'm wearing jeans and a tee shirt, it may not be what is wanted but it's not against a rule. I just saw a NOS compass which now says casual or carribean attire. Someone define carribean attire please.

[LetsGetWet!]

But plenty of folks (cruisers) have determined it's up to them to enforce the rule here (you know, all those posts who say everyone should follow the rules).

 

If you honestly thought I was suggesting there are cruisers enforcing the rules on board, I don't know how to help you.

There's a huge difference between stating on a message board that you believe people should follow the rule and actually enforcing the rule. If you honestly can't see that distinction, I don't know how to help you.

[LetsGetWet!]

I guess some people can't read or understand American english. IT IS NOT A RULE! IT IS SUGGESTED ATTIRE.

You're right, apparently some people CAN'T read or understand American English. Formal attire is suggested, no shorts is a written RULE, whether or not it's always enforced.

[comxkid]

You're right, apparently some people CAN'T read or understand American English. Formal attire is suggested, no shorts is a written RULE, whether or not it's always enforced.

 

According to many on these boards the following are rules that I can ignore on my upcoming cruise:

 

1. Wearing shorts in the dining room during dinner.

2. Smuggling alcoholic and non-alcoholic drinks onto the ship.

3. Public nudity including sex if I think no one can see me.

4. Saving deck chairs for my spouse, my 10 children, my parents, my in-laws.

5. Saving theater seats for the same mentioned above.

6. Smoking on my balcony because it will be a he said / she said argument if anyone turns me in.

7. Getting in elevators before letting others out first.

8. Cutting in any and all possible lines.

 

I'm looking forward to an uneventful cruise.

Edited July 9, 2014 by comxkid

[Jobeth66]

If everyone just showed up naked then there would be no argument about dress :rolleyes:

 

That's what *I* said!

[LMaxwell]

If MDR is so upscale and is a business like atmosphere, to conduct the business of cruising, why does anyone tolerate shorts at breakfast or lunch.

 

Yes, I understand they are allowed, but if people personally feel it is "beneath" the elegant surroundings and traditions of the MDR, why do they do the bare minimum for breakfast and lunch? I say if you believe in all this elegance and tradition and business meeting as a vacation malarky you should be wearing pants and collared shirts for breakfast and lunch or else go eat elsewhere. No? It's the same room, same waitstaff. Other than a non-thinking, non-discriminatory sign at the door, what exactly is different on casual evenings versus daytime dining?

 

Nothing

 

Hypocrites...

[Captain Jake]

If MDR is so upscale and is a business like atmosphere, to conduct the business of cruising, why does anyone tolerate shorts at breakfast or lunch.

 

Yes, I understand they are allowed, but if people personally feel it is "beneath" the elegant surroundings and traditions of the MDR, why do they do the bare minimum for breakfast and lunch? I say if you believe in all this elegance and tradition and business meeting as a vacation malarky you should be wearing pants and collared shirts for breakfast and lunch or else go eat elsewhere. No? It's the same room, same waitstaff. Other than a non-thinking, non-discriminatory sign at the door, what exactly is different on casual evenings versus daytime dining?

 

Nothing

 

Hypocrites...

 

what a bunch of crap. Grade D-

[Captain Jake]

According to many on these boards the following are rules that I can ignore on my upcoming cruise:

 

1. Wearing shorts in the dining room during dinner.

2. Smuggling alcoholic and non-alcoholic drinks onto the ship.

3. Public nudity including sex if I think no one can see me.

4. Saving deck chairs for my spouse, my 10 children, my parents, my in-laws.

5. Saving theater seats for the same mentioned above.

6. Smoking on my balcony because it will be a he said / she said argument if anyone turns me in.

7. Getting in elevators before letting others out first.

8. Cutting in any and all possible lines.

 

I'm looking forward to an uneventful cruise.

 

9, Jump on lifeboats ahead of women and kids

[davekathy]

I guess some people can't read or understand American english. IT IS NOT A RULE! IT IS SUGGESTED ATTIRE. If I'm barefoot, then there is a rule and it is enforced. If I'm wearing jeans and a tee shirt, it may not be what is wanted but it's not against a rule. I just saw a NOS compass which now says casual or carribean attire. Someone define carribean attire please.

 

My interpretation of Caribbean attire would be shorts, tee shirts and vans.

[TerriDHair]

If the sign at the entrance of the MDR says "no shorts during the evening meal". Why would you ask us if shorts are OK ???? read the sign...

 

WHY--WHY--WHY ???????????????

 

I miss you, Ed, lol. And your lovely bride. And you know me (and Jeff), we love to dress up on cruises and have no real opportunity to do so in our "casual" city of Phoenix.

 

BTW, on a recent cruise, our concierge made a point to tell me how much he loves that I still like to dress up every night. :D

 

I get weary of reading replies on these types of threads that are something like, "It's your vacation, wear whatever you feel like". *sigh* Not to say I am not traditionally a rebel...but for me dressing nice is part of the fun as as they make it more and more relaxed I fear I may as well give up and go to the Windjammer for dinner, which I hate doing. It's sad, but increasingly I feel out of place for being dressed up!

[BamaGuy44]

If MDR is so upscale and is a business like atmosphere, to conduct the business of cruising, why does anyone tolerate shorts at breakfast or lunch.

 

Yes, I understand they are allowed, but if people personally feel it is "beneath" the elegant surroundings and traditions of the MDR, why do they do the bare minimum for breakfast and lunch? I say if you believe in all this elegance and tradition and business meeting as a vacation malarky you should be wearing pants and collared shirts for breakfast and lunch or else go eat elsewhere. No? It's the same room, same waitstaff. Other than a non-thinking, non-discriminatory sign at the door, what exactly is different on casual evenings versus daytime dining?

 

Nothing

 

Hypocrites...

 

Another weak attempt to scientifically prove or disprove an issue of manners and decorum. The reason is dinner is traditionally considered a little more formal than breakfast or lunch. Is there a scientific reason behind it? No, it's just tradition.

 

Why is wearing a tie more formal than not wearing one? Nothing magic about a piece of cloth around your neck, it's just tradition and the way our culture views it.

 

Some people like the MDR dress to be a little more formal than shorts for dinner. (Why are shorts considered less formal? See above.) You obviously don't, we get it. But it's your opinion, not a provable fact.. Someone who disagrees with you is not necessarily dumber than you or a hypocrite, which seem to be your main 2 arguments.

[LetsGetWet!]

Another weak attempt to scientifically prove or disprove an issue of manners and decorum. The reason is dinner is traditionally considered a little more formal than breakfast or lunch. Is there a scientific reason behind it? No, it's just tradition.

 

Why is wearing a tie more formal than not wearing one? Nothing magic about a piece of cloth around your neck, it's just tradition and the way our culture views it.

 

Some people like the MDR dress to be a little more formal than shorts for dinner. (Why are shorts considered less formal? See above.) You obviously don't, we get it. But it's your opinion, not a provable fact.. Someone who disagrees with you is not necessarily dumber than you or a hypocrite, which seem to be your main 2 arguments.

Yep, dumber than he is, a hypocrite, irrational and incapable of critical thought - his go-to arguments over and over. And its fun to watch the 2-3 groupies he's developed chime in and congratulate him on it too. :)

[LMaxwell]

But it's your opinion, not a provable fact.. Someone who disagrees with you is not necessarily dumber than you or a hypocrite, which seem to be your main 2 arguments.

 

Firstly, let me thank you for using words to make your point and not just saying something nasty. I always appreciate having a discussion / debate.

 

Secondly, I have never called anyone "dumb" or attacked anyone's intelligence level, so let's discount that right off the bat.

 

Third, I do not call people hypocrites because they disagree with me. I call them hypocrites because there are people that feel that dressing in shorts is

-Rude to the waitstaff

-Not up to the elegance of the dining room

Yet, when allowed to do so for breakfast and lunch they will happily wear shorts. If they truly believed that shorts were an affront to the staff or not up to the rooms standards they would not ever wear them. It is pointing out a flaw in their argument, not attacking their intelligence.

 

It's a circular argument; changing people's opinions is almost always fruitless. The difference is I don't say nasty things to people who have opinions that differ from mine. People on this forum are downright nasty to me for having a different opinion. Is not treating someone worse than you want to be treated hypocritical as well?

 

Like I said the other day, this is just a web forum; other than some very nice people I have met face to face on ships no one here knows me, who I am, what I am like, what I do for a living, etc., so the insults roll off my back, but it does speak volumes about others who take time out of their day just to say something nasty in a "drive by". So, again, thank you for participating in a discussion and not just mud slinging.

 

Finally I will say this; if you write to RCI about your concerns and what you want as a paying customer they will respond to you.

[Evilgrin72]

Rule or no rule, all I know is that if I'm ever such a miserable bast**d that even on a cruise, I'm worried about castigating or reporting others for wearing shorts to dinner, just put a bullet in my head. No questions asked, just one to the temple and let me sleep.

 

I'll be the guy over in the corner with a scotch, not giving a ####.

[Big_G]

If everyone just showed up naked then there would be no argument about dress :rolleyes:

 

Agreed. With all the killed appetites, RC could cut way back on the food. :D

[S.A.M.J.R.]

Another weak attempt to scientifically prove or disprove an issue of manners and decorum. The reason is dinner is traditionally considered a little more formal than breakfast or lunch. Is there a scientific reason behind it? No, it's just tradition.

 

Why is wearing a tie more formal than not wearing one? Nothing magic about a piece of cloth around your neck, it's just tradition and the way our culture views it.

 

Some people like the MDR dress to be a little more formal than shorts for dinner. (Why are shorts considered less formal? See above.) You obviously don't, we get it. But it's your opinion, not a provable fact.. Someone who disagrees with you is not necessarily dumber than you or a hypocrite, which seem to be your main 2 arguments.

But traditions (along with manners and decorum) change over time. Maybe now is the time the "no shorts in the MDR" tradition is changing.

[LMaxwell]

But traditions (along with manners and decorum) change over time. Maybe now is the time the "no shorts in the MDR" tradition is changing.

 

Traditionally Breakfast, Lunch, and Dinner was served in dual fixed times (early and late) and they were assigned times. If you were assigned 8:00AM breakfast and did not want to eat at that time you were basically out of luck as the dining room doors were CLOSED and entrance forbidden.

 

Windjammer did not appear until Sovereign of the Seas; yet RCI had been cruising for nearly two decades at that point, so they clearly has enacted change to give customers more options.

 

They then moved away from fixed time breakfast and lunch and went to open seating. Then they added breakfast and lunch buffet in MDR to compliment the menus. They made changes that reflected the values of guests.

 

If it is about what is traditional would people not be asking to go back to the old way of set rigid times and assignments? I would not want to go on a cruise that had fixed and rigid dining times for all three meals; for any line.

[BamaGuy44]

Firstly, let me thank you for using words to make your point and not just saying something nasty. I always appreciate having a discussion / debate.

 

Secondly, I have never called anyone "dumb" or attacked anyone's intelligence level, so let's discount that right off the bat.

 

Third, I do not call people hypocrites because they disagree with me. I call them hypocrites because there are people that feel that dressing in shorts is

-Rude to the waitstaff

-Not up to the elegance of the dining room

Yet, when allowed to do so for breakfast and lunch they will happily wear shorts. If they truly believed that shorts were an affront to the staff or not up to the rooms standards they would not ever wear them. It is pointing out a flaw in their argument, not attacking their intelligence.

 

It's a circular argument; changing people's opinions is almost always fruitless. The difference is I don't say nasty things to people who have opinions that differ from mine. People on this forum are downright nasty to me for having a different opinion. Is not treating someone worse than you want to be treated hypocritical as well?

 

Like I said the other day, this is just a web forum; other than some very nice people I have met face to face on ships no one here knows me, who I am, what I am like, what I do for a living, etc., so the insults roll off my back, but it does speak volumes about others who take time out of their day just to say something nasty in a "drive by". So, again, thank you for participating in a discussion and not just mud slinging.

 

Finally I will say this; if you write to RCI about your concerns and what you want as a paying customer they will respond to you.

 

Well to be fair you have accused people of not being capable of rational thought or critical thinking, which to me is insulting their intelligence. Maybe in a passive aggressive way, but still. But hey we all get worked up sometimes.

 

I do agree the bolded above are weak arguments in favor of no shorts, plenty of weak arguments on both sides, amirite? :D

 

For the record I do consider it a bit rude to wear shorts to dinner when the cruise line politely asks you not to. But if they changed the rule as they did on Disney it wouldn't bother me one bit. And if I see people in shorts at dinner does it ruin my day/meal/cruise/life? Of course not I wouldn't give it more than 5 seconds thought. It would be like if someone cut in front of me in the WJ, I would think "wow, that guy is rude", and move on with my vacation :cool: I'm as laid back as they come, especially on a cruise.

 

I just like to poke holes in illogical arguments then watch people defend them to the death. It could easily be done on either side of the MDR/smoking/chair hog/whatever debate ;)

[WetToes]

Any progress here? No? Carry on. ;)

[LMaxwell]

Well to be fair you have accused people of not being capable of rational thought or critical thinking, which to me is insulting their intelligence. Maybe in a passive aggressive way, but still. But hey we all get worked up sometimes.

 

 

The words I used were definitions gleaned from business books on doing focus group research. They are descriptors of mindsets; traditional, practical, progressive. I did not say anyone on here in particular was not capable of thought or critical thinking, nor did I label anyone other than myself as traditional, practical, or progressive. I labeled myself as practical (someone who follows conventions but actively questions if there is a better way. Meaning; I have always worn pants in the dining room for dinner, but I have in fact put pen to paper (well, toner to paper) and questioned RCI).

 

My intent was not passive aggressiveness, but to put definitions to different viewpoints. Some people took it as an assault or affront to their sensibilities; I can do nothing about that. They self-labeled and then took offense.

 

 

I do agree the bolded above are weak arguments in favor of no shorts, plenty of weak arguments on both sides, amirite? :D

 

 

Every argument has strong and weak points on both sides, I will agree with that. Shorts being offensive to the staff, or not, I think is a weak argument, but it is one that has been made here so I will use it as an example.

 

For the record I do consider it a bit rude to wear shorts to dinner when the cruise line politely asks you not to. But if they changed the rule as they did on Disney it wouldn't bother me one bit. And if I see people in shorts at dinner does it ruin my day/meal/cruise/life? Of course not I wouldn't give it more than 5 seconds thought. It would be like if someone cut in front of me in the WJ, I would think "wow, that guy is rude", and move on with my vacation :cool: I'm as laid back as they come, especially on a cruise.

 

 

That, again, is where I consider myself to be practical. I'll follow rules I don't necessarily like, but raise the flag for change. Does someone in shorts ruin my dinner? No. My main focus is on my dinner party. I may just not be as noticing of others in the dining room as some others. If people want to dress up or dress down, I have no problem with it. Cruise fare has paid for MDR food and table service. I have said that if they want to offer table service in Windjammer for meat / fish / chicken (proteins) and have buffet for self service sides, I'd consider going there for a casual dinner too. Or splitting up MDR by floors for those that want a dress code versus those that don't. I'm not going to wear a graphic t-shirt and gym shorts into the dining room. But if my golf club / resort wear clothing means I have to dine with someone in graphic t and gym shorts I accept it, because ultimately I will be comfortable and not really notice them. I'm not totally unreasonable; since this is not a health or safety issue I am open for compromises and suggestions.

 

 

I just like to poke holes in illogical arguments then watch people defend them to the death. It could easily be done on either side of the MDR/smoking/chair hog/whatever debate ;)

 

I like to do the same. That's why I am responding to you. You have the courtesy to have a conversation on the topic.

[Adayatatime]

Yep, dumber than he is, a hypocrite, irrational and incapable of critical thought - his go-to arguments over and over. And its fun to watch the 2-3 groupies he's developed chime in and congratulate him on it too. :)

 

 

So people who agree with him are groupies? I hope you're not aiming that at me (as I agree with his arguments) because that really is insulting.

[Sitzmark]

Any progress here? No? Carry on. ;)

 

 

Progressing towards 300 posts.

[CruiseTobey]

So people who agree with him are groupies? I hope you're not aiming that at me (as I agree with his arguments) because that really is insulting.

 

Standard retailation when backed into a corner. When your position can no longer be logically defended, attack the person, not the issue. It's interesting that he extended his hostilities to those who happen to agree with a viewpoint that is not in sync with his. :rolleyes:

[BamaGuy44]

The words I used were definitions gleaned from business books on doing focus group research. They are descriptors of mindsets; traditional, practical, progressive. I did not say anyone on here in particular was not capable of thought or critical thinking, nor did I label anyone other than myself as traditional, practical, or progressive.

 

 

 

 

Nice try but no. I'm too lazy to look up the exact wording but something along the lines of blind followers incapable of critical thinking. Maybe I'm just reading the wrong business books :)

 

No big deal either way like I said we all get worked up sometimes. Internet debate over cruise ship fashion is serious business.

 

 

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