Are Princess losing the plot

[chloe45]

For all of you who commented about Princess Live - it's going away on the next new ship. That whole area including the Wheelhouse and Crown Grill are being reconfigured. (heard this on the Regal).

 

Princess Live is a total waste of space! There is no ambience to the room at all. Went on the Regal once. Will probably never do it again for all the reasons that have been discussed on this board.

[senior lady]

I just returned from a 10 day coastal on the Grand. I was worried about all the negative comments.

 

I can honestly say it was one of my best cruises. The food, service and entertainment was "top notch" I never had a bad meal. I ate more steaks on this cruise because they were so good.

 

Yes the ship is older, but they were replacing carpets and doing other stuff the whole 10 days.

 

The cruise director and his staff where so funny and friendly. There never was a dull moment.

I asked for a "top" sheet and it was put on right away. I also know they changed the sheets and duvet many times as I saw them in the hallway.

 

As to the Coral Princess comments............. I had friends do the whole 21 day panama canal cruise and they didn't have any complaints either. They said the food was great. They bought several FCC

 

I've cruised other lines but I keep coming back to Princess as I always find them to have a consistent product. Never had the "hard" sell for anything at dinner. I always have anytime dinning so maybe that makes a difference.

The only wait we had was on the first and last night... other nights we would get to the dinning room around 7:15 and be seated right away.:D

 

This cruise was sold out a couple of mths before sailing. I think these west coast sailings are going to be very popular.

 

As for Asia market........... if the amount of Asians sailing on this cruise, that Asia is going to be a very hot, hot market.

[Elequieu]

I agree with most comments. The big exception being the constant selling which we have observed in previous posts but not experienced ourselves. Our waiters are aware after the first night that we are not interested in wine tastings, etc., and do not bother us with it.

[Colo Cruiser]

I am not sure who is the one totally lost here. Many of Princess ships are sold out.

 

 

Correct but what goes up must come down.

Edited May 5, 2015 by Colo Cruiser

[Jo and Rob]

We have two Princess cruises booked this summer and can't wait!! We love the International cafe, the beautiful atrium and the fact that Ultimate kids package is a great unlimited non alcoholic package which suits us well.

 

Product pushing is certainly evident with all cruise lines. I don't want a foot print of my foot thank you, I've been there, done that but there it is every day in an attempt to sell in soles. It was in the daily newspaper most days on P&O Britannia under different headings such as bad back, bad posture, sore knees etc etc.

 

My gripe is that fee events are becoming more frequent at the expense of other entertainment. I enjoy the spa seminars but know that it will be a product hard sell for the majority of the talk.

 

What we mustn't forget however is that cruising is actually fantastic value compared to land holidays. We are treated to waiter service, shows, twice daily steward service not to mention the fabulous ports.

 

We sail with a variety of lines and Princess remains a firm favourite with Celebrity. I think we are really lucky to be able to have such fabulous holidays thanks to the hard work and effort of the crew. :)

[paddingtonbear]

I agree with just about every thought in this post - except perhaps the speculation on Carnival/Princess business motivations.

 

 

 

I'm just off a really fantastic cruise on the Regal - which was a redeeming surprise after an generally unsatisfactory Royal cruise the previous year (in retrospect remind self to NEVER cruise at Christmas). That said' date=' while I appreciate the Royal class ships and what the offer, the line just isn't feeling like the Princess I fell in love with. I've dabbled a bit with Cunard and it's fine for what it is, but it isn't going to be my new go-to. I was so frustrated with the lack of 10day Caribbean options and PRICING for next winter that I'm actually going to try HAL. I normally take a minisuite and after my Regal cruise would only go on one of the extended balcony minis mid-ship but on HAL I saved over $1400 and got a suite. I doubt they will be my new go-to but it's a great itinerary and I'm sure it will be "fine."

 

 

 

For all of you who commented about Princess Live - it's going away on the next new ship. That whole area including the Wheelhouse and Crown Grill are being reconfigured. (heard this on the Regal).[/quote']

 

 

Cruising Chris,

I would love to hear a HAL vs princess report on this princess board after your cruise if you get a chance.

[runnerodb83]

I am not sure who is the one totally lost here. Many of Princess ships are sold out.

 

The problem is, they are totally sold out because many of the cabins are sold at a loss and must re-coup the operating expenses from onboard sales - meaning nearly every crewmember must become a salesperson.

 

Cruising is still a novelty in Asia, and there are cruises there by Star cruises that are nothing more than floating casinos - and they do very well. Guests using slot machines arent complaining about chair hogs around the pool, food quality, excursion reservations, or need to be entertained. The US based cruise lines are learning this quick. And learning how to make money. And by virtue of being US companies, they are instantly popular.

 

If the middle class(and therefore target market) of china is only 1/4th the population, thats more than the total population of the united states. You can imagine why Carnival and RCCL have made waves to get to asia and china in particular and done vessel refits that have changed their ships to be more tailored to the market.

 

Moving the Sapphire and Diamond to asia was a smart move by princess where you can guarantee that a selling point (at least for the japanese market) is that the ships were constructed in Japan.

[doe326]

Our last two cruise on Princess the food was awful. Both in the dining room and buffet. Most of the time the food in the buffet looked like mush. On the Regal they had a lot of pork, which I love. Unfortunately it was so dry the gravy couldn't make it better. Too many ethnic dishes. If you have an Indian night, please have some food that others might like better. We went to the buffet on one of the ethnic nights and there wasn't one thing that I could eat. Thank goodness for pizza and hamburgers. We usually book the steakhouse one night on our last cruise we booked it two because of the food elsewhere. I love Princess and hope they can get their act together about the decline of their food. In the meantime I'll try some other lines too.

[OCruisers]

Cruising Chris,

I would love to hear a HAL vs princess report on this princess board after your cruise if you get a chance.

 

Not Cruising Chris but we have cruised on HAL five times.

While Princess is our favorite and way best all around for us, HAL works for us on port intensive cruises when we want to return to a quiet ship and get to bed early. HAL sometimes has itineraries not offered by Princess.

 

Like on Princess, there's good service on HAL.

You'll find the food and dress codes about the same HAL and Princess.

Entertainment in all areas is lots better on Princess.

Princess has longer buffet times open/other food options like the International Café (open 24/7)

 

HAL has very good room service.

On HAL we find a regular verandah cabin roomy enough. To get the space we want in the cabin/bath we book a mini-suite on Princess.

 

They are both very good cruise lines ... just HAL is lots more laid back. ;)

 

LuLu

[Shogun]

Hi All

Latest Royal Princess 12 nights under £500 plus on board spread these cruises started at ,£1299 so to me business model is not working yours Shogun

[BruceMuzz]

So many people on these boards seem stuck with those old grandma stories about how businesses run.

 

"The customer is always right."

"It's cheaper to get a customer to return than it is to get a new customer."

"One dissatisfied customer will tell X number of others about his bad experience."

"What goes up must come down."

"If you lose your loyal customer base, you go out of business."

 

These old ideas just do not work in the cruise industry.

 

All those multi-million dollar studies we paid for over the years tell us that we can expect an over-supply of passengers and a shortage of beds for the next several decades.

 

Carnival Cruise Line (the most financially successful cruise line on Earth for the past 23 consecutive years) has proven that first time cruisers are where the money is, that repeat passengers are not worth the trouble, and that if you make it cheap enough, the American public will beat a path to your door - even when your ships are losing power at sea, burning up, or sinking.

 

Holland America Line has proven that having a high number of repeat cruisers is the perfect recipe for financial ruin. They have been one of the poorest financial performers in the industry for many years. Their Ancient Mariners are all on fixed incomes, and stopped spending money on ships years ago. The company cannot make a profit.

 

When NCL switched from traditional cruising to Freestyle Cruising in 1999, their loyal Ancient Mariners were screaming and moaning about the destruction of the line. The man who was recently promoted to CEO of NCL told those old timers to either accept the new product or go somewhere else. The repeaters left - to be quickly replaced by first timers who spent far more money onboard.

NCL eventually made so much money that they bought the holding company that owned them and 2 other cruise lines.

 

Currently the Middle Class in China is larger than the entire population of North America. That middle class is growing even larger every day.

 

Last year the entire cruise industry was able to carry about 25 million passengers from all around the world, with the majority of ships at full capacity.

The Chinese tell us that at least 100 million of their new middle class want to take a cruise every year.

We cannot build ships fast enough to meet the present demand. How can we possibly build them fast enough to satisfy the developing Chinese market?

 

So you don't like what the cruise lines are doing and the direction they are taking?

I agree with you.

But are you so naïve to really believe that the cruise lines care what you or I think or like?

 

You can complain to a cruise line, and they will tell you some very nice stories about how much they value your business.

But what they are really thinking is, "If you do not return, there are 10 more people -with more money than you - begging to take your place."

Edited May 5, 2015 by BruceMuzz

[bdjam]

Just returned from Fantastic 15 days on Coral Princess but have to say we have some issues that may make us look at other cruise lines.

Firstly the whole cruise seems to have become one long sales pitch. I do not want my waiter trying to sell me something every night at dinner from wine tasting to a cookery book(who buys one of these on holiday) I accept its not their fault they are obviously being pushed by their bosses.

Secondly the food, the standard has definately dropped. It was not up to previous standards, the meat was not cooked as requested, the lobsters have definately got smaller and the puddings were a complete let down. The head waiter was pushing "flambayed peaches" which turned out to be tinned peaches with the top burnt.

Thirdly the excursions seem to be getting more and more expensive.

We booked a trip on a yaght in Cab San Lucus for $129 before we left home but if you booked it on the boat it was $159 which for a 3hrs trip with a drink and a bit of food was expensive and no wonder the trip wasn't full.

Fourthly our bedding was not changed for entire cruise our Duvet cover was very worn & had a hole in it.

We love using Princess because they are usually of such a high standard for which you pay a premium but those standards are definately starting to slip. There are lots of other options out there and if they are not careful other people like ourselves will start to look elsewhere.

 

I just returned from a 7-day California Coastal cruise on Crown Princess. As Senior Lady points out above (hee hee) my cruise again reinforced that Princess is a stable, quality and fairly priced product.

 

I never got a sales pitch in the whole seven days. In fact I had to ask THEM to buy a coffee card.

 

The food on Crown Princess was exquisite. There was not one thing that wasn't cooked and flavored perfectly. All of the desserts were up to the usual Princess standard and I can't say that anything was canned. It was all fresh and delicious.

 

I can understand extra expense for shore tours when they are organized by the ship...there's extra work that goes into the arrangements when the ship handles a bunch of people so between that and the assurance of some level of quality, the additional cost doesn't bother me. But this is hardly something new - buying shore excursions directly has always been less expensive than buying from the ship.

 

My cabin was serviced excellently and I got new sheets during the cruise and none of them had holes in them.

 

I guess my only question for the original poster is what they did to rectify these issues while on board and if they did nothing, why not??

 

Too many ethnic dishes. If you have an Indian night, please have some food that others might like better. We went to the buffet on one of the ethnic nights and there wasn't one thing that I could eat. Thank goodness for pizza and hamburgers.

So your complaint was that on nights when ethnic food was served there weren't alternatives but you had pizza and hamburgers which I'm assuming you liked? One of the great things about cruising - at least it was until a good deal of the cruising population wanted only meat and potatoes on the table - is the ability to discover different cultures through food. Try an ethnic dish...you might like it.

So you don't like what the cruise lines are doing and the direction they are taking?

I agree with you.

But are you so naïve to really believe that the cruise lines care what you or I think or like?

 

You can complain to a cruise line, and they will tell you some very nice stories about how much they value your business.

But what they are really thinking is, "If you do not return, there are 10 more people -with more money than you - begging to take your place."

I totally agree with your analysis of the cruise line business model but when it comes to quality, I don't think it's as bad as some people would like to believe.

Edited May 5, 2015 by bdjam

[seamwoman]

Dylandog - we were on the Coral before you got on. We had wonderful food and service. Saw them loading supplies as we disembarked so sure you had oranges and mixed berries that ran out on our cruise.

[shredie]

Thanks for the lesson, BM. :rolleyes:

[Colo Cruiser]

Thanks for the lesson, BM. :rolleyes:

 

Another Chafkin ray of sunshine. :p

[SadieN]

The North American carnival brands are in a tough spot. Carnival generally competes by itself, .......................

 

 

Sounds like GM in the 80's. Dad decided on what car he wanted. Checked out everything from Chevrolet to Cadillac. Best bang for his buck was an Oldsmobile.

[swedish weave]

I totally agree with your analysis of the cruise line business model but when it comes to quality, I don't think it's as bad as some people would like to believe.

 

I also agree with Bruce Muzz analysis and would like to add a comment.

 

Carnival offers a wide range of cruising experiences from the low priced Carnival ships to the more expensive Cunard ships. If one is not happy with Princess (for example) it would ot bother CCL if you chose another of the Carnival family ships.

 

If you choose to go to NCL or RCCL, they offer some variety but that may not suit your tastes either.

 

Carnival began their cruise line by offering low priced cruises and they have absorbed many of the higher priced lines. That verifies Muzz' statement that if you offer a low price, the business will come to you.

 

The competition between the Carnival family lines is not really competition, but family rivalry and they are each trying to provide enough income to Carnival to justify their existance. The success of CCL's business plan is obvious in the numbers.

 

The debt equity ratios of the three major cruise companies show that CCL is in a much better position to survive an economic downturn than the others by a large margin. See below !

 

CCL Debt to Equity Ratio (Quarterly) Benchmarks

Companies

Royal Caribbean Cruises 1.074

Carnival 0.3914

Norwegian Cruise Line 1.757

 

CCL debt is only about a third of their equity value while the other two are what is called "under water".

[PescadoAmarillo]

Fourthly our bedding was not changed for entire cruise our Duvet cover was very worn & had a hole in it.

 

Why didn't you ask the steward to change your sheets:confused:

 

If my room doesn't have toilet paper, should I simply resign myself to having to ask for it? Some things (TP, washcloths and fresh, hole-less linens periodically) should be a given.

[swedish weave]

If my room doesn't have toilet paper, should I simply resign myself to having to ask for it? Some things (TP, washcloths and fresh, hole-less linens periodically) should be a given.

 

Don't lower yourself to ask for problems to be corrected on the ship !!! Wait until the cruise is over and complain about it on Cruise Critic !!!!

 

Not logical !!

[bdjam]

Don't lower yourself to ask for problems to be corrected on the ship !!! Wait until the cruise is over and complain about it on Cruise Critic !!!!

 

Not logical !!

 

Agreed...and if I was out of toilet paper, I wouldn't just sit on a throne waiting to be served.

[MTJSR]

Agree with other posters. Princess is lost and is struggling to recognize it's place in the Carnival Corp. world wide market. The old saying of 'no company ever saved their way to success' is still true. Regarding on board sales, while they aren't too annoying, Princess needs to be aware not to push too hard. One thing I don't like is the blocking of gang ways, creating a queue, and somewhat aggressive nature of the photographers. Also when the photographers set up their evening locations they always seem to block passage into or out of the central area.

 

I Agree!! I hate the fact we are all "marks" for the up-sell patrol. All I want to do is "Escape Completely" and if I have to pay another 100 bucks to do it, Charge Me!

 

.

[Chrisbha]

My views were only an observation not a complaint. I was basing my views on previous cruises. we didn't complain about bedding because we are clean people. It was just we thought that generally the standards on Princess had started to fall. In answer to the comment about pay a premium Princess are more expensive than a lot of other cruise lines so you would expect the standards to be higher or why bother paying extra.

[Miss Pat]

Don't lower yourself to ask for problems to be corrected on the ship !!! Wait until the cruise is over and complain about it on Cruise Critic !!!!

 

Not logical !!

 

That has a certain "ring" to it. If you now what I mean. :D:D

[Nezmo]

...

 

For all of you who commented about Princess Live - it's going away on the next new ship. That whole area including the Wheelhouse and Crown Grill are being reconfigured. (heard this on the Regal).

 

Not according to this article: http://www.seatrade-insider.com/news/news-headlines/new-princess-ship-to-be-based-in-shanghai-year-round.html

[msmoger]

My views were only an observation not a complaint. I was basing my views on previous cruises. we didn't complain about bedding because we are clean people. It was just we thought that generally the standards on Princess had started to fall. In answer to the comment about pay a premium Princess are more expensive than a lot of other cruise lines so you would expect the standards to be higher or why bother paying extra.

 

That's certainly not what I have observed among the mass market cruise lines in the US. Sure there are going to be differences on any given sailing but I don't think there's a huge difference in pricing strategies between cruise lines like Princess, HAL, Celebrity, NCL and RCI. Especially if you have a good travel agent. When I think of paying a "premium" I tend to think of the more luxury lines like Oceania, Regent, etc.

Edited May 6, 2015 by msmoger