SS Cruise Critic Member Review Data v. Other Ultra Premium Lines

[UKCruiseJeff]

........... and by the way!

 

Even if there were say four or more consecutive sea days there is no viable excuse for using canned fruit extensively except laziness and cheapness. Fresh fruit is available everywhere and is "bookable" for quayside delivery and keeps in cool storage for more than four days ......

 

This issue is illuminating ...... :)

 

Just an opinion.

 

:D:D:D

 

 

Jeff

[Keith1010]

........... and by the way!

 

Even if there were say four or more consecutive sea days there is no viable excuse for using canned fruit extensively except laziness and cheapness. Fresh fruit is available everywhere and is "bookable" for quayside delivery and keeps in cool storage for more than four days ......

 

This issue is illuminating ...... :)

 

Just an opinion.

 

:D:D:D

 

 

Jeff

 

Jeff:

 

I didn't go to any breakfast buffets.

 

But I did go to all of the lunch buffets and all I saw was fresh fruit.

 

And I just looked at my photos and it was fresh.

 

Keith

[UKCruiseJeff]

Jeff:

 

I didn't go to any breakfast buffets.

 

But I did go to all of the lunch buffets and all I saw was fresh fruit.

 

And I just looked at my photos and it was fresh.

 

Keith

 

 

You are now illustrating your very own point. Different cruises, different times, different people = different experiences!

 

All need reporting!

 

:D

 

Jeff

[Keith1010]

The issue of reviews came up on the Crystal Board a few weeks ago.

 

Evidently someone posted concerned that the last few reviews they had read on the Crystal Symphony were very poor and were worried that people didn't like it. Well, all of a sudden several people posted to say they had recently returned from the Symphony cruises and loved it and that included both first time and seasoned cruisers.

 

Many people who sail frequently just never post reviews and the reality is that the vast majority of people who are members of CC just don't take the time to write a review for the member review section of CC.

 

I always encourage people to write reviews because when they don't you get a very small sampling of reviews and people put too much weight on them.

 

I know when it comes to most luxury lines there are very few reviews for a variety of reasons including less people sail them than the large cruise lines/ships.

 

And sometimes people who had a bad experience are more apt to write a review (on luxury lines) just as more people will talk about a bad experience they had on land at a restaurant than a good experience.

 

When I am making decisions about something that I know very little about I will read reviews but if there are not many I won't put weight on them.

 

Instead I will just read threads to get an idea of what people are discussing to look for trends and when it comes to cruising one of my biggest sources is the annual cruise book written by Douglas Ward and published by Berlitz. I think he does a nice job in his narrative and in his ratings.

 

But as they say, you will never know until you experience it yourself.

 

Keith

[Keith1010]

Jeff: just to be clear.

 

I think anyone who wants to make a comment; good, bad or indifferent should as long as it conforms to Cruise Critic.

 

I think my track record is pretty good on that.

 

If someone didn't care for a cruise they should post that as if someone likes it they should.

 

I don't think I have ever put down another poster for expressing themselves. I might not agree with them but that is different.

 

Again, in the end, each person needs to figure out what they like or not like.

 

And if you don't like something that doesn't mean that others will feel the way you do and of course the reverse is true.

 

But as I said in my first post, never a need to use names to describe others who like or do not like something and that was in response to the first post of this thread.

Doesn't make sense to insult part of the audience if you want them to understand your points. Just something I learned a long time ago.

 

OK. I'm exhausted now and it is still very early in the morning here.

 

Have a nice day.

 

Keith

Edited January 22, 2016 by Keith1010

[UKCruiseJeff]

The issue of reviews came up on the Crystal Board a few weeks ago.

 

But as they say, you will never know until you experience it yourself.

 

Keith

 

Exactly. But you seem to still miss the point. :)

 

Unless you re able to try all or many as you have, and build up experience you have to make the first choice and you will be dumb just to pick a cruise at random. If somone did this without reading feedback and doing due dliligence and then complained and whinged on CC they would be told it was "their own fault".

 

Therefore they should be reading the opinions of others if they are prudent before they choose which line to "experience".

 

:)

 

Jeff

 

ps ..... you have a good rest now .... :D

Edited January 22, 2016 by UKCruiseJeff

[Keith1010]

Exactly. But you seem to still miss the point. :)

 

Unless you re able to try all or many as you have, and build up experience you have to make the first choice and you will be dumb just to pick a cruise at random. If somone did this without reading feedback and doing due dliligence and then complained and whinged on CC they would be told it was "their own fault".

 

Therefore they should be reading the opinions of others if they are prudent before they choose which line to "experience".

 

:)

 

Jeff

 

ps ..... you have a good rest now .... :D

 

Oh but you are not letting me rest. :)

 

I do understand the point. :D

 

This is why I do encourage people to write reviews because my experience on the luxury lines is more people are apt to write a review when things go wrong.

 

I also encourage people to write reviews no matter how many times they have sailed the line. I do it each time we sail on a cruise.

 

But also I realize that if there are very few reviews in the scheme of things that there are other ways to do the research which is exactly what I have done over the years and it has worked well.

 

Oh, no rest for me now. In an hour I will be walking over to the Fitness Center to take an indoor cycling class.

 

Keith

[UKCruiseJeff]

Oh but you are not letting me rest. :)

 

I do understand the point. :D

 

Oh, no rest for me now. In an hour I will be walking over to the Fitness Center to take an indoor cycling class.

 

Keith

 

No good ever came from indoor fitness centers.

 

Go and exercise your elbow at the pool bar.

 

:D

 

Have a great day Keith.

 

Jeff

[Tothesunset]

This thread is not really about the validity or otherwise of others' views. It is about someone's need to continually express their dissatisfaction ad nauseam while at the same time attempting to validate their opinion using a dubious ''statistical analysis''.

 

Giving a view once or twice or as a rebuttal to others' experiences is fine - in fact, it's an essential tool for balance. But to bang on incessantly is not only unhelpful, it alienates those who might, at first, have considered the poster's comments as rational and impartial - we are long past that stage now.

 

I know truculent children just can't keep quiet but metaphorically stamping one's feet on an open forum just discredits any validity the original comments may have had.

[UKCruiseJeff]

Keith, are you typing this whilst on an exercise bike? :eek:

 

The issue now being discussed is effectively about tolerance.

 

With the way that some behave you really have to think very carefully before providing either advice or feedback if it is negative. It involves you having to be prepared to justify your comments or defend yourself. That is a shame.

 

Jeff

[Kilroyshere]

The issue now being discussed is effectively about tolerance.

 

With the way that some behave you really have to think very carefully before providing either advice or feedback if it is negative. It involves you having to be prepared to justify your comments or defend yourself. That is a shame.

 

Jeff

 

Good point.

 

In reality, the flamers discredit themselves showing they've no intelligent rebuttal, cannot stay on thread and have to resort to juvenile personal attacks. And like moth to flame, they just keep coming back for more...

 

This forum seems to be more a cheerleader rally than a place to discuss, debate, refute, get info or find data (e.g.; the Cruise Critic cruise reviews) that others might find useful when considering a cruise line they've heretofore never sailed on.

 

I wish Cruise Critic had compiled their own member review data in a way to compare scored results cruise line to cruise line.

 

In the future, I'll have to do that myself, as I found the data and reports herein this site, very valuable and comporting closely to the experiences we've had on cruise lines.

 

So yes, the flamers and those who go personal might discourage an open and civil debate.

 

I've taken quite a bit of heat here for being frank and as objective as I can. The number of posters who seem to have taken offense at that, is curious indeed.

 

And like I've said, I appreciate the thread being bump'd to the top of the Forum front page by the flamers because it defeats what they intended to do.

 

Back on thread...

[UKCruiseJeff]

Good point.

 

In reality, the flamers discredit themselves showing they've no intelligent rebuttal, cannot stay on thread and have to resort to juvenile personal attacks. And like moth to flame, they just keep coming back for more...

 

This forum seems to be more a cheerleader rally than a place to discuss, debate, refute, get info or find data (e.g.; the Cruise Critic cruise reviews) that others might find useful when considering a cruise line they've heretofore never sailed on.

 

I wish Cruise Critic had compiled their own member review data in a way to compare scored results cruise line to cruise line.

 

In the future, I'll have to do that myself, as I found the data and reports herein this site, very valuable and comporting closely to the experiences we've had on cruise lines.

 

So yes, the flamers and those who go personal might discourage an open and civil debate.

 

I've taken quite a bit of heat here for being frank and as objective as I can. The number of posters who seem to have taken offense at that, is curious indeed.

 

And like I've said, I appreciate the thread being bump'd to the top of the Forum front page by the flamers because it defeats what they intended to do.

 

Back on thread...

 

 

If I might offer a suggestion.

 

In a way, talking about "flamers" inflames and derails your own thread. Ignore those posts you dislike and engage with those that engage. Ignoring people that are ignorable really hacks them off. :eek: Arguing with people you cannot influence is pointless. Engaging with those you might have an interesting debate with might be worthwhile. So choose what you say better. IMHO. :) Stop grenading if you don't need to and nothing good can come of it. ;):p

 

Jeff

[les37b]

I never added any votes to this poll that seems to be important - but if I had, it would have been an "Excellent". I voted so with my wallet too if that's any indication!

 

I agree that tinned fruit great, but its hardly something to rant about either.

 

Life's too short......

[UKCruiseJeff]

 

I agree that tinned fruit great, but its hardly something to rant about either.

 

Life's too short......

 

Many people do not eat tinned fruit at home and see it a bit of like going camping and might be suprised to hear that others think it OK for Silversea. It just goes to show that one person tinned fruit is another persons suprise.

 

The alternative view.

 

And I didn't rant by the way ............:p

 

Jeff

[Keith1010]

OK.Just read the review.

 

To say there were no flowers at all on the ship is not true. We had them in the Japanese Specialty Restaurant and in Le Champagne. Just double checked my photos although I remembered them. In our suite, we had a live plant with a flower which is actually larger than we have had on other luxury lines.

 

I didn't go to the breakfast buffet (by the way on the line I sail the most breakfast is the same each day) but did go to the lunch buffet each day. While many of the choices were the same, some of the items did vary each day and not just the ones carved/heated. I just looked at my photos.

 

I did offer recommendations though to enhance it in my review.

 

By the pool area they do have lunch.

 

Ice cream available but no specific bar.

 

Made to order omelets available but no omelet station.

 

Yes, no special place for coffee.

 

Hors d'oevres were served. Some nights and some venues more elaborate than others. Times they were offered were pretty much what we are used to from other luxury lines we sailed.

 

Yes, Silversea sells Caviar. We did have it as part of the La Champagne menu. At least one other luxury line does that as well.

 

Sorry it didn't work for you. Not every voyage nor line works for everyone. Certainly that has been our experience.

 

Just wanted to post some things that we saw on the same cruise (flowers, changes of items at the buffet, etc.) that were stated differently in the review.

 

Again, in the end, each person is the one whose opinion matters most and if this doesn't work for someone no sense in spending money to sail on a line they don't care for.

 

Keith

[oregon50]

Kilroy has provided a great service for people considering a first cruise in this category. Azamera, which really should not be listed, proves a few interesting points.

 

Having experienced the other lines, minus Regent, the only surprise is that SB weighs so much over Crystal. If Doug Ward would take time to do for himself what you did for everyone, he would be writing a better book. Between company advertising and his outdated reviews, it's no wonder so many can be disappointed with their choosing Silversea.

[Kilroyshere]

Kilroy has provided a great service for people considering a first cruise in this category. Azamera, which really should not be listed, proves a few interesting points.

 

Having experienced the other lines, minus Regent, the only surprise is that SB weighs so much over Crystal. If Doug Ward would take time to do for himself what you did for everyone, he would be writing a better book. Between company advertising and his outdated reviews, it's no wonder so many can be disappointed with their choosing Silversea.

 

Others have noted that Azamara ought not be in the same comparisons as SS, Seabourn, Regent and Crystal. Fair nuf...I included them because they're a small ship cruise line charging similar price point as SS does.

 

As I stated in my OP, I used mainstream lines I had experience with; SS, Seabourn, Regent, Crystal, Azamara and Regent. As I've stated: I think these lines are all competing for the same cruisers, same cruise dollars and are parallel product akin to Mercedes v. Lexus.

 

I might have included Seadream (former Sea Goddess I & II when Cunard operated them and b4 Carnival purchased Cunard). But I did not include Seadream. Nor did I include Oceana, Ponant, Fathom and other small ship cruise operators.

 

I've found no standard for what is a 'small luxury cruise ship.' SS calls themselves an "Ultra Premium" cruise line, what ever that is sposed' to mean.

 

And therein begs another reason that I'd like to see Cruise Critic compile their cruiser review data in format to compare cruise line to cruise line reviews in each of the many main and sub categories they've assigned star ratings to. I think that would be a very valuable tool when evaluating a cruise line, or a particular ship within a cruise line. Not all ships within a cruise line are equal in the eyes of cruisers.

 

Let consumers decide who to cruise with. And Cruise Critic has IMO valuable data here from other cruisers reviews, that if compiled and were available in a better format for comparative purposes, would be an excellent addition to this site.

 

It's of note that Seabourn reviews herein Cruise Critic no longer include the 3 little sista' ships Spirit, Pride and Legend. I have no data from those reviews and those ships served for several decades. I'd expect the level of personal service, attention to detail, the private shore parties and special event deck BBQ's, 'Rock The Boat' under the stars dinner and entertainment, the marina that opened in the aft of the ship, so many extras everywhere, might have raised SB's already high data grades herein Cruise Critic if those reviews were included.

Edited January 22, 2016 by Kilroyshere

[oregon50]

When has Silversea used "ultra premium " as a description?

[Host Dan]

I really didn't want to contribute to this thread, but feel I need to respond to a few comments. TC2 went on to say that only 5% of cruisers read CC. (Always wondered where that specific number came from, as I've met so many CC members over the years and the MAJORITY don't post, but lurk). Kilroy posted specific percentages and data regarding CC reviews. Please note, these are accurate numbers. Unlike Yelp!, CC does not discount poor reviews and delete them. They are however read before publishing to make sure they don't violate TOS.

As far as Azamara... Why do people discount this line as being less than SS, SB, Regent, Crystal etc? I've sailed on all the luxe lines (including SeaDream, Le Ponant) but not SS. Azamara delivered a luxury experience when I was onboard, even before going to the open bar concept. Comparing the line to Celebrity etc, is just apples to oranges.

My $.02.

Let's move on please?

[CruisinPashmina]

I should stay out of this, but I've gotten out my Pom Poms!

 

I LOVE SILVERSEA. We haven't had a disappointing cruise in 20 years. Some have had more interesting itineraries, but the essentials have always been wonderful.

 

I simply do not understand the purpose of such insistent negativity. Don't like something? Don't do it. Feel an obligation to tell others about what you don't like? And hang on to this position like a dog with a bone? WHY?

 

Makes me think some one doesn't have enough to do.

[lincslady]

I found the statistics interesting, and thanks Dan for confirming that they are correct.

 

I do think now that this thread has gone on long enough; the same thing being said over and over again. I could say a lot more, but will refrain.

[Kilroyshere]

Oregon50;

 

Go to their website and printed materials. There you'll also see descriptors:

 

"Ultra-Luxury," "World Class," "Superior Service," "Top Luxury Cruise Line," The Gold Standard In Luxury Cruising By Which All Others Are Judged," "Best Ultra Luxury Cruise Company," "Intimate Luxury Ships," "Best Premium Cruise Line..."

[Keith1010]

When a similar issue came up on the Crystal board about negative reviews on Symphony and so many people posted about how much they enjoyed their recent cruise I just reminded people why not take the time to write a review because many people do read the reviews. I say the same thing on the Silversea Board. If you are pleased with the product why not write a review and why not do it for each and every cruise. That is what I do.

 

Unlike Trip Advisor (a sister site of Cruise Critic) or reading an Amazon Review or reading Yelp it appears that good or bad the reviews are actually from passengers and not from others who either sail the cruise line or are competitors. You don't always know if that is the case on the other web sites.

 

Other than not having sailed Azamara so I have no opinion I agree with all that Host Dan has said.

 

I have met so many people on board the ships who joined CC, who read it, and who don't post.

 

Interestingly enough, many tell me they enjoy a particular cruise line (the one we are sailing at the time) but they don't post mainly for fear that if they post something positive they will get push back. Now I didn't take a scientific polls so I am just sharing what I have heard.

 

Keith

[oregon50]

Oregon50;

 

Go to their website and printed materials. There you'll also see descriptors:

 

"Ultra-Luxury," "World Class," "Superior Service," "Top Luxury Cruise Line," The Gold Standard In Luxury Cruising By Which All Others Are Judged," "Best Ultra Luxury Cruise Company," "Intimate Luxury Ships," "Best Premium Cruise Line..."

 

I am SHOCKED That SS would ever use "Best premium cruise line" in any printed material. I think of SS as nice premium line, but surprised they would use same description.

[MrsWaldo]

I am SHOCKED That SS would ever use "Best premium cruise line" in any printed material. I think of SS as nice premium line, but surprised they would use same description.

 

 

Those little descriptors are often lifted after winning XXX magazines award, or XXX travel websites award.

 

These type of awards are a dime a dozen and IMHO, especially when it comes to a reader based poll (complete with win a holiday to our place), these results are flawed. I've seen places with 200 rooms win best boutique in magazine competition over places with just 20. The one with 20 won Worlds Best Boutique based on a traveller who compared numerous places (kind of Michelin Style)

 

Having stayed at both properties, in reality there was no comparison, yet hotel 1 was able to call itself Best Boutique Hotel in Australia on its advertising material.

 

In a world where Marketing is such a precise science and companies pay exorbitant amounts to ensure their product is promoted in the way they want, it is hard to get an accurate idea of best fit for you.

 

Statistics are fine, but they only represent the key sample of people who contributed, and in the case of CC, that is the group that are happy to whinge or are review oriented. To have a fair result scientifically you need mohave the same cruiser reviewing each ship for the same itinerary.

 

As an example, Crystal gets 84% loved it. I know I wont love it and wont book it as part of my choice, perhaps sailing with others who do enjoy it I may.

 

Why wont i love it, because I like small ships and 1000 people to me in any confined area is too many. They automatically add an 18% gratuity to spa services, (what if i wasn't happy?) It has set dining times, yes I know there is some flexibility but not on the day.

 

So, after my friend has coaxed me to join them, I come back and give a lower score because the cruise didn't meet what I was looking for. Is that fair on the cruise line?

 

I've been in small boutique island resorts where people have complained there is no nightclub and this has been more than just one time and one set of people, or there was no nearby shopping, or no TV in the room. They clearly did not look at any of the information available, magazine articles, online etc. Had they done that they would know.

 

Similarly I have had people say to me, don't sail with SS or SB, it's all mobility aids and old people. This has not been the case on any of the cruises we have done. In fact my young adult children have always found a small group of people of a similar age on board.

 

So how many reviews can be discounted because people failed to do their homework? How many reviews come about because people have listened to others and gone with their opinions and not their own.

 

I guess in summing up my points are

1. Read and look beyond a number or a vote

2. Work out what you want and go with it

3. Walk in knowing life is never perfect and isn't it great just to be alive and be able to afford to do a trip