Princess should pay for China visa screw-up

[TNTLAMB]

Actually if check back this is not the first time this has happened. There was a similar change back in 2013 and again in 2015. The cruise companies (all of them) waited until the change was actually in effect before changing their policies. the 2015 (June) change for a 24 hour visa although announced didn't take effect (check the celebrity boards)

 

So Princess waited a month to see if it was actually working, so what? Its not worked before.

 

I have travelled in China, frankly I can't imagine NOT having a multi entry visa. They have no slack. delayed ship, illness, late plane, etc too many variables for a limited entry set up.

[WpgCruise]

Governments change policies frequently and sometimes airlines, cruise lines travel providers and individuals get caught.

 

Here's another example. Canada as of March 15, 2015 implemented an Electronic Travel Authorization (eTA). http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/visit/visas.asp

 

Now the Canadian Government have decided to delay implementation. What about those who have applied and paid for the eTA ? Should they get a refund from the airline because the Canadian government postponed implementation ?

 

While no where close to the cost of the Chinese Visa's it is evident policies change, and in this case Princess is dammed if they do and dammed if they don't.

 

I don't really see how Princess benefited by telling people to get a Visa. They were only providing the information they had to the best of their ability.

Edited March 9, 2016 by WpgCruise

[tothemall&beyond]

Personally, I think Princess should not send out emails or information for any visa or documents and leave it up to the passenger to research and know what's required for their nationality and travel and assume 100% of the responsibility. There are too many passengers from too many counties and too many variables. No matter what Princess says or does, they're going to make mistakes. :(

 

 

Yes, Pam, but the problem here is not that Princess was merely sending out emails, advice or information. Princess affirmatively and absolutely required the visa in order for us to board in Singapore. They injected themselves into a position of responsibility. They did not give the passenger the option to "assume the risk". If they had, then no one would have any basis for complaint if they later encountered problems with the Chinese gov't.

[tothemall&beyond]

Well, I suggest to making lemonade out of lemons. Visit other parts of China. China has lots of culture/history and definitely has the best natural scenery. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I heard China visas are good for 10 years now. Doesn't hurt to spend some time to visit another area of China post-cruise. If not, go back another time.

 

 

That would be very nice indeed. But not everyone has unlimited resources for that type of trip. Or perhaps, like my husband and me, have jobs which limit the time they can take off for vacation. Hopefully, we will get to use the visas again. But, we certainly do not need it for this trip which is the only one in China for the foreseeable future.

Edited March 9, 2016 by tothemall&beyond

[tothemall&beyond]

This has been the policy in many cruise lines for many years.

 

A few years back, we had a TA, tell us that we needed a visa for Turkey and Eqypt, for day in port visits only. I knew that was not the case, from prior experience. I contacted the consulates via email and got confirmation in writing from both that no visas were required. I took that with me to the ship. Just in case.

 

Before booking a cruise I would check in to the requirements my self. I would not rely on a TA or a cruise line.

 

You missed a very important fact here: Princess REQUIRED the visa or we would be denied boarding. I did do lots of research and even tried to educate Princess on the results of that research, but they told me I still had to get the visa in order to board.

[tothemall&beyond]

I might not be able to rely on a TA or cruise line for accurate visa information, but I would believe a statement from Princess that says Princess will not let you board the ship in Singapore without a Chinese visa in your passport.

 

Being correct about the need for the visa means nothing if Princess because of a lack of knowledge on their part will not let you board the ship.

 

 

OP here. Thanks, caribill, for completely understanding my point.

[tothemall&beyond]

As other posters have pointed out though, what happens when you correctly determine that you don't need a visa, show up at the ship, and Princess denies you boarding because they mistakenly think you DO need a visa? You'll stand there waving goodbye as the ship leaves without you, is what you'll do.

 

If the cruise line tells you that you need a visa and you shell out hundreds of dollars for it to avoid being left on the pier, only to have the cruise line come back later and say "whoopsie, my bad" I think it's only decent to at least offer some OBC to the passengers who are out that much money for something SOLELY the fault of the cruise line. The passengers in this case were not even remotely at fault. They tried to tell Princess about the new rule and Princess chose to ignore what they were told.

 

I'd be steaming mad and would probably never sail Princess again if this had happened to me. Princess' attitude towards the situation is deplorable.

 

Thank you for your support!!!

[likeadisguise]

Princess has posted in their Facebook account a few times that they were in contact with their Port Agent in Shanghai about the new requirements. Sounds like they wanted to verify exactly what was needed for the new policy before telling people what they'd have to do.

[caribill]

Princess has posted in their Facebook account a few times that they were in contact with their Port Agent in Shanghai about the new requirements. Sounds like they wanted to verify exactly what was needed for the new policy before telling people what they'd have to do.

 

But before "verifying exactly what was needed," Princess did tell people what they had to do --- get a visa.

[likeadisguise]

And once they had verified what was necessary to avoid that visa, they told people. Seems pretty simple.

 

Didn't somebody post on another thread that they actually went to the Chinese Consulate, and were told no such policy existed? Sounds like China doesn't quite have their act together with communicating this.

[pris993]

You missed a very important fact here: Princess REQUIRED the visa or we would be denied boarding. I did do lots of research and even tried to educate Princess on the results of that research, but they told me I still had to get the visa in order to board.

 

If I had to educate Princess I would cancel the trip.

[rubens]

We are booked on the Sapphire Princess’ 4/25/16 Grand Asia sailing. On Thursday night, March 3rd, at just before 8:00 pm, we received an email from Princess informing us that we no longer needed to get Chinese visas for this trip.

 

Princess cited a “new” policy regarding transit travel through Shanghai as the reason. But the notification came long after most of the people on board had already spent approximately $500 per couple for these visas which Princess continually insisted that we have in order to embark the ship.

 

is it possible to get a copy of the mail you received from Princess?

Please copy and paste

[sandyss]

It would be very helpful to those of us on a similar cruise on Celebrity to see a copy of the announcement from Princess about this new 144-Hour Visa Free Policy. So far, Celebrity is sticking to their outdated visa information.

 

Please post a copy of the notification, so that I can pass it on to the reps at Celebrity. If you prefer, you could email it to me at GoneTravelin2 at aol dot com.

 

Thank you so very much.

[kingsgirl]

I really sorry this happened to you. What a frustrating situation to be in!

[CI66774]

I agree it's frustrating. That being said, Princess has stated time and time again in writing it's the pax's responsibility to determine Visa requirements. Even if Princess said you need one, the requirement quickly changed, and Princess didn't follow up, it's still the pax's responsibility. At the end of the day - it's our responsibility regardless of whether Princess' email was out-of-date. Don't expect any kind of compensation but there's no harm in trying.

[frugaltravel]

It sounds like your best forms of protest are 1) sue in small claims court for your costs, and 2) don't book Princess cruises anymore. If one is not willing to take those steps, my guess is it is more just venting than really wanting to take action.

[Pushka]

I agree it's frustrating. That being said, Princess has stated time and time again in writing it's the pax's responsibility to determine Visa requirements. Even if Princess said you need one, the requirement quickly changed, and Princess didn't follow up, it's still the pax's responsibility. At the end of the day - it's our responsibility regardless of whether Princess' email was out-of-date. Don't expect any kind of compensation but there's no harm in trying.

 

 

Its more complex than that if Princess deducts the cost of the visa automatically to your account when they shouldn't have as you didnt need the visa.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Forums mobile app

[coolchan]

Hi we have also had the same problem. It caused a lot of unnecessary stress because it is a lot of money to us and if we didn't need to pay it why should we loose it? We are going on our honeymoon cruise around Asia on the 25th April. When we checked we can apply for our visa upto 90 days before you travel so we wanted to get it sorted. Then three days later after I had paid for mine we got the same notice from Princess. My husband took the money out of his account and asked them.to return his passport but they wouldn't return it and said he needed to pay to have it returned. We couldn't get any answers from the Chinese visa centre or get through to any one. I contacted the travel agency,.Princess and then ABTA. ABTA told me to contact citizens advice and I gave them all the information. They confirmed that Princess are at.fault and we need to do an official complaint to them. They said they have also reported the case to trading standards. If Princess refuse to refund us the visa application fees then to contact CAB and send them my response and they will get involved. I recommend anyone else with this issue does the same and writes a complaint letter to customer relations and also contacts cab with their problem to obtain a reference number. Hopefully in time we will all receive a refund of what we deserve.

[BearX]

We are booked on the Sapphire Princess’ 4/25/16 Grand Asia sailing. On Thursday night, March 3rd, at just before 8:00 pm, we received an email from Princess informing us that we no longer needed to get Chinese visas for this trip.

 

Princess cited a “new” policy regarding transit travel through Shanghai as the reason. But the notification came long after most of the people on board had already spent approximately $500 per couple for these visas which Princess continually insisted that we have in order to embark the ship.

 

Also, this “new” policy is not as new as Princess portends to make it appear. It was actually publicly announced by Chinese officials in mid-December 2015, and went into effect on January 30, 2016.

 

Additionally, as early as the first week of February, people began posting threads on CC about it and trying to get Princess to revise their requirement. Princess continued to deny knowledge of the new policy and to insist that we get the visas, even after people sent written proof of the existence of the new policy. I personally called Customer Relations, and despite giving them very specific details about the change, was told we still needed to have the visas. I took them at their word that there was some reason why. We now know, of course, that there was no such reason.

 

Upon receiving the emails last Thursday, we, and the two other couples with whom we are traveling, each called Princess Customer Relations. We were all firmly and callously told that Princess management had decided to not compensate passengers in any way for the expenses we incurred in obtaining visas we did not need. Their stated reason was because” Princess did not know about it until just now”.

 

But Princess clearly bears responsibility here and owes something more than “too bad, so sad” to its passengers. Princess either knew, or should have known, about the new policy, especially once it was specifically brought to their attention, and should have acted accordingly in revising its requirements for passage. But it did not. Princess can not escape liability by denying knowledge when it was repeatedly put on notice by passengers who seemed to easily be able to ascertain that Princess could not or simply did not.

 

The facts here are as follows:

 

1) Our cruise disembarks in Shanghai.

2) Shanghai is the only port in mainland China which we will enter or exit.

3) Shanghai has long had a "72 hour visa-free transit policy”, but it applied only to travelers transiting through its two airports.

4) BUT, as of January 30, 2016, the visa exemption was extended to be for 144 hours, and would apply to ALL common carrier travel into and out of Shanghai, whether by air, cruise ship or train.

5) The formal, public announcement of the new extended policy had actually been made almost three months ago. Specifically, the formal announcement was made on December 21st, 2015, by Bai Shaokang, the deputy mayor of Shanghai, who publicly declared at a press conference that Shanghai was about to implement the 144-hour visa-free transit policy. It was further announced that the policy had been approved by the State Council and would be put into effect as of January 30th, 2016.

 

As alluded to above, for our situation, the most important change to Shanghai’s visa-free transit policy was the transit point being expanded to no longer be limited to only airports. It would now include all the major cruise ports and train stations in Shanghai, meaning that cruise ship passengers, like us, would also be able to travel visa-free through Shanghai, even on multiple methods of transport.

This was a very big change to the previous policy and it is one which completely negated the need for any of us to obtain Chinese visas for this trip, and to spend nearly $500 in doing so.

 

Moreover, it was something about which Princess, as a huge player in the travel industry, and ever- increasingly so as it continues to expand its China market, should have been fully-informed long before most of us applied for our visas.

 

Indeed, I suspect that with the new Majestic Princess being home-ported in China, someone within the Princess organization was actually actively advocating for this change, which would relax visa requirements and make cruises in China more affordable.

As a lay person without the expertise and resources that are available to a cruise line as prominent as Princess, I would not know about the changes which negated the need for the visas, but it was reasonable for me to rely on Princess to have full and current knowledge in this regard.

 

Other travel-related companies seemed to have been aware of the policy change, and acted accordingly in the best interests of their clients. For example, the website travelchinaguide.com, even published a newsletter about it on December 23, 2015. So did the website for “CNTO China Like Never Before”.

 

Why, then, did it take Princess almost three months to find out about it and change the boarding document requirements? They were actually told about it by many of us!

 

Those of us who have been adversely affected by Princess’ negligence and then total lack of concern, should join together to make our voices heard and to insist upon compensation.

 

Respectfully submitted…

 

Does anyone have a copy of the Princess guidance? I am on Celebrity Millenium disembarking Shanghai 9/29. Celebrity still insists we need a visa.

[nnps]

Can anyone advise as to the current situation? I am on the Diamond Princess docking at Shanghai in October and Princess is still saying that we need to get a Visa for China prior to boarding.

 

Has anyone actually not had a visa and still been allowed to go ashore?

 

I have a UK passport and my wife Australian.

[sandyss]

Can anyone advise as to the current situation? I am on the Diamond Princess docking at Shanghai in October and Princess is still saying that we need to get a Visa for China prior to boarding.

 

Has anyone actually not had a visa and still been allowed to go ashore?

 

I have a UK passport and my wife Australian.

 

You might want to send an email to the documentation officer on your ship, to see if your cruise meets the requirements of the 144 Hour Visa-Free Transit. Also, contact Princess again to find out why they say that your itinerary does not qualify.

 

If you are just docking in Shanghai, what is the previous port and the following port. They would have to be in different countries to qualify.

 

(We are on the Celebrity Millennium, and since our cruise ends in Shanghai, and we return home to the USA from there, we qualify. I will be carrying emails both from Celebrity and the Documentation Officer of our ship.)

[nnps]

Thanks for the input Sandyss. We are in Korea, Shanghai and then Hong Kong. I have read that Hong Kong qualifies as a separate country for the purpose of this ruling.

 

I realise that ultimately it all comes down to Princess's interpretation and whether they will let us board or not. Another killer for us is that we don't have the option of the 10 year visa, only 3 months, essentially this trip only.

[tgwabd]

As far as the Chinese government goes, they go by the ships passenger count, that is why everyone pays through Princess cruise line, they bill Princess.

[emileg]

For what it's worth, Celebrity also appears equally ignorant of the new 144 hour rule.

[nnps]

As far as the Chinese government goes, they go by the ships passenger count, that is why everyone pays through Princess cruise line, they bill Princess.

 

I'm not sure that this applies in this case as we have been informed by Princess that we have to have the visa BEFORE boarding, that it can't be purchased on board (visa for Vietnam can) and that it doesn't matter whether we intend to stay on the ship and not go ashore. At this stage, it appears if we don't have it, they won't let us board in Yokohama.