You Won't Believe NCL's New Contract Waivers

[sanger727]

15 minutes ago, njhorseman said:

Once again...this isn't new contract language, it's been in place for two years, so the poster is expressing concern about a problem that doesn't exist.

 

That doesn't change the fact that in light of this unprecedented global issue that trip insurance prices may go up in the future and if they are concerned about that, it's helpful to know that they can get medical policies without paying for full trip insurance.

[Davechipp74]

Can someone define an act of God? I feel like my attorney would have a field day with such an archaic phrase.  

[njhorseman]

1 hour ago, sanger727 said:

 

That doesn't change the fact that in light of this unprecedented global issue that trip insurance prices may go up in the future and if they are concerned about that, it's helpful to know that they can get medical policies without paying for full trip insurance.

Your medical coverage is also going to be more expensive. As a former actuary, I'd like to point out that the potential exposure on the medical/evacuation/repatriation side of the coverage is potentially far worse and harder to accurately predict than the trip cancellation component. The downside for the insurance company on trip cancellation is relatively modest...a couple of thousand typically, a known relatively modest upper limit. The potential downside for medical, etc. is far worse...the coverage maximums are far higher and harder to predict. Until actual experience is available that allows the companies to accurately estimate the loss potential they have no choice but to price coverage high enough to cover the unknown and potentially high costs.

[njhorseman]

42 minutes ago, DAVECHIPP1974 said:

Can someone define an act of God? I feel like my attorney would have a field day with such an archaic phrase.  

It has a well-established meaning. Not archaic at all.

 

https://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/act_of_god

Edited April 22, 2020 by njhorseman

[sanger727]

48 minutes ago, njhorseman said:

Your medical coverage is also going to be more expensive. As a former actuary, I'd like to point out that the potential exposure on the medical/evacuation/repatriation side of the coverage is potentially far worse and harder to accurately predict than the trip cancellation component. The downside for the insurance company on trip cancellation is relatively modest...a couple of thousand typically, a known relatively modest upper limit. The potential downside for medical, etc. is far worse...the coverage maximums are far higher and harder to predict. Until actual experience is available that allows the companies to accurately estimate the loss potential they have no choice but to price coverage high enough to cover the unknown and potentially high costs.

 

I'm really not sure why you are trying to make an argument here. Nothing I said is false. If you are priced out of trip insurance you can purchase medical only policies at a much lower cost. Sharing information, nothing more. Not interested in discussing NCL's contract or insurance actuary information. The last time I priced out insurance for a large trip; the trip insurance priced out in $300-$400 range. The medical only policy was less than $50. If medical insurance is included in the comprehensive trip insurance and medical prices go up then that won't change the ratio of the trip insurance costing more than a medical only policy.

[njhorseman]

44 minutes ago, sanger727 said:

 

I'm really not sure why you are trying to make an argument here. Nothing I said is false. If you are priced out of trip insurance you can purchase medical only policies at a much lower cost. Sharing information, nothing more. Not interested in discussing NCL's contract or insurance actuary information. The last time I priced out insurance for a large trip; the trip insurance priced out in $300-$400 range. The medical only policy was less than $50. If medical insurance is included in the comprehensive trip insurance and medical prices go up then that won't change the ratio of the trip insurance costing more than a medical only policy.

I'm not arguing,  I'm just sharing information that you can also expect medical-only policies to increase in cost. 

 

[krittykat]

On 4/19/2020 at 8:37 AM, cruiser4801 said:

I realize most of us accept terms and conditions sometimes without reading them, such as those from airlines simply because we are not going to forego anecessary airplane travel based on limitations of liability in contract terms.

 

That being said, I think many people including myself will not go on a cruise based on NCL's new contract terms.  You will find them on NCL's web page at the very botton under Guest Ticket Contract.  Here is link:  https://www.ncl.com/sites/default/files/NCL_Guest_Ticket_Contract_041818.pdf.

 

I don't know what NCL was thinking.  A cruise delay or cancellation due to an Act of God or a terrorist attcak is no longer a basis for a refund.  No way I am signing up for an NCL cruise.

They may say it is not but my travel insurance states terrorist attacks are covered (NCL Standard policy for State of WA). 

 

TRIP CANCELLATION The Company will pay a benefit, up to the maximum shown on the Confirmation of Coverage, if You are prevented from taking Your Covered Trip due to:

(a) Sickness, Accidental Injury or death of You, a Traveling Companion, or Family Member; which results in medically imposed restrictions as certified by a Physician at the time of loss preventing Your participation in the Trip. A Physician must advise cancellation of the Trip on or before the Scheduled Departure Date.

(b) You or a Traveling Companion being hijacked, quarantined, required to serve on a jury, subpoenaed, the victim of felonious assault within 10 days of departure; or having Your principal place of residence made uninhabitable by fire, flood or other natural disaster;

(c) or burglary of Your principal place of residence within 10 days of departure.

(d) You or a Traveling Companion being directly involved in a traffic accident substantiated by a police report, while en route to departure;

(e) A transfer of You by the employer with whom You are employed on the Effective Date that requires Your principal residence to be relocated;

(f) The death or hospitalization of Your Host at Destination;

(g) A Terrorist Incident that occurs in a city listed on Your Trip itinerary and within 30 days prior to your Scheduled Departure Date. Benefits are not provided if the Travel Supplier offers a substitute itinerary. Your Scheduled Departure Date must be no more than 15 months beyond Your Effective Date.

(h) Terrorism in a country which is part of the Trip which causes the United States Department of State to issue a travel warning that the Insured should not travel within that country for a period of time that would include the Trip;

(i) If within 45 days of Your departure, a politically motivated Terrorist Attack occurs within a 50 mile radius of the territorial city limits of the foreign city to be visited by the program for which You have registered and if the United States government issues a travel advisory indicating that Americans should not travel to a city named on the itinerary;

(j) Your Traveling Companion or Family Member, who are military personnel, and are called to emergency duty for a natural disaster other than war.

(k) Strike that causes complete cessation of services for at least 48 consecutive hours.

(l) Weather at the departure site that causes complete cessation of services of the Common Carrier for at least 48 consecutive hours and prevents You from reaching Your destination.

(m) Bankruptcy and/or Default of Your Travel Supplier which occurs more than 10 days following Your Effective Date. Coverage is not provided for the Bankruptcy or Default of the agency from whom the Insured purchased the Land/Sea Arrangements. Your Scheduled Departure Date must be no more than 15 months beyond Your Effective Date. Benefits will be paid due to Bankruptcy or Default of an airline only if no alternate transportation is available. If alternate transportation is available, benefits will be limited to the change fee charged to allow You to transfer to another airline in order to get to Your intended destination.

(n) An Insured is terminated, or laid off from employment subject to five years of continuous employment at the place of employment where terminated.

(o) Natural disaster at the site of Your destination that renders their destination accommodations uninhabitable limited to the cost of the airfare of Your Covered Trip.

[Travelling2Some]

On 4/22/2020 at 9:52 AM, sanger727 said:

 Sharing information, nothing more. Not interested in discussing NCL's contract or insurance actuary information.

Exactly.  Thank you, Sanger727, for the helpful information!  We will all find out sooner or later how this pandemic may or may not affect future travel insurance pricing.  Hopefully it will be a "problem that doesn't exist" but that remains to be seen.  It may also depend on how deep one's pockets are, which obviously varies from person to person.  Thank you again!

[Laszlo]

On 4/22/2020 at 8:21 AM, DAVECHIPP1974 said:

Can someone define an act of God? I feel like my attorney would have a field day with such an archaic phrase.  

I saw an act of God once, it wasn't pretty

[Wendy&Grumpy]

On 4/19/2020 at 7:41 PM, njhorseman said:

 I have no idea where the OP got the wording at the top of the post that he claimed was changed in April 2020. Perhaps it was a contract that predated the April 2018 edition.

 

 

Just came across it so figured I'd come back and share. It's from this document, dated April 2017. 

 

https://www.ncl.com/sites/default/files/FULL_CEBookingConditions_for_bookings_until_31Jan18.pdf

[njhorseman]

1 hour ago, Wendy&Grumpy said:

 

Just came across it so figured I'd come back and share. It's from this document, dated April 2017. 

 

https://www.ncl.com/sites/default/files/FULL_CEBookingConditions_for_bookings_until_31Jan18.pdf

That's an EU document...note the reference to Wiesbaden in the title and ncl.eu being referenced as NCL's website in the first paragraph. The OP was referencing the US contract and incorrectly stating it was something new introduced in April 2020 in response to the pandemic, when in fact the wording was from the April 2018 edition of the contract,  and has not changed.

 

The OP was comparing it to an even older contract dating from, if I recall correctly, 2014.

Edited May 3, 2020 by njhorseman

[Wendy&Grumpy]

4 minutes ago, njhorseman said:

That's an EU document...note the reference to Wiesbaden in the title and ncl.eu being referenced as NCL's website in the first paragraph. The OP was referencing the US contract and incorrectly stating it was something new introduced in April 2020 in response to the pandemic, when in fact the wording was from the April 2018 edition of the contract,  and has not changed.

 

I completely understand what he was referencing, and the fact that his claim is bogus.

 

My response was to your " I have no idea where the OP got the wording at the top of the post ".

 

That document is where he "got the wording at the top of the post" from. Follow the link and scroll down to section 7. Interestingly, he chose to leave off the end of it as well. 😉 

 

 

[njhorseman]

23 minutes ago, Wendy&Grumpy said:

I completely understand what he was referencing, and the fact that his claim is bogus.

 

My response was to your " I have no idea where the OP got the wording at the top of the post ".

 

That document is where he "got the wording at the top of the post" from. Follow the link and scroll down to section 7. Interestingly, he chose to leave off the end of it as well. 😉 

I understand what you're saying.