Gratuities

[Seville2Cabo]

25 minutes ago, PhillyFan33579 said:

If the cruise line includes it in the base cost of the cruise, it now becomes income for the cruise line. I agree with you that gratuities should be included in the cruise fare, but there are huge financial reasons why most cruise lines “pay” their employees using gratuities. 

They would also have to raise the fare more than the tip amount, as they would have to pay commission, taxes / VAT on the higher price.  

[SRF]

7 hours ago, Subman738 said:

Since I don't drink that much and don't use the ships WIFI I would rather have those items broken out as separate items instead of having to pay a higher fare for all inclusive drinks/wifi that I wouldn't get my money's worth from. That is why the cruise lines offer a drinks package and a WIFI package for those who want to partake can purchase those packages up front and not have to worry about those cost during their entire cruise. I do agree that the daily gratuities/daily service charge should be included in the base fare to make things more transparent and straightforward.

 

I agree, even though I normally do get those things.  It is the CHOICE.

[SRF]

7 hours ago, Akkers said:

Fair enough; keep it there. So why do we have to conform to your standards when we cruise in the Caribbean or Mediteranean?

 

Because you are cruising on ships run by a US based company.

 

If you want things to be run like the UK, sail on a UK cruise line.

[SRF]

On 4/3/2022 at 2:12 PM, CaroleSS said:

Maybe tips would raise them up a bit? Or maybe your dining out experience should go up by 35% so they could have a living wage?

 

Yes, like in Denmark.  Where a simple lunch (salad, app and a beer) was $60.

 

Give me tipping. 😄

 

[SRF]

6 hours ago, strickerj said:

I think that depends on where you are in the U.S. I'm not against states and cities imposing higher minimum wages if they so desire, but people in New York, San Francisco, Seattle, etc. petitioning the federal government for a much higher minimum wage don't understand that this would wreck the local economies in areas where the cost of living is lower.

 

Yes.  A HUGE difference in cost of living and income needs for different parts of the country.

 

Look at the locality pay for Federal gov workers.  It ranges from 16% to 43% over your base pay for the same Grade and Step.

 

 

[Akkers]

20 hours ago, rudeney said:

just claim it's racist

I did see something in a video that good looking white females make more on tips than their colleagues from ethnic minorities. Where tips are used to make up minimum wage it can be hugely unfair on minority workers who get less tips because of their race of colour of their skin.

If tipping is practiced mainly on american cruise lines then I will head straight for UK based cruises (eg: Virgin). In fact why bother with cruising at all, I am happy with hotel based holidays where you always know the cost up front and there are usually no hidden extras.

[bucfan2]

7 minutes ago, Akkers said:

 In fact why bother with cruising at all, I am happy with hotel based holidays where you always know the cost up front and there are usually no hidden extras.

And yet you’re reading and commenting on CC….

[CaroleSS]

55 minutes ago, Akkers said:

I am happy with hotel based holidays where you always know the cost up front and there are usually no hidden extras.

Can anyone say "resort fees"?

[SRF]

1 hour ago, Akkers said:

I did see something in a video that good looking white females make more on tips than their colleagues from ethnic minorities. Where tips are used to make up minimum wage it can be hugely unfair on minority workers who get less tips because of their race of colour of their skin.

If tipping is practiced mainly on american cruise lines then I will head straight for UK based cruises (eg: Virgin). In fact why bother with cruising at all, I am happy with hotel based holidays where you always know the cost up front and there are usually no hidden extras.

 

Well, check online for the cultural norms where the hotel is located, unless you are going to remain in the UK.  Even some EU countries have a tipping culture, not a huge tip, but some small tip is expected.

[SRF]

49 minutes ago, CaroleSS said:

Can anyone say "resort fees"?

 

Absolutely.

 

Did Vegas about a year and a half ago.  The resort fee was more than the room rate. 😄

 

[SRF]

1 hour ago, Akkers said:

I did see something in a video that good looking white females make more on tips than their colleagues from ethnic minorities. Where tips are used to make up minimum wage it can be hugely unfair on minority workers who get less tips because of their race of colour of their skin.

 

Was that a properly done study?  Or comparing just a few workers.

 

And in a world view, what makes non-white equal minority?  White is about 20% of the world population.

[Akkers]

58 minutes ago, CaroleSS said:

Can anyone say "resort fees"?

I have not come across 'resort fees' in places I have been to. And I have been to many places in Middles East, North Africa, Mediteranean, Far east etc. Usually I book a holiday with a TA and you pay everything and that is it. The only on-site charge I have come across is a 'City tax' that they charge in Morocco which is a small amount but you do get warned about in advance.

I think non-white people are in a minority in the US where the tipping/minimum wage issue is raised.

[not-enough-cruising]

We have our new ACE,  they are singularly focused and have an answer for everything

[Tree_skier]

16 hours ago, SRF said:

 

Yes, like in Denmark.  Where a simple lunch (salad, app and a beer) was $60.

 

Give me tipping. 😄

 

I remember paying $37 for a burger, fries and a coke in Oslo Noway.  I'll take tipping any day.

[UNCFanatik]

22 hours ago, rudeney said:

If you really want to argue against tipping, just claim it's racist, like this article:

 

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/tipping-jobs-history-slave-wage-cbsn-originals-documentary/

 

Personally, I find the practice of tipping to be a good thing.  It puts me, the customer, in charge of paying for the personalized service I receive.  Instead of having to report exceptionally good or bad service to a manager, I get to express my disappointment or gratitude directly to the person providing the service.  Just as I factor in sales tax (which is 10% or more where I live), I factor in a tip when I eat in a restaurant or use personal services such as getting a haircut or massage.  I even tip when I order carry-out, especially if the person giving me my food takes the time to go through the items ordered and ensure that everything is correct.    

 

The alternative to this is that the restaurant (or cruise line) raises prices by 20% and now the employees are guaranteed a certain wage, like in the fast-food industry.  Imagine the experience of eating a meal at a nice restaurant when the server has the same attitude as the cashier at McDonald's.  I have encountered a few very nice cashiers, but that's the rare exception.  Most of them act like they hate their jobs and customers are a barely acceptable annoyance.  That would make for a very unpleasant meal/cruise.

 

 

Except when you order a drink package online and Royal charges you mandatory gratuity fee upfront before ANY service is rendered. And that fee cannot be removed. Even when you order drinks onboard, a mandatory gratuity is added. The customer is not in charge of anything when gratuity is mandatory. And if you are just drinking bottled beer on a cruise and the bartender just hands you a beer and pops the top, is that REALLY worth 15% of the cost of the beer?

[Tree_skier]

28 minutes ago, SRF said:

 

Well, check online for the cultural norms where the hotel is located, unless you are going to remain in the UK.  Even some EU countries have a tipping culture, not a huge tip, but some small tip is expected.

I'm sure that @Akkers can get a great package holiday down at Essex.  

 

The Virgin comment again is hilarious.  "I'm going to spend $1000 more for the same thing because I don't like how they charge more."

 

He's full of it.  Anyone too cheap to pay the $200 for two people on a 7 day Royal cruise isn't paying an extra $1000 extra to cruise Virgin.

[SRF]

6 minutes ago, UNCFanatik said:

 

Except when you order a drink package online and Royal charges you mandatory gratuity fee upfront before ANY service is rendered. And that fee cannot be removed. Even when you order drinks onboard, a mandatory gratuity is added. The customer is not in charge of anything when gratuity is mandatory. And if you are just drinking bottled beer on a cruise and the bartender just hands you a beer and pops the top, is that REALLY worth 15% of the cost of the beer?

 

The reality, it is service fee, not a gratuity.

 

 

[UNCFanatik]

On 4/3/2022 at 6:46 PM, katiel53 said:

I have to voice my opinion.  I think it is unethical to not tip as I don't want to pay for part of YOUR cruise.  The cruise line has contracts with employees that guarantee a certain income.  When people like you, don't tip, in theory the cruise line has to make it up.  You don't believe for one minute that the cruise line is going to do so out of the goodness of their hearts.  I am already paying enough, with my tips etc so I don't need to contribute to yours..  

 

I do wish that the tips were made a mandatory service charge, so ALL would have to pay unless there were a serious issue that could not be resolved, and that portion of the tip could be removed.  I doubt that you don't eat on the ship, have your cabin cleaned etc.

 

My thought is that if you can't afford to tip, you shouldn't be cruising.  If you went out to dinner at a nice restaurant, would you stiff the waiter?  To me you are abusing the staff by removing your tips.  You wouldn't work for next to nothing, so why should they?   If the cruise line raised their wages to what you consider a livable wage, who do you think is going to pay for it?  It's going to you and me and all others cruising.  That's why I think a mandatory service charge is needed. I know this is just my opinion, and yours is obviously very different.

 

Here we go with the not tipping is unethical line. I guess its ethical for the cruise lines to hire workers from third world countries so they can pay them below living wages? I guess thats all good. 

 

If I went to a nice restaurant and the waiter provided me with terrible service, I would have no issues at all not leaving a tip. 

 

No one is abusing the staff. The staff willfully signed their cruise contracts. 

 

I have no issues with Cruise lines raising their pricing and doing away with add-on gratuities. 

[UNCFanatik]

2 minutes ago, SRF said:

 

The reality, it is service fee, not a gratuity.

 

 

In reality, you can not remove service fees but you and should remove daily auto-gratuities and take control and tip as you see fit. They need to do away with auto-gratuities at the bar. Just raise the base drink prices and stop playing games

[brillohead]

48 minutes ago, Akkers said:

The only on-site charge I have come across is a 'City tax' that they charge in Morocco which is a small amount but you do get warned about in advance.

You're okay with the Morocco charge because you're warned in advance, but you're warned in advance about the auto-grats on Royal and you're NOT okay with that.

Keep on spinning...

Edited April 5, 2022 by brillohead

[Hutcha]

26 minutes ago, UNCFanatik said:

No one is abusing the staff. The staff willfully signed their cruise contracts. 

Again, they willingly signed those contracts knowing that the tips they receive make up the majority of their compensation. You willingly go on a cruise knowing that tipping is expected. If you have a problem with it, don't go.

Complain all you want about the tipping ahead of the service. Don't buy a drink package if it bothers you that much. No one is forcing you.

23 minutes ago, UNCFanatik said:

They need to do away with auto-gratuities at the bar. Just raise the base drink prices and stop playing games

It is not a game. It's been explained many times, but you fail to see the logic (🤯). If they raise the prices, that adds to the reportable income for the cruise line. They would have to raise it more than the 18% grat to make up for it.

 

A point on tipping in general. I'd rather be in a crowded bar that has tipped bartenders vs salaried ones. The fact the a server is counting on your tip, makes them work a little harder. They want the turn over. They want to get that drink or meal in front of you as fast as they can, so they can move onto the next one. A salaried server just needs to move fast enough to not get fired.

 

OH....great game last night 😁

I see a pad lock in this threads future....

Edited April 5, 2022 by Hutcha

[Seville2Cabo]

48 minutes ago, Akkers said:

I have not come across 'resort fees' in places I have been to. And I have been to many places in Middles East, North Africa, Mediteranean, Far east etc. Usually I book a holiday with a TA and you pay everything and that is it. The only on-site charge I have come across is a 'City tax' that they charge in Morocco which is a small amount but you do get warned about in advance.

I think non-white people are in a minority in the US where the tipping/minimum wage issue is raised.

We live part year in Mexico and there is a tipping culture there as well.  So not just the US.  In fact, the baggers at food stores get no salary. Maybe you should go there and protest the less than living wage they make. Their total pay is tips.  

BTW - We, and many locals, tip the butcher and it is not learned from the US as there is little to no English spoken at the butcher shop.

Put me in the category that prefers tipping versus the poor service at restaurants we see in non-tipping countries

[UNCFanatik]

Just now, Hutcha said:

Again, they willingly signed those contracts knowing that the tips they receive make up the majority of their compensation. You willingly go on a cruise knowing that tipping is expected. If you have a problem with it, don't go.

Complain all you want about the tipping ahead of the service. Don't buy a drink package if it bothers you that much. No one is forcing you.

It is not a game. It's been explained many times, but you fail to see the logic (🤯). If they raise the prices, that adds to the reportable income for the cruise line. They would have to raise it more than the 18% grat to make up for it.

 

A point on tipping in general. I'd rather be in a crowded bar that has tipped bartenders vs salaried ones. The fact the a server is counting on your tip, makes them work a little harder. They want the turn over. They want to get that drink or meal in front of you as fast as they can, so they can move onto the next one. A salaried server just needs to move fast enough to not get fired.

 

I see a pad lock in this threads future....

 

AND they willingly sign contracts knowing that the daily auto-gratuities can be removed and are not mandatory. 

 

I willingly go on a cruise knowing that tipping should be controlled by the customer not the company that provides service. It should always be up to the consumer to determine to tip and also how much to tip all based on the service provided. Also, if you want all people that remove the daily auto-gratuities to stop cruising, that would also hurt the crew. 

 

But its just not the drink package, its ALL drinks on board where gratuities are mandatory. Wait, I thought you wanted the crew to get gratuities on drink packages but now you are telling me not to buy a drink package before hand and depriving those crew members that gratuity? You do see the logical inconsistency here, I am sure. 

 

And since gratuities are automatically included on ALL drinks and they are serving a captive audience, the bartenders know they will get gratuities no matter how poor their service is. Again, 18% gratuity for popping a top of a bottle of beer and handing it to me? What level of service and effort was afforded the customer? AND more than like there is tip pooling going on and not broken out per individual. 

[LGW59]

2 minutes ago, UNCFanatik said:

 

AND they willingly sign contracts knowing that the daily auto-gratuities can be removed and are not mandatory. 

 

I willingly go on a cruise knowing that tipping should be controlled by the customer not the company that provides service. It should always be up to the consumer to determine to tip and also how much to tip all based on the service provided. Also, if you want all people that remove the daily auto-gratuities to stop cruising, that would also hurt the crew. 

 

But its just not the drink package, its ALL drinks on board where gratuities are mandatory. Wait, I thought you wanted the crew to get gratuities on drink packages but now you are telling me not to buy a drink package before hand and depriving those crew members that gratuity? You do see the logical inconsistency here, I am sure. 

 

And since gratuities are automatically included on ALL drinks and they are serving a captive audience, the bartenders know they will get gratuities no matter how poor their service is. Again, 18% gratuity for popping a top of a bottle of beer and handing it to me? What level of service and effort was afforded the customer? AND more than like there is tip pooling going on and not broken out per individual. 

tough morning for UNC fanatiks!

[UNCFanatik]

Just now, Seville2Cabo said:

We live part year in Mexico and there is a tipping culture there as well.  So not just the US.  In fact, the baggers at food stores get no salary. Maybe you should go there and protest the less than living wage they make. Their total pay is tips.  

BTW - We, and many locals, tip the butcher and it is not learned from the US as there is little to no English spoken at the butcher shop.

Put me in the category that prefers tipping versus the poor service at restaurants we see in non-tipping countries

Its a different tipping culture in Mexico than the US. For example, people in US are expected to tip taxi drivers.