Connection time advice

[junnipper]

Hi me again, the newbie European traveler. Is a 1h35m connection time in Lisbon arriving 6:00AM departing 7:35 AM an adequate layover time?

Arriving on Air Canada departing TAP PORTUGAL. 

 

[CCWineLover]

54 minutes ago, junnipper said:

Hi me again, the newbie European traveler. Is a 1h35m connection time in Lisbon arriving 6:00AM departing 7:35 AM an adequate layover time?

Arriving on Air Canada departing TAP PORTUGAL. 

 

Lisbon airport is a zoo.  Was just there.  I'd feel comfortable with a bit more time if you can do it.  Especially if you have to go through any passport control.  We had long lines there.

[FlyerTalker]

5 minutes ago, CCWineLover said:

Especially if you have to go through any passport control.

 

Which we have NO way of knowing, since the OP only mentions airlines.

 

We can assume that the inbound will be from either YYZ or YUL - but since TAP flies both intra and extra Schengen, no idea of the ultimate destination.

[CDNPolar]

Think always that your first destination in Europe you will have to get through passport control before you move to your connection flight.  I have only gone through Lisbon once and don't really remember, but that 1h35m is only as good as your first outbound flight being on time.  If your first outbound is on time or early landing then generally that connection time will be ok...  but some airports you have to change terminals as you are arriving from international and going to internal Europe flight.

 

We never book anything less that 2.5 hours for our connection in our first Europe airport.

 

A friend recently booked a Warsaw connection of 1h30m but his Air Canada flight was 1h45m late leaving so his connection was gone before he touched down.

[CILCIANRQTS]

FWIW.

 

https://scottscheapflights.com/guides/the-layover-guide-to-lisbon

[hbtraveler]

Based on our trip this summer to Europe, I think a connection time of 2 hours minimum is needed for most big European airports.  I can't speak for Lisbon, but at Frankfurt and Heathrow this summer, 1:30 wasn't adequate.  While we managed to make both connecting flights, our checked luggage missed them.  So that needs to be a consideration, beyond the usual passport control and (potentially) security lines.

[FlyerTalker]

17 minutes ago, CDNPolar said:

Think always that your first destination in Europe you will have to get through passport control before you move to your connection flight. 

 

Only if you are arriving at an airport in the Schengen zone and your next flight is to another airport within the zone.

 

For example, these routings would NOT go through passport control:

 

JFK - London - Rome

JFK - London - Istanbul

JFK - Paris - Zagreb

 

And yet all those cities aside from New York are in "Europe".

[junnipper]

3 hours ago, FlyerTalker said:

3 hours ago, CCWineLover said:

Especially if you have to go through any passport control.

 

Which we have NO way of knowing, since the OP only mentions airlines.

 

We can assume that the inbound will be from either YYZ or YUL - but since TAP flies both intra and extra Schengen, no idea of the ultimate destination.

Oh sorry, here is my itinerary: Halifax to Montreal to Lisbon then Florence. 

I appreciate your help. 

 

[junnipper]

1 hour ago, CILCIANRQTS said:

FWIW.

 

https://scottscheapflights.com/guides/the-layover-guide-to-lisbon

Thank you Cilcianrqts. I did do a search for information on connection time in Lisbon but this didn't show up. If I am understanding correctly where I arrive from Canada, connect in Lisbon and end in Florence an hour is enough time. 

 

 

To make an international to international connection: 1 -2.5 hours

If you are traveling on to another Schengen country, you will connect in the same terminal as you arrive. An hour is a comfortable connection time. If you are traveling to a country outside of Schengen where you might need to go through security again, such as the US, 2.5 hours is safe. 

[FlyerTalker]

46 minutes ago, junnipper said:

Oh sorry, here is my itinerary: Halifax to Montreal to Lisbon then Florence. 

I appreciate your help.

 

You will do inbound Schengen immigration at LIS.  You will then do customs (red lane/green lane) at FLR.  And FWIW, you will often see "Florence" as "Firenza" which is the Italian spelling.

[mariavii]

2 hours ago, hbtraveler said:

but at Frankfurt and Heathrow this summer, 1:30 wasn't adequate.

 

At Heathrow our 5 hour layover was barely enough in June!

[junnipper]

1 hour ago, FlyerTalker said:

 

You will do inbound Schengen immigration at LIS.  You will then do customs (red lane/green lane) at FLR.  And FWIW, you will often see "Florence" as "Firenza" which is the Italian spelling.

I am very thankful for your help. Firenza was a great point which I would have been oblivious to! I think I will roll the dice with the 1h 30m connection. Every other connection is 2h-2h30m so I don't feel it worthwhile to pay to upgrade to Air Plus.... besides the flights could still change. 

[Azulann]

Asking  for advise on the  the longest layover  allowed  on one ticket? Thinking  of  layover in AMS from:Copenhagen  to AMS to MSP. I can find 15  and 17hrs layover in AMS on KLM/DL. We could  get into AMS in early evening go to  airport hotel nearby and get on the outbound flight at 9:45 am next morning  to MSP. Does KLM keep our checked luggage?  After a wonderful cruise and post extension this would add a easy way to return home. Refreshed and not rushed.

this trip is in June of 2023.

Edited August 24, 2022 by Azulann

[DGHOC]

I'm not sure what the state of play is in the US re airlines and airports but in Europe it's grim at the moment. My daughter recently flew from Paris to Hawaii via LHR and LAX. Every flight was delayed, missed or cancelled both going and coming back through San Fran. In some cases she had an expected layover of 5 hours and still the flight was missed.

 

I will avoid anything but direct flights at the moment and avoid LHR and BA like the plague!! If a direct flight is not poss then I'll definitely allow plenty of time between flights and go grab a leisurely breakfast or lunch. Flying is just too stressful at the moment.

[FlyerTalker]

50 minutes ago, Azulann said:

Asking  for advise on the  the longest layover  allowed  on one ticket? Thinking  of  layover in AMS from:Copenhagen  to AMS to MSP. I can find 15  and 17hrs layover in AMS on KLM/DL. We could  get into AMS in early evening go to  airport hotel nearby and get on the outbound flight at 9:45 am next morning  to MSP. Does KLM keep our checked luggage?  After a wonderful cruise and post extension this would add a easy way to return home. Refreshed and not rushed.

this trip is in June of 2023.

 

On an international itinerary, you can have a connection time of 24 hours or less (or the first available flight for routes without daily service).  This keeps it as a "connection", so you still have a through fare from A to C, with the connection at B.

 

If the time is over 24 hours, you no longer have a "connection" but you have a "stopover".  This now "breaks" the fare into two separate components, which get added together to find the price.  So your results would be:

 

CPH to AMS (less than 24 hours time) to MSP = through fare between CPH and MSP.

 

CPH to AMS (more than 24 hours time) to MSP = combination fare of CPH to AMS and AMS to MSP added together.

 

As for the luggage, that is up to the operating carrier.  At a number of airports, they will keep the luggage as a matter of course (HKG and SIN come to mind right away).  At most others, you have to collect the bags at the intermediate point (including virtually all USA airports).  You would have to check with KL - given the many issues at AMS right now, I would assume they won't do it now, and who knows into the future.

 

The "under 24 hour" rule is a great little trick on international trips.  For domestic USA flights, it's 4 hours or first flight, which makes it a bit more difficult to use, but still something to remember.

 

Last thing to remember -- unless you are at some specific airports with connection and stopover programs, you are on the hook for your lodging.  In contrast, there are airlines/airports that have free stopover programs (meaning keeping the through fare) which may include free lodging and tours at their hub.  Some that you might consider for your trip include Madrid, Lisbon, Dublin, Reykjavik, Istanbul and Abu Dhabi - all of which have programs up and running in 2022.  These stopovers can be for various durations, sometimes as much as six days  Cities that have had these in the past include Helsinki, Zurich, Brussels, Amsterdam, Paris, Dubai, and Toronto, so you may want to investigate further.   They are a great way to add other locations to your vacation.

 

Feel free to post any other questions you might have on this concept.

[FlyerTalker]

46 minutes ago, DGHOC said:

I will avoid anything but direct flights at the moment

 

Please remember that there is a difference between a "direct' flight and a "non-stop" flight.

 

Non-stop means just that - no stops between point A and B.

 

Direct means that there is no change of flight number between A and B.  But you could stop many times between A and B, as long as there is no change of flight number, and it would still be "direct".

 

FWIW, Southwest has a direct flight from Baltimore to Oakland that makes SEVEN stops along the way, but it would still be sold as a "Direct" flight because it's the same flight number all the way.

[FlyerTalker]

ADDENDUM:

 

It's a bit too late to edit the above post, but I omitted a key phrase. 

 

Instead of "24 hours or less (or the first available flight for routes without daily service)", it should have been:

 

24 hours or less, OR the first available flight - whichever is longer.  (the latter is mostly applicable for routes without daily service, but not always).

 

So you get at least 24 hours for an international connection, but you can have more if it's the first flight out to the next stop in the itinerary.

 

And for domestic itineraries, the same thing.  4 hours or first flight - whichever is longer.

 

Sorry for leaving that out.

[LindaS272]

Icelandair has done a free stopover at Reykjavik for up to a week for years.

Edited August 25, 2022 by LindaS272

[DGHOC]

Thanks for your detailed post FlyerTalker. I stand corrected and fully admit I have absolutely no knowledge of the technicalities and correct terminology of flying..

 

To correct my post - I will only take non stop flights now and I'd still avoid LHR and BA like the plague. If forced to take multi stop flights, I'd leave a very lengthy gap between each. The recent stories from friends and family would make you weep; no one needs that hassle to go on holiday or travel with business.

[CCWineLover]

as far as Lisbon is concerned, to add one more possible nuance  . .

The airport is old and doesn't have enough gates for all the planes arriving and departing, so there are numerous planes (we saw possibly 30-60) that have to park out on the tarmac.  Then they bring buses out to ferry passengers back to the terminal and bring passengers from the terminal to the plane by bus.  (Have seen this at Heathrow as well).  If that happens to you, it can easily add 30 minutes extra or more . . .

[DGHOC]

CCWineLover, honestly anything is possible at Heathrow at the moment. I wouldn't be surprised if a horse and cart was ferrying passengers out to their planes. It's always been a brilliant airport, what a nightmare at the moment!

[janetcbl]

1 hour ago, DGHOC said:

CCWineLover, honestly anything is possible at Heathrow at the moment. I wouldn't be surprised if a horse and cart was ferrying passengers out to their planes. It's always been a brilliant airport, what a nightmare at the moment!

…or not, depending on luck, and luck alone. We managed plane landing to hired car in under 45 minutes; others on our cruise much longer times. I think this is true of every major airport these days. These days it is necessary to pack an infinite supply of patience.

[DGHOC]

You were extraordinary lucky janetcbl!! When did you travel through it? That said, we were through super quickly in May but that's when the chaos really hit.

 

This summer has been truly awful with hundreds of flights being cancelled, frequently when passengers are at the departure gate. I think hell will freeze over before we use BA again, (well unless we have no other options! 😉) Jeez, oh for the good old bad old days. 

[janetcbl]

4 hours ago, DGHOC said:

You were extraordinary lucky janetcbl!! When did you travel through it? That said, we were through super quickly in May but that's when the chaos really hit.

 

This summer has been truly awful with hundreds of flights being cancelled, frequently when passengers are at the departure gate. I think hell will freeze over before we use BA again, (well unless we have no other options! 😉) Jeez, oh for the good old bad old days. 

The end of June. As I mentioned, I think it was all due to luck, not planning.

[oskidunker]

Bilbao Spain to Frankfurt on Lufthansa. Frankfurt to San Francisco on United. Oct 20, 2023. Thursday. Have one hour connection. Prepared for the worst. Do you think we will make it? I know they are both in the same terminal. All checked luggage.