Rhine water levels 2024 and similar topics

[Nippy Sweetie]

Easy direct travel between Edinburgh and Kings Cross. No need to change. Quite quick too. Probably works out the same as flying by the time you add in getting to the airport in Edinburgh and getting to London from Heathrow. 

Edited April 4 by Nippy Sweetie

[notamermaid]

2 hours ago, Nippy Sweetie said:

Probably works out the same as flying by the time you add in getting to the airport in Edinburgh and getting to London from Heathrow. 

I went from Heathrow to central London before the shuttle train existed. What a journey.

 

To get from home to my river cruise in Passau I could have travelled to Cologne and flown to Munich from there. Or Frankfurt to Munich. I did not see the point, train ride was convenient. Not without fretting about not getting the connecting train but still fine.

 

I like that Riviera Travel offers river cruises from Cologne. One can fly into Düsseldorf or Cologne airport but I think Düsseldorf has the better international connections. Frankfurt airport is on the Main river but the connections to the Rhine area are so frequent that I would always consider this as an alternative airport to get to many parts of the Rhineland.

 

notamermaid

 

 

[notamermaid]

The sun is shining brightly on the river cruise ships today, a slightly cloudy, lovely day for sailing and a bit better weather for the passengers of the MS Amina on her first proper river cruise itinerary. The inaugural cruise with her christening was only three days and partly a rainy experience. Still, a fun time was surely had by the dignitaries and industry guests (and some folk the likes of you and me). Matthias Morr, a youtube travel blogger, covered the christening in a live stream and also took his followers along on a walk through Koblenz. Kind of weird to see my "shopping turf" from that perspective.

 

Another river cruise ship is ready to be photographed in spring sunlight, the MS Gentleman. She is now signalling in Heusden in the Netherlands. She is a Dutch ship. More on that in another post.

 

notamermaid

 

PS: River water levels all good.

 

[notamermaid]

The past week was the high time for the pink cherry blossoms in Bonn (and elsewhere). Saturday was a beautiful day and apparently Bonn Altstadt was packed. There was a flea market and everyone wanted to see the blossoms.

 

You can see the flowers in other parks and streets along the Rhine of course as well, just a few more days.

 

The proper white cherry blossoms of the fruit trees also look pretty. Now it is the apple orchards that follow with their bloom.

 

Koblenz will have a spring market weekend from 12 to 14 April. There are many other small festivals in the Rhine towns and villages. Perhaps you will stumble upon one when on your river cruise. Filsen in the Rhine Gorge is known for its cherry orchards and has a cherry tree trail but the village is not a stop for river cruise ships. It can be reached from Boppard by ferry.

 

notamermaid

 

 

 

[notamermaid]

Forecast for river levels still looks good for at least a week so let us have a look at a ship.

On 4/7/2024 at 2:00 PM, notamermaid said:

Another river cruise ship is ready to be photographed in spring sunlight, the MS Gentleman.

We talked about the ship more than a year ago when the proud company announced it and now it is ready to sail. The big difference with the MS Gentleman is that she has not been built by the Vahali shipyards and she does not belong to a "normal" river cruise company or fit into an existing fleet of an owner or lease company like Scylla in Switzerland. The company is actually an operator of commercial transport ships. This is their first venture into river cruising (setting up a separate company for that). In spring and summer the MS Gentleman will sail for 1A Vista Reisen. It appears from the website of that river cruise operator that she will sail after the christening which will be in May. It is not clear when exactly and where it will take place. Heusden on the Meuse is the home of Teamco shipyards that last year built a river cruise ship for Amadeus Flusskreuzfahrten, the Riva. The company delivers about one river cruise ship per year, but appears to have been busier with river cruise ships in the past. Another charter this summer is done by Thurgau Travel in Switzerland. That river cruise operator offers the "Southern runs", i.e. starting and/or ending in Basel.

 

I am looking forward to seeing this ship on "my" river. I kind of think it does look a bit "male" in the interior design. Will be doing even more ship spotting to try and see this brain child of Arjan Van Loon and his children in May/June.

 

notamermaid

 

[Peribit1]

I am considering a Rhine River cruise at the end of August. Any suggestions or concerns that I should consider (other than the hot weather)?

Thanks

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[notamermaid]

2 hours ago, Peribit1 said:

Any suggestions or concerns that I should consider (other than the hot weather)?

Hmmm, I cannot really think of anything. The busy weekend of Rhine in Flames is at Oberwesel on 14 September and the big one at Koblenz is earlier than your time frame. Public holidays I am not aware of - those may impact on shopping and other activities. But do check dates yourself: https://www.feiertagskalender.ch/index.php?geo=0&jahr=2024&hl=en

 

You may bump into a wine festival which generally is a plus but could alter a schedule in a port.

 

River levels tend to be okay, but no way of planning that.

 

Crowds are there and rafting of river cruise ships will happen. But that is not confined to August.

 

Has anyone any thoughts?

 

notamermaid

 

[Peribit1]

1 hour ago, notamermaid said:

Hmmm, I cannot really think of anything. The busy weekend of Rhine in Flames is at Oberwesel on 14 September and the big one at Koblenz is earlier than your time frame. Public holidays I am not aware of - those may impact on shopping and other activities. But do check dates yourself: https://www.feiertagskalender.ch/index.php?geo=0&jahr=2024&hl=en

 

You may bump into a wine festival which generally is a plus but could alter a schedule in a port.

 

River levels tend to be okay, but no way of planning that.

 

Crowds are there and rafting of river cruise ships will happen. But that is not confined to August.

 

Has anyone any thoughts?

 

notamermaid

 

Thanks for the link and the info.  Sounds okay, nothing in particular to be concerned about.  I do expect a lot of crowds in Europe in August.

Pat

 

[notamermaid]

The water levels continue to be good. After dry and warm days the weather is now changing and the rain next week should bring the level at Kaub over 250cm again, staying any under levels that could indicate flooding in the near future. 208cm is the long-term mean so you can look forward to continued very pleasant sailing on "my" river.

 

So let us have look at the islands in the river again this year. Tons of them about and one section of it has actually been dubbed the "Inselrhein", that is between Mainz and Bingen, as there are so many islands close together. Many are uninhabited (by humans), some are designated nature reserves or have another protected status, a few are peninsulas due to interference by humans, others are inhabited and one is a separate administrative entity, i.e. a proper village.

 

One very interesting one historically is up there in Switzerland. No need for a moat or artificial way of creating a recluse - just use the mighty Rhine. Rheinau with its former monastery: https://www.myswitzerland.com/en/destinations/rheinau-abbey-island/

While this a distance from Basel and other places in Switzerland are more popular, with good reason, for extensions, I have long thought that it would be nice if a company could put a bigger focus on the upper reaches of the Rhine beyond Basel. The nearby Rhine Falls are not massive compared to others in the world but the scenery is nevertheless stunning. It is a different aspect of the Rhine that is worth seeing to "complete" the picture of this river in Europe I find.

 

notamermaid

 

 

 

[Canal archive]

Notamermaid what a super analogy MS Gentleman, inside design ‘looks a bit male’  wonderful! 

[euro.]

Hello! Looking to cruise along the Rhine & Danube the 1st half of August, and would like to know more about/what to expect with river levels and experiences in the case of ship switches/bussing. I know it's hard to predict the weather but any insight would be helpful in dissuading concerns of a ruined trip!

 

Please advise any other threads I should look at for tips! Thanks in advance.

[notamermaid]

Hello and welcome to Cruisecritic. I will start with this.

2 hours ago, euro. said:

Please advise any other threads I should look at for tips!

Last year's Rhine thread, perhaps start on page 10 and work your way forward: https://boards.cruisecritic.com/topic/2910181-rhine-water-levels-2023-and-similar-topics/page/10/

As you are also interested in the Danube, here is the thread, I have given you page 13 as a start: https://boards.cruisecritic.com/topic/2910185-danube-water-levels-2023-and-similar-topics-plus-tips-and-info/page/13/

 

Both give you an idea of the conversations we have had. For logistics of ship swaps the roll calls of last year, mainly the Viking Rhine Getaway and the Grand European, tell you how the ship swaps work and how people felt about it. The Viking roll calls are the most active. Many people prefer just to post there, not on the main river cruising board (i.e. this one you are on now reading this thread).

 

You are right about unpredictability but we can look at statistics that help a little to narrow it down and put into perspective. More on that in another post.

 

notamermaid

 

[notamermaid]

The Rhine as regards water levels is the "easier" of the two rivers to sail in August, but there can certainly be low water.

 

8 hours ago, euro. said:

Looking to cruise along the Rhine & Danube the 1st half of August

So let us have a look at the Danube. Track record of first half of the month in:

2018 - no sailing of 135m ships possible in the shallow parts of Germany, bad in Hungary as well.

2019 - not too bad, sailing restricted, Hungary was okay as far as I know.

2020 - bad start, fine from 5 August

2021 - perfect

2022 - see 2018

2023 - perfect

 

For further info on how to almost avoid this see here: https://boards.cruisecritic.com/topic/2984995-danube-water-levels-2024-and-similar-topics-plus-tips-and-info/page/2/

post #48 and #49.

 

notamermaid

 

 

[euro.]

6 hours ago, notamermaid said:

Hello and welcome to Cruisecritic. I will start with this.

Thank you so much @notamermaid!! I really appreciate the references and input.

 

It definitely seems like a mixed bag of experiences, but in general, people only had one or two ship swaps. That's encouraging!

 

I'm getting the sense that it is difficult to get a totally accurate prediction until the weeks leading up to the cruise. In the meantime, I'll keep reading through these threads and then follow up closer to the cruise dates for a better idea of water levels.

[euro.]

1 hour ago, notamermaid said:

The Rhine as regards water levels is the "easier" of the two rivers to sail in August, but there can certainly be low water.

I had no idea the Danube would be more finicky! Good to know. Hopefully it will be a repeat of 2023 and will be "perfect"! 

[Host Jazzbeau]

1 hour ago, euro. said:

I'm getting the sense that it is difficult to get a totally accurate prediction until the weeks leading up to the cruise.

Often the levels are close enough to the cusp that it can change from one day to the next!

 

[Canal archive]

I think any river can have a hissy-fit I’m sure that’s why the old boatmen being superstitious named them to Saints or beings that they thought were good to look over them. Some are recognisable but some not such as Old Father Thames and Sabrina Celtic goddess for the Severn.

Very useful if anything went wrong who else but a God or Goddess to blame.

Edited April 16 by Canal archive

[notamermaid]

12 hours ago, Host Jazzbeau said:

Often the levels are close enough to the cusp that it can change from one day to the next!

 

Indeed. The abysmal year of 2018 seems to have brought in more awareness with companies that people prefer to be informed prior to sailing and from what I have gathered there have been more notifications and e-mails sent to passengers. Also, passengers are generally more aware of what may be in store. However, it is not a given that you will be informed or that the company can inform you. Say you leave on 10 August to a cruise starting in Amsterdam and all river levels are fine. You sail the Rhine and by the time you are on the Main river the weather is really dry and the level in the Danube drops. A hydrologist may have been able to tell you of the risk on 9 August but neither he nor the company can tell you for sure on 11 August that you cannot sail on 14 August. It really depends on what level the river is at when you leave on 10 August and then you can still not be certain either way. Likewise it is the same coming from Budapest and then finding the Rhine is too low. We have had passengers report that the captain announced in the morning that they would not be able to sail the Danube (at Pfelling) the same evening. Lots of scenarios...

 

 

13 hours ago, euro. said:

I had no idea the Danube would be more finicky!

It is not an exact science but usually both rivers are low in a similar time frame as we share weather patterns overall. However, the "cut-off point" for sailing or not sailing on the German Danube is often reached before the corresponding level on the German Rhine (in the Rhine Gorge that is). An important difference between the two rivers is that on the Rhine the shallow area just extends in length as the river level drops whereas on the Danube you get two shallow sections, first one in Germany and then one in Hungary around Budapest (scenarios further down from Hungary I am not familiar with, low water happens there as well though).

 

Major ways of avoiding both Rhine and Danube shallows: 1. Choose a route that does not include Pfelling (mentioned before and explained in the Danube thread).

2. Do not choose a "Grand European" itinerary.

3. Choose a route that does not include the Rhine Gorge (which you may prefer to keep in the itinerary because it is the most scenic part (tough luck!)).

4. Choose a 110m ship over a 135m ship. As a rule of thumb that gives you a tiny advantage of lower draft and could be the difference between sailing and not sailing.

 

Finally, my "disclaimer". I cannot and will not give figures of when ships cannot sail. That is a range of figures depending on each individual ship and its captain and may even vary going upstream or downstream. However, from past years' experiences and authorities commenting in the news I will give hints and tips about it when the rivers get low. Flooding is different so there are figures declared by authorities to be the maximum when ships are allowed to sail. Just before that level for a specific section of river is reached captains know a river traffic ban will be issued.

 

Another problem if you want to call it that is, by the way, the fact that as the river level drops on the Rhine, so do the landing stages and the available water for the ship hull at the embankments. You may have to dock away from the prime spots.

 

@euro. I am taking the liberty of using your question to put a bit more statistics in the Danube thread.

 

notamermaid

 

 

 

[notamermaid]

8 hours ago, Canal archive said:

Saints or beings that they thought were good to look over them

Going back all the way to the Celts: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rhenus_Pater

Rhenus bicornis of the Romans, a sculptured head: https://www.rheinische-geschichte.lvr.de/Epochen-und-Themen/Themen/der-rhein-im-denken-der-roemer/DE-2086/lido/5d63a243246c37.82044604

The two horns are said to represent the fact that the Rhine has two branches in the Netherlands.

 

notamermaid

 

 

[Canal archive]

At one end of and top of the arch of a bridge in Bath there is the head of Old Father Thames and at the other the head of Sabrina supposedly so that the boatmen knew which river they were heading towards.

[notamermaid]

20 hours ago, notamermaid said:

An important difference between the two rivers is that on the Rhine the shallow area just extends in length as the river level drops whereas on the Danube you get two shallow sections, first one in Germany and then one in Hungary around Budapest (scenarios further down from Hungary I am not familiar with, low water happens there as well though).

To the length of the problem on the Rhine. The shallowest section is around Kaub so that there is in effect only a stretch of about 30km that needs bridging in a coach and with a ship swap. That is in the Rhine Gorge. But the nature of the river and it logistics makes it difficult just to do 30km. So you can use a landing stage at Rüdesheim and at Braubach or Lahnstein, which extends the process to something like 45km. You can look up the exact distances by looking at the Rhine kilometres. With so many ships needing docking locations that scenario will only work for a few ships at any one time. Next solution is Mainz to Koblenz when Rüdesheim is full or too shallow. The shallow part extends upstream first, then downstream. So most of the time Rüdesheim, Speyer, Mainz, etc. and then at the other end Koblenz will be your ports of call. It gets more complicated to organize with longer distances, so depending on excursion and company, the ship swap is not just 90 minutes by coach (the driving time through the Gorge) but up to six hours or a real day trip.

 

How long can the situation last? The river being too shallow can be a time frame of 12 hours to one week (and more, like in 2018). It happens every year for commercial shipping, that means barges and tankers adjust their load. The impact on river cruising differs every year, there have been a few years when the level was good enough for all ships to sail through the Rhine Gorge. River cruise ships with a length of 105m or less can almost always sail without problems.

 

notamermaid

 

 

 

[Izengolf]

I have broken 2 of your points of advice with my itinerary by going through the Rhine Gorge twice as we go from Frankfurt to the Moselle and back on a 135m ship. The anticipation is part of the adventure!

[notamermaid]

5 hours ago, Izengolf said:

I have broken 2 of your points of advice with my itinerary by going through the Rhine Gorge twice as we go from Frankfurt to the Moselle and back on a 135m ship. The anticipation is part of the adventure!

That's right, just ignore advice! Seriously, most of the time things go well and the comfort of the ships and the delight of seeing the Rhine Gorge is worth the risk. An adventure that will most likely be an amazing trip without interruption, especially as you are going in July. I hardly ever spotted the Crystal ships on the river so I guess it will not look too weird to see the ex-Crystal Bach on my river with her slightly changed livery. Luxury in store for you in July.

 

If anyone is interested in the takeover: https://www.travelweekly.com/River-Cruising/Uniworld-charter-two-former-Crystal-river-ships

 

The stop in Karlsruhe is unusual on your itinerary, one of those places I called "beyond the standard": https://boards.cruisecritic.com/topic/2516698-rhine-beyond-the-standard-ports/

 

notamermaid

 

[Izengolf]

I read that advice too late I'm afraid. They had a super sale on and we jumped without looking 😊

 

Thank you, that is really interesting about Karlsruhe. The only excursion at that stop is a day trip to Baden-Baden so I must get on reading Dostoyevsky's The Gambler before visiting!

Edited April 17 by Izengolf

[notamermaid]

Hmm, looking at the list of ports in the thread "Beyond the standard ports" I notice Neuwied again. They are still no further with their plans from what I have heard as there are legal hurdles I did not know about. Those have been explained to me recently by a local. The details had not made it into the newspapers.

 

So back to the statistics. Autumn is the most likely time to have low water on the Rhine, but it can happen from July onwards. For commercial traffic low water is declared when the level on Kaub gauge reaches 150cm. You may see articles in business papers reporting on it. That has no impact on sailing for river cruise ships as regards draft, which means other than perhaps going a bit more slowly and carefully and having the odd difficulty at a low landing stage things will be fine.

 

Kaub gauge goes down further basically every year, sometimes a lot. I do not want to go into details but just in case someone says to you "I went on a river cruise in 2018, it was awful" I would like to explain this most abysmal year for river cruising (whoever says to you "awful" is right). 2018 has been the worst year ever in river cruising and commercial traffic had an awful year, too. Apart from the curiosity factor (no consolation) the year was bad for locals, too. We had the driest and hottest weather for a long, long time and in that autumn Kaub got a new historical record for low water. River cruising came almost to a standstill. No ship of 110m(!) length made it through the Rhine Gorge for days and the 135m ships, well, I do not remember details, but they did not sail for some time. No chance. The river being so low the shallow section extended further than Mainz. This is the year at Kaub, the second half of 2018 the figures were in double digits only for a long time:

 

Just to explain again, these figures are the gauge, a marker at the side of the river. To get the depth of the navigation channel, captains "translate" this into the real figures.

 

The record was declared by the authorities on 22 October 2018 to be 25cm.

 

notamermaid