Flights with codeshare - American

[planitohio]

We are flying this Fall home from a cruise.  We have business class booked on American - all one ticket.  It goes from Venice to Madrid, Madrid to Charlotte.  The Venice to Madrid is listed as economy, because of the plane being used (Iberia I believe).  I've been able to find things indicating that we can check two bags (if needed) through - as the main (overseas flight) will dictate.  But what about the carryon.  The one listed for the Venice to Madrid hop would show on that airline as being smaller and lighter than what is allowed on the overseas flight.  

 

Thank you for any help you can provide.  

[Globaliser]

34 minutes ago, planitohio said:

We have business class booked on American - all one ticket.  It goes from Venice to Madrid, Madrid to Charlotte.  The Venice to Madrid is listed as economy, because of the plane being used (Iberia I believe).

 

I think that Iberia aircraft on this route should have business class, so if you have to fly economy you will want to check whether you have actually been booked on to a Vueling-operated flight.

 

Whichever it turns out to be, your safest approach is to assume that each operator will apply its own rules for cabin baggage. In other words, organise yourself to comply with the most restrictive rules.

[Zach1213]

Yeah, I usually find that the operating carrier rules over the cabin baggage and there's little wiggle room on that part. I always plan my cabin baggage around the most restrictive carrier and would recommend you do as well. 

[planitohio]

Ok

I double checked and it is Iberia. They do have a business class on this flight. Even though the other three legs are in business, this piece is in economy. I’m confused as to why that would be. Does it seem right that we should be able to check two bags (so essentially checking our carryon) as there is an international piece?

[Globaliser]

1 hour ago, planitohio said:

I double checked and it is Iberia. They do have a business class on this flight. Even though the other three legs are in business, this piece is in economy. I’m confused as to why that would be.

 

The obvious first guess is on that flight, business class has no availability in the booking class that you need. There are other possible reasons, but one would need to have a lot more information to try to work it out.

 

1 hour ago, planitohio said:

Does it seem right that we should be able to check two bags (so essentially checking our carryon) as there is an international piece?

 

Venice-Madrid and Madrid-Charlotte are both international, but that doesn't necessarily mean that you can check any bags, let alone two. There are plenty of international fares that come with no checked bags, or with only one checked bag included. You have to find out what the included baggage allowance is for what you've bought, and in particular whether you'll have two bags even on the flight on which you're booked in economy, which may depend on the reason why you were booked in economy.

 

But really you should have been told all this before you paid for the tickets.

[FlyerTalker]

Further....if you bought this ticket through your cruiseline, do not just accept whatever the cruiseline says about the ticket, baggage or carry-ons.  The only true answers are what you would get from the airline(s) directly.  Also note that there can be significant differences between what the marketing and operating carriers may say.  As noted above, it is the operating carrier that determines your carry-on allowance.

 

Also,  you are on one ticket if you have only one 13 digit ticket number covering all your flights.  Having a single 6 character locator does not guarantee that.

 

Caveat emptor.

 

 

[planitohio]

I bought it online on AA and do have one 13 digit number for the four flights (one over and three back). The receipt specifies the bags for the flight over, but makes no mention of any bags for any of the return segments. The segments ticketed are:

  TPA-LGW

  VCE-MAD

  MAD-CLT

  CLT-CLE

 

All are business except VCE-MAD. All are AA numbered flights. British Air is the carrier over and Iberia the first on the return. 

[Globaliser]

I can't work out what's happened to cause one sector to be booked in economy. I'm only working with random dates, but even if I allow VCE-MAD to be priced in economy, specifying business for MAD-CLT-CLE forces VCE-MAD to be booked into business (and even then, that trick only produces an IB code for VCE-MAD, and it can't be booked on an AA code).

 

So I think that you need to find out from AA what baggage allowance is written on your ticket for each of the sectors. I don't have a recent cash AA ticket receipt to look at so I don't know what they show and whether they should be explicit about the baggage allowance for each sector.

[planitohio]

On 2/27/2024 at 6:07 AM, Globaliser said:

I can't work out what's happened to cause one sector to be booked in economy. I'm only working with random dates, but even if I allow VCE-MAD to be priced in economy, specifying business for MAD-CLT-CLE forces VCE-MAD to be booked into business (and even then, that trick only produces an IB code for VCE-MAD, and it can't be booked on an AA code).

 

So I think that you need to find out from AA what baggage allowance is written on your ticket for each of the sectors. I don't have a recent cash AA ticket receipt to look at so I don't know what they show and whether they should be explicit about the baggage allowance for each sector.

Thank you for looking at it. I’m finding it very confusing as well. The only luggage specified is the very first leg. Following the trail for the others is rather circuitous. There are several of us doing this so I’m trying to sort it out. 

[FlyerTalker]

18 hours ago, planitohio said:

Thank you for looking at it. I’m finding it very confusing as well. The only luggage specified is the very first leg. Following the trail for the others is rather circuitous. There are several of us doing this so I’m trying to sort it out. 

 

And what did AA say when you called them on the phone?

 

You did call them to get the direct answer?

 

 

[planitohio]

7 hours ago, FlyerTalker said:

 

And what did AA say when you called them on the phone?

 

You did call them to get the direct answer?

 

 

Yes!  It took a few tries as I had to be around long enough to wait to get an agent.  

They were very confused and I spent a fair amount of time on hold.  The in person folks don't do the internet stuff...so no clear answers, but she could see my issues.  They indicated that AA business is to rule the ticket, but that it's not 100% clear.  One issue is that they had provided me a confirm for IB.  When I logged in with that - I could see no bags, no seat, etc and no ability to do anything about it.  She got new confirms for me for all three of us and now when I use those - I can see that we get two checked bags for person - in line with AA business international.  And that allowed me to then purchase seats.  So having a better path forward with IB I'm more confident of what should happen and be permitted at the airport in Venice.  Was trying to avoid any issues at the gate at 4 am.  

 

Appreciate your assistance.  Travel is certainly not straightforward anymore.  

[Hezu]

I guess it is worth a mention that most narrow-body airliners in Europe (used on nearly all intra-Europe routes) have seats configured so that the entire plane has only single* type of seats and if there is business class available, front rows have been designated for business "cabin" and the rest for economy and the only difference in seating is that  the middle seats in business class are usually not used (assuming there is three seats on each side of aisle). Of course, in business class you should get better free meal and beverage service even if the hard product is similar to the economy class.

*) ok, in practice, bulkhead and emergency exit row seats may be slightly different from the rest of seats.

[em-sk]

On 2/28/2024 at 3:44 AM, planitohio said:

Thank you for looking at it. I’m finding it very confusing as well. The only luggage specified is the very first leg. Following the trail for the others is rather circuitous. There are several of us doing this so I’m trying to sort it out. 

 

The normal way this works is if you check your bags in VCE all the way to CLE, the rules for the overseas flight trump the rules for the local connecting flight.  If were not a connection and you were staying in Madrid for a few days, then rules for the Venice to Madrid flight would apply.

 

For what it is worth, business on narrow body aircraft in Europe is very scaled back from what you would use to in the US/Canada when it comes to the seat.  Food/beverage can be better in Europe but your millage varies on that.

 

Being seated in economy for one leg is not that rare.  It happens sometimes.  I would all call to AA and ask them if you could be moved into business.  Your will quickly find out if it was glitch, if all the business seats are sold out or its something else.  (You may also discover that airline call centre staff have little insight into why the computer does things one way or another).  

 

Are you on a weird fare with some odd rules? Possibly.  In the case there may be some other rules at play.  

Edited March 15 by em-sk

[GeezerCouple]

On 2/26/2024 at 10:27 PM, planitohio said:

I bought it online on AA and do have one 13 digit number for the four flights (one over and three back). The receipt specifies the bags for the flight over, but makes no mention of any bags for any of the return segments. The segments ticketed are:

  TPA-LGW

  VCE-MAD

  MAD-CLT

  CLT-CLE

 

All are business except VCE-MAD. All are AA numbered flights. British Air is the carrier over and Iberia the first on the return. 

I'm less concerned about the baggage difference than why you are in economy if you are paying for business class from Venice to the USA...

Why didn't you call AA when you saw that happening, before the ticketing was finalized?

 

But it is "now", now. 😉

So I'd call AA and discuss with them, and see if you could be moved to a business class on the shorter flight, assuming that does indeed exist.

 

And if business was full and still is, it seems there's quite some time until the actual flight, so there's a good chance that there will be some passengers changing.

I'd definitely keep on it if they can't change that now.

 

Now, keep in mind that the "business class" of some of the intra-European legs of the long itineraries may be "in economy seating", but could have the middle seat "blocked".  That is, it's the same economy seat others have, but there's no one seated next to you; there'd be an empty seat in the middle of the 3-seat section. 

We don't much like that, as the "comfort" is certainly not better, but it is nicer to have the "space", plus no "unknowns" sitting right there.  (One can "never know" about those "unknowns", right!? 😲 )

 

GC

[FlyerTalker]

8 hours ago, GeezerCouple said:

I'm less concerned about the baggage difference than why you are in economy if you are paying for business class from Venice to the USA.

 

It might not be "paying for business class".  It could also be a fare that covers economy travel for one or more segments.  Without actually looking at the fare construction, it's all a bunch of assumptions.

 

For example -- was on a DL ticket from Cape Town to my home.  DL offered me a fare construction that was business class from CPT to ATL, but only Comfort Plus from ATL onward.  It was a significantly cheaper alternative than a ticket using domestic first from ATL.   Sometimes that happens, and you end up with what is known as a "mixed class itinerary".

 

Again, without looking at the actual fare construction and the fare rules, it's all guesses.