Your Cruise Has Departed

[HappyInVan]

Guys,

 

I'm not an IT person. But, I'll offer a few comments on the functional areas. Please contribute if you have IT experience.

 

These days, the company's IT functions are dispersed among service providers and specialist contractors. First, the telecoms industry provides the gateway between the customers and the company. Problems here may cause slow response times.

 

Occasionally, the service provider is disabled. Pretty obvious since all users are disabled.

 

Second, customer information (profile, orders, history) is stored with a database company Google Cloud etc provides secure and high speed services. Occasionally, disruptions here result in missing data. “What happened to my bookings?”

 

Third, a multitude of vendors provide essential and additional services to handle your queries and transactions. The sales vendor maintains the price list and tracks the discounts and special offers. The payment vendor handles the $$$$. Then, there are the vendors that analyses the data into reports for the Management Information System.

 

Problems occur frequently in this area because of the amount of data exchange between multiple vendors. “My fault???? It's your fault!!!”

 

The security vendor is usually invisible, until someone hacks the company. Then, a chunk of the company's customer base shows up on the dark web. The amount of data stolen will reflect how much or little the company paid for IT security.

 

Then, there are the vendors running the company's app. Definite under-funding here, because most cruise app have limited functionality or under-perform.

 

Frankly, the problem presently by this thread's OP is confusing. The database used by the online service appears to be corrupted. The app reports the correct period to embarkation, but onboard bookings are missing? Frankly, I'm surprised by the persistent of data corruption for a company of this size.

 

In the end, the company sets spending priorities. Customers experiences the lapses and confidence is lost in the prolific offenders. Blame HAL management, not the CSR. To be fair, the online experience could be better if there were enough money from higher fares.

 

For the better companies, they acknowledge the problem. "Sorry, we're experiencing technical difficulties. Please come back later to access your bookings." They don't leave the customer confused and anxious.

 

Edited May 26 by HappyInVan

[shadow 123]

On 5/26/2024 at 12:05 PM, ChinaShrek said:

Some people think HAL is going out of business this year but there is no evidence to support this idea.

I hate to be the 1 to say this but I wouldn't be surprised if they did go out of business. I'd hate to see it, but it wouldn't shock me. Sometimes I wonder how they stay in business. I am  a loyal  customer. Actually since 2017 I really only travel with Holland America. I like the line I like the crew.

I worked in a call center I can tell when someone has been trained. I do not believe they're getting the proper training. And their IT department is a mess

[shadow 123]

18 hours ago, HappyInVan said:

Guys,

 

I'm not an IT person. But, I'll offer a few comments on the functional areas. Please contribute if you have IT experience.

 

These days, the company's IT functions are dispersed among service providers and specialist contractors. First, the telecoms industry provides the gateway between the customers and the company. Problems here may cause slow response times.

 

Occasionally, the service provider is disabled. Pretty obvious since all users are disabled.

 

Second, customer information (profile, orders, history) is stored with a database company Google Cloud etc provides secure and high speed services. Occasionally, disruptions here result in missing data. “What happened to my bookings?”

 

Third, a multitude of vendors provide essential and additional services to handle your queries and transactions. The sales vendor maintains the price list and tracks the discounts and special offers. The payment vendor handles the $$$$. Then, there are the vendors that analyses the data into reports for the Management Information System.

 

Problems occur frequently in this area because of the amount of data exchange between multiple vendors. “My fault???? It's your fault!!!”

 

The security vendor is usually invisible, until someone hacks the company. Then, a chunk of the company's customer base shows up on the dark web. The amount of data stolen will reflect how much or little the company paid for IT security.

 

Then, there are the vendors running the company's app. Definite under-funding here, because most cruise app have limited functionality or under-perform.

 

Frankly, the problem presently by this thread's OP is confusing. The database used by the online service appears to be corrupted. The app reports the correct period to embarkation, but onboard bookings are missing? Frankly, I'm surprised by the persistent of data corruption for a company of this size.

 

In the end, the company sets spending priorities. Customers experiences the lapses and confidence is lost in the prolific offenders. Blame HAL management, not the CSR. To be fair, the online experience could be better if there were enough money from higher fares.

 

For the better companies, they acknowledge the problem. "Sorry, we're experiencing technical difficulties. Please come back later to access your bookings." They don't leave the customer confused and anxious.

 

Probably dating myself but I remember when every company,  especially a fortune 500 company, had their own IT department on site

[AV8rix]

<sigh>  It's me again.  I have to post this EVERY time there's a thread about the ABYSMAL CCL (corporate, not only HAL) IT issues:

 

In late 2016 Carnival corporate outsourced IT to Capgemini, a firm based in France but uses  personnel in India to do the actual coding and maintenance. 

 

Just google keywords "Carnival Capgemini outsourcing" and read all about it. 

 

Edited May 27 by AV8rix

[Sir PMP]

On 5/26/2024 at 12:05 PM, ChinaShrek said:

Some people think HAL is going out of business this year but there is no evidence to support this idea.

That would be announced differently.

[QuattroRomeo]

33 minutes ago, AV8rix said:

<sigh>  It's me again.  I have to post this EVERY time there's a thread about the ABYSMAL CCL (corporate, not only HAL) IT issues:

 

In late 2016 Carnival corporate outsourced IT to Capgemini, a firm based in France but uses  personnel in India to do the actual coding and maintenance. 

 

Just google keywords "Carnival Capgemini outsourcing" and read all about it. 

 

Thank you- I was trying to remember who posted abut Capgemini before, from months ago. As we know, there are no improvements!

[HappyInVan]

2 hours ago, shadow 123 said:

Probably dating myself but I remember when every company,  especially a fortune 500 company, had their own IT department on site

 

Me too! 🧐

 

Back in the day, you bought an IBM service package when you bought IBM mainframes. They took care of the 'overheads'.

[ontheweb]

3 hours ago, AV8rix said:

<sigh>  It's me again.  I have to post this EVERY time there's a thread about the ABYSMAL CCL (corporate, not only HAL) IT issues:

 

In late 2016 Carnival corporate outsourced IT to Capgemini, a firm based in France but uses  personnel in India to do the actual coding and maintenance. 

 

Just google keywords "Carnival Capgemini outsourcing" and read all about it. 

 

Should we assume that that was done for cost savings as opposed to effective IT?

[HappyInVan]

Here's some insights from 2016...

 

https://www.cbsnews.com/miami/news/carnival-cruise-line-plan-threatens-miami-jobs/

 

"Capgemini stated to the fired Americans at a town hall meeting that Capgemini was outsourcing the work to India because that was the only way it could provide the IT services to Carnival at the rate paid to them by the company," Blackwell said.

 

Carnival denied the workers were being fired. Instead they were "transitioned" into the new company, Capgemini, said Roger Frizzell, a senior vice president and Chief Communications Officer for Carnival.

 

Frizzell stressed these moves were being done to improve performance and not to save money...  Will those efficiencies result in Capgemini moving those IT jobs to lower wage workers in foreign countries? Frizzell responded, "No, I am not aware of any such plans."

 

Ta da! 😛

[ontheweb]

7 hours ago, HappyInVan said:

Here's some insights from 2016...

 

https://www.cbsnews.com/miami/news/carnival-cruise-line-plan-threatens-miami-jobs/

 

"Capgemini stated to the fired Americans at a town hall meeting that Capgemini was outsourcing the work to India because that was the only way it could provide the IT services to Carnival at the rate paid to them by the company," Blackwell said.

 

Carnival denied the workers were being fired. Instead they were "transitioned" into the new company, Capgemini, said Roger Frizzell, a senior vice president and Chief Communications Officer for Carnival.

 

Frizzell stressed these moves were being done to improve performance and not to save money...  Will those efficiencies result in Capgemini moving those IT jobs to lower wage workers in foreign countries? Frizzell responded, "No, I am not aware of any such plans."

 

Ta da! 😛

Did they really say with a straight fact that the move was to improve performance and not to save money? And how has that worked out?

[AV8rix]

13 hours ago, HappyInVan said:

Here's some insights from 2016...

 

https://www.cbsnews.com/miami/news/carnival-cruise-line-plan-threatens-miami-jobs/

 

"Capgemini stated to the fired Americans at a town hall meeting that Capgemini was outsourcing the work to India because that was the only way it could provide the IT services to Carnival at the rate paid to them by the company," Blackwell said.

 

Carnival denied the workers were being fired. Instead they were "transitioned" into the new company, Capgemini, said Roger Frizzell, a senior vice president and Chief Communications Officer for Carnival.

 

Frizzell stressed these moves were being done to improve performance and not to save money...  Will those efficiencies result in Capgemini moving those IT jobs to lower wage workers in foreign countries? Frizzell responded, "No, I am not aware of any such plans."

 

Ta da! 😛

Yeah, but they weren't transitioned, were they?  The CCL IT folks were umm, "transitioned" to Capgemini just long enough (about 6 mos or so) to teach the offshore coders their jobs, then were jettisoned.

[shadow 123]

32 minutes ago, AV8rix said:

Yeah, but they weren't transitioned, were they?  The CCL IT folks were umm, "transitioned" to Capgemini just long enough (about 6 mos or so) to teach the offshore coders their jobs, then were jettisoned.

So sad. But that seems to be the way of the world now.

[HappyInVan]

I should add that outsourcing a critical function is a dangerous decision. Sometimes, it goes horribly wrong. CCL ties itself into a multi-year contract. Loses operational control as the contractor runs the program. It should be possible to terminate the contractor For Cause. But, the transition to a new contractor is a mess.

 

For those who are interested, this is my 5 cents worth.

 

Outsourcing is prevalent where there is complexity. You would outsource the management issues (cost, quality, environment) to a third party. Just shop around for a deal.

 

You can reduce costs by outsourcing to a third party operating in low cost countries. You can outsource to a specialist who can produce higher quality than you can. You might outsource to a third party that has scalability. That is, it can meet your needs if demand for your products surge.

 

That said, it doesn't mean that lower quality is the inevitable result of third world outsourcing. Indeed, economic outsourcing can allow you to achieve higher quality because it costs less to build high quality.

 

The fact that HAL customers have been persistently disappointed in HAL IT reliability means that this is the choice that HAL made. HAL spent their money elsewhere, and built poor IT reliability (including dumb mistakes) into the customer experience.😛

Edited May 29 by HappyInVan

[alwaysfrantic]

On 5/26/2024 at 1:02 PM, HappyInVan said:

 

What's a computer glitch? Is it the same as a gremlin?

 

From what the CSR people say, it sounds like a systemic problem. Insufficient funds for IT infrastructure? Incompetent cheap contractor? Forgot to pay the bills? Never heard of a problem like this in the past, or with any other brand.

 

Every organization has its strengths and weaknesses. Good and bad days. What matters is the trajectory! 🥸

 

Of course, failing brands have loyal customers to keep them going a little longer! 😍

If you’ve never heard of such glitches I know you don’t own in Marriott Vacation Club.  Pretty sure they have a neighborhood kid computer club run their website. 

[HappyInVan]

Sorry.

 

I've traveled most with the Hilton group and through hotel dot com. No glitches with the Hilton chain, and usually hotel dot com posts an apology for online disruption. Never had the OP's problem. 😒

 

Gotta wonder if the Marriott uses the same contractor as CCL. Thanks for the heads up.

Edited May 31 by HappyInVan

[electro]

I got the "your cruise has departed" msg this morning for my sailing tomorrow. I'm really getting tired of the issues with HAL's website. I have never seen a cruise line website this bad before. (I don't use any other carnival lines so I don't know if they are as bad). NCL, Celebrity, Royal, even MSC have been better than HAL by a wide margin.

[Wayward Son]

9 hours ago, electro said:

I got the "your cruise has departed" msg this morning for my sailing tomorrow. I'm really getting tired of the issues with HAL's website. I have never seen a cruise line website this bad before. (I don't use any other carnival lines so I don't know if they are as bad). NCL, Celebrity, Royal, even MSC have been better than HAL by a wide margin.

 

NCL's website is very good. Royal, not so much. HAL's is not at all intuitive, and difficult to navigate and find anything, at first. However, once you get the hang if it, and understand how to find what you want, it's quite good -- 90% of the time. The other 10%, I just log off and come back later.

 

[HappyInVan]

12 hours ago, Wayward Son said:

 

However, once you get the hang if it, and understand how to find what you want, it's quite good -- 90% of the time. The other 10%, I just log off and come back later.

 

 

Frankly, I don't think that the message "Your ship has departed" can be ignored. What I can't understand is why the problem keeps cropping up???

 

Clearly, something is happening within HAL. Another little sign that the pax matter as much as potatoes. 🥴

 

Edited June 1 by HappyInVan