ADA/Wheelchair Travelers?

[Cruising_Gals]

Hello.

 

Was so disappointed to learn that we would not be able to enjoy Viking River Cruises due to limitations of the vessels if you are mobility-impaired.  No scooters allowed and wheelchairs are useless since you have to go up and down stairs throughout the day (tours, meals, entertainment, etc.).

 

Decided to look up Viking Ocean Cruises and they have the same limitations!  "Motorized scooters are not typically suitable for international cruises and cannot be accommodated."  "Wheelchairs must not exceed 22" in width."  

 

Viking calls itself "the thinking person's cruise," but they need to add 'able-bodied only need apply.'  Always thought we would do a Viking cruise after retirement but looks like it won't happen. 

 

Has anyone travelled with someone who needed a wheelchair onboard?  If so, what was your experience?   Thanks in advance for your reply.

[Mike07]

A fight broke out the last time this was discussed. You may benefit from reading this.

 

That being said, don't get upset about feeling excluded from a Viking cruise when there are many competitors in the Ocean, River, and Expedition arenas.

 

 

[Redtravel]

I have been on riverboats with people in wheelchairs. On long ships, there is an elevator between the upper and middle deck. Cabins on those decks have large windows. Some have verandas.  That gives access to reception, lounge, aquavit terrace and the restaurant. The gangway is usually flat or a slight incline. To access the lower deck and sun deck, you use stairs.  On Viking Mississippi, there were several people using canes and walkers.  Ship provided help for people with limited mobility. golf carts transported guests up the levees.  On ocean cruises, there will be people with canes and walkers. Excursions are geared to a vast range of abilities.  Viking is most caring when it comes to assisting guests.  

[CDNPolar]

I hear what you are saying and I feel for your situation, but...

 

Scooters are often not allowed because there is no place to keep them.  You cannot leave them in the corridors / hallways as these hallways are not wide enough to safely get by or for the ship's crew to move about with carts and whatnot.  In the average cabin, there is not enough room to keep a scooter overnight.  You would fill the only available space with the scooter and then you would not have any space to move in the cabin.

 

For scooters, and even some wheelchairs you would have to be in a larger cabin or a suite to accommodate you.

 

The last Viking River cruise we were on, there where three wheelchair guests on board.  Two were 100% dependent on their chairs.  One could manage some limited walking.

 

The challenge here was getting these folks that could not walk on and off the ship.  River ships raft and you may have to cross 1, 2, or more ships to get to shore.  This is not a flat surface but an up and down and single steps between ships.  Then there is the gangway.  It can often be either extremely steep or even steps and not a ramp.

 

Then when you get to European countries, you are then faced with very different accessibility standards.

 

For excursions you are then also faced with busses and getting on and off the bus.

 

Crew, Tour Guides, and Drivers will traditionally not help you, so you have to have people with you that can assist you on and off the bus.

 

These folks managed, but wow, it was a struggle every day and every excursion.  Both of the guests that were dependent on their chair had 3 or 4 family members that did all the heavy work of getting them on and off.  It was not easy, but they did it.

 

I get your frustration completely.  I am not trying to anger you, I am just suggesting that even if Viking allowed scooters, or if the ships were more accessible the challenges don't end with the ship.  The challenges are also at every port, and they range from no handrails on steps, no ramps, and cobblestones everywhere.

[Jim Avery]

Nicely said CDN.  I would add that our bodies don't last forever and there comes a time when unpleasant choices abound.  I like to tell people I have enjoyed wearing this body out....

[Hanoj]

Every time I read about cruising and the challenges those with mobility limitations face, I am grateful I don't presently experience such obstacles. My DW is quick to remind me about this when we are delayed by someone who is and I express gratitude for my good fortune and feel compassion for my fellow sojourner. The more I wear out my body (trying to do so less quickly than @Jim Avery😇), I realize a misstep could easily change my mobility. Last summer I nearly fell forward into a tender while stepping on. Always having been very agile and athletic, I foolishly refused assistance from the crew as the tender was bobbing up and down in the chop. I thought I had timed it perfectly. But the cadence changed just as I made my step and the crew grabbed a hold of me and broke my fall. Thankfully nothing more than my pride was injured. That incident taught me to accept help (beforehand) even when I don't think it is needed. More efficient this way, especially when tendering.

[Tsunami74]

3 hours ago, Jim Avery said:

Nicely said CDN.  I would add that our bodies don't last forever and there comes a time when unpleasant choices abound.  I like to tell people I have enjoyed wearing this body out....

I agree with Jim Avery's words and  that CDN was spot on.

This is why I continuously tell people to go while they can!

Don't put off what you want to do because you never know when your mobility will limit you too much. "Someday" may never come then.

 

[Mike07]

2 hours ago, Tsunami74 said:

I agree with Jim Avery's words and  that CDN was spot on.

This is why I continuously tell people to go while they can!

Don't put off what you want to do because you never know when your mobility will limit you too much. "Someday" may never come then.

 

 

 

 

100% and that's why I'm generally one of the youngest ones on a Viking cruise. I don't see any point in waiting.

 

I know there are car enthusiasts above the age of 50s that have the money to afford any number of exotic cars and some of them, they simply cannot get in easily or comfortably sit in. Granted, sometimes it's due to body weight. But other times, not.

 

I think CDN highlighted the issues well in a thoughtful and tactful manner. Viking likes, no loves money, and if what OP wanted to do was feasible, Viking would be all over it. Furthermore, the longships I believe are registered in Switzerland (??) or Norway (??), but they're in Europe. American law doesn't apply over there.

[Mike07]

On 8/13/2024 at 3:22 PM, Cruising_Gals said:

Viking calls itself "the thinking person's cruise," but they need to add 'able-bodied only need apply.'  Always thought we would do a Viking cruise after retirement but looks like it won't happen. 

 

 

 

CDN articulated things well above, but one caveat about European river cruising --- it is very different from ocean cruising on a number of points. There are videos on YT that highlight said differences, but reading through your message again and reading between the lines, I don't think you've actually done a European river cruise. Also, Mediterranean ocean cruises do not count.

 

 

[Breckski]

3 hours ago, Tsunami74 said:

I agree with Jim Avery's words and  that CDN was spot on.

This is why I continuously tell people to go while they can!

Don't put off what you want to do because you never know when your mobility will limit you too much. "Someday" may never come then.

 

This and other responses are spot on.  We retired a good bit earlier than most.  All my friends thought I loved work too much and would hate retirement.  Well, I like traveling and doing the "someday" things much more than working.  

 

We love living in a ski town but have decided (like most of our neighbors) that we'll have to move when we start losing mobility.  It's a shame but a fact of life.  

[lovetosew]

Unfortunately, we all have to stay somewhat fit for these trips. But that is good. It just means that we will have a better time.

[Redtravel]

Get out there and travel.  Your mobility may become limited at any time. Understand your limitations.  After being home during the pandemic, returning to traveling was a challenge.  We are older, somewhat slower, and more cautious. However, we are still above ground. Time to see the world. 

[SantaFe1]

12 hours ago, Jim Avery said:

 I like to tell people I have enjoyed wearing this body out....

This is a good one.  I’m going to have to plagiarize it soon!  But we are still trucking.  My first husband died at 46.  My second turns 75 tomorrow.  I learned carpe diem a long time ago!  

[rmalbers]

The bottom line is V ships are just not designed for wheelchairs, etc.  I've seen it, but I think if the people knew ahead of time what they were getting into they would have picked a ship that was designed to better handle mobility issues.  There are so many better choices out there if you have mobility issues.

[KBs mum]

I use a wheelchair, and have no more problems with Viking than I do with any other accommodation provider. Research is key, not everywhere suits everyone, if something isn't suitable book an alternative, It's that simple. 

Most of Europe has regulations that exceed the ADA, but much older infrastructure that does not need to be altered, as the regulations are not retroactive. 

A folding wheelchair solves the width restriction, but I've taken a rigid frame with no problems. I don't take a scooter, they are more hassle than they are worth for travel.

Viking have to have rules that work for every type of ship, in every country, and for their third party bus companies, airlines etc. Also they have no control over local infrastructure, or lack of it

They give permission to travel on a case by case basis

 

 

[deec]

We continue to travel while our hips, knees and brains allow us to do so.  I am very glad we took some of the more arduous treks ( Galapagos, Machu Picchu, Ankor Wat, African Safari) already!  Each of those places probably could still be done but at a much less demanding pace and activities!  I hope that I have the grace to stop traveling when my mobility issues begin to impact my fellow passengers.

Edited August 17 by deec

[Redtravel]

on Mars now.  For those using wheelchairs and walkers, there are some places where it would be more accessible if there were automatic door openers.  On deck 7 as you walk aft past the winter garden and pool, there are doors that don’t have automatic openers. They are stiff and difficult to open.  One has a broken pane of glass next to it.  This is a real hazard.  

[CDR2001]

Redtravel, I hope you have notified Viking Guest services about the broken glass. I hope you continue to enjoy your cruise. 

[KBs mum]

1 hour ago, Redtravel said:

on Mars now.  For those using wheelchairs and walkers, there are some places where it would be more accessible if there were automatic door openers.  On deck 7 as you walk aft past the winter garden and pool, there are doors that don’t have automatic openers. They are stiff and difficult to open.  One has a broken pane of glass next to it.  This is a real hazard.  

The broken glass should be repaired or made safe, but fire doors will never be automatic. Ask someone nearby for assistance, or plan ahead and ask whoever you are travelling with 

[Harley57]

While many of the comments on this thread focused on mobility issues associated with aging, it’s important to remember that folks of all ages may require some form of mobility assistance due to accidents, illnesses or conditions they are born with.  
 

My friend’s son who is in his mid 40’s has used a wheelchair most of his life due to a condition he was born with.  He (and they) love cruising and sail a variety of cruise lines but their experiences with tendering and excursions have really opened my eyes to the challenges faced by those with mobility issues.  Typically his dad pushes the wheelchair, however as his dad is now in his senior years this is becoming increasingly difficult.  
 

So while the ‘travel while you can’ is good advice, it doesn’t apply to everyone.  

[rbslos18]

My heart goes out to @Cruising_Gals The challenges that frustrate her will likely be faced by most of us. I agree research is key. Some ships and itineraries are better suited for passengers needing wheelchair assistance.

 

The posts are a sobering reminder of the importance of exercise and healthy eating. 

[Redtravel]

On 8/29/2024 at 3:32 PM, CDR2001 said:

Redtravel, I hope you have notified Viking Guest services about the broken glass. I hope you continue to enjoy your cruise. 

Some of those doors were propped open later in the cruise.  
Another issue was the public restrooms.  Some of the handicapped restrooms have push doors that open and close automatically.  On deck 7 the handicapped restroom can only be accessed by first going through a doorway that doesn’t open automatically. You need a person to hold the door for you. Once through that door, you get to restrooms for both genders plus separate handicapped. That door has an automatic opener.  

[KBs mum]

On 9/11/2024 at 4:24 PM, Redtravel said:

Some of those doors were propped open later in the cruise.  
Another issue was the public restrooms.  Some of the handicapped restrooms have push doors that open and close automatically.  On deck 7 the handicapped restroom can only be accessed by first going through a doorway that doesn’t open automatically. You need a person to hold the door for you. Once through that door, you get to restrooms for both genders plus separate handicapped. That door has an automatic opener.  

The accessible toilets all have automatic doors. Other doors may not be automatic. 

People who have disabilities are used to dealing with awkward doors, particularly in non standard (not in modern buildings) settings. There are quite a few techniques that can be used 

 

 

 

[KBs mum]

On 9/1/2024 at 12:20 AM, rbslos18 said:

My heart goes out to @Cruising_Gals The challenges that frustrate her will likely be faced by most of us. I agree research is key. Some ships and itineraries are better suited for passengers needing wheelchair assistance.

 

The posts are a sobering reminder of the importance of exercise and healthy eating. 

Healthy eating will not repair accident damage, genetic or birth problem disabilities. 

Exercise may be impossible for those affected. 

Getting old is not a disability

[rmalbers]

The itinerary point above is important.  Just back from the British Isles cruise and because of the very high/low tides in the region the boarding ramps were sometimes VERY steep, to the ship or tenders.  I didn't see anyone take a dive but I'd be surprised if it didn't happen.  I did see a women go down stepping into a tender and couldn't get up by herself. There are VO itineraries that are not suited for some people.