Reporting and disciplining unethical TA

[seawyllow]

The "TA" is in Florida. When I contacted them upon discovering the double billing on September 24...they said it was a mistake and they would issue a refund. They said the refund would take 5-10 days to show up on my Visa. I haven't seen it yet (but still within the 5-10 day window...) and yesterday I emailed them to ask when the refund was issued. They said it had been issued on September 25th but that "depending on how fast banks talk to each other" it might take up to two weeks for the credit to appear. At this point I'm going to just search my Visa on-line daily to see if the credit appears, otherwise try to forget this "glitch" and pack for my trip....if when I get back the credit still never appeared then I'll put it in Visa's hands....and start writing letters etc. of complaint to RCI, the TA, and whoever else anyone can think of!

 

Thank you all for your support!!! My husband hasn't been much help as he is the eternal optimist and keeps saying he's sure everything will be fine....(easy to say when it's MY $4500...) and I don't want to talk too much about it to my friends....since hithertofore I was known as the smart, savy traveler....sigh.

 

Helen, you might want to take a look-

 

http://www.800helpfla.com/sot.html

 

This is about the seller of travel laws for Florida. It applies to either selling travel to residents of the state, or companies doing business from that state. They can sell to any other state.

 

And I believe she said that the charges were run to 2 different places, one to the TA and one to RCCL, so I may be wrong, but I believe she can dispute the charge to the TA.

[megnsamsgracie]

I dont think she can dispute the charge with the TA because I gathered the TA was paid the $4500 back in March, past the timeframe from disputing a charge.

 

Second, I have never had a refund take more than 72 hours for ANYTHING and I only use my debit card. That is a lie! I had cancelled cruises, Disney hotels and did plenty of returns at stores using my CC. Most were creditted back within 48 hours (if not over a weekend) but a couple took 72hrs. I would keep hounding them as I highly doubt they refunded you on the 25th.

 

Third, I pretty sure they cant refund you that money this far from date of purchase, I am almost positive at this point it has to be cash/check. I know if a purchase at a store is 90 days after, they have to give cash back and not credit.

 

Good luck!

 

PS All my bookings through a TA, the charge came through from the cruiseline!

[seawyllow]

I dont think she can dispute the charge with the TA because I gathered the TA was paid the $4500 back in March, past the timeframe from disputing a charge.

 

Second, I have never had a refund take more than 72 hours for ANYTHING and I only use my debit card. That is a lie! I had cancelled cruises, Disney hotels and did plenty of returns at stores using my CC. Most were creditted back within 48 hours (if not over a weekend) but a couple took 72hrs. I would keep hounding them as I highly doubt they refunded you on the 25th.

 

Third, I pretty sure they cant refund you that money this far from date of purchase, I am almost positive at this point it has to be cash/check. I know if a purchase at a store is 90 days after, they have to give cash back and not credit.

 

Good luck!

 

PS All my bookings through a TA, the charge came through from the cruiseline!

 

I have to agree with this poster. I am a TA and deal with cc all the time. If the charge is over 90 days old, I cannot do a charge back, I would have to send a check. And any cancellations, changes, etc. have been back on the card within 72 hours at the most. I would call them today, get the transaction number from the chargeback they supposedly did, and then call the bank to verify. If they cannot supply a transaction number, then it was not done.

[DougYWG]

I think Helen has to deal with the agent. I'm not familiar with this 90 day limit and am surprised. Airline tickets are valid for 12 months. If you want a refund at 11 months and 29 days, you can get it, and it has to be to the original form of payment which could well be Visa, MasterCard etc.

 

Legally, the thing to remember is that the agent is an agent i.e. acting on behalf of a principal, in this case a cruise line. The agent has to conduct business as the principal advises and does not take title to the goods as a retailer normally does. Agents do not accept credit cards on their own behalf. So if, for example, RCCL accepted only Visa as a form of payment, the agent could not accept your MasterCard.

 

If, however, an agent has their own merchant contract with a Visa or MasterCard bank, then they can accept your card as payment and keep the cash which seems to be what happened. The Visa statement would describe the charge as 'ABC Agencies', not 'Royal Caribbean'. If an agent borrowed my cash for several months, interest free, I would be hostile as all hell. It's called 'kiting'.

[helen haywood]

OK...thanks for the advice. I'll contact the TA again and try to get the transaction number. In response to an earlier post...there was no upgrade in my case. Visa is telling me that they will dispute (if I don't get the refund) the charge as a duplicate charge. I don't care whether I get a credit card refund or a check...money is money!

[firefly333]

state.

 

And I believe she said that the charges were run to 2 different places, one to the TA and one to RCCL, so I may be wrong, but I believe she can dispute the charge to the TA.

 

I agree with everyone above, get on the arse of the TA and find out why the bill was not paid by them to RCI and why RCI also charged the card.

 

If the charge to the card is more than 180 days old, its already tricky from the credit card company's viewpoint. I wouldnt say which card I worked for, but I can say after 6 months the charges "fall off the system" as we called it. They go to film and cannot be viewed by the reps working the case, so film has to be ordered. The filming is outsourced and takes a while to arrive and is a pain in the neck.

 

As I said above there are circumstances where the merchant can be charged back after 6 months. For instance you ordered a wedding gown in March and delivery of the wedding gown was not until now. This should qualify since travel has not yet occured. However, the fact that both charges are on your card, I would not delay. The fact that RCI charged later and if you dispute that charge RCI will say you didnt pay is a big problem.

 

Get on the phone and demand from the TA to know what the problem is, sounds like they took your money and now making excuses to delay gving it back. I would not wait until you get back to demand an answer from your TA.

 

If the TA doesnt give you back the money willingly and you cant prove they paid RCI you might have no other recourse but to sue them if you keep waiting on answers from the TA. RCI only billed you once, so your quarrel isnt really with them.

[helen haywood]

OK...I emailed the TA and I was given a 11 digit transaction number. When I asked the name of the bank I was told they "have a credit card processor and its coming from their bank and we have no idea what it is." Is an 11 digit number right? I suppose if the travel agency had to process paperwork to their credit card processor that since an additional middleman is involved it could take longer than usual.....

[firefly333]

OK...I emailed the TA and I was given a 11 digit transaction number. When I asked the name of the bank I was told they "have a credit card processor and its coming from their bank and we have no idea what it is." Is an 11 digit number right? I suppose if the travel agency had to process paperwork to their credit card processor that since an additional middleman is involved it could take longer than usual.....

 

A merchant may process mostly VISA card transactions and so use VISA as their processor for MasterCard and American Express charges. I have seen cases where the processor made the mistake and double billed and it was not the merchant's mistake. In this case could even be the processor did not properly have the charge listed is why RCI also billed.

 

So, yes, the problem could lie with the bank processor, not the TA, but its still the TAs problem. Just keep after them. charges post every night at midnight usually, so if the credit is not posted tomorrow, call them again.

[owl61]

, but your arrogance is outrageous.

The thread has evolved which is fine, but I invited the flamer to comment on my (OP) situation after he learned of the facts. He's seems to be in hiding notwithstanding 4000+ posts. I would bet s/he is a TA who is quick to defend deceptive conduct by colleagues.

[cherylandtk]

Owl61-you guessed wrong on that. She is a transportation attorney. Let it go, its not worth holding on to after a week now.

[takeavacation]

Helen.....just wondering if you've received your refund from the TA that held your $4500 for several months? I hope it's all going well -- and you enjoy your cruise!!

[helen haywood]

I'm sorry...I'd been avoiding this post after venting for a bit...because the subject gets me so upset that I can't concentrate on the 20th anniversary trip I planned so long for.... OK...if you guys still have the stomach for it....the latest is this. When I hadn't heard from the TA at the edge of what they said it would take I emailed and said could they check into whether this transaction ever actually occurred with their processing company because neither Visa nor my bank believed refunds took 2-3 weeks... I got an email telling me that they were asking their processing company about this...but that this inquiry would take 24-36 hours to complete. So I waited. On the eve of the 36 hour mark, having heard nothing, I emailed back that it would be 36 hours the next day, and I needed to hear WHERE WAS MY REFUND?!? The next day I received an email in which they told me that they were so sorry...it turns out that the "processing company" had "transposed" the numbers so that my refund had gone to someone else. They were going to retrieve the money and credit my account....(some comment here about how much paperwork this will involve...) and they would transfer the money to me today and the funds would show up next week. I am in daily contact with my Visa representative...if the funds were transferred "today" then they'd show up in my account "today." The TA said they were so sorry....that if I'd let them know the amount of the finance charges then they'd send me a check "ASAP"....at this point I'd LOVE to know their definition of asap... I responded that I couldn't tell them the amount of the finance charges until I knew the date that I was actually refunded the money. They also said that they were going to issue an OBC of $100 to me. Of course, at this point, I'm highly sceptical...but I'll hope for the best and see what transpires...I'll keep you posted.

[Jimsgirl]

Do not hold your breath.

 

I am so sorry you have had all this trouble. You just do not know how a TA will act until the trouble happens.

 

I had hoped that your credit card company would put the money back inot your account and go after the TA themselves. but I suppose that is too simplistic a view.

 

Will check back in a few days hoping I will read that all is well

 

Good luck

[helen haywood]

The credit card company (Visa) felt the charge to be disputed was the second one...and unfortunately that one was paid to RCI and it was the balance for paying off the cruise. If that was disputed, so Visa told me, BEFORE I went on the cruise...I might put the cruise in jeopardy...so they advised me to go on the cruise and we'd handle it when I returned...they told me it was very straightforward because all the charges were on the same card....easy to see that I was charged twice.... They said they would dispute the RCI charge....which would mean RCI would have to get the money from the TA... Obviously RCI will have more clout with the TA than little ole me.... I will post what the resolution is here....one question, am I allowed to post the name of the travel agency?

[newmexicoNita]

 

 

By "behavior" do you mean thief of money or unwanted advances towards you? Without more details everyone of us will have our minds racing in all different directions. Is it something that your local district attorney need to be made aware of?

 

 

thanks, as a TA, I too would want to know what the OP is referring to before giving any advise.

 

Nita

[SheilaNC]

No, sorry but you may not mention the TA by name. :)

[sultan_sfo]

In 99.99% cases, transposition of numbers will result in an invalid Credit Card number! There is an auto check built in all account numbers. /Sultan

 

...

The next day I received an email in which they told me that they were so sorry...it turns out that the "processing company" had "transposed" the numbers so that my refund had gone to someone else. ...

[helen haywood]

I certainly accept whatever the rules are at cruisecritic...no problem at all. But why is it acceptable to post warnings about certain tour operators but not travel agents?

[newmexicoNita]

I certainly accept whatever the rules are at cruisecritic...no problem at all. But why is it acceptable to post warnings about certain tour operators but not travel agents?

Only admin can answer this for you but my understanding is Travel Agencies pay to advertise on CC as well as other websites. BTW I agree with this, if indeed this is the reason. Can you imagine, XXX agency is paying through the nose to advertise on CC and someone gets on here to blast the company, legit or not. Often, someone is upset with a company for reasons that are not legit even. does that make any sense. Laura, what is the reason?

 

Nita

[sustyse]

The credit card company (Visa) felt the charge to be disputed was the second one...

 

I would have thought that the Visa customer would be the one to decide which transaction they wished to dispute not the credit card company.

[helen haywood]

The initial charge was my payment to the TA for the cruise. The second charge....months later....was to RCI for the same cruise. The TA had my money for the cruise in March....and instead of passing it along to RCI at the time...or later....they charged me a second time in September....paid to RCI. So Visa felt the second charge...which was the duplicate charge...was the one to dispute.

[cruiseco]

In 99.99% cases, transposition of numbers will result in an invalid Credit Card number! There is an auto check built in all account numbers. /Sultan

 

That actually happened to me once. I messed up a couple of numbers of the card and not only came up with a good number but the three digit check number on the original card just happened to be the same for both cards so it went through with no problem. We figured I'd have a better chance of winning the lottery than to have that happen again.

[helen haywood]

Unbelievably enough, last night when I did my daily bedtime check of my Visa account.....there my $4500 refund WAS!!!!!! I couldn't believe it!!!! I was certain I was going to have to wait till I got back and duke it out with them. I guess I'll never know the real story of why it took 26 days to get a refund... I'll post back to update you on whether the promised OBC appears....and if I get the check for the interest fees.... Thank you to all you ccers who helped me immeasurably with all your advice!!!!

[Jhawktx]

The TA actually did not do anything illegal. There was a price drop, rather than cut the commission, the TA upgraded you to a higher category for the same amount of money so it would not impact the commission. I always ask people, do you want to stay in the same category and get a refund for price drop or do you want to keep the same price and go into a higher category cabin. I think you will have a hard time proving your TA was negligent, because of the amount of TA's that routinely use these tactics.

 

The main point you are making is that the majority of TA's are unethical. I think you are right about that and people should be careful about using TA's. One should never use a TA unless doing so can give you a significant cost reduction.

[seawyllow]

The main point you are making is that the majority of TA's are unethical. I think you are right about that and people should be careful about using TA's. One should never use a TA unless doing so can give you a significant cost reduction.

 

I have to beg to differ with you. The majority of agents in my profession are hard working, educated, and very professional. To lump us all in with a couple of bad apples is wrong of you to do.

 

TA's are your advocate and can help in ways you are not aware or. I am glad most people do not think as you do or many people would not have jobs and many more people would not travel as EVERYONE had a first time to go before they learned what they want and where they want to go. Who do you think guides them the majority of the time? Maybe you had a bad experiene with a TA and have a sour taste about them now?