Trying to understand NCF charges

I booked a cruise on the royal through our TA a couple months back while princess had a sale which gave us $600 of obc for booking a balcony cabin for a cruise of >12 days.

What I'm trying to understand is that the invoice from our TA lists $450 for "taxes, fees and port charges". It also has a $1000 charge for NCFs.

I know that NCF means non-commissioned fees.

What I don't understand is that if I go to the princess website and book a similar cabin now and. It using the TA their website has the same $450 fee for the taxes, port charges and such; but no NCF charges.

Is the NCF something princess adds right and sneaks in right at checkout?

Or is this something the TA is adding innfor extra profit or do they add the fee to counteract the $600 in obc we got?

Edited May 25, 2017 by Optotronics
typo

NCF = Non-Commissionable FARE.

 

The cruise fares are the same if you book directly with Princess or with TAs. NCF is basically a way for a cruise line to pay less commissions to TAs.

Thanks for replying.

Does this then mean the if I went through checkout, that $1000 NCF would be added and snuck in on top of the $450 of "taxes, fees and port charges" which they list along the process?

Because I had taken a snapshot from the princess site right after booking the cruise and it doesn't show this $1000 NCF, but it's on my TA invoice, so it makes it look like the TA just added in $1000 extra for their booking cruise?? As the price difference between the two is $1000.

When searching prices directly from the cruise line they are required to include the NCF in the base fare.

Travel Agents are not--which allows them to advertise lowballl fares and then surprise you by not adding the NCF back in, or even mentioning that it will be, until you are about to put down your deposit. Or on the invoice you are not shown until after making the deposit.

 

In agent-speak NCF is often referred to as "port charges" so they can falsely blame the cruise line for the agent's deceptive trick of lumping the NCF charge in with the Government Taxes and Fees. Since your agent correctly labelled the NCF as such, they are actually more honest than most. (But not entirely since they obviously did not explain your invoice adequately to you, thus this thread...)

 

Bottom line is that all that matters is the grand total. If the advertised price in a TA add seems too good to be true, it usually is.

Edited May 25, 2017 by fishywood

My TA quotes me a lower total price than Princess, I don't see how it's broken down until I get an invoice after paying my deposit. It's never more than his original quote, he's not slamming me with fees.

You don't see NCF on Princess invoices because hey don't pay themselves a commission

 

 

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"Taxes, Fees, and Port Charges" are fees collected by governments. While it is part of the total you pay, it is not part of the cruise fare.

 

NCF is part of the cruise fare. It is separated out by the cruise line solely for the purpose of calculating commissions payable to TAs. It is not added on top of the fares you see on Princess.com, and it shouldn't be added on top of advertised TA fares. If you see any TAs doing that, report it to Princess as I believe that's a breach of terms of service by the TA.

My TA quotes me a lower total price than Princess, I don't see how it's broken down until I get an invoice after paying my deposit. It's never more than his original quote, he's not slamming me with fees.

The Guest Copy confirmation should not show NCF.

Final payment is still over 2 months away; however room selection is not as good now.

It sounds like I could save $1000 by canceling my booking and going directly with princess, but I would lose my sale items of 600 in obc and have to see what sale princess has now.

Should I call the TA and see if they want to keep the booking by reducing their NCF some? Has anyone had luck doing that?

I'm feeling kind of ripped off if I'm paying them and extra grand for 10 minutes work on the phone with me:(

NCF is set by the cruise line and it may be related to that OBC offer you received. As Princess's promo change all the time, you can always refare before final payment date if you feel the new fare/promo combination is to your advantage.

 

Doesn't hurt to give your TA a call and see what can be done.

"Taxes, Fees, and Port Charges" are fees collected by governments. While it is part of the total you pay, it is not part of the cruise fare.

 

NCF is part of the cruise fare. It is separated out by the cruise line solely for the purpose of calculating commissions payable to TAs. It is not added on top of the fares you see on Princess.com, and it shouldn't be added on top of advertised TA fares. If you see any TAs doing that, report it to Princess as I believe that's a breach of terms of service by the TA.

At the time of booking the TA fare was about $100 lower than the princess fare at the time. But as it stands currently the farea are equal except that TA invoice is adding a $1000 NCF to make it $1000 about the cost directly from princess. So is that legit or should it be reported to princess like you said?

At the time of booking the TA fare was about $100 lower than the princess fare at the time. But as it stands currently the farea are equal except that TA invoice is adding a $1000 NCF to make it $1000 about the cost directly from princess. So is that legit or should it be reported to princess like you said?

You cannot compare the fares you booked at that time to the fare you see now. I thought you meant you just booked and the advertised fare did not include NCF.

 

As I mentioned earlier, promos change and fares change. You have the option to refare/rebook before final payment date by contacting your TA.

If your TA does not discount then the total fare should be exactly the same as Princess. It is just that the TA is breaking down the fare and labeling the different parts to it more than Princess is. Many years ago the fares did not include all the fees. Your fare would be quoted as x and then they would say you had to add in y on top of it. Because of that some TA's advertised the lower amount and it looked like they were less expensive when they really were not. I think there may have been a court case or something because I believe laws were changed. Now they all list most of the fees in the price and tell you what the additional amount of gov't taxes and fees are. Some TA's (like mine) quote me a price which is either the same as Princess or less (because they discount). After I book I get an invoice that breaks the fare down between the fare, NCF, and gov't fees. It all adds up to what I was quoted originally which was either the same as Princess or less because I am getting a TA discount.

 

If yours shows a fare $1000 MORE than Princess I would call the TA to see what is going on. Does not sound right at all.

 

Ok, I just read the post just before mine. I must have missed something originally. You booked a while ago and at that time your fare was $100 less than Princess. Looks like fares have gone up. Your TA DID NOT add in something they should not have but just broke down the different parts of the fare whereas Princess does not but it is still included. Sounds like you have a better deal than people who are trying to book now. Be thankful you got in at a better price.

Go to the Princess website. Locate the same category cabin and obtain the fare plus the port charges.

Compare that fare to yours. The T.A's total should be the same or lower. If it is hiogher you have an issue with the T.A.

I just booked a vista suite for a seven day caribbean in 2019. I have both the invoice from the TA and the confirmation from the cruise line.

There is a portion of the fare, the NCF, that the cruise line does not pay commission on and my TA does not discount.

 

The cruise line confirmation

2749 fare.

125 Port Charges

2874 total.

 

TA Invoice

2324 Fare

175 NCF

125 Port Charges

2624 Total

 

Essentially, the TA subtracts the NCF and applies ~10% discount which is the 2324 fare. Then the TA adds back in the NCF and adds in the port charges. My cost has been reduced by $250.

Optotronics, $1000 sounds high for NCF for a cruise of 12 days or a little more. What sailing of the Royal are you on? We can look up the NCF and see if your TA is misstating the amount. (Unless you are on a really unusual itinerary, it should run close to $25/day)

Pretty sure they're saying the total for 2 people (because $450 taxes is way too high for one person, too). There are some 21 days sailings on the Royal in August and September, and in that case $500 NCF and $225 taxes/fees per person is about right.

 

But yes, if they would give the exact sailing we could easily check what the NCF is according to some other TAs.

Yes, I think that as well, as the 20 day Caribbean on the Royal this fall fits the NCF and taxes/fees numbers exactly.

 

OP: You said you had a screen shot of the Princess price when you booked a couple of months ago. How does that number compare to the Princess price for the same category today? (In an earlier post you wrote 'about' the cost from Princess, and I now wonder if you meant 'above' the cost from Princess??)

 

If you are on the itinerary I think you are on, the fare on most sailings has been reduced in the current sale by a significant amount....and if it is more than $300 pp (and balcony categories were reduced a LOT more than that) you should probably ask your TA to refare you. You will lose the OBC, but come out ahead in the final total.

Thanks everyone for helping with this, here is more detail.

We booked the 11/5/17 20 day cruise. Category BA

TA invoice for the 2 of is.

Cabin:6338 (3174 each)

NCF: 1000 (500 each)

Taxes/port fees 450 (225 each)

 

At the time of booking this same cabin from princess direct was.

Cabin: 6598 (3299 each)

Taxes/port fees 450 (225 each)

So it seems when I look at the invoice I received that I paid $740 more by using the TA than I did going direct with princess.

Is this what you see?

Now if I look at current prices I can get a comparable but only BB cabin that is about 10 cabins away in mid-forward for a total of 6966 but wouldn't get the 600obc.

 

I should have realized this sooner and dumped using a TA. Also shows me now that I look at it is that sales are often not really sales, they just jack up the price so that you think you're getting all this obc, but later when no saws is on the regular price drops back down... is this what you guys see?

 

Live and learn I guess.

Like someone once said

"Fool me once shame on me? Fool

Me twice...won't get fooled again":)

What is the final total on your invoice? Often TAs will indicate the amount of the NCCF, but it is actually already part of the cruise fare, not an additional charge.

 

In other words, is your final total $6788 or $7788?

What is the final total on your invoice? Often TAs will indicate the amount of the NCCF, but it is actually already part of the cruise fare, not an additional charge.

 

In other words, is your final total $6788 or $7788?

 

The final total due is $7788

Thanks everyone for helping with this, here is more detail.

We booked the 11/5/17 20 day cruise. Category BA

TA invoice for the 2 of is.

Cabin:6338 (3174 each)

NCF: 1000 (500 each)

Taxes/port fees 450 (225 each)

 

At the time of booking this same cabin from princess direct was.

Cabin: 6598 (3299 each)

Taxes/port fees 450 (225 each)

So it seems when I look at the invoice I received that I paid $740 more by using the TA than I did going direct with princess.

Is this what you see?

Now if I look at current prices I can get a comparable but only BB cabin that is about 10 cabins away in mid-forward for a total of 6966 but wouldn't get the 600obc.

 

I should have realized this sooner and dumped using a TA. Also shows me now that I look at it is that sales are often not really sales, they just jack up the price so that you think you're getting all this obc, but later when no saws is on the regular price drops back down... is this what you guys see?

 

Live and learn I guess.

Like someone once said

"Fool me once shame on me? Fool

Me twice...won't get fooled again":)

 

The final total due is $7788

 

Something is seriously wrong with your TA. The NCF, as folks have explained above, shouldn't have even appeared on your invoice. All it means is that Princess will be paying commission to the TA on $5338 (the $6338 fare - $1000 NCF). That's it. In no way should the NCF be passed along to the passenger.

Optotronics....I had to struggle a bit to make sense of what is happening here, but I think I have it figured out now. From your prior posts, I am guessing you booked under the Anniversary sale (which provided the $600 per cabin OBC) and which ran from Dec. 6-Feb 28. Is that correct?

 

For the dates of the sale, Princess offered a BA cabin at a price of $3674. I do not see that a BA was offered for $3299. However, during that same period I do see an entry level balcony (category BF) offered at $3299. Is it possible your screen shot price was for the entry level balcony? The 'balcony starting from' price? BF vs. BA?

 

I also note that your booked/invoice price via the TA (including NCF) is $3674....which exactly matches the price Princess was offering for a BA at this time, according to my sources.

 

So, let's assume your TA is not discounting, and you did get the OBC (and also one specialty dining should have also been included under that same sale). Let's just start with the price of $3674, which is what you have on your invoice...the current BA price is $3323, a reduction of $351pp. Total of $702 better than your booked price. Less the OBC value, less the cost of two specialty dining, leaves you with a difference of $44 if you refare. (Personally, I always prefer money in my pocket to spend as I wish rather than a credit or gift card to use only in certain places, but you may feel differently.)

 

It should be a simple matter to contact your TA and ask to be refared under the current promotion; you do not have to cancel your current cabin. I also should point out that I do not think your TA is doing anything nefarious or wrong (well, they could have explained NCF and how to read an invoice) but you could do better by finding a discount TA next time around. In this example, you could be saving an additional $635 per cabin by using a discounting TA.

 

I hope this helped explain things. :D

Something is seriously wrong with your TA. The NCF, as folks have explained above, shouldn't have even appeared on your invoice. All it means is that Princess will be paying commission to the TA on $5338 (the $6338 fare - $1000 NCF). That's it. In no way should the NCF be passed along to the passenger.

I have to disagree...NCF is always paid by the passenger. Some TAs may invoice it as a separate line item, but all include it in the total advertised fare just as Princess does. NCF plus the commissionable portion equals the total advertised fare. (So in this case, Princess pays commission on the $6338, not on the $1000 NCF, and the total invoiced and advertised fare is $7338.) Edited May 26, 2017 by cherylandtk

Optotronics....I had to struggle a bit to make sense of what is happening here, but I think I have it figured out now. From your prior posts, I am guessing you booked under the Anniversary sale (which provided the $600 per cabin OBC) and which ran from Dec. 6-Feb 28. Is that correct?

Yes it is:)

 

For the dates of the sale, Princess offered a BA cabin at a price of $3674. I do not see that a BA was offered for $3299. However, during that same period I do see an entry level balcony (category BF) offered at $3299. Is it possible your screen shot price was for the entry level balcony? The 'balcony starting from' price? BF vs. BA?

I think you are possibly correct here too :) do you have a database of every cruise and price or possibly a TA yourself?

 

I also note that your booked/invoice price via the TA (including NCF) is $3674....which exactly matches the price Princess was offering for a BA at this time, according to my sources.

 

So, let's assume your TA is not discounting, and you did get the OBC (and also one specialty dining should have also been included under that same sale). Let's just start with the price of $3674, which is what you have on your invoice...the current BA price is $3323, a reduction of $351pp. Total of $702 better than your booked price. Less the OBC value, less the cost of two specialty dining, leaves you with a difference of $44 if you refare. (Personally, I always prefer money in my pocket to spend as I wish rather than a credit or gift card to use only in certain places, but you may feel differently.)

 

It should be a simple matter to contact your TA and ask to be refared under the current promotion; you do not have to cancel your current cabin. I also should point out that I do not think your TA is doing anything nefarious or wrong (well, they could have explained NCF and how to read an invoice) but you could do better by finding a discount TA next time around. In this example, you could be saving an additional $635 per cabin by using a discounting TA.

 

I hope this helped explain things. :D

Thank you very much!

I think I will keep things as they are, it's. it worth the time over $40. If it were any other I would always fight for money in the pocket over "store credit", but since we will need to pay tips anyway, I would rather keep it as is than to have a bigger bill when I get off the ship:)

Again I can't thank everyone enough and especially you for the amazing detective work.