Passenger list distribution

[Skeezics]

Regent and Seabourn also have passenger lists and you can opt out if you wish.

[CruisinGerman]

On my last cruise, I wasn't given any form to fill out. We just showed up at the pier in Venice.

 

True compliance with the EU Data Protection laws would be a system to opt-in, not to opt-out, of this type of list.

 

Anyway, I repeat that I am not one of the passengers bothered by being included on the list.

 

However, I do advocate Silversea respecting the law.

 

Kind regards,

 

Gunther and Uta

[CASHIPman]

On my last cruise, I wasn't given any form to fill out. We just showed up at the pier in Venice.

 

Did you use a travel agent who filled it in for you? When I haven't filled in a guest information form on past Silversea trips I've received communication from them asking for the form. They (Silversea) seemed pretty insistent on this so I'd be VERY surprised if a form wasn't submitted for you in some way, shape or form.

[Keith1010]

Did you use a travel agent who filled it in for you? When I haven't filled in a guest information form on past Silversea trips I've received communication from them asking for the form. They (Silversea) seemed pretty insistent on this so I'd be VERY surprised if a form wasn't submitted for you in some way, shape or form.

 

We did all of ours on line.

 

I thought that was a requirement to get your final documents since it includes more than just this section?

 

Keith

[Needhamite]

I'm all for protecting privacy but as I have read the back and forth on this topic a variety of thoughts crossed my mind. Several writers have already mentioned one of them: it is very nice to have the passenger list as a memory aid for the names of all the people we meet on the ship in the course of a cruise. (After all, Silversea goes to great lengths to project a "country club image" for their ships. People who want to remain anonymous usually do not join country clubs.)

 

A second thought, however, is that given how the world has changed over the past decade I really have to wonder just how comfortable I would be spending one or two weeks (or longer) on a ship at sea with passengers who do not want to identify themselves on ships as small as those operated by Silversea. I certainly would understand (and agree with) objecting to publishing cabin numbers, home addresses and phone numbers, but is my instinct to be suspicious (and, perhaps, fearful) of "mystery" guests absolutely irrelevant when pitted against fellow passenger's claimed right to remain anonymous?

 

Third, I wonder if publishing a list of passenger names and home countries is, in fact, a violation of any national laws. International maritime law has a history much longer than our more recent concern about personal privacy. It certainly was not a violation in the past since passenger manifests for thousands of transatlantic crossings are part of the public record (and I am sure that each passenger was not queried to obtain his/her consent). Likewise, in the terrible situation of an airplane crash, is it not customary to release the names of individuals (and their nationalities) known to have booked seats? I understand that personal privacy laws (particularly in the EU) are much more restrictive now than they ever were but aren't a name and face unavoidably public aspects of a human being in normal social situations? Don't spies, criminals and hermits forfeit their preference for anonymity when they choose to travel on a public carrier? I have to wonder if the specific obligations cited in previous posts might simply not apply to the specific case of passenger lists. I am sure that there are knowledgeable CC's who would know the answer to this question.

 

-Peter

[CruisinGerman]

Dear friends:

 

First, whether or not our travel agency filled in any guest questionnaire I have no idea.

 

We merely showed up at the port in Venice, which by the way, and unlike usual Silversea service, was a complete disaster. The people they sent outside to the check-in desks didn't have a clue, and check-in outside ended up being nothing more than getting everyone through the metal detectors, onto the ship, and merely sent to reception on the ship to continue and complete check-in. Silversea definitely failed organization and crowd control that day -- thank god their ships only hold a few hundred people.

 

The EU data protection privacy laws developed in the mid 1990's and were truly scrutinized and further developed throughout the 2000's when the U.S. started demanding personal information from passenger records in airline reservations throughout the world.

 

The data protection relationship is between the passenger and Silversea. Silversea has the right to collect certain personal data to process a reservation and the cruise. It is highly doubtful that distributing a passenger list containing name, city and country falls within the justified use by Silversea of passenger data. (The only justified use would be to process the reservation, payment, immigration.)

 

Therefore, distributing the passenger list to third parties does not fall within Silversea's necessity to use passenger data and thus requires permission from the passenger. The way Silversea seems to describe the passenger list on the guest questionnaire would not pass muster under EU law to satisfy the requirement of obtaining the passenger's permission. Furthermore, this type of disclosure to third parties who do not require the passenger data in order to carry out the contractual business relationship between the passenger and Silversea would require a specific "opt-in" -- and not an ambiguous "opt-out" as Silversea appears to carry out.

 

I, personally, don't care one way or another that my name appears on the list, but there are people who do care. To the poster who is automatically suspicious of someone who wants or needs to remain anonymous, I don't think that is fair. The way the poster describes that suspicion seems to come from the generation of "Leave it to Beaver" or "Father Knows Best". The world has changed a great deal. I can think of many reasons why someone might want or need to remain anonymous on a Silversea Cruise, and none of those reasons point to the person in question being on the Interpol most wanted list. Maybe someone is on the cruise with a person who is not his or her spouse, but is giving the impression that it is indeed the spouse (oh, heavens, this doesn't happen in the 21st century). Maybe a passenger is a President of one of the world's countries. While that person will probably be recognized anyway, the bodyguards on the ship who are there as other passengers might have their security compromised if their identity were to be published on the passenger list. The potential reasons are endless. These people all have a right to their automatic privacy and anonymity and shouldn't have to take the proactive step of "opting-out" to protect that privacy. The procedure should definitely be "opting-in".

 

It's funny how nobody seems to care about this because it is such an intangible issue and matter. But it has some of the same principles involved as the charity issue has had on other threads.

 

You all agree that Silversea has no right to automatically take your money for its choice of charity, unless you specifically "opt-in". Along these lines, you feel that "opt-out" is inappropriate, because they have no right to take your money and specifically make you take an action to opt-out.

 

Well this is really the same thing. According to the EU Data protection laws applicable, at the very least, to passengers who purchase their cruise in the EU, Silversea has no right to disclose your data to a third party unless you specifically "opt-in". To make the passenger specifically "opt-out" would be a similar instance of taking your data first and making the passenger take a proactive step to "opt-out" of that unnecessary disclosure of personal data to third persons.

 

Kind regards,

 

Gunther and Uta

[CASHIPman]

We did all of ours on line.

 

I thought that was a requirement to get your final documents since it includes more than just this section?

 

Keith

 

Exactly. I think they even go on to say that they can't issue the tickets without the form.

[LaCroisiereS'amuse]

I have just received my Guest Information Form from the Silversea office in London for my forthcoming trip on the Whisper....

 

Whilst there is a "How do you want your name listed?" box on the form, there is also a very clear tick box next to it labelled "Please do not list my name".

[Host Dan]

I have just received my Guest Information Form from the Silversea office in London for my forthcoming trip on the Whisper....

 

Whilst there is a "How do you want your name listed?" box on the form' date=' there is also a very clear tick box next to it labelled "Please do not list my name".[/quote']

Thank you for posting this information...

 

Host Dan

[Isklaar]

I have just received my Guest Information Form from the Silversea office in London for my forthcoming trip on the Whisper....

 

Whilst there is a "How do you want your name listed?" box on the form' date=' there is also a very clear tick box next to it labelled "Please do not list my name".[/quote']

 

Thank you very much for posting this, as it has helped me to clarify the situation.

 

Our GIF was completed online, and there is certainly not any 'opt out' facility on the online form. We are currently composing a snail mail letter about this to SS so we can add this information for their benefit.

 

I'd also like to say that there is nothing sinister whatsoever about my partner's desire to not have his details listed, and I am rather offended by the suggestion.

 

Thank you to all of those who have responded politely and been helpful in answering what I originally thought was a straightforward question.

[LOGHL]

There are people who do not wish to be included in the Guest Directory. Just tell the Reception Desk and they will take care of it if you do not wish to be included. It is only your name and city/state/country. As jgibbs says, you are asked on your pre-registration form, online, how you wish to be listed in the Guest Directory.

 

 

Many folks do not want to be listed & SS respects their wishes.

Susan..who is the maitr'd on the Shadow, also the captain.. thanks Judy

[duct tape]

HI! Gilbert & Tatulli.

[LOGHL]

HI! Gilbert & Tatulli.

 

 

Thanks for the infor... are there many of the "old time" cruisers still with SS ??

[dusababy]

Thanks for the infor... are there many of the "old time" cruisers still with SS ??

 

 

Do you mean crew or guests? If guests -- that would be me :)

[brimary]

Having sailed with Silversea every year since 1997 I have built up a collection of Passenger List booklets which sad as it may seem, I still refer to for assistance with an ageing memory.Passengers decide as to their own entry or non entry so I fail to see a problem.I do have a problem with the other issue raised on this thread of the owners charity continuing to charge passengers credit cards without any authority to do so.The charity thread was locked sometime ago with an assurance that this unauthorised charity charge had ceased.Sadly we have all been mislead and misinformed presumably at the behest of the owners which is not a wise PR move.

[Bon.Vivant]

.The charity thread was locked sometime ago with an assurance that this unauthorised charity charge had ceased.Sadly we have all been mislead and misinformed presumably at the behest of the owners which is not a wise PR move.

 

Here’s the last entry from the "Automatic Charity" thread:

"I would say that the new policy of "opt-out" form w/o having to go to reception is here to stay. That said, I think this thread has served its purpose, and will need to close.

Thank you-

Host Dan "

 

In other words, nothing changed despite the outcry about this practice. We were told that the automatic charge would continue and it’s "here to stay", and it remains an opt-out and not an opt-in thing – nothing ‘new’ there. Such blatant disregard of customers’ sentiments is an insult – and such bad PR.

[CanadianKate]

In other words, nothing changed despite the outcry about this practice. We were told that the automatic charge would continue and it’s "here to stay", and it remains an opt-out and not an opt-in thing – nothing ‘new’ there. Such blatant disregard of customers’ sentiments is an insult – and such bad PR.

 

As I said, up-thread, in March 2011, on the Spirit, I was given an opt-in sheet which I didn't return to reception and my account was charged nothing.

 

Other cruisers reported up-thread that other ships, in March, had the opt-out form but it shows that there is a change happening at SilverSea.

[scapel]

Dear friends:

 

 

Meow, you should probably stick to measuring all of Silversea's cabins and deck space, because on this legal matter you don't have a clue.

 

 

 

Cruisin German,

I enjoyed reading all your post and respect what your knowledge has brought to the thread, but the above comment was out of place and should have an apology. I don't know "Meow", but the comments were appropriate.

[scapel]

Once again, my apologies for starting this discussion.

 

Isklaar,

No need to apologize for starting this discussion. It is a good topic and interesting to see the different takes.

Of course if we talk Silversea policy we always seem to come back to the charity donation (assumed donation).

[scapel]

Well I guess I don't have to express an opinion here. If you click on my name for the profile, I obviously want you to know me. The most entertaining thing on a cruise are the people you meet. I so far I have found out that I never met an Aussie that I didn't like.

[CruisinGerman]

Dear friends:

 

Of course I apologize to Meow. I meant her no offense and I appreciate her comments on a plural, diverse, forum such as this one.

 

However, what you are not seeing are the eight or ten posts of people lashing out at me for defending the European privacy laws -- these appear to have been deleted by the moderator.

 

To summarize, my position on this matter is that, in order to comply with EU data protection and privacy laws (for passengers who purchase their cruises in the EU), Silversea would have to make specific mention of these laws, offering passengers the opportunity to OPT-IN and not to OPT-OUT, since the use of passenger data on a passenger name list distributed to passengers goes way beyond Silversea's business and administrative need to collect the data in the first place.

 

Kind regards,

 

Gunther and Uta

[meow!]

Cruisin German,

I enjoyed reading all your post and respect what your knowledge has brought to the thread, but the above comment was out of place and should have an apology. I don't know "Meow", but the comments were appropriate.

Thank you kindly for your support, your fairness has been cordially appreciated.

 

 

Of course I apologize to Meow. I meant her no offense and I appreciate her comments on a plural, diverse, forum such as this one.

Thank you for your reply. Apology accepted.

[Silver Spectre]

Dear friends:

 

However, what you are not seeing are the eight or ten posts of people lashing out at me for defending the European privacy laws -- these appear to have been deleted by the moderator.

 

Gunther and Uta

 

This is perhaps a wee bit extreme, some mild joshing maybe, with just the merest hint of irony.