Birth Certificates- Be Aware, it's VERY particular!

[Jimmy Geegitz]

We have the passport cards we love those.

[pjhootch]

[COLOR=purple][quote name='njhorseman']Sorry, but the State of New York does not issue birth certificates for New York City births, only New York City does:[/COLOR]
[COLOR=purple] [/COLOR]
[COLOR=purple]VitalChek is just a business that operates as an intermediary for ordering birth and other records from the government agencies that keep those records. They can't issue a document that doesn't exist. I suspect what you got for your children was an updated version of their NY City birth certificates that includes all the information required by the State Department, while their previous BCs were missing something State requires.[/quote][/COLOR]


You're probaby right. I just didn't look closely enough. I know it wasn't the short form BC from NYC, it was a long form and it "seemed" to have all the info on it. Either way, when we got the BCs from vitalcheck we took them straight to the passport office and had no problem that time. I guess since we got the passports I haven't bothered to look too closely at the new BCs.

No way am I going to preach to anyone about getting a passport if they're comfortable cruising with a BC. If we didn't travel out of the country routinely (not cruising) we might have just stuck with the BCs ourselves for cruising.

I think the problem is that federal regs now being applied to something the states have control over, is causing all kinds of confusion in people, cruisers and officials. Passports [U]are[/U] expensive for a large family. More importantly, if people rely on the information sent out by Carnival, they may wind up not having the correct documentation. Also, us comparing our BCs to each other online, is not going to ensure anyone has documentation that will be accepted when they arrive at the port.

[cmorie]

[quote name='rockbock']Somehow I can't help but think that it was the guy at the port who was clueless. A thread like this would have popped up MUCH sooner than this otherwise, since apparently there are a LOT of people who have county-issued birth certificates. Surely there would have been LOTS of posts about unhappy cruisers if county-issued BCs weren't allowed. And the Carnival rep I spoke to was very convinced that the county-issued certificate was ok. I'm too tired to do it now, but tomorrow I'll call Carnival a few more times to see if I get the same story from other agents.[/quote]

+1.

With as many threads created about shrimp cocktail there seems like there would be more threads/posts about people not getting on because their BC wasn't state-issued. Looks like it varies by who's working at which port and on which day and who says it's okay to use documents that otherwise wouldn't be excepted. I don't even know where my hospital birth record is so I would never think to bring it. Because if it's one thing everyone (mostly) agrees on is that hospital-issued BC are NOT acceptable but the OP was able to use it.

[cmorie]

[quote name='pjhootch']


You're probaby right. I just didn't look closely enough. I know it wasn't the short form BC from NYC, it was a long form and it "seemed" to have all the info on it. Either way, when we got the BCs from vitalcheck we took them straight to the passport office and had no problem that time. I guess since we got the passports I haven't bothered to look too closely at the new BCs.

No way am I going to preach to anyone about getting a passport if they're comfortable cruising with a BC. If we didn't travel out of the country routinely (not cruising) we might have just stuck with the BCs ourselves for cruising.

I think the problem is that federal regs now being applied to something the states have control over, is causing all kinds of confusion in people, cruisers and officials. Passports [U]are[/U] expensive for a large family. More importantly, if people rely on the information sent out by Carnival, they may wind up not having the correct documentation. [B]Also, us comparing our BCs to each other online, is not going to ensure anyone has documentation that will be accepted when they arrive at the port.[/B][/quote]

Everyone should upload the top section of their BCs so we can see. lol. I'm kidding of course but I agree with you. Hard to compare without visuals and even then BCs look so different year to year and state to state we still couldn't confirm.

[chicy724]

[quote name='cmorie']+1.

With as many threads created about shrimp cocktail there seems like there would be more threads/posts about people not getting on because their BC wasn't state-issued. Looks like it varies by who's working at which port and on which day and who says it's okay to use documents that otherwise wouldn't be excepted. I don't even know where my hospital birth record is so I would never think to bring it. Because if it's one thing everyone (mostly) agrees on is that hospital-issued BC are NOT acceptable but the OP was able to use it.[/quote]

I agree with you completely. From all of the posts on here, it seems we just got someone who may have different requirements than another.. or misconstrued the requirements.. or perhaps it is just that specific port. At any rate, as you said we were able to use the hospital BC which they said normally is not acceptable but "today" they will as an exception. Who knows.. What I do not understand is why the hospital one was more accepted than the one my hubby had. We will never know.. especially since we will have passports for our next cruise! I'm not going through that again, I'd rather not worry! :p

[cmorie]

[quote name='chicy724']I agree with you completely. From all of the posts on here, it seems we just got someone who may have different requirements than another.. or misconstrued the requirements.. or perhaps it is just that specific port. At any rate, as you said we were able to use the hospital BC which they said normally is not acceptable but "today" they will as an exception. Who knows.. What I do not understand is why the hospital one was more accepted than the one my hubby had. We will never know.. especially since we will have passports for our next cruise! I'm not going through that again, I'd rather not worry! :p[/quote]

I just may get one for my next one. (Funny to say as I haven't went on the first one yet lol). However I know for almost a 100% fact my boyfriend will probably not. He doesn't fly so going out of country, outside of a cruise, isn't in the near future and if it's just the two of us I'm not going without him if worst case scenario were to arise.

BTW if someone knows how to trick a person on a plane....I'm all ears..;)

[B and C Blake]

[quote name='cmorie']
BTW if someone knows how to trick a person on a plane....I'm all ears..;)[/QUOTE]

5 letter word ....

XANAX:D

[rnvattes]

[quote name='MsTabbyKats']There is absolutely NO excuse to not have a passport....if the price is too much....then you really should re-evaluate whether of not you can afford a cruise.
[/QUOTE]

Really? On what basis do you make this statement??

:popcorn

also

:rolleyes

[msstarr22]

My birth certificate is a city issue, and old very very old......

[RMM34667]

[quote name='MsTabbyKats']Sorry, but either this was a long time ago...or you don't have the facts.
A supervisor on NCL doesn't supersede the CPB.

I have a close relative in Homeland Security....the agents don't have the authority to make "exceptions". The only exceptions made are if an agent screws up.[/quote]

You are so wrong. It was 2007 and I WAS RIGHT THERE! The fact that the BC he was carrying (and must have shown to enter the terminal) had my sister's name on it. It was not questioned until checking in with NCL.

We sailed..

[IMG]http://i780.photobucket.com/albums/yy87/RMM34667/family.jpg[/IMG]

[Warm Breezes]

[quote name='MsTabbyKats']There is absolutely NO excuse to not have a passport....if the price is too much....then you really should re-evaluate whether of not you can afford a cruise.[COLOR=red] I don't need to make excuses for not having a passport. It is not REQUIRED for the type of travel I am currently doing, that includes closed loop cruises. No need to make excuses to you or anyone else and I can afford to cruise, with or with out one, not that it is any of your business.[/COLOR]

If the agent is doing his job....don't complain when your left at the port. Agents don't want to hear "sob stories"....nor do they want to lose their jobs by letting people sail who don't have valid documentation.[/quote]
[COLOR=red]If an agent is doing his job then I won't be left at port because I have valid documentation....a certified BC issued by the Dept of Vital Statistic and a valid driver's license. If people do their research before traveling out of the country, then they will know what is required for the type of traveling they are doing. [/COLOR]
[COLOR=red][/COLOR]
[COLOR=red]It does not matter if you don't think it's valid or if you think that everyone should have passports. What matters is what is required by our gov't. They made the closed loop exception for a reason. Whether you like it or not it is there for people like me who only travel out of the country on closed loop cruises and who are willing to take on the very small risk that an emergency will occur, which would require a passport to get off an island that I am only on for a couple of brief hours.[/COLOR]

[Sauer-kraut]

[quote name='msstarr22']My birth certificate is a city issue, and old very very old......[/QUOTE]

You might want to call the state you were born in and get the updated one. For years I still was able to use the county record of live birth, but just last year on a lark I got a new one.

I happened to be in the county courthouse for another reason and saw the vital statics department, went in, paid my $15 and instantly got a new printed out one right away. Raised seals and all out of a computer printer. I was skeptical that it was the real thing but was assured it was.

When I couldn't find my passport for my July cruise I went and got a new one issued and it was fine with my new birth certificate.

[buckeyefrank]

[quote name='Alliezona09']I believe the Dept. of Vital Statistics are State offices~ :confused: aren't they~ lol:D[/quote]

No they are not. Each state operates differently. In Ohio, there is a state Dept of Vital Statistics and is located in Columbus. The city of Columbus also has a Dept of Vital Statistics. They utilize the Ohio database so as long as you were born in Ohio, you can go to any of the county or city departments and obtain a copy of your birth certificate. The signature is from the registrar for that particular office.

We just returned from our cruise a couple weeks ago and had no problems with our city issued birth certificate.

[Elmer McCurdy]

[quote name='RMM34667']WOW.. So I went to see what the new rules where on BC for passport application. There is NOTHING about being issued by a State. [/quote]



Okay, let's demystify something here.

The Federal Government does not issue birth certificates. That is done by the states. Various states employ various apperatus for doing so. Some have Vital Statistics offices in county court houses, other have them in municipal buildings, some have a regional structure, others have it at a local level. There is no hard-and-fast run on this. You have to figure out it by what state you were born in. VitalChek is a helpful resource for anyone who lives in a seperate state than the one in which they were born. However, depending on how the state you were born in operates there vital statistics department, even then they may not help you. Some states still require you to show up in person to get a copy of your birth certificate.

As for only having the mother listed on a birth certificate, that's fine. It's a none issue. It just means that legally the child only has one parent and that parent is the sole caretaker and has sole custody.

And the ultimate way to make sure is to call the Department of State. Not CCL. CCL doesn't decide if you get on the ship. Board Patrol does, and Boarder Patrol is a division of the Department of State.

[buckeyefrank]

[quote name='misguidedangel']Oh my, city issued, state issued...oh my...I consider myself lucky for being a Canadian and requiring a passport to go anywhere. Also, the hospital gives you a birth certificate, but it is more of a mometo document than anything. We have one and only one BC issued to us and that is from the provincial Vital Statistics department. They have changed styles since I got mine in 1973 and are not larger and include more detail like parents name. If I ever need to use my BC it is still legally acceptable even if it is 39 years old.....

I only wish more Americans would break down and do what everyone else in the world has to do--get a passport. Heck, even Europeans travelling to another European country need a passport. Ya, it is called the EU--European Union, but that applies more to goods travelling over the borders...

Besides, anyone with a passort has a much quicker trip through customs...[/quote]

Not necessarily true. When we came back through customs a couple weeks ago, the agent didn't even look our BCs. We gave him 1 passport and 3 BCs, he looked at the pile and handed it back saying "have a nice day".

[njhorseman]

[quote name='Elmer McCurdy']Okay, let's demystify something here.

The Federal Government does not issue birth certificates. That is done by the states. Various states employ various apperatus for doing so. Some have Vital Statistics offices in county court houses, other have them in municipal buildings, some have a regional structure, others have it at a local level. There is no hard-and-fast run on this. You have to figure out it by what state you were born in. VitalChek is a helpful resource for anyone who lives in a seperate state than the one in which they were born. However, depending on how the state you were born in operates there vital statistics department, even then they may not help you. Some states still require you to show up in person to get a copy of your birth certificate.

As for only having the mother listed on a birth certificate, that's fine. It's a none issue. It just means that legally the child only has one parent and that parent is the sole caretaker and has sole custody.

[COLOR="DarkRed"]And the ultimate way to make sure is to call the Department of State. Not CCL. CCL doesn't decide if you get on the ship. Board Patrol does, and Boarder Patrol is a division of the Department of State.[/COLOR][/QUOTE]

That's incorrect. Customs and Border Protection (CBP) is the agency's name, and it is part of the Department of Homeland Security (DHS), not the Department of State. You can read about CBP's responsibilities here:

[url]http://www.cbp.gov/xp/cgov/about/[/url]

[Warm Breezes]

[quote name='misguidedangel']Oh my, city issued, state issued...oh my...I consider myself lucky for being a Canadian and requiring a passport to go anywhere. Also, the hospital gives you a birth certificate, but it is more of a mometo document than anything. We have one and only one BC issued to us and that is from the provincial Vital Statistics department. They have changed styles since I got mine in 1973 and are not larger and include more detail like parents name. If I ever need to use my BC it is still legally acceptable even if it is 39 years old.....

I only wish more Americans would break down and do what everyone else in the world has to do--get a passport. Heck, even Europeans travelling to another European country need a passport. Ya, it is called the EU--European Union, but that applies more to goods travelling over the borders...

[COLOR=red]Besides, anyone with a passort has a much quicker trip through customs[/COLOR]...[/quote]

That is not true. We have never had any issues or been slowed down going through customs with our BC and DL. In fact, on our Destiny cruise, the couple in front of us had passports. It took the 2 of them longer to get through customs than it did the 4 of us with BC and DL. They normally just glance through our paperwork and wave us on.

[Elmer McCurdy]

[quote name='njhorseman']That's incorrect. Customs and Border Protection (CBP) is the agency's name, and it is part of the Department of Homeland Security (DHS), not the Department of State. You can read about CBP's responsibilities here:

[URL]http://www.cbp.gov/xp/cgov/about/[/URL][/quote]

You're right. Call the DHS then. ;)

[iowagirl411]

[quote name='Alliezona09']Yup~ that's what it states on the government website~
Beginning April 1, 2011, the U.S. Department of State will require the full names of the applicant’s parent(s) to be listed on all certified birth certificates to be considered as primary evidence of U.S. citizenship for all passport applicants, regardless of age. Certified birth certificates missing this information will not be acceptable as evidence of citizenship. This will not affect applications already in-process that have been submitted or accepted before the effective date.
In addition to this requirement, certified copies of birth certificates must also include the following information to be considered acceptable primary evidence of U.S. citizenship:
Full name of the applicant
Date of birth
Place of birth
Raised, embossed, impressed or multicolored seal of issuing authority
Registrar’s signature
The date the certificate was filed with the registrar’s office [COLOR="Red"]([B]must be within one year) [/B][/COLOR]![/QUOTE]

[quote name='jmeans23970'](a) [I]Primary evidence of birth in the United States. [/I]A person born in the United States generally must submit a birth certificate. The birth certificate must show the full name of the applicant, the applicant's place and date of birth, the full name of the parent(s),and must be signed by the official custodian of birth records, bear the seal of the issuing office, [COLOR="Red"][B]and show a filing date within one year of the date of birth[/B][/COLOR].[/QUOTE]

[COLOR="Red"][SIZE="4"]Here's another wrinkle. My SO wasn't issued a birth certificate until he was an adult.
He has been on 3 cruises with his funky certified type written certificate, but not in the last few years. He used to have a passport, but that hasn't been seen for 25 or 30 years.
Anyone have experience with this?[/SIZE][/COLOR]

[Jkcyoung]

Chicy724
Do you know if your husbands BC was issued from the department of vital statistics? We are cruising next month and we have passports, but my parents do not and are not getting them. My stepdads is city issued but has all the info required and was issued by vital statistics. I called CBP and they said it is fine, but your post makes me nervous! My moms does not have her parents name, but it appears she would only need that for applying for a passport? For some reason my parents are not worried about this but I will loose sleep over it:confused:Don't want to be waving to them from the ship:eek:

[jmjpro]

Birth certificate posts always gets me scared. Cruising in 3 weeks, just pulled out my dd's birth certificate to make sure it was not a city one (I don't really know what that even is).

 

Hers says across the top...

 

State of Ohio

Vital Statistics

Certificate of Live Birth

 

I assume this was issued by the state of Ohio.

 

However, it is stamped that this is an official copy issued by my local city registrar. There is the raised stamp from the city next to that.

 

Is this an official state issued BC?

[JJ2sail]

Yup~ that's what it states on the government website~

Beginning April 1, 2011, the U.S. Department of State will require the full names of the applicant’s parent(s) to be listed on all certified birth certificates to be considered as primary evidence of U.S. citizenship for all passport applicants, regardless of age. Certified birth certificates missing this information will not be acceptable as evidence of citizenship. This will not affect applications already in-process that have been submitted or accepted before the effective date.

In addition to this requirement, certified copies of birth certificates must also include the following information to be considered acceptable primary evidence of U.S. citizenship:

Full name of the applicant

Date of birth

Place of birth

Raised, embossed, impressed or multicolored seal of issuing authority

Registrar’s signature

The date the certificate was filed with the registrar’s office (must be within one year)

 

a lot of people on here have said *raised seal*raised seal*raised seal* when in fact not all states have a raised seal, some have a waterwark, some a stamp...etc... glad it all worked out for you in the end!!

 

 

~~~~~~~~~~~~

 

To add to the confusion~I just saw this on the government site:

Primary Evidence of U.S. Citizenship (One of the following):

Previously issued, undamaged U.S. Passport

Certified birth certificate issued by the city, county or state* Consular Report of Birth Abroad or Certification of Birth

Naturalization Certificate

Certificate of Citizenship

 

How come the government will take a BC issued by the city or county but not Carnival~?? Odd! lol~ I'm glad I have all my paperwork in order!

 

 

County birth certificates are from the state and county, our bc's say State of Califorinia county of___________ Office of vital statistics. Also if I go to the California state website of vital statistics it says if you need your bc within 6 weeks, to go to your county registrar to get it.

[bo didy]

:)Just get a pass port. Yea they may cost a little but they are worth it. Look at this way if something happens on a ship and you have to leave out of an island that ain't part of the good ole usa. YOU ARE IN TROUABLE. Look at what happened when the ships left San Juan early. They went to Barbados no pass port no entry. Pass port is the best policey.

[DebJ14]

I have never heard of a city issued birth certifcate. I learn something new everyday.

 

DH has one issued in 1952 by the City of Newark, NJ. Not worth the paper it is printed on now.

[JJ2sail]

We do have passports and so do our kids and I also recommend getting them. But for some people who do not travel a lot it is an extra expense, especially if they are traveling with kids.