The arrest of the captain is very shocking

[IndyDenise]

From eyewitnesses:

Ophelie Gondelle and David Du Pays of Marseille, France, said they saw the captain in a lifeboat, covered by a blanket, well before all the passengers were off the ship. They insisted on telling a reporter what they saw, so incensed that — according to them — the captain had abandoned the ship before everyone had been evacuated.

"The commander left before and was on the dock before everyone was off," said Gondelle, 28, a French military officer.

[sstrong]

If we are going to quote facts, please let's keep it to the facts and not mix it up with opinion or hearsay.

 

These are all facts that have been widely reported by multiple sources. That the captain has denied them doesn't make them any less fact. Of course it's possible new facts could come to light, or the ones that have been reported could change. But this is what we know now. None of it is "opinion." There is much opinion in this and other threads, which is why most of us come here -- to exchange our opinions with others. Our opinions are all *based on* the known facts (or at least, the ones we choose to acknowledge -- some here seem to ignore certain facts for some reason). But what I've stated are strictly the known facts, as best we can know them, and nothing more. The fact that facts are subject to change is no reason not to discuss them.

 

For the record, I don't have much of an opinion one way or the other because I'm not a sailor, I've only been on one cruise, and I know little about navigation or evacuation procedures. I came here hoping to hear the opinions of others who have such knowledge and experience. And I've been happy to find it!

[cmaygar]

There are many things that we all know:

 

1. The Captain ran a mega cruise liner aground by hitting rocks in very heavily navigated waters through a route that he has sailed many times.

 

2. The Captain never held a safety "muster station" drill for any of the passengers prior to to or immediately after setting sail, which is a violation of maritime laws.

 

3. The Captain never called for assistance or issued a "mayday" signal for assistance from emergency sources.

 

4. The Captain did not have a well-trained crew that was skilled at handling emergency situations and delayed assisting passengers to abandon ship.

 

5. The Captain never notified the passengers that the vessel was in distress and never alerted them to get to their muster stations with their life vests on in order to leave the ship in an orderly and safe fashion.

 

6. By the time that the crew started to fill lifeboats, it was too late to safely lower most of them because the boat was sinking and the list of the vessel was too great to safely lower the lifeboats.

 

7. The Captain and many of his officers left the vessel prior to the safe rescue of the passengers and his crew.

 

8. Costa is doing very little to help the stranded from reports coming in indicating that they are not providing the stranded passengers with a much as a change of clothes.

 

9. The Captain and another officer have been arrested and detained for manslaughter of at least 5 people.

 

Seems like there is a lot of information here that show complete recklessness on the part of the Captain. Huge rocks don't just magically appear in the Med. It's almost the equivalent of a drunk driver indicating that they have no idea how a telephone pole just appeared before them out of nowhere before they hit it. This sordid tale shows complete disregard for all safety laws, complete disregard for the safety of passengers and crew, complete disregard for ensuring that all passengers and crew were removed from the ship prior to the Captain leaving them to fend for themselves.

 

Not sure how much more information that you need to indicate that it's apparent that the Captain in this instance is 100% at fault for causing this disaster and his employer will be paying a hefty price to the survivors of the deceased and to the surviving passengers for surviving a totally preventable experience of horror.

[IndyDenise]

By msnbc.com staff and news services

Updated at 3 p.m. ET:

The captain of the capsized Italian cruise ship was spotted on land during the evacuation, and he ignored pleas by officers that he return to his ship and honor his duty to stay aboard until everyone else was safely off the vessel, a Coast Guard official said Sunday.

"We did our duty," Italian Coast Guard Cmdr. Francesco Paolillo told The Associated Press, referring to efforts to get Francesco Schettino back on the Costa Concordia Friday night.

 

------------------------------------------

 

If all these reports are true about this captain ( and there are many, many eyewitnesses to support the same claims ) ..well I am just shocked at the cowardness of this man.

[Gerrym]

These are all facts that have been widely reported by multiple sources. That the captain has denied them doesn't make them any less fact. Of course it's possible new facts could come to light, or the ones that have been reported could change. But this is what we know now. None of it is "opinion." There is much opinion in this and other threads, which is why most of us come here -- to exchange our opinions with others. Our opinions are all *based on* the known facts (or at least, the ones we choose to acknowledge -- some here seem to ignore certain facts for some reason). But what I've stated are strictly the known facts, as best we can know them, and nothing more. The fact that facts are subject to change is no reason not to discuss them.

 

For the record, I don't have much of an opinion one way or the other because I'm not a sailor, I've only been on one cruise, and I know little about navigation or evacuation procedures. I came here hoping to hear the opinions of others who have such knowledge and experience. And I've been happy to find it!

 

Because they have been reported does not mean they are fact. Facts are something that are proven. It was widely reported that the captain left the ship before his passengers had finished being evacuated. Now that may well be proven to be fact, but right now it is disputed by the Captain and it has not been proven to be correct or incorrect. Therefore how on earth can it be fact???

 

I think that unproven reports, rumour and hearsay should be tagged as just that so that people understand the difference between that and fact.

 

Also it doesn't help generally in such a tragic situation.

 

 

I hope that's clearer for you now.

 

Cheers

 

Gerry

[Gerrym]

And you know all this from what - media reports, eyewitness reports, etc. All of these have been very wrong in the past. Wait until the investigation is completed and then place the blame where it belongs.

 

 

Spot on Dot!

 

 

Cheers

 

Gerry

[Hunwolf]

Because they have been reported does not mean they are fact. Facts are something that are proven. It was widely reported that the captain left the ship before his passengers had finished being evacuated. Now that may well be proven to be fact, but right now it is disputed by the Captain and it has not been proven to be correct or incorrect. Therefore how on earth can it be fact???

 

I think that unproven reports, rumour and hearsay should be tagged as just that so that people understand the difference between that and fact.

 

Also it doesn't help generally in such a tragic situation.

 

 

I hope that's clearer for you now.

 

Cheers

 

Gerry

 

Well...either the Captain is lying or multiple passengers AND the Italian Coast Guard which have both reported him bailing are lying.

 

Hmm...I'm torn...Tough call. Occam's Razor may apply here.

[YII]

There are many things that we all know:

 

1. The Captain ran a mega cruise liner aground by hitting rocks in very heavily navigated waters through a route that he has sailed many times.

 

2. The Captain never held a safety "muster station" drill for any of the passengers prior to to or immediately after setting sail, which is a violation of maritime laws.

 

3. The Captain never called for assistance or issued a "mayday" signal for assistance from emergency sources.

 

4. The Captain did not have a well-trained crew that was skilled at handling emergency situations and delayed assisting passengers to abandon ship.

 

5. The Captain never notified the passengers that the vessel was in distress and never alerted them to get to their muster stations with their life vests on in order to leave the ship in an orderly and safe fashion.

 

6. By the time that the crew started to fill lifeboats, it was too late to safely lower most of them because the boat was sinking and the list of the vessel was too great to safely lower the lifeboats.

 

7. The Captain and many of his officers left the vessel prior to the safe rescue of the passengers and his crew.

 

8. Costa is doing very little to help the stranded from reports coming in indicating that they are not providing the stranded passengers with a much as a change of clothes.

 

9. The Captain and another officer have been arrested and detained for manslaughter of at least 5 people.

 

Seems like there is a lot of information here that show complete recklessness on the part of the Captain. Huge rocks don't just magically appear in the Med. It's almost the equivalent of a drunk driver indicating that they have no idea how a telephone pole just appeared before them out of nowhere before they hit it. This sordid tale shows complete disregard for all safety laws, complete disregard for the safety of passengers and crew, complete disregard for ensuring that all passengers and crew were removed from the ship prior to the Captain leaving them to fend for themselves.

 

Not sure how much more information that you need to indicate that it's apparent that the Captain in this instance is 100% at fault for causing this disaster and his employer will be paying a hefty price to the survivors of the deceased and to the surviving passengers for surviving a totally preventable experience of horror.

 

3. Do you have any actual proof ?

 

4. Once they were on board they had the papers in order to be on the board. The fact that their training was bull**** it's different.

 

5. Well they all got on shore didn't they ? If they weren't notified they would have been dead now.

 

6. Crew couldn't predict how long they will have until the ship would incline.

 

7. Do you have any actual proof ?

 

8. Most of the passengers are safe. Their attention needs to be focused on the other passengers that might be onboard. They don't have the authority to issue passports or do miracles for the passengers already on shore. Local embassies must assist it's citizen with legal support. What would you expect that Costa will deliver H&M vouchers to each individual on ship ? They don't have the manpower to do that, other passengers are onboard of other ships in their fleet and need to be safe as well.

[Red Mini Stapler]

8. Most of the passengers are safe. Their attention needs to be focused on the other passengers that might be onboard. They don't have the authority to issue passports or do miracles for the passengers already on shore. Local embassies must assist it's citizen with legal support. What would you expect that Costa will deliver H&M vouchers to each individual on ship ? They don't have the manpower to do that, other passengers are onboard of other ships in their fleet and need to be safe as well.

 

H&M? oh come on! they can do better than that! how about giorgio armani or gucci?

[Hunwolf]

I'm pretty sure not all pax made it to shore.

 

Why is that even the posters trying to chastise other posters for not stating facts can't even get the facts right themselves?!?!

[BecciBoo]

Well...either the Captain is lying or multiple passengers AND the Italian Coast Guard which have both reported him bailing are lying.

 

Hmm...I'm torn...Tough call. Occam's Razor may apply here.

 

Very astute IMHO.

[Gerrym]

I'm pretty sure not all pax made it to shore.

 

Why is that even the posters trying to chastise other posters for not stating facts can't even get the facts right themselves?!?!

 

 

Sorry mate. don't know what post(s) you are referring to.

[cmaygar]

The passengers on the ship are reporting all of this. Come on, the Med is one of the most navigated areas in the world for thousands of years. Did mysterious rocks magically appear in approved navigation routes? Please. At least 5 are dead. That's an absolute tragedy. There is no excuse whatsoever for something that was totlaly avoidable to occur. This is a travesty. I love cruising and will continue to cruise, but will never cruise with Costa after this horror.

[Jimsgirl]

Am I wrong in thinking that pictures of the ship after all the passengers have left show the ship with the interior lights on.

 

If this is so, then obviously it was not a failure of electrics that caused the ship to sail so close to the rocks.

 

I am not a "sailor" just a cruiser, but it does not make sense to go so close to an island , when I drive my car I do not drive within an inch of the kerb, I leave adequate space "just in case" I have to move over because someone comes too close to my left hand side (I live in USA).

 

A man with 11 years experience would know that island had rocks that close to the land.

 

Who will investigate , the Italian police, an Italian Maritime board, will the hearings be public or behind closed doors ? Why do I think that the cruising public will never hear the truth?

[jopocop]

Good observation. It was reported that the Ship hit the Le Scole rocks just south of the town. The ship then swerved to the left and hung up at the town beach. The Captain and his team needed to be 1-2 miles from that Island at least. The bridge people were all derelict and all need to be arrested before they escape or flee.

Cruise lines from the HQ now need to watch each ship via modern GPS and Track their ships. The can watch the bridge via remote ways, TV and computers.

They can listen to all commands.

The Cruise Industry has to do remote tracking and monitoring 24/7 from HQ. Do not ever trust these people with your lives. We deserve better protection with modern technology and as stated by remote monitoring.

Remember Bin Laden and how Obama listened live the assault then? That is possible today by the cruise industry.

Boycott until they make these safety improvements.

[Presto2]

Just been on Sky News that Costa Cruises are saying that there may have been "significant human error on behalf of the Captain of the CC" --- that doesn't make me think that they have a lot of confidence in their Capt at the minute .........

[kirsty_r]

Just been on Sky News that Costa Cruises are saying that there may have been "significant human error on behalf of the Captain of the CC" --- that doesn't make me think that they have a lot of confidence in their Capt at the minute .........

Very true - Costa seem to have washed their hands of him. It doesn't sound like an innocent man.

[missfrankiecat]

Your post reminds me of the "gossip" or "telephone" game that we used to play as kids. One child would whisper something in the next kid's ear, and the story that emerged at the other end of the line seldom matched the original statement.

 

All that you have to go on is a news story about a radio report. Have you heard the original radio report? Can you verify its content and its source?

 

Maybe the captain screwed up, and maybe he didn't. At this point, we simply don't know.

 

His employers seem to think he did and they should know.

 

http://www.costacruises.co.uk/B2C/GB/Info/concordia_statement.htm

[Cancruizer]

Interesting - excerpt from Costa's website

.... seems that what passengers, crew, media have reported is coraborated. Unbelievable!

 

 

We are working with investigators to find out precisely what went wrong aboard the Costa Concordia. While the investigation is ongoing, preliminary indications are that there may have been significant human error on the part of the ship’s Master, Captain Francesco Schettino, which resulted in these grave consequences. The route of the vessel appears to have been too close to the shore, and the Captain’s judgment in handling the emergency appears to have not followed standard Costa procedures. We are aware that the lead Prosecutor has levelled serious accusations against the ship’s Captain, who joined Costa Crociere in 2002 as a Safety Officer and was appointed Captain in 2006, after acting as Staff Captain as well. As all Costa Masters, he has been constantly trained passing all tests. In light of these accusations and the continuing investigation, it would be inappropriate for us to comment further at this time.

 

 

[sstrong]

Because they have been reported does not mean they are fact. Facts are something that are proven. It was widely reported that the captain left the ship before his passengers had finished being evacuated. Now that may well be proven to be fact, but right now it is disputed by the Captain and it has not been proven to be correct or incorrect. Therefore how on earth can it be fact???

 

I think that unproven reports, rumour and hearsay should be tagged as just that so that people understand the difference between that and fact.

 

Also it doesn't help generally in such a tragic situation.

 

 

I hope that's clearer for you now.

 

Cheers

 

Gerry

 

Nothing that I or anyone else has said on here purports to be "proven" fact in the legal sense. Nor do I think anyone would take these discussions as legal proof. As I said, it's just what the facts are as we best know them. Pointing out that the facts could conceivably change adds nothing to the discussion. Of course they might change. Everyone knows that. But as it stands, there is a general consensus that these things happened. And that's what we're here to talk about (what happened, how, and why). If you're not interested in the discussion then why are you here? There is no such thing as absolute certainty in life, even in legal proceedings, much less on an internet chat board.

[Starlight Durban Cruising]

Also, executive management of Costa violated every PR rule in the book. There are expert crisis management companies that are available 24/7 to rapidly assess a disaster and do immediate PR to show the company in the best possible light.

 

Here we are two days later and upper management is in denial and will not release the truth to the public. Upper Management knows what exactly happened and will not tell the truth.

 

Shame on them, including Carnival executive management not cooperating to tell the truth to the public.

 

WOW. Not sure if you realized it:

 

1. Different culture in Italy.

2. Not every country does PR "the American way". Sure, most of us foreigners studied from the "American" Marketing textbook, the "American" PR textbook, etc., while at a "foreign" university, but whose to say that textbook (handbook) is the best way for the local country.

3. They have more important priorities right now - safety of the rescued passengers.

4. "Releasing the truth". They have been posting information on their web-site - but since Saturday it has been slow, bordering on crashing at the best of times.

5. Lastly, it IS a weekend.

[Signor John]

His employers seem to think he did and they should know.

 

They won't know until the investigation is complete.

 

Even if the accident was the result of human error, it will take an investigation to determine what caused the error. Bad judgment? Bad data? Both?

[SomeBeach]

From 2 major news sources...

"While the investigation is ongoing, preliminary indications are that there may have been significant human error on the part of the ship's master, Captain Francesco Schettino, which resulted in these grave consequences," Costa Cruises, a subsidiary of U.S.-based Carnival Corp., stated. "The route of the vessel appears to have been too close to the shore, and in handling the emergency the captain appears not to have followed standard Costa procedures."

[SomeBeach]

 

Question I would have is if the ship hit on the port side why is it laying on the starboard side?

 

The only help I can give you on your question is that the answer lies in physics. The simple way it was explained to me is air displacement forces the water to the opposite side of the ship, creating the list to the starboard side.

[nellydean]

All of Costa's statements made so far can be read here:

 

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2012/jan/15/costa-cruises-concordia-ship-disaster?newsfeed=true