Pros/Cons of using Budget airlines?

[DT1304]

Hi all,

 

While calculating my budgets for a cruise, I am seeing where I can save money on the transport. I plan on flying from Melbourne, Australia to Rome. My plan is to stop in Hong Kong for a few days on the way, and in Singapore for a few days on the way home.

 

My question is this: There are some budget airlines, like scoot (budget airline of Singapore airlines) and the like. I can get really good rates on these. (There are 5 of us travelling). The rates are in some cases less than half what the major airlines can offer. (And that is after adding the extras like luggage, meals etc)

 

How reliable are these airlines to use. If for some reason the flight is cancelled, they don't usually have another flight to put you on for a couple of days as they dont fly daily.

 

A relative of mine could have got cheaper tickets to Thailand from Australia on a budget airline, but was advised against for the reason I stated above. Co-incidentally, that particular airline has closed!

[CruiserBruce]

The rule is, you get what you pay for. Just was helping someone on another board who saved 500 USD by booking with a discount airline, but got 22 hour lay overs both ways, booked hotels in both cases, and has major issues with checked bags with those sort of layover. So they didn't save anywhere near their 500 USD, and were forced to extend their vacation 2 days.

 

You may also find with discount airlines they have extremely limited number of flights, so if something goes wrong, you could be stranded for days.

[kenish]

Another consideration is safety. I'm not saying all budget airlines are unsafe, but some are. For example Tiger Air was banned from Aussie airspace for several weeks after a string of very bad safety incidents. They are flying Down Under again, on a restricted basis. On the consumer side, Tiger Air routinely left people stranded for days. Air Jamaica is another example; they were severely restricted by the FAA a few years ago due to substandard training and maintenance and had to pinch hit with "outsourced" aircraft and flight crews. Last example, an Air Transat flight ran out of fuel over the Atlantic due to a maintenance error. They had to glide and barely made it to the Azores.

[DT1304]

Hi kenish,

 

I cant comment on your examples other than the Tiger Air one. They were not banned due to safety incidents. They were however grounded due to the fact that they failed certain safety checks, but there was never a safety incident as such.

 

Since they have returned to the skies in Australia just over a year ago, they have actually been the most reliable airline flying domestically in Australia.

 

Regarding the other posters comments regarding lay over times etc, that does not bother me in my particular situation, as I plan to stay a couple of days anyway, and then just plan the one way flight home on the budget airline.

[Keith1010]

Be sure to also read about any carry on restrictions and fees for luggage.

 

Keith

[waterbug123]

How reliable are these airlines to use. If for some reason the flight is cancelled, they don't usually have another flight to put you on for a couple of days as they dont fly daily.

 

IMO, you've answered your own question. What happens if you are supposed to fly in on Monday but there's an issue and that flight doesn't go, or you don't get on it or whatever? Next flight is, say, Thursday, but there are no available seats, or not enough seats for your entire party. Now what? Personally, I would NEVER book an airline whose limited flight schedule left almost nothing available for "plan B."

[Bowie MeMe]

I too think that sitting at home it does not seem too bad that the next POSSIBLE flight is four days because I was going to stop over anyway BUT it is a whole different thing to be in a foreign city with say 200 other folks needing the exact same thing you need and a new batch of 200 passengers sitting in line in front of you because they actually have tickets for that exact flight. And so on. Ultra budget and budget airlines usually will not have any agreement with the other airlines to bail them or their passengers out. You will pay full walkup price and any savings is gone. I also now factor in what it costs for hotel, taxi, food etc to keep me someplace while I wait for the plane schedule -- for instance tuesday/wednesday can have cheaper US flights but not if you have to spend $150 for a hotel Wednesday night to go to a Friday meeting/cruise.

 

Even major players have small airlines doing some of the regional flights under the major's name. Just having a major name does not guarantee excellence in training and maintance -- but I do try not to think about those things.

 

While on the subject be very careful who you buy your air tickets from. Some of the cheaper agencies sell a product that looks like the ticket that you get from the airline itself -- but if something goes wrong your ticket can have severe restrictions and demands that are impossible to know about on purchase. Read in this forum enough days and there will indeed be a sad story from a consolidator ticket purchase. Buyer beware and ask "how can this agency sell me a product so cheaply?" and you better have a pretty good reason or perhaps it is not the bargain you thought you had. Good luck and may all your flights be smooth and trouble free.

[kenish]

Hi kenish,

 

I cant comment on your examples other than the Tiger Air one. They were not banned due to safety incidents. They were however grounded due to the fact that they failed certain safety checks, but there was never a safety incident as such.

 

Since they have returned to the skies in Australia just over a year ago, they have actually been the most reliable airline flying domestically in Australia.

 

I recall that Tiger Air had safety check issues as you state, but there were also several potentially serious errors made by flight crews. I will have to dig up the details, but as a private pilot, I recall they were pretty serious. I seem to recall that Aussie ATC intervention prevented one error from evolving into an accident.

 

Good they have improved with their dispatch reliability...I did hear they are operating under a provisional certificate with close Aussie CAA scrutiny so hopefully their training issues have been sorted.

 

The point is still the same...having an operating certificate pulled is very rare and indicates very serious safety problems are deeply embedded in the airline's culture.

[Zach1213]

I recall that Tiger Air had safety check issues as you state, but there were also several potentially serious errors made by flight crews. I will have to dig up the details, but as a private pilot, I recall they were pretty serious. I seem to recall that Aussie ATC intervention prevented one error from evolving into an accident.

 

Good they have improved with their dispatch reliability...I did hear they are operating under a provisional certificate with close Aussie CAA scrutiny so hopefully their training issues have been sorted.

 

The point is still the same...having an operating certificate pulled is very rare and indicates very serious safety problems are deeply embedded in the airline's culture.

 

Pretty serious mistakes like...when a Delta Connection (non-budget) crew heard their stall horn and pulled up, which I learned not to do on my second flying lesson at age 12?

 

Yes, I do believe you're right that Tiger had pilot issues as well, and some pretty bad ones if I remember correctly. The scary thing, though, is that those things aren't limited to budget airlines

[FlyerTalker]

Yes, I do believe you're right that Tiger had pilot issues as well, and some pretty bad ones if I remember correctly. The scary thing, though, is that those things aren't limited to budget airlines

Korean Air in the 1980s and 90s??? Some severe CRM issues that have been resolved, but for a while there, I stayed FAR away from KE.

[Zach1213]

Korean Air in the 1980s and 90s??? Some severe CRM issues that have been resolved, but for a while there, I stayed FAR away from KE.

 

Hell, Korean was so bad that even the Korean government started putting their people on Asiana instead...

[kenish]

In the mid 90's, I recall that Korean Air had lost half their widebody fleet in crashes, all of them pilot error. China Airlines also had a string of crashes and incidents. In both cases it was poor CRM. Many major airlines, mostly Asian ones, seemed to have followed that pattern at some time in their history and most cleaned up their act...but some have not.

 

Yes, all airlines have random incidents and accidents but when they become a pattern at a specific airline it's time to pick another carrier.

[Alaskanb]

Another thing to consider is what airport not just what city they fly into.

[Jetdriver787]

Low cost carriers are very much a growth industry. Certainly you can save a lot of money if you buy at the right time and make yourself aware of exactly what it is you are buying. The secret is in the name. Low cost, isn't simply a reflection of the ticket price, but importantly in the airlines own operating and infrastructure costs. There are regulatory items that mandate things such as safety. However the types of "flexibility" that you might ordinarilly find on a legacy or full service carrier, are very unlikely on this type of airline.

 

 

 

A couple of points to bear in mind:

 

1) These carriers are usually "point to point" so the contract will be to do just that. They are unlikely to be concerned with your pre or post contract arrangements.

 

2) Their liability to you often comprises the monies paid for the contract. In other words if they cancel the flight (which is usually rare) they may have difficulty re-booking you on another one of their services for quite some time. They are unlikely to protect you on another carrier. A refund (which wouldn't be until a later date) might be little use, when it would only total the "bargain" fare in an environment when you are facing a great deal of money to buy an instant purchase full fare ticket on another carrier.

[Zach1213]

Another thing to consider is what airport not just what city they fly into.

Scoot flies to all major airports, no secondary ones. Sydney is Sydney, Bangkok is Bangkok, Tokyo is Narita (the main international airport).

 

With others, this is certainly one thing to confirm. Many people learn the hard way that Paris isn't necessarily Paris, and Barcelona isn't necessarily Barcelona (I'm looking at your, Ryanair) because they made assumptions and didn't look at the wording close enough. AirAsia, for example, switches their Bangkok airport from Suvarnabhumi (the main one) to Don Mueang (the secondary one) starting October 1. Air Asia X uses Orly, not CDG, as their Paris airport. Just things to make sure you know before booking (and the appropriate costs to get to your actual destination once you've landed)

[DT1304]

Thanks for all the feedback folks. I really appreciate it. Lots of great points made.

 

I will take all things into consideration when making my final decision. I know scoot gives me the best saving for my particular situation, but then I have to get my family (5 of us) tickets to travel between Sydney and Melbourne, which will be another $1000 approx.