Swimsuits in the Lido--dress code in general

[HAL92]

HAL needs to maintain a level of elegance aboard thier ships....if you pay to go on a HAL cruise that says it has a dress code, than you should get what you paid for! I wouldn't book a HAL cruise to look at people wearing baseball hats and shorts.

[dakrewser]

we have freedom of choice in this country and as long as it is legal and moral by our laws who am I to judge.

 

1) "our" laws - whose laws is that, exactly? I wasn't aware of any global laws yet.

 

2) "moral by our laws" perhaps in theocracies, but no moral judgements are made in any of the English-speaking democracies that I'm aware of.

 

3) Even in the US, private industry can choose to serve, or not serve, any potential customer - even based on how they are dressed. It's legal, and it's used frequently.

 

4) Assuming you do mean US law, why would a Dutch registered ship sailing in French waters real give a fig?

[want2travelbad]

No excuse, IMO. "But officer, I really didn't know the speed limit here was only 35. I didn't see the sign." How far will that get you?

 

Why would anyone enter into a contract without reading it? Plus, he had the chance to read it again in his daily program.

 

First of all, let me say I am all for any cruise lines dress code and I adhere to them strictly. My point is that I don't assume others failure to do so is willful.

 

Why would anyone enter into a contract without reading it? Well, I do think that some first time cruisers don't think of "contract" when they think of "vacation". The stuff about the dress code isn't even in HAL's contracts; it's in the "Know Before You Go" guide, which is a document separate from the contract. I just think that some first time cruisers may not realize what they are in for when it comes to this topic, and that was the point of my previous post.

 

By the time people read about the dress code for the evening in their daily program I am thinking it is a little too late to head back home to get the tux.

 

Also, I gotta say, I honestly think there is a difference between breaking the law and not following a rule. Speeding and not following a dress code just don't fall in the same offense category in my book. Although, maybe if HAL started giving out tickets for each violation of the dress code, everyone would get with the program in a hurry. "Sir, this is your 3rd violation of our dress code this week. Man boobs may not be seen in the Lido (and yours are so scary they are not even fit for the pool), so please take this ticket to the Front Office for payment, or we would be happy to charge it to your shipboard account. Yes, HAL tickets for violations are progressive and man boob violations are more serious than, say, coming to formal night without a tie, so they cost more, and that is why this ticket is $300":D

[kryos]

Oh yeah, I forgot to post about the shirtless guy I saw in the Lido. I swore to my dh that if I saw him again I was going to tell him that I really didn't appreciate having to see his man boobs while I was eating my lunch.

I understand that a shirt and shoes should be required in the Lido, but how about shorts? During the day, I'm talking about?

 

I would think that allowing people into the Lido during lunch with bathing suits (worn with cover up of some type ... shorts over top of the bathing suit) should be okay. After all, people are at the pool and just want to come inside to have a bite to eat. Maybe they don't like eating outdoors.

 

But, yeah, I sure wouldn't want to sit near a man who didn't even have a shirt on. Same goes for shoes. They should have something ... flipflops, sandals, whatever.

 

Blue skies ...

 

--rita

[Sailure]

I'm curious:

 

Has anyone here ever commented directly to the offenders? What happened?

 

Has anyone here ever reported this to the appropriate staff? What happened?

 

I have a feeling if anyone "pointed" out that they were offended by another passenger the offender just might point out that HAL's dress code is SUGGESTED and not mandatory and that the person doing the pointing might be better off minding their own business.

Seems to me that it's getting obvious that there are more people sailing on HAL who want things more relaxed and HAL might have more people sailing who aren't as formal as others and they just might be making most of their profits from the relaxed group of people.

Remember...CARNIVAL owns HAL, no? I would tell a slob with his armpit in my face to please get his armpit out of my face though.

There are other cruise lines more formal than HAL though and if it really bothered me about how someone chooses to take the suggestions of HAL...I'd find a more formal cruise line that would be up to my "Higher Than HAL" standards.

The times, they are a changing.

[Sailure]

And that's the problem, exactly. People who don't understand, don't understand. They don't recognize that for others it spoils the ambiance of the entire setting.

I have no problem with people dining in more casual clothes in the more casual setting of the Lido, if that is their choice. But when they venture to the show, lounges, or casino thusly dressed they set off a jarring note in what is otherwise a pretty melody (and boy, did I ever nice'n that one up!)

 

And for people to walk around undressed---except for the immediate area of the pool---is flat-out boorish.

 

Oh, dear, I have casual clothes that look more formal than some of the formal drag I see on formal night:eek:

I guess it's all relative. Maybe HAL should make things mandatory instead of suggesting. See how many cabins get filled up then.;)

[HAL92]

HAL should try to restore the elegance aboard their ships and not turn into Carnival. They should make a mandatory dress code that is more strict, but not make it TOO formal. The very formal attire can be suggested, but they need to lock down on shorts and swimsuits in the Main Dinig Room at all occasions. Anywhere besides the Lido on formal nights, the short sleeves, shorts, and baseball caps need to be banned.

[ekerr19]

Remember...CARNIVAL owns HAL, no?

They have owned HAL for many years... I don't see how this can be considered an issue.

There are other cruise lines more formal than HAL though and if it really bothered me about how someone chooses to take the suggestions of HAL...I'd find a more formal cruise line that would be up to my "Higher Than HAL" standards.

The times, they are a changing.

 

Well, the times may indeed be changing, but I still fail to see what is wrong with even adhering to "suggested" dress. It is not about "higher than HAL standards" at all. It is about those folks who constantly think they are the only ones who matter and will do whatever they choose, whenever they choose, however they choose and anyone who doesn't like it, well - that's just tough.

 

I think one of the biggest problems today is that we live in a completely self-centered, self-absorbed society where everyone has the "right" to do as they see fit - and anyone who doesn't like it can just step off.

 

It seems to me as if everyone is so "entitled" these days, and so few folks give a thought to common courtesy any longer.

 

I cruise on HAL with the expectation and understanding that I will be on a cruise with certain number of formal nights - why should I be forced to lower my expectations because someone else feels "entitled" to dress in whatever manner they deem appropriate? Am I not just as entitled to have the expected cruise and vacation that I also paid for?

[HAL92]

I totally agree with ekerr19-If I've paid for a HAL cruise with a certain number of formal nights and a dress code, I expect to get what I paid for. If HAL wants to let selfish people get away with their poor dress, than they are not doing the right thing. Why should I have to lower my expectations of a HAL cruise just because someone else feels as if they are entitles to dressing like a slob? Am I not just as entitled to have an expected cruise vacation aboard an elegant ship? Once again, HAL needs to enforce the dress code to maintain a level of elegance on their ships.

Sailure-Even know Carnival owns HAL, many companies that make mediocre products own ones that make better products. Carnival is a much larger company than HAL, and just like Ford owns Jaguar, it doesn't matter what the parent company is like, HAL should take the dress code issue into their own hands.

[MBeamTX]

I honestly think that part of the dress code problem is the change in cruise sales channels, especially the Internet. It used to be that in order to book a cruise, you consulted with a travel agent, often one who specialized in cruises. A good TA took the time to find the right vacation for you and told you what to expect on matters such as food and entertainment as well as dress code and gratuities. Most people boarded the ship knowing what the policies were, even if they didn't always follow them.

 

Now many people book online without talking to anyone, or through a discount travel agency that doesn't offer any advice. So you get some people with the (mistaken) impression that cruise ship = beach and they pack accordingly. (A duffle bag full of shorts, sneakers and flip flops.)

 

Ignorance doesn't explain it all, of course. Another segment of the dress code flaunters is the entitlement crowd ("I can wear any d*mn thing I please, it's my vacation"). If you believe that following a dress code is a kind of social contract that respects those around you, you'll never find common ground with the entitlement crowd, and vice versa.

 

I like the dress code. There are plenty of ways to honor it that don't require spending a fortune, strangling yourself, or hobbling around in uncomfortable footwear. And if you don't like the dress code, there are plenty of other places to spend your vacation time and money.

 

As for me, if I wanted a sea view with a casual attitude - I could drive down to Corpus Christi for dinner at Denny's.

 

Happy cruising,

Susan

[gizmo]

I understand that a shirt and shoes should be required in the Lido, but how about shorts? During the day, I'm talking about?

 

I would think that allowing people into the Lido during lunch with bathing suits (worn with cover up of some type ... shorts over top of the bathing suit) should be okay. After all, people are at the pool and just want to come inside to have a bite to eat. Maybe they don't like eating outdoors.

 

But, yeah, I sure wouldn't want to sit near a man who didn't even have a shirt on. Same goes for shoes. They should have something ... flipflops, sandals, whatever.

 

Blue skies ...

 

--rita

My thoughts exactly.

[HAL92]

QUOTE=So you get some people with the (mistaken) impression that cruise ship = beach and they pack accordingly. (A duffle bag full of shorts, sneakers and flip flops.)

On warm-weather cruises, people may have that wrong impression that they should not have anyways about HAL ships (but maybe Carnival ships)that cruise ship=beach, but on cold-weather cruises such as Alaska, Baltic, Europe, etc., there is no excuse for it. There are no beaches to swim in in Alaska and the Baltic, and the cruise ship atmosphere is more formal. So in that situation, the "entitlement crowd" needs to dress right or stay off HAL ships and cold-weather cruises.

[pklopp]

I totally agree that shoes and a shirt should be worn in the Lido, even if you are coming in to eat from the pool - that is just common decency. I guess I am beginning to wonder what makes HAL so superior to the other lines though. I paid twice as much in '01 for my Carnival cruise than I am for this upcoming cruise and I will be wearing the same type of clothing. My husband wears a suit and I wear decent dresses (not formal - I just can't validate that expense and I prefer shorter wear). I feel that we look very appropriate, but now am wondering if people will be looking down their noses at us because we are not in a tux or formal! We chose HAL this time for the ports and number of sea days - not because it is the "elite" line. We never attempt to go in the dining room in shorts, but we also like to be comfortable while eating - I am comfortable in slacks some nites (of course no blue jeans - which is what I live in - but leave at home for a cruise)

 

We really enjoy cruising and feel that we, too, have paid a sizable amount of money to do it (although not as much as others), so we also deserve the same respect as the rest - even if we are not in expensive attire.

 

I guess we'll find out in September whether this was a good choice or not.

 

thanks for hearing me out.

Peggy

[Copper10-8]

I guess we'll find out in September whether this was a good choice or not.

 

Hi Peggy, I'll be willing to bet you that you and your husband will be having a great time on HAL in September. From what you describe, you'll both be looking fine and I don't think anyone will be looking down their noses at you. If you find anyone that does, it'll be their problem and not yours! Have a great time!

 

Take care and be safe!

 

John

[pklopp]

Thanks, John, and we do plan to have fun no matter what!

Peggy

[RuthC]

Peggy, you don't have to equate "correct" attire with "expensive". There are many, many second hand shops that sell fabulous clothes for a triffle. You can be dressed to the nine's for less than the price of one of those pairs of slacks. Then throw a shawl over it for the second formal night.

 

It's easy.

[jhannah]

And don't overlook ebay. I purchased a tux (new with tags) for about the same cost as one rental. My DW has also found some lovely pieces on ebay. Nice thing for her is that she can wear them for a couple of cruises then place them back on ebay for sale.

[HAL92]

pklopp-are you going on a Caribbean cruise or a cold-weather cruise? The Caribbean HAL cruises are much more casual than others. You must have gotten a much better room on Carnival in '01 than you are getting this year on HAL, because from my expeience, HAL was more expensive than Carnival. I've been on plenty of HAL and Carnival cruises, and the people seemed like they had much more class on HAL ships than on Carnival. (Carnival has come out with a few new ships that are nicer than Carnival standards, but in my opinion still aren't as good as HAL ships).

[pklopp]

Thanks for the ebay suggestions - however, your wife may fortunately be able to fit in a perfect size, but not me as I have to try on everything. I did not explain either that my body cannot do strapless (have to wear a bra at all times!), so that eliminates a lot of dresses (I thank my dear departed mom for my body shape)

 

Yes, we are going to the Caribbean as we did in '01 on Carnival - in '01 we went in the spring and this year again during the hurricane season - when it obviously is less expensive and fewer children. We are still working folks, so when we can find a cruise in our price range, we take it.

 

I will however try to look for a little fancier dress maybe a second hand shop.

 

I still do intend to have a wonderful cruise even if John and I are not totallly dressed as the rules stipulate.

Peggy

[MBeamTX]

Peggy,

I worried a lot before my first cruise because I didn't own anything truly formal and am definitely in the plus-size category. This is just my observation based on 6 or 7 cruises, but I offer it for what it's worth.

 

When it comes to cruising, I think "formal dress" covers a lot more territory than you might imagine. It doesn't have to mean an Oscar-worthy long gown. Some women wear truly formal gowns, but I'd say they were definitely in the minority. Many women take a long black skirt, palazzo pants or other dressy slacks to pair with satin or sequinned tops. Separates make it easier to get the right size, and you end up with two outfits for the price of one bottom and two tops. Others like to wear short, sparkly cocktail dresses.

 

My mom pairs a beautiful, ivory-colored twinset with sequin trim with a long ivory skirt. I got her those separates on sale from Chadwicks. I've worn a long black georgette tank dress witih a matching sheer-sleeved blouse over it on one night, and then a mid-calf length print dress with a sheer duster on another. I got the former on sale at Ulla Popken and the latter on eBay, and both were inexpensive. Those things may not all fit the traditional definition of "formal wear" but they are dressy and look appropriate, in my opinion. The only kind of dresses that look out of place to me on formal night are what I call "church dresses" - knee-length print dresses or sporty skirts that look like something you'd wear to a PTA meeting.

 

Just my two cents, for what it's worth.

 

Happy cruising,

Susan

[Oceanwench]

Susan: I am laughing at your "church dresses" comment, because that is exactly what comes to my mind when I see people dressed that way on formal night!

 

My daughters [in their 20s] and I all wore dresses that were mid-calf length on the first formal night. The girls wore strapless -- not me! ;) We were all in black.

[Cruiseoften]

My late husband tried sitting in our living room like that once. :eek:

Once. ;)

 

You're my kind of lady! Once for me was once too often! :eek:

[RevNeal]

Last time we went through this issue for dress in the Lido I mentioned that I would take a photograph of the dress-code notices at the entrance to the Lido from both the aft pool and the mid-ships pool. On the Zaandam I did that. Here it is:

 

 

It's not a small sign. This, and other signs just like it, are mounted on the walls in several places near the doors and at the head of the serving lines. You'll find them on the Zaandam, for sure (this photo came form the Zaandam) and on the Volendam (where I first noticed them, but didn't photograph them), and on the Oosterdam (where I photographed them, but the photos are all too blurry).

 

:)

 

Anyone who fails to wear a shirt or shoes (slippers/flipflops?) in the Lido Restaurant are breaking rules posted right in front of their noses.

[kruzkeen]

If the dress code is not enforced by the staff on the ship, a person might ask the Guest Relations Officer or the Hotel Manager why they are not.

 

If a satisfactory answer is not given, a person might really mark down the Guest Survey form and make strong written comments. Ships, like branch offices, are compared to each other and I think if the scores are not close to 9 reviews are done.

[dippy]

Is there an eating area near the pool. That is, can we go to the Lido restaurant, get our food and eat in the mid pool area?