Muster stations

[Brandonclan]

Assigning a parent to each cabin still does not gaurantee you will all be assigned the same muster station! Isn't that the real issue here?

 

 

 

SO?! if you are so freaked out at being separated possibly, then why bother going anywhere or doing anything where it may happen? I guess I just cannot fathom this attached at the hip mentality so many parents/families seem to have..

 

seriously.. if it is THAT important that you never be separated ever ever ever, then book a cabin that fits all of you together.

 

 

I just love the way some on this board like to twist our words into whatever suits there own "bark" agenda......

My statement was concerning muster stations in an emergency situation.

 

My feelings on this align with most on this board. I want my family with me in an emergency situation. This discussion is about the muster station assignments being published for all to see so it can be a consideration when booking.

The "attached at the hip" comment just shows me that we think differently about what family means, and that's O.K. with me that we are different.

 

 

I also agree that it is crazy to say you would go to whatever muster station suits you, instead of going where assigned....that's wrong and could put everyone at risk! I would never do that, but, I will make an effort to insure that my family be assigned to the same muster staion if possible.

[Brandonclan]

and part of acting like an adult is having the foresight to plan ahead for the unexpected. Part of that planning for me now will be to try to be sure our family's cabins have the same muster station.

 

 

like:)

[powelweb]

We usually sail in one cabin with myself, DH and DD, but she is getting to the age where we're considering allowing her to bring a friend along and were looking into connecting cabins to have the extra bathroom for the girls.

 

Prior to this thread, I would have assumed that connecting cabins would have automatically mustered at the same station.

 

I would be very concerned about taking responsibility for my dear friend's daughter and having the girls separated from us in an emergency even though this would have been booked following RCCL's rules for minors and everyone is sleeping where they are assigned.

 

That is a precarious situation indeed.

[RockeyBullwinkle]

The problem with this logic is that you don't know ahead of time what will happen to the lifeboats. Let's flip your question around...what if the lifeboat the parents are on is the one to make it and the lifeboat the kids are on doesn't make it? I would obviously do anything that needed to be done for my kids to survive, even if I did not. However, splitting up my family does not guarantee better odds for my kids, so I'd rather be with my kids and wife where doing whatever it takes to save them is still a possibility.

 

Huh? so you rather it be all or nothing..

 

frankly the odds are so long that anyone would ever need to board a life boat that it isn't even worth worrying about. even if you do when you get to your station it will be full because mum wanted the whole family to go down in the same life boat.

[time4u2go]

And part of acting like an adult is having the foresight to plan ahead for the unexpected. Part of that planning for me now will be to try to be sure our family's cabins have the same muster station.

 

I'm curious...how will you know which rooms have which muster stations when you plan your cruise?

[rculross]

Huh? so you rather it be all or nothing..

 

Well, if given the choice I'd rather it be nothing ;)

 

All I'm saying is that once my wife and or kids are separated from me, there is absolutely nothing I can do to help them. I'd rather have them with me, so that if there is something within my power that I can do, I damn well will do it. If it so happens that sending them off in a separate boat gives them a better chance of survival, then I would do that. I just can't envision a scenario where that is the case. Under your thinking (at least as I'm understanding it) the best thing to do would be to put each member of my family in a separate lifeboat. If we continue that logic, does your family all drive separate cars to the same destination?

[rculross]

I'm curious...how will you know which rooms have which muster stations when you plan your cruise?

 

I think thats part of the point of this thread. To make more people knowledgeable, which in turn might make more people ask during booking, which in turn might make the information more readily available.

[Cindy]

As spookwife has mentioned repeatedly, your options as they are currently is to book a cabin big enough for your entire party or make sure an adult is in every cabin. I don't know why you mention disabled people. The cruise line employees will help those that are disabled to make sure they get where they need to be. I'm sure tons of disabled people travel and they aren't always with an able bodied person.

 

As far as royals responsibility, they are required to make sure that all persons go to their assigned muster station in the event of an emergency. And to make sure, if needed, everyone gets off the ship safely. The least of their concerns in these situations is whether or not all family members have the same muster station.

 

There is no reason you can give that can justify ignoring the safety rules and changing muster stations in the event of an emergency.

 

I think we all agree that muster station information being available during the booking process would be optimal and hopefully it's something the cruise lines can provide in the future. However, unless or until that happens, I agree with BeachChik...there is no justification for a person disobeying a crew directive or safety procedure during an emergency. Someone's desire or emotional need to keep their family together does not and can not supercede the captain and crew's obligation to protect lives.

[mollanjake]

I my March cruise on Indy at our Muster drill:

 

the very serious blond female officer manually checked us in, our sea pass cards were not swiped.

 

when another officer stopped at our station to verify everyone was present I heard her tell him that she had an extra cabin b/c they were minors, he made a note and moved on.

 

I am going to guess or hope that the lifeboats hold a few more than max capacity, but maybe not.

 

Kids under 12(I believe) are given a color coded bracelet with muster info. In case of muster the kids would be taken to their parents/station.

 

For the record, I only have 1 DD, so she sails in our cabin.

 

Would be nice to have muster info available if traveling with family in multiple cabins.

[JasonTehGreat]

This is about responsibility. The first person to bring this subject up was upset because her and her husband were in one cabin and her 21 year old and 12 year old children were in a different and were assigned different muster stations than the parents. The theory is that a 21 year old is responsible enough to get a 12 year old to a muster station in an emergency. Though some people may not realize it in their own children 21 year olds can drink, gamble and join the military and go off and fight in a war; which means they can get a 12 year old to the proper muster station.

 

 

It should also be kept in mind that it is entirely possible for a life boat to sink, etc. . . . Why keep all of your eggs in one basket? Do you need to ensure that if any child is going to possibly go down in a life boat the whole family should too?

[cruiser87654321]

This is about responsibility. The first person to bring this subject up was upset because her and her husband were in one cabin and her 21 year old and 12 year old children were in a different and were assigned different muster stations than the parents. The theory is that a 21 year old is responsible enough to get a 12 year old to a muster station in an emergency. Though some people may not realize it in their own children 21 year olds can drink, gamble and join the military and go off and fight in a war; which means they can get a 12 year old to the proper muster station.

 

 

It should also be kept in mind that it is entirely possible for a life boat to sink, etc. . . . Why keep all of your eggs in one basket? Do you need to ensure that if any child is going to possibly go down in a life boat the whole family should too?

 

It is not about getting the 12 year old to the proper station, or even supervising him. They both had a lot of common sense when this happened to us and that 21 year old is now a lawyer. It is about the situation such as happened on the Grandeur 3/4 hours in the dark waiting on deck, with the apprehension and uncertainty that brings. Now, call me over protective, but as a parent I want to be with my kids (or elderly parents) in that eventuality.

 

As for the lifeboat going down scenario, as someone else stated if we thought that on every mode of transport the worst was going to happen we would all be travelling in separate pods like the Flintstones.;)

[fragilek]

Though some people may not realize it in their own children 21 year olds can drink, gamble and join the military and go off and fight in a war; which means they can get a 12 year old to the proper muster station.

 

Being able to gamble and drink - IS NO SIGN of maturity lol

 

That is not the point anyway family is family and should be together in any time of crisis where that is possible. I have stated quite clearly why the 2 different muster station WILL not work for our family to the point of we would HAVE to leave the ship if alternative arrangements could not be made, we would not choose to go against the rules so would leave.

 

 

However, if you can only get off the ship at your OWN Muster station, and there is no extra space/ means of evacuation elsewhere then we are all in big trouble if a ship has a fire blocking one or lists so baldly that whole side is out of commission. To all the non rule breakers - I bet you 2 things.

 

1.If your kids were not with you and were on the side of the side with an out of commission muster - you would give your right arm to have "broken" the rules.

 

2. If you were on the way to your muster station and realised (even by word of mouth that it is out of commission. I.e. no official word that you have to go elsewhere). Most of you would hot foot it to the nearest available muster station before being told you, which is also out with the official steps to follow.- If you didn't you could be relying on a captain you know nothing about, he might even have broken the rules and already left himself- Now try and tell me that that wouldn't happen!!!

[cruiser87654321]

Being able to gamble and drink - IS NO SIGN of maturity lol

 

That is not the point anyway family is family and should be together in any time of crisis where that is possible. I have stated quite clearly why the 2 different muster station WILL not work for our family to the point of we would HAVE to leave the ship if alternative arrangements could not be made, we would not choose to go against the rules so would leave.

 

 

However, if you can only get off the ship at your OWN Muster station, and there is no extra space/ means of evacuation elsewhere then we are all in big trouble if a ship has a fire blocking one or lists so baldly that whole side is out of commission. To all the non rule breakers - I bet you 2 things.

 

1.If your kids were not with you and were on the side of the side with an out of commission muster - you would give your right arm to have "broken" the rules.

 

2. If you were on the way to your muster station and realised (even by word of mouth that it is out of commission. I.e. no official word that you have to go elsewhere). Most of you would hot foot it to the nearest available muster station before being told you, which is also out with the official steps to follow.- If you didn't you could be relying on a captain you know nothing about, he might even have broken the rules and already left himself- Now try and tell me that that wouldn't happen!!!

 

As I understand it that has happened.

[fragilek]

As I understand it that has happened.

 

that's the point and more than once ;)

[Ocean Boy]

This is about responsibility. The first person to bring this subject up was upset because her and her husband were in one cabin and her 21 year old and 12 year old children were in a different and were assigned different muster stations than the parents. The theory is that a 21 year old is responsible enough to get a 12 year old to a muster station in an emergency. Though some people may not realize it in their own children 21 year olds can drink, gamble and join the military and go off and fight in a war; which means they can get a 12 year old to the proper muster station.

 

 

It should also be kept in mind that it is entirely possible for a life boat to sink, etc. . . . Why keep all of your eggs in one basket? Do you need to ensure that if any child is going to possibly go down in a life boat the whole family should too?

 

If a lifeboat sinks who do you think would be more likely to look after your kids and help them, you or some stranger who has his own family to worry about? Do you think that just because a lifeboat goes down that everyone in it is helpless and a gonner? I can swim quite well and with a life vest I am sure I could float for hours in the right sea conditions. And in the warmer Caribbean waters it is quite possible to do just that unless some shark happened to pick me out for dinner. The fact is you are goining to be surrounded by other lifeboats. You won't be out there in the ocean all by yourself. In the case of the Concordia swimming to shore would not have been unthinkable.

[Ocean Boy]

I'm curious...how will you know which rooms have which muster stations when you plan your cruise?

 

I don't know the answer to this yet as I have not thought about it in the past. But having cabins next to each other gives me a better chance of accomplishing what I am looking for rather than having cabins some distance apart. So that is a start anyway.

[fragilek]

:eek::eek:

 

OK so I can just see my Husband go off with my DD leaving me to wait for RCI staff to collect me and take me to a different muster point. - what planet are you living on - Are you married- if so and your husband would happily leave you go to a different muster station having no idea if you have been collected - then get a new husband!!:eek:

And I would have been freaking out if he waited for me to be collected before getting my DD safely to the muster station.

 

As I said we would not just have gone against the rules as they are there to ensure the maximum number of passengers get of the ship safely, however, we would have left the cruise before it begun.

 

To strengthen this further here is an extract from the official report on the Concordia re staff collecting people from cabins

 

"Passengers were not gathered in their cabins by the crew, as instead safety the

procedures establishes in case of a general emergency occurred (this was

proved by two passengers found still in live, three days after, on the deck 8,

were there are not living saloon, but only cabins)."

 

Now my husband would not leave me to be collected by the crew- I wonder why!!!

[fragilek]

that's the point and more than once ;)

extract from the Marine Casualties Investigative Body – C/S Costa Concordia from the timeline of the accident

 

 

11 22.30 Flooding increases than to reach the Deck 0

(watertight deck)

Passengers, by herself,

embark in the lifeboat

12 22.33 General emergency is announced

13 22.36 Something like an “Abandon ship” is announced but

the related sentence was not pronounced, even if the

announcement stated only to reach with calm the

muster stations, following the crewmembers

instructions.

Passengers confirmed,

testifying, that the abandon

ship signal occurred after.

14 22.39

22.47

Ship in touch with the shoreline and grounds

Master ordered to drop the starboard anchor

15 22.54

22.55

23 19 34

Staff Master orders to launch the lifeboats and lifrats,

after the main order by the Master

Master ordered to drop the port anchor.

Staff Master now announced the abandon ship.

Master left the Bridge

16 00.34 Master embarks in the lifeboat and abandons the ship

17 00.41 Healing of the ship reaches 80°

18 06.14 Evacuation of ship is completed

[NJcruisenewbie]

You are entitled to your opinion. I note you have not addressed the other scenarios; disabled person, infirm parent, small children in connecting cabin (as detailed earlier by another poster) Do RCI really bear no responsibility here?

 

Where did I start out saying what you allege? The poster above stated quite correctly what my OP was on the other thread. And I have no doubt there are a lot of people reading this who, in extremis, would do the same but might not say so.;)

 

 

Have people forgotten something called "personal accountability"? A reasonable and responsible adult would not put a disabled person, infirmed parent or small child in a cabin without an able bodied person in their with them. It doesn't take a fire to create an emergency that would require immediate action.

 

No one who cannot care for themselves or get themselves to safety in an emergency should be in a cabin without a travel mate regardless of what the cruise ship's occupancy policy is.

[fragilek]

Have people forgotten something called "personal accountability"? A reasonable and responsible adult would not put a disabled person, infirmed parent or small child in a cabin without an able bodied person in their with them. It doesn't take a fire to create an emergency that would require immediate action.

 

No one who cannot care for themselves or get themselves to safety in an emergency should be in a cabin without a travel mate regardless of what the cruise ship's occupancy policy is.

 

We can cope fine fine 'emergencies' in our family as long as all of us pull together, but split into 2 groups as I explained would not work , Disabled families manage to do all sorts of things- You would be surprised at the places/things we have managed to go/do- extra planning and care is involved - but we don't stay home thinking I wish I could try that! Some of us even manage to become Olympic champions, and others like us aim to try one new thing every year and not give in to any illness. So our plans are carefully thought out including evacuation plans on any holiday hotels/cruises no difference, we plan ahead and check it through on arrival. However, in this case we would never have thought about the fact all 4 of us may not get to evacuate together. That is the whole point of the thread.

 

I think if you read through it was another poster who pointed out the protcol is for the disabled person to be left behind to wait for a crew evacuation while the adult goes with the child to muster. I have posted back with good cause the reason why we will NOT do that, even if it means leaving a ship.

[WpgCruise]

Have people forgotten something called "personal accountability"? A reasonable and responsible adult would not put a disabled person, infirmed parent or small child in a cabin without an able bodied person in their with them. It doesn't take a fire to create an emergency that would require immediate action.

 

No one who cannot care for themselves or get themselves to safety in an emergency should be in a cabin without a travel mate regardless of what the cruise ship's occupancy policy is.

 

I agree.

 

It seems so much the trend to regulate, require, or demand "Someone" else be responsible. Whatever happened to taking personal responsibility, following rules, assessing risk and mitigating as required?

[cruiser87654321]

I agree.

 

It seems so much the trend to regulate, require, or demand "Someone" else be responsible. Whatever happened to taking personal responsibility, following rules, assessing risk and mitigating as required?

 

The cruiseline are the only people with the information required for passengers to be able to take personal responsibility;that is to only book cabins with the same muster station.

 

Those who are concerned have done exactly what you opine; decided that they are not willing to take the risk of separation so want to mitigate that by being in possession of all the facts needed to do so.

 

As someone else posted, it no use saying "what if" after the event.

 

Disabled people are capable of many things, but still may require help with others. It is routine in the workplace to have "refuge points" where disabled personnel wait for rescue by the fire service, but at sea whose family would seriously leave them there and go off to a muster station without them?

 

All those who say they wouldn't do this or that; fine words, but in a real ship going down emergency, in the middle of the night, I would not put money on any parent waving their kids off to another part of the ship.

 

It just shouldn't happen that family groups are allocated different muster stations, but it does, it is just not widely known.

[Ocean Boy]

I agree.

 

It seems so much the trend to regulate, require, or demand "Someone" else be responsible. Whatever happened to taking personal responsibility, following rules, assessing risk and mitigating as required?

 

Isn't trying to make sure your family's cabins have the same muster station so that you can care for your family in an emergency taking personal responsibility, assessing risk, and following rules? :confused:

[WpgCruise]

So at the end of the day we have two choices as matters stand today.

 

1) Accept and follow the existing rules, in this case Muster where the rules dictate.

 

2) Do what we want regardless of the consequences to ourselves and others. In the event of an emergency this choice would increase the risk for all, but probably result in significant risk for the rule breaker(s)

 

You can of course advocate for the cruise line to list every Muster station and the stateroom attached to each. Good luck with that. I just don't see this as a priority for any mainstream cruise line.

 

The other option of course is that if this is such a huge problem, seek other vacation opportunities.

 

 

The cruiseline are the only people with the information required for passengers to be able to take personal responsibility;that is to only book cabins with the same muster station.

 

Those who are concerned have done exactly what you opine; decided that they are not willing to take the risk of separation so want to mitigate that by being in possession of all the facts needed to do so.

 

As someone else posted, it no use saying "what if" after the event.

 

Disabled people are capable of many things, but still may require help with others. It is routine in the workplace to have "refuge points" where disabled personnel wait for rescue by the fire service, but at sea whose family would seriously leave them there and go off to a muster station without them?

 

All those who say they wouldn't do this or that; fine words, but in a real ship going down emergency, in the middle of the night, I would not put money on any parent waving their kids off to another part of the ship.

 

It just shouldn't happen that family groups are allocated different muster stations, but it does, it is just not widely known.

[cruiser87654321]

So at the end of the day we have two choices as matters stand today.

 

1) Accept and follow the existing rules, in this case Muster where the rules dictate.

 

2) Do what we want regardless of the consequences to ourselves and others. In the event of an emergency this choice would increase the risk for all, but probably result in significant risk for the rule breaker(s)

 

You can of course advocate for the cruise line to list every Muster station and the stateroom attached to each. Good luck with that. I just don't see this as a priority for any mainstream cruise line.

 

The other option of course is that if this is such a huge problem, seek other vacation opportunities.

 

And that is your prerogative just as much as it is mine to see it that way. How hard a job can it be?