Caribbean Princess cruise cut short?

[eclue]

Fog is a problem in December and January as a rule....after that and before that, should be fine BUT this has been a very erratic and strange winter in Houston and everywhere else.......Princess cannot control the weather.:rolleyes:

[Shoalwater]

:eek::eek:

The Harbormaster need to grow a pair.:p

 

Below is what it looked like when we sailed into the LA harbor last week.:eek:

Viz couldn't be more than 200 feet at times less than 50 feet. The ships location is known within 20 feet...

 

20140128_065133 by MauiLvrs, on Flickr

 

That is the Iowa docked at the pier...

Looked like this when we left...

2014-01-24_16-24-33_807 by MauiLvrs, on Flickr

 

Seriously considering moving our cruise to FFL...

 

The problem isn't with the harbormaster. If you had taken the time to research this before firing you would have discovered that the Houston Ship Channel is controlled by the U.S. Coast Guard and not the Port of Houston Harbormaster. Houston is the fourth busiest port in the America and the main port of entry for oil into the US. Any accident that could tie it up for several days would immediately translate into a huge spike in gasoline prices, not to mention the potential catastrophe if there was a collision with fire between a cruise ship and a tanker laden with gasoline. Sorry, but you are way off base here. Check out the Galveston webcams and you'll see that visibility is nearly zero all the way to the coast. Its a long, winding narrow channel requiring good visibility to safely navigate.

 

Looks to me like the Captain made the right call by returning early. At least those finishing their cruise aren't wallowing offshore wondering when they'll get to go home. The airports are open and on schedule. Where would you rather be?

 

I agree that the Baytown Cruiseport was a poorly conceived waste of money by the PoH, but that's another story. I suspect they subsidized the cruise lines heavily, mucho heavily to move up there from Galveston and that after this fiasco of a year they will exit at the first opportunity (when the subsidy ends).

[flamomo]

Bridgecam showing FOG!!! Fancy that! Princess DID know what they were talking about!!

Edited February 2, 2014 by flamomo

[DrSch]

:eek::eek:

 

The problem isn't with the harbormaster. If you had taken the time to research this before firing you would have discovered that the Houston Ship Channel is controlled by the U.S. Coast Guard and not the Port of Houston Harbormaster. Houston is the fourth busiest port in the America and the main port of entry for oil into the US. Any accident that could tie it up for several days would immediately translate into a huge spike in gasoline prices, not to mention the potential catastrophe if there was a collision with fire between a cruise ship and a tanker laden with gasoline. Sorry, but you are way off base here. Check out the Galveston webcams and you'll see that visibility is nearly zero all the way to the coast. Its a long, winding narrow channel requiring good visibility to safely navigate.

 

Looks to me like the Captain made the right call by returning early. At least those finishing their cruise aren't wallowing offshore wondering when they'll get to go home. The airports are open and on schedule. Where would you rather be?

 

I agree that the Baytown Cruiseport was a poorly conceived waste of money by the PoH, but that's another story. I suspect they subsidized the cruise lines heavily, mucho heavily to move up there from Galveston and that after this fiasco of a year they will exit at the first opportunity (when the subsidy ends).

 

They are stuck there for 2 years, unless they can find a way to break the contract. However since they are already selling cruises on the Emerald out of there for 2015, that might be hard.

 

Worse, Norwegian will be coming in in Dec 2014. Imagine 2 cruises trying to embark and being delayed. With the minimum parking spaces, and space in that terminal, it could be a nightmare.

 

I know Houston gave Princess a few million in subsidies to cruise out of POH.. but I hope that they don't lose that much or more in business, or empty ships next year. Princess needs to make it a 6 day cruise, and have an extra day for port problems and noro cleanings :)

[DebJ14]

Fog impacts more ports than just Houston. The Port of Galveston is closed this morning and the Carnival Magic is stuck out in the Gulf at the Pilot Station waiting for the port to reopen. Perhaps they would have been well served to race back to arrive after the Triumph left yesterday afternoon. Lots of people will be missing their flights today and are probably wishing the Magic had come in early.

 

The Port of Tampa also had dense fog this morning and the ships docking there will be several hours late.

 

The problem is not isolated to the Gulf of Mexico as Jacksonville has also had fog problems recently.

Edited February 2, 2014 by DebJ14

[WWCJR]

For those interested in the Houston Ship Channel operation and procedures you might want to visit the website for the Houston Pilots:

 

http://www.houston-pilots.com/default.aspx

 

If you go to Port Information then on page 4 it gives information on how ships are to approach and pass each other. It is far more involved than just going down your side of the channel. This is a big reason that there must be good visibility.

 

A little further down starting on page 10 are maps of the channel.

 

I hope this helps some people understand the operation of the Houston Ship Channel. It handles lots of traffic on a daily basis, much of which is hazard cargo so safety is of utmost importance.

[douglinc@msn.com]

Bridgecam showing FOG!!! Fancy that! Princess DID know what they were talking about!!

 

It always amazes me that the passengers and a lot of people hundreds of miles away know more than the Captain & his staff of officers.

 

Doug

[Loonbeam]

Alright, I put a few feelers out to people I used to know at Princess to try to resolve this...

 

As far as I can tell, Princess corporate in consultation with the port and the corporate decided on the route change on Jan 29th, based on predictions of a closed port (those predictions of course turned out to be wrong - but that's not relevant). Princess has posted the appropriate weather advisory. The intent was to trade guaranteed impact for one cruise against potential impact for 2 (which happened anyway).

 

With that decision made, the decision was made to proceed at speed, partly to ensure docking but also in hopes of avoiding them having to sit outside the port in fog with a noro outbreak onboard. So noro was a factor in the timing decision. Once that decision was made, the decision was made to disembark early to allow for a cleaning. I do not know the timing of these decisions.

 

The following are my comments only:

 

So the short answer appears to be, Belize was going to be skipped due to fog regardless. With that in mind, Princess took additional steps to deal with the noro and did not communicate that well. The captain was not lying, nor was he totally forthcoming based on reports. Nor did they handle the early disembarkation well. As I noted, this is a trend with Princess from what I have seen and an area they could clearly improve in. It amazes me that they apparently do not have a good incident response plan drawn up for every port and cruise.

[Tucker in Texas]

What drink options are there while sitting at Bayport?

 

Last year, we were on the Crown Princess coming into Galveston which was delayed until around 3:30 p.m. getting in because of fog.

 

I thought Princess handled it quite well. Announcements frequently about the status. Mostly "Port is still closed but projected to open at ????" They treated it as a "sea day" with activities scheduled, food venues open, etc. Free internet for those that needed to deal with air changes, hotel reservations, etc. Help provided whether you bought your accommodations from Princess or not.

 

As for drinks, they went to a cash basis since sea pass accounts had been closed. Only limited brands available because they can only sell what they have purchased in Texas. They buy what they need to get them out into the Gulf where they can then sell all brands they have on board. Some bars gave sodas out for free while others did charge. I saw one lady who was at a "pay" bar bring out a $50 bill to pay and was told "never mind." I had a soda card so no problem for me.

 

I think I heard some stores opened in the afternoon but not sure as I didn't venture down that way.

 

Another negative was vacating the cabins. However, I heard, if you asked, you could stay in them. We just gathered our things together and set up camp in one of the lounges with some cards to play Liverpool Rummy when trivia wasn't going.

 

I have no doubt those that complained about coming in early would be complaining just as loud about missing their flights, having to buy hotel space, food, etc. because of the fog. At least they are home and those getting on the ship can "party on" a little even if they can't have their premium bourbon and water and have to settle for Beam and Branch (lol).

 

Tucker in Texas

[caribill]

They are stuck there for 2 years, unless they can find a way to break the contract. However since they are already selling cruises on the Emerald out of there for 2015, that might be hard. Princess, if the contract allows, could switch the Emerald sailings to Galveston (which also has its fog problems). After all, they did switch the CB which originally sold as cruises from Galveston to Houston.

 

Worse, Norwegian will be coming in in Dec 2014. Imagine 2 cruises trying to embark and being delayed. With the minimum parking spaces, and space in that terminal, it could be a nightmare. The parking lot is being expanded before NCL starts cruising from Baytport. NCL will sail on a different day than Princess, so the terminal will not be used for two ships at once.

 

 

see above in red

[DrSch]

see above in red

 

They better have a few days between sailings.. If Princes is scheduled for Saturday, and Norwegian is scheduled for Sunday.. well if there is a problem like today.. all bets are off

[Coral]

It always amazes me that the passengers and a lot of people hundreds of miles away know more than the Captain & his staff of officers.

 

Doug

 

I feel sorry for anyone having to make decisions based on weather. It is always a guess where I live and I assume in other places. We were originally scheduled to get 8" of snow between Friday and Saturday. At most, we probably got 1.5". Earlier in the season, we were supposed to get 1" and ended up with 6".

 

Having to make a decision 48 hours on weather is always tricky. I think Princess has to go with the worst case scenario just in case. Houston and Galveston has turned into a very difficult port for weather.

 

Sounds like Princess did their best to make up for the inconvenience travelers experienced.

[caribill]

Nor did they handle the early disembarkation well.

 

How was disembarkation not handled well? I thought it went smoothly once it started on Friday morning.

Edited February 2, 2014 by caribill

[DrSch]

Checked with Princess - New Itinerary

 

3 Feb - at sea

4 Feb - Costa Maya 8 - 5pm

5 Feb - Belize 7 - 5?

6 Feb - Cozumel 7 -5

7 Feb - At Sea

8 Feb - Dock in Houston 7 am

[eclue]

Disembarkation went very well. We were off the ship and through customs by 8:30 am....could not ask for anything better than that!!!

It was well organized, as usual.

eclue:rolleyes:

[dleighb]

I think one of the main points of contention here is that some people (the group of which I fall in) would rather deal with known weather issues that cause delays or issues in changing flights and getting home while others would prefer to have their trip cut short on a possibility of weather issues because they can be guaranteed of getting home on time.

 

Because there are two groups here who have different philosophies on their travel arrangements and preferences, we will never see eye to eye on whether or not we believe the correct call was made. For those who don't believe that a weather prediction should influence the duration of the trip, we will feel lied to and like it was a dumb decision -- especially when the Norovirus was also on onboard and influencing the decision which was obvious to most of us even though it was never communicated as such thus adding to our frustration. For those who have no issues with a weather prediction causing a cruise to be cut short, they will see that the right call was made even though no fog appeared Friday night/Saturday morning and the trip could have gone as planned (had it not been for that Norovirus).

 

I will never believe that fog was the sole deciding factor in this decision. We might have skipped Belize because of it, but in the end we lost 36 hours because of Noro. And because it was so unbelievable that a trip would be cut short on a possibility, it rather overshadowed the last couple days (not to mention that rather rough storm that coated my balcony on Deck 8 in salty sea spray crystalline mix and laid out two members of our group with minor bouts of seasickness).

 

There were plenty of parts of this cruise that I did enjoy and I wouldn't even say that this was a Cruise from Hell, but of the five total cruises now that I have taken, this so far was the worst of the bunch.

 

And while I am sorry for those that couldn't sail on the ship last night, as of the weather forecast last Tuesday, they shouldn't have been able to sail out anyway, so their being stuck in port overnight really shouldn't come as a great surprise to them. I certainly hope that they don't get another fog prediction on Tuesday and have to come back early. That would mean they would only get one port at best. I should be thankful for the two that I did get. At least they were lovely.

Edited February 2, 2014 by dleighb

[texast518]

see above in red

 

There will be cars there for 2 cruises!

[SanDiegoHeather]

I think one of the main points of contention here is that some people (the group of which I fall in) would rather deal with known weather issues that cause delays or issues in changing flights and getting home while others would prefer to have their trip cut short on a possibility of weather issues because they can be guaranteed of getting home on time.

 

Because there are two groups here who have different philosophies on their travel arrangements and preferences, we will never see eye to eye on whether or not we believe the correct call was made. For those who don't believe that a weather prediction should influence the duration of the trip, we will feel lied to and like it was a dumb decision -- especially when the Norovirus was also on onboard and influencing the decision which was obvious to most of us even though it was never communicated as such thus adding to our frustration. For those who have no issues with a weather prediction causing a cruise to be cut short, they will see that the right call was made even though no fog appeared Friday night/Saturday morning and the trip could have gone as planned (had it not been for that Norovirus).

 

I will never believe that fog was the sole deciding factor in this decision. We might have skipped Belize because of it, but in the end we lost 36 hours because of Noro. And because it was so unbelievable that a trip would be cut short on a possibility, it rather overshadowed the last couple days (not to mention that rather rough storm that coated my balcony on Deck 8 in salty sea spray crystalline mix and laid out two members of our group with minor bouts of seasickness).

 

There were plenty of parts of this cruise that I did enjoy and I wouldn't even say that this was a Cruise from Hell, but of the five total cruises now that I have taken, this so far was the worst of the bunch.

 

And while I am sorry for those that couldn't sail on the ship last night, as of the weather forecast last Tuesday, they shouldn't have been able to sail out anyway, so their being stuck in port overnight really shouldn't come as a great surprise to them. I certainly hope that they don't get another fog prediction on Tuesday and have to come back early. That would mean they would only get one port at best. I should be thankful for the two that I did get. At least they were lovely.

 

I want to repost this because I believe pretty much the same way. Our cruise wasn't cut short 1 day but at least 2-days. I understand the problems with port of Galveston and now Houston and as a coast-guard licensed boat captain I understand the implications. However, there is no (little? I can't think of any reason) to predict this 4 days in advance. If it were me, I would use this as an excuse.

 

We heard from everyone - EVEN THE CUSTOMS OFFICIALS that we came in because of Noro. We also heard Belize would not allow us into port. We know there are a lot of rumors so know one will ever be able to agree as to what really happened. We all know as a fact that this ship has had Noro for at least the last three sailing. My parents best friends also sailed out LATE a couple of week ago due to sanitation. Also, when the CDC commented, they were not sure that it would be ready by sailaway yesterday - which could also explain the delayed departure. Anyway, all that aside- whether fog or virus, they are both issues in the winter and we'll never know.

 

I personally won't cruise on Princess in the Caribbean again because I really just don't like their product. I tried it last year and thought it was OK but this year was poor even before the disaster. I'll stick with Celebrity or Royal Caribbean. I WILL cruise on Princess on their "Exotics" where I'm basically using them as a hotel.

 

The bottom line though - they treated us poorly on this cruise and I recall when we were booked on a 9/15/01 cruise on Royal Caribbean without insurance. They let us rebook the next week without charge and Princess/Carnival did not. I am LOYAL to cruise lines that treat people well even when they do not have to via terms of contract. There were only certain reasons we were going on another princess cruise this year...

[caribill]

There will be cars there for 2 cruises!

 

Which is why they are expanding the parking lot.

[BridgeMates]

How was disembarkation not handled well? I thought it went smoothly once it started on Friday morning.

 

No problems getting on or off. The people in the terminal were very pleasant. Lots of seats, at least for those of us who got there around 1130. We requested a 9:15 departure and it slipped to 10:00am, which was fine. Even got a revised notice stating we could remain in the comfort of our cabin if we wished instead of having to vacate at 8am. They had plenty of time to clean the cabins without passengers boarding so they let us stay where we wanted.

We've missed ports on many cruises, sometimes tenders can't get in due to rough weather, one time a stabilizer broke and we hate to wait 2 days for divers to come from England to fix it, and we couldn't stay at the dock in Lisbon as another ship was booked. We sat out in the harbor for 2 days and missed two ports on a Transatlantic which doesn't have very many ports anyway. As you know, these things happen regularly if you continue to cruise. We've encountered fog delays in Galveston on occasion. Houston may be a little more difficult, but we will continue to pick cruises that have a good price for a few days in the sun during the winter. It's not all bad!

[SanDiegoHeather]

Had they done similar to what Royal Caribbean did for the Explorer - which was 50% of cruise refund (which was over the top and not expected by Caribbean Princess passengers) and 50% of the cruise fare paid as a credit for the next cruise -Princess would have had LOYAL customers for life. I know I am LOYAL to RCI/Celebrity because of how I've been treated before (we only went on 6 Previous Princess cruises because of itinerary/family reasons).

 

I don't think that Princess needed to match RCI, but the fact that they always want to CHEAP OUT makes them suck. If they were smart - they would have MATCHED RCI. I think people expected more than 1/7 cruise fare since we missed a port - since that was pretty much the port most passengers wanted and took the cruise for. Also, we also missed a whole day because there were no activities. They should have offered 30% and 30% on a future cruise.

 

Anyway, the ROTTEN treatment pretty much alienated a bunch of us. While I'm just platinum on Princess, my parents are Elite and are now switching to Celebrity. We are higher levels already on Royal Caribbean and Celebrity so I don't care - I just wanted to add that so that anyone reading this knows that I have been on more than 1 cruise.

Edited February 2, 2014 by SanDiegoHeather

[SKAGGS1234]

We have been on 10 or so cruises out of Galveston in February. Only 1 time in 10 years have we had a delay due to fog.

Having a ship close by is wonderful! Maybe Princess should think about having some long cruises out of these ports. Seems the turn around causes so many problems. I would love to see some new destinations and longer cruises out of this area:)!

[Loonbeam]

There were at least 3 reports here and on other forums of problems with hotels, etc not being properly communicated, transportation issues and more. I wasn't referring to the disembarkation itself, it was how arrangements were made for those people who had to make alternate arrangements may have been handled.

 

How was disembarkation not handled well? I thought it went smoothly once it started on Friday morning.

[Loonbeam]

As I posted above, the decision to return early was primarily due to fog. The decision to Disembark early was due to Noro. It's my understanding, though with no confirmation, to originally allow passengers to stay on board once in dock (which makes sense - Princess wouldn't have to pay compensation or hotel and travel costs), but they decided to change that to allow for disinfection.

 

I want to repost this because I believe pretty much the same way. Our cruise wasn't cut short 1 day but at least 2-days. I understand the problems with port of Galveston and now Houston and as a coast-guard licensed boat captain I understand the implications. However, there is no (little? I can't think of any reason) to predict this 4 days in advance. If it were me, I would use this as an excuse.

 

We heard from everyone - EVEN THE CUSTOMS OFFICIALS that we came in because of Noro. We also heard Belize would not allow us into port. We know there are a lot of rumors so know one will ever be able to agree as to what really happened. We all know as a fact that this ship has had Noro for at least the last three sailing. My parents best friends also sailed out LATE a couple of week ago due to sanitation. Also, when the CDC commented, they were not sure that it would be ready by sailaway yesterday - which could also explain the delayed departure. Anyway, all that aside- whether fog or virus, they are both issues in the winter and we'll never know.

 

I personally won't cruise on Princess in the Caribbean again because I really just don't like their product. I tried it last year and thought it was OK but this year was poor even before the disaster. I'll stick with Celebrity or Royal Caribbean. I WILL cruise on Princess on their "Exotics" where I'm basically using them as a hotel.

 

The bottom line though - they treated us poorly on this cruise and I recall when we were booked on a 9/15/01 cruise on Royal Caribbean without insurance. They let us rebook the next week without charge and Princess/Carnival did not. I am LOYAL to cruise lines that treat people well even when they do not have to via terms of contract. There were only certain reasons we were going on another princess cruise this year...

[RDC1]

Had they done similar to what Royal Caribbean did for the Explorer - which was 50% of cruise refund (which was over the top and not expected by Caribbean Princess passengers) and 50% of the cruise are paid as a credit for the next cruise -they would have had LOYAL customers for life. I know I am LOYAL because of how I've been treated before.

 

I don't think that Princess needed to match RCI, but the fact that they always want to CHEAP OUT makes them suck. If they were smart - they would have MATCHED RCI. I think people expected more than 1/7 cruise fare since we missed a port - since that was pretty much the port we cruised. Also, we also missed a whole day. They should have offered 30% and 30% on a future cruise.

 

Anyway, the ROTTEN treatment pretty much alienated a bunch of us. While I'm just platinum on Princess, my parents are Elite and are now switching to Celebrity. We are higher levels already on Royal Caribbean and Celebrity so I don't care - I just wanted to add that so that anyone reading this knows that I have been on more than 1 cruise.

 

Big difference between the two events. On the RCI cruise the sickness started quickly. Large numbers were sick before they ever reached a port. they basically skipped all of their ports except 1 and that one was severely impacted because the sickness was widespread. 20% of the ship was sick. Pools closed. Entertainment canceled because the entertainers were sick.

 

On the princess cruise the ship came back 33 hours early and missed 1 port. Other activities ran as scheduled.

The 20% refund plus 20% FCC seems resonable based upon the level of impact.