Making lemonade with the Journey propellor lemons - how it went

[uktog]

Well, there was that massive lemon, the cancelled cruise, the temporary lemons, when we had issues persuading the cruiseline to allow a rebook before the compensation package was agreed and one or two Celebrity lemons but I am back to say, we did get a holiday and it was a cruise and we had a pretty good (cannot give it great) time.

 

I hope this post will also give a useful insight to those wondering about suite life on Celebrity vs a room on Azamara, particularly now Celebrity is relaunching its suite experience.

 

Our cruise was in fact two cruises back to back covering the Eastern and Western Caribbean. For our first week, we had a Royal Suite and the second a Celebrity suite. Because we were such late bookers, we did not get any perks, though on both both cruises the majority of other guests had free beverage packages. Late booking had other disadvantages, a lot of week one issues were defended with comments that of course we had not been expected and that was what the issue was. They were silly things and we were also very grateful for the help of the Guest Support Manager at Azamara UK who interacted with the ship to smooth things over. He has to leave the company very soon as part of the restructure, I do not believe we will get such support in the new operation and that remains a concern.

 

Our rooms both weeks were beautiful with fantastic showers, plenty space and generally better than we get on Azamara, however the service was sadly lacking during cruise one. We had a butler who I am sure would have been walking down the gangplank by Day two on Azamara. It was his way or no way, his command of English was very poor despite being the Head Butler and he kept making out he had done things for us when get had not (like bringing some champagne and roses) when they were in fact a gift from someone else. The cleaning of the room was also very poor. We were left no comment card by the team on week one, we wonder if this was deliberate as we had had to raise issues during the week - such a pity we knew the score and got a form direct from Guest Relations.

We changed room team week two when we changed rooms, and our Week two team would have been excellent fits on Azamara, it was a chalk and cheese experience. Our stateroom assistant sang all day long as he worked and when the two were in the room they both sang as they worked - such a positive impression!

 

Food was good, but not the same attention to detail in presentation or seasoning you see on Azamara. Service was very spotty, there were great wait staff and bar staff and there were some shockers. Numbers have been cut back so the staff are at times seriously overworked and that shows in their automaton type guest engagement and generally far fewer smiles. It was the silly things, not remembering orders or addressing you by name, hunting for tables that had been cleared whilst staff just watched not clearing space for you and no carrying of plates back for you that left you feeling very much part of a mass market crowd, even though the cost of the b2b cruises and our original Azamara booking were very similar.

 

There are no evening buffets on the scale offered by Azamara, however the speciality restaurants were better, albeit if you are paying, much more expensive although there are discounts to be had and of course from next year they will be free for suite guests (it was one visit per seven nights that was free at present).

 

One real disappointment was the ice cream, it was just supermarket quality and very standard offerings in terms of flavour, not the special tastes of Azamara - as Captains Club members we had some free scoops of the pay for ice cream at the Gelaterie and this was only marginally better than the buffet ice cream and again miles off the Azamara ice cream.

 

A lot of the issues stemmed from poor supervision and poor training and a general "clumsiness" with how to handle guests. In all sections we just did not see team cohesion as we see on Azamara and individuals often pushing themselves forward at the expense of their colleagues, especially in the run up to the end of the cruise, no doubt hoping for tips or being named on comment cards. One example of clumsiness, on night 3, we had to send back two entrees that were cold, it was rectified as you would expect. On Azamara, when this has happened, the maître d has checked next night all is well, but on future nights when he/she speaks with us, the conversation has moved on. In Blu on Celebrity for the next ten days we had the maître d every night as we walked into the restaurant saying loudly "nice and hot food tonight". We actually asked him, could we just drop the fact there was an issue on night 3 but he did not get it and kept on at it, carrying on every night when the waiter brought food to our table and he was near us. Again I felt this maître d was well short of Azamara quality although the delightful hostess Anita (so lovely to see her promoted, we met her last year as an Assistant waitress on Solstice) was excellent and to our eyes ran that restaurant whilst the Maître d just wandered around aimlessly, very rarely giving his team a hand.

 

We realised how important the ambience of Azamara matters to us now. The areas where this hit us most were

 

1. The "entertainment" - whilst we loved the shows and guest entertainers, the resident groups were not great and worst of all, it's not a Max experience when sipping a martini, it is a loud electronic rapp trio that comprises two drummers and someone manipulating a computer called Miami DJs - if they are on a ship near you, pack earplugs! You also have loud loud pool games and music complete with a hyperactive member of the Activities Staff on a microphone booming out commentaries even on the Lawn based games (incidentally the lawn is in a really poor state, no putting, it's mostly fenced off as they try and repair it).

 

2. The up selling pressure - it is all over the ship, at times very hard not to walk from A to B without an approach. I know there is upsell on Azamara but there when the guest declines that is graciously accepted. On Celebrity, dialogue continues in a way that leaves you feeling your views do not matter or you are somehow ignorant about the benefits of the product offering. Celebrity do offer guests a 2 hour event each night where complimentary drinks are served, it is very nice but is now a "hawking event". Every night the little man from Qsine approached us with his iPad, same starting line asking us to look at the offerings - every night we said we did not plan to visit Qsine, next night back he comes..... maybe we look very different each night but as there was only about 20-30 people at these drinks each night, the art of remembering guests was missing.

 

3. The passenger mix - tricky one, with x4 guests it's going to be difficult but whereas included drinks on Azamara has brought no issues in our experiences, free beverage packages promotions have changed Celebrity for the worse. We had guests so drunk they were throwing up at the Martini Bar, a large group, identified by group t shirts highlighting their purpose on the cruise was to drink taking over the sunset bar and playing loud drinking games on sea days, a large group taking over the Molecular Bar all, regardless of gender, wearing red frocks and pushing and rudeness in elevators the likes of which you just do not see on Azamara. These were not young people, age group 40-55 seemed worst.

 

A lot is made about the officer interaction on Azamara. I have to say we did have a lot of interaction I believe because we were in a RS and then as top cruisers. For other guests there was interaction, it was more structured and formal, they had meet the officers hours some evening, and I would suspect it was much less personal than how you see it on Azamara. The Captain is outgoing and was more visible than many we have had on Celebrity.

 

One area Celebrity is getting it right, certainly on Silhouette, is they have split the concierge role - you have a concierge based within Guest Relations, in our case Gareth who is high class professional "Azamara" material and Amrish who is a destination concierge customising a menu of shore excursions for small groups of guests. These are small number events and are not offered on the main shorex menu. The pricing is very fair. We had two great trips out organised by Amrish, the highlight in St Kitts was a day at a restored plantation house, a personalised Caribbean cookery demo and lunch based on what Janis cooked and use of the house pool in the afternoon. He would have taken up to 12 guests on the trip, in the end only 4 went, so it cost a little more but at under $300 for two for a whole day out and memories of a really special trip.

When I look at what some of the standard shore excursions on Azamara cost in this region, I hope they too can adopt this Destination Concierge concept - which is just being rolled out on Celebrity, this was the one area Celebrity is currently doing much better than Azamara on. This comment is based only on these specialised trips, we did no standard trips so cannot comment there.

 

So our conclusions - of course we will sail again later this year on Celebrity as they are going to New England and this is not offered by Azamara. It is not a bad experience, it is a very different experience. I think Celebrity's new suite offering is going to struggle unless they can achieve consistency of service across all areas of the ship and I see a conflict between how they operate onboard ship for the mass market (hawking products, loud music, a party drinking culture) and what suite guests will want - unless they stay in their suites and their dedicated lounge.

 

Our heart is still with Azamara, but we are so thankful we can cruise and that in the situation we found ourselves in on 26 Feb, we could make some lemonade with the lemons that landed in our laps, albeit not top shelf quality lemonade.

[Lottie A]

Thank you for the excellent and unbiased review Ann. I am so glad you got to "make lemonade from your lemons" .....it certainly wasn't Azamara but it seems you managed to enjoy your stand in Celebrity cruise anyway. I like Celebrity a lot too but would always choose an AZ cruise over them if possible.

 

And that AWFUL thumping music they play on Celebrity ....it seems there is no where to get away from it. It's impossible to have a conversation in the Martini Bar .....they definitely need to rethink the ambience there.....as you say, what they need is a Max! :)

[dln929]

Thank you so much for all your observations. I must sadly agree with you--and it truly does make me sad because we've loved Celebrity cruises and now it is simply not the same line we knew at the beginning. Some people are keen on the direction Celebrity is moving but we're not one of them. We just got off the Reflection two weeks ago and it exhausted me. Too much noise and too many people and not enough open space now that so many revenue-generating venues have moved in. Item #1 about entertainment and #3 about passenger mix: you hit the bulls eye on those. :(

[Granny DI]

We have found every cruise is different even on the same ship. We did b2b2b on the QM2 several years ago. We kept the same stateroom for the entire 24 day journey. We enjoyed the first leg, loved the second part and hated the third. DH will not cruise the QM2 again. What happened on the 3rd leg of the trip was almost a complete turnover in passengers ...mix didn't work for us...terrible service and rude passengers. In generalities the first and 2nd legs were formal but passengers one would expect on Azamara, Oceania, Crystal etc... Last leg was something right off of a Carnival fire sale cruise...muscle shirts, etc in the dining rooms.

 

We had a wonderful cruise on the Azamara in July. It was pretty like what most of you describe....our second cruise was not and DH is very hesitant to sail them again. Difference was location, staff and passenger mix....cabin was superior to the first cruise but nothing else matched the experience on the first cruise.

[Sailin' Shoes]

Booked on the Silhouette for a Holy Land cruise in October. Distressed to hear Celebrity is going Carnival. Just got off a Princess cruise and won't ever do that again, main problem being the passenger mix. May have to rethink Celebrity. I wonder if part of the problem is the Caribbean cruises attract party people and people who can't afford to fly to, say, Europe to catch a cruise.

Edited March 17, 2014 by Sailin' Shoes

[kathy9]

I made my lemonade on the Wind Spirit, sailing from Colon to Puerto Caldera, CR. There were 130 passengers and a crew of 98. There was not one crew member I met who was not AZ material. It was a pleasure to sail with them and they felt like old friends before the cruise was over. The food had it's high 's and a few lows, but I don't cruise to eat. We will sail AZ again but Windstar will be in our rotation. Will write a review when I return home.

Kathy

[uktog]

Certainly as regards the guest behaviour I expect the Carribean had a part to play,it does not explain some of the crew behaviour ( which I have not detailed here)

[Granny DI]

Certainly as regards the guest behaviour I expect the Carribean had a part to play...

 

Our great cruise was in the British Isles and our average cruise was in the Caribbean so perhaps the difference was location, location, location.

[Sailin' Shoes]

Certainly as regards the guest behaviour I expect the Carribean had a part to play...

 

Our great cruise was in the British Isles and our average cruise was in the Caribbean so perhaps the difference was location, location, location.

 

I think we were on the same Caribbean cruise as you. I was very disappointed since I am an ACC fan. Food was subpar, pax were the oldest demographic I have ever seen, we were "stalked" by some needy couple that would not leave us alone, disaster Azamazing evening thing, etc. We think that after three tries, two on ACC, that Caribbean cruises are not for us. We tried a Princess cruise after the ACC cruise since Capt. Jose said test the other product so we did. The cabin was far superior and the food, except for ice cream, was better on Princess. Service was a toss up. No warm and fuzzies. The passenger mix was not for us.

[Andy]

And that AWFUL thumping music they play on Celebrity ....it seems there is no where to get away from it. It's impossible to have a conversation in the Martini Bar .....they definitely need to rethink the ambience there.....as you say, what they need is a Max! :)

 

Hi Lottie,

 

Based on what we experienced on Century a few weeks ago, I feel it's only going to get worse before it gets better. I truly hope I'm wrong, but the whole music/entertainment situation is very discouraging. We are sailing on Eclipse in 3 weeks, and we spent top dollar for this cruise. If we experience more of the same on Eclipse, I suspect we will try other brands when the ships return to Florida later this year.

Edited March 18, 2014 by Host Andy

[Granny DI]

 

I think we were on the same Caribbean cruise as you. I was very disappointed since I am an ACC fan. Food was subpar' date=' pax were the oldest demographic I have ever seen, we were "stalked" by some needy couple that would not leave us alone, disaster Azamazing evening thing, etc. We think that after three tries, two on ACC, that Caribbean cruises are not for us. We tried a Princess cruise after the ACC cruise since Capt. Jose said test the other product so we did. The cabin was far superior and the food, except for ice cream, was better on Princess. Service was a toss up. No warm and fuzzies. The passenger mix was not for us.[/quote']

 

Agree with everything you said! Not planning another Caribbean cruise...Bermuda, The Med and China are our next cruises.

[Andy]

Hi Uktog,

 

Just wanted to say thank you for your insights. While we sailed on a different Celebrity ship (Century) a few weeks ago, we also experienced much of the same - especially the loud music, and personnel that didnt have a clue what they were doing. With that said, we had a nice time... but we arent thrilled with the direction Celebrity is headed. I hope things will improve, but I'm not holding my breath.

 

Thanks again for your comments, and welcome home !

[marinaro44]

 

I think we were on the same Caribbean cruise as you. I was very disappointed since I am an ACC fan. Food was subpar' date=' pax were the oldest demographic I have ever seen, we were "stalked" by some needy couple that would not leave us alone, disaster Azamazing evening thing, etc. We think that after three tries, two on ACC, that Caribbean cruises are not for us. We tried a Princess cruise after the ACC cruise since Capt. Jose said test the other product so we did. The cabin was far superior and the food, except for ice cream, was better on Princess. Service was a toss up. No warm and fuzzies. The passenger mix was not for us.[/quote']

Strange. We had lunch today with a couple that has cruised Azamara with us and had just returned from a Princess cruise through the Canal. They are pretty far up the Princess frequent cruiser ladder. Said the food was terrible. Tapioca for dessert.:eek: Tough, strange-tasting beef. Invisible, unengaged senior officers. They worry that we'll be really disappointed when we take a Princess cruise with them in 2015.

 

We've spent about 100 nights on Azamara and have never found the food to be "subpar," but I suppose others could.

Edited March 18, 2014 by marinaro44

[midwestchick]

Uktog...thank you so much for a great review and I agree with many of your points. As someone else said, maybe it's the Caribbean itinerary that attracts the "party type" pax. That is one thing we did not experience on X but it was a Med cruise and maybe the airfare is a deterrent.

I'm happy to hear that for the most part, your "lemonade" turned out pretty good.

kathy9....looking forward to your report. Please post on this forum when it's finished.

[puppypundit]

Thanks for the detailed report, Uktog and to all the others sharing their "add water and serve" instant lemonade plans.

 

I'm grateful to have had the opportunity to discover Azamara because my folks have always been Celebrity-people. They don't seem to mind the crowds, prefer the bigger shows and as for destinations, my mom never even disembarks.

 

I'm the Azamara niche market in a nutshell: Give me smaller ships with the opportunity to really experience the places we visit and the chance to meet the other people on board, both passengers and staff. Between the international make-up of the cruisers and the workers, it's like going all around the world just by having chit-chat in the coffee-bar!

 

Anyway, it's also really refreshing to hear that even on short notice, terrific experiences can be had in these lemonade moments. More, please.

[HudandPug]

Thanks Uktog

 

Interesting reading.

 

We sailed Celebrity last October and noticed the attitude of some staff, mainly senior to be a bit off! We had one incident that became two that upset many passengers and the attitude of senior staff was appalling.

 

There is always a staff party at some point on a cruise, or so we have found. This is great and I enjoy thinking the staff are getting a deserved break.

 

On our cruise there was no warning about this party and everyone was turfed out of the Constellation lounge with disco in full swing. Ok one night, then it happened again the following night. Most of the bars/venues closed and one chap who asked at reception where to go to get a drink (he had a large group with him) was told 'over there' as the staff member pointed to shore. He organised a party in his suite instead. The following night there was a sit-in by those who had been in the constellation lounge in another venue.

 

What really bothered me was;

 

the lack of any notification regarding the parties and closure of the Constellation lounge (still showed open on the newsheet) and everywhere else, which had they been reported, would have been accepted and thus passengers could plan.

 

the number of night staff I asked who had not been to either party, not invited, not nice given the two nights and size of the venue.

 

We had to change our original plans for this April (should have been Azamara Journey) and even though Celebrity were offering some good deals and ports, we chose Azamara with only a few new ports, thinking, maybe never again on Celebrity.

 

Yvonne

Edited March 18, 2014 by HudandPug

[nordski]

Let me add my thanks for a great review. Your posts always help us keep things in perspective.

 

Perhaps the leaders of Celebrity should read this month's article in The New Republic entitled: "Silence is Now a Luxury Product".

 

This article details the issues we face trying to escape the ubiquitous "noisiness" of our culture, a "noisiness" that is difficult to either escape or ignore. That concern now seems to be spreading to our cruise ships.

 

Certainly it's a common theme on the Celebrity forum and well described there by Host Andy and others.

[pacheco18]

We have found every cruise is different even on the same ship.

 

Truer words were never spoken.

 

BTW, the OP is right on this score. Celebrity's ice cream is inedible. But their gelato (which you pay for) is quite good).

[Sailin' Shoes]

Strange. We had lunch today with a couple that has cruised Azamara with us and had just returned from a Princess cruise through the Canal. They are pretty far up the Princess frequent cruiser ladder. Said the food was terrible. Tapioca for dessert.:eek: Tough, strange-tasting beef. Invisible, unengaged senior officers. They worry that we'll be really disappointed when we take a Princess cruise with them in 2015.

 

We've spent about 100 nights on Azamara and have never found the food to be "subpar," but I suppose others could.

 

Different ship, different chef. To clarify the Princess food we had was better than the Quest food we had in late 2013 which was not up to the standard we expected from ACC. Invisible officers is a characteristic of Princess and probably all other mass market lines, we didn't see any on our ship either. I think you will be disappointed with Princess in 2015 if you have grown to consider ACC as your type of ship. I might do Princess again but not in the Caribbean.

[pacheco18]

Different ship' date=' different chef. .[/quote']

 

How about same ship, different chef. We have always found food to be a crap shoot, even in the outstanding specialty restaurants on Oceania. Sometimes beyond great, other times just fine and once even awful.

 

How do you explain it? Chef, ingredients available and source and a myriad other things that affect food quality.

 

I think food is the biggest variable on any sailing.

[English Tim]

Thanks for a great review, Ann.

 

As you probably noticed we sailed on Celebrity Reflection, EC, in February and although, as always we enjoyed the cruise, some things alarmed us, particularly the loud music in many places, the attempts at upselling and the extremely poor bar service.

 

We had the drinks package included in our fare, in addition to pre-paid gratuities and found that people generally behaved quite well, but a few didn't, though I never saw anyone D&I.

 

The Observation lounge was one of our favourite bars, but alas much of the time it was closed due to private parties. The Platinum guests on our dinner table, enjoyed the free cocktails and then drank water at dinner!

 

Embarkation at Miami was a nightmare, but disembarkation was excellent for a change.

 

Incidentally, we cruised the Panama Canal, in November, with Princess and had a wonderful cruise, with excellent food and service.

 

We are now pretty committed to smaller ship cruising.

[azevedan]

on Reflection.

And, on reflection:

The ship was gorgeous, but too dang big. And there were too many people (and it was spring break and this was the Caribbean). The pool area was packed solid and noisy, and yes, the music was really really LOUD. Even the Solstice Deck (the top small deck where I like to hide out to get my sun) got crowded with others seeking sun with quiet (there's an indoor pool area for quiet, but that was pretty crowded, too, and doesn't get sun). It took forever to get anywhere, and I never did get to know the boat in the week I was on it. There were lots of nice little nooks all over. The Promenade Deck (as on Azamara) was a much quieter place to hang out.

There are a lot more smoking areas on Celebrity, but it wasn't a big issue. Frankly, the smoking situation was worse on my last Azamara cruise, due to a continual cigar smoker and the fact that the odor affected a much larger (proportionally) area of the ship.

I had a soda package, but still had to hand over my card to be rung up each time I got one. Why couldn't I just show it? (Yes, I know - bookkeeping.) I forgot it at a bar one time and had to retrieve it. The bartender lectured me about not losing it again, then (after I said I was used to not having to give my card to get a soda) lectured me that I was "on Celebrity now, and you have to obey Celebrity's rules!" Yes, a direct quote. :eek: Most of the crew and workers, though, were friendly and had a smile and hello. The captain even introduced himself to me as we were both getting a late lunch in the cafe.

I think the live entertainment was a step above Azamara. There was a female guitar player/vocalist who was fabulous, and they were a couple of amazing acrobatic/artistic shows. The production shows/singers were fairly typical.

The food was mostly very good. I didn't sample the ice cream or gelato, except for the day they had a delicious low-fat peach ice cream, with real peaches. The service in the MDR was up and down, but mostly up. Sometimes they worked with requests for meal alterations; other times, it was 'this is just the way it comes.' They also didn't make any reference to the dietary restrictions I had filed before sailing, unlike Azamara, where the maitre d' had a lengthy discussion with me at the start of the cruise.

I did one ship excursion, which I was very pleased with. We only had 27 snorkelers on a boat meant for over 100, and it was a great trip. Also, there were crew members waiting with fruit punch and cold towels when we returned. The cruise only had 3 ports - San Juan, St Thomas and St Maarten. I would've preferred a cruise that stopped more places, but I was traveling last minute with family (but without the DH) on a pre-arranged cruise.

Due to flight problems, I got to Miami later than planned and boarded well after the rush, so checkin was a breeze (normally, I'd go down the day before, but it was a short flight and I'd returned from a business trip the day before). Walking off at the end was also a breeze. I got off even before the announcement, and the wait at customs was minimal. No problem getting a cab to the airport (but there were flight problems AGAIN getting home.)

There was certainly a broader age spectrum of passengers, and lots of families. Also, those passengers who were of the age that you typically see on Azamara represented a much broader (shall we say) behavioral spectrum.

Two formal nights; I brought a cocktail length dress, which I wore for the first formal night. A wide variety of what constituted 'formal' wear. :rolleyes: The second formal night (which I skipped) appeared to be a lot more 'formal', judging by the attire of people walking around that evening.

It was a nice break, the weather was fabulous, I had a couple of great snorkel days in crystal blue waters, but the ship was just too dang big and crowded for my taste.

Edited March 23, 2014 by azevedan

[kathy9]

Here is the link to my CC Wind Spirit review.

http://www.cruisecritic.com/memberreviews/memberreview.cfm?EntryID=252228.

 

We are looking to sail WindStar in the Med in 2016....

Viking Star in April 2015 and we will try for Asia again on AZ in December 2015!

Then who knows........... Sir Richard Branson's Virgin cruise line in 2017?

I have to retire so I can cruise more.

[English Tim]

Here is the link to my CC Wind Spirit review.

http://www.cruisecritic.com/memberreviews/memberreview.cfm?EntryID=252228.

 

We are looking to sail WindStar in the Med in 2016....

Viking Star in April 2015 and we will try for Asia again on AZ in December 2015!

Then who knows........... Sir Richard Branson's Virgin cruise line in 2017?

I have to retire so I can cruise more.

 

Thanks for your review.