Jones Act - Can't Disembark Ship

[br3ds0x]

My family is going on the Century this weekend. For work reasons, one of my brothers can now only go on the first 3 days of the cruise, then will have to fly home. This has happened before, so I had the TA call up Celebrity to let them know. It turns out that guests are not allowed to disembark the ship at a U.S. per the Jones Act of 1920 (really?). I tried doing some research and have read that if there is an emergency (which this obviously is not), you can request Customs to allow you to disembark and if approved you are charged a $300 fine.

 

Does anyone have any experience with this?

[Gonzo70]

It is not actually the Jones Act (a cabotage law impacting the transportation of cargo) but the Passenger Vessel Services Act (PVSA). A foreign flagged ship cannot transport a passenger from one US city to a different US city unless the ship stops at a DISTANT foreign port in between (distant is generally defined as a port outside of North America - so a stop in Canada, Mexico or most Caribbean islands does not count). It is similar to the laws that do not allow a foreign airline to transport you from one US city to another (i.e. you can fly British Airways from a US city to London, but not from one US city to another). While under emergencies people generally are permitted to violate the PVSA, a cruise line generally cannot provide advance permission for someone to violate the PVSA (even if the person is willing to pay the fine) as the cruise line may face harsh additional sanctions if they willingly allow the PVSA to be violated under non-emergency situations (i.e. the ship could be banned at calling at US ports for a period of time).

[BEAV]

Wonder what would happen if he boards in LA and disembarks in SF (to go sightseeing, etc, like all the rest of the passengers) and just didn't return back to the ship? And the rest of the family held onto his luggage for the duration of the cruise back to LA?

[spookwife]

Wonder what would happen if he boards in LA and disembarks in SF (to go sightseeing, etc, like all the rest of the passengers) and just didn't return back to the ship? And the rest of the family held onto his luggage for the duration of the cruise back to LA?

 

he would cause a huge kerfluffle. they will raise a big stink since they ship won't leave without everyone on on board until they absolutely have to, causing extra work for the pier side crew, the ship's crew and lots of other people.

 

once they realize he deliberately bailed he will get into a lot of trouble and yes get fined if not worse.

[br3ds0x]

he would cause a huge kerfluffle. they will raise a big stink since they ship won't leave without everyone on on board until they absolutely have to, causing extra work for the pier side crew, the ship's crew and lots of other people.

 

once they realize he deliberately bailed he will get into a lot of trouble and yes get fined if not worse.

 

 

Ya I wouldn't do that as I wouldn't want to cause any delays for the other passengers. Part of me wants to just bring him and on that day say there is a work emergency and he needs to leave. If there is a fine, so be it. I can't imagine that they can say no, you can't leave..but at the same time would hate to find out there is more than just a fine.

[wallie5446]

No experience. I would assume his name would be turned over to the US authorties as to having missed the ship.

[Gonzo70]

Ya I wouldn't do that as I wouldn't want to cause any delays for the other passengers. Part of me wants to just bring him and on that day say there is a work emergency and he needs to leave. If there is a fine, so be it. I can't imagine that they can say no, you can't leave..but at the same time would hate to find out there is more than just a fine.

 

You can try this, but be prepared to be informed that he cannot leave the ship (as that is likely to occur). While they would be unlikely to physically restrain him from leaving (he is not a prisoner on the ship), they might very well turn him over to local authorities as he debarks (as he is entering the US illegally) and/or ban him from future cruises across RCCL brands if he insists on leaving after being informed he cannot. So there could be consequences beyond a fine. I would only attempt this if your brother is prepared to remain on the ship if told by Celebrity that he may not debark at the US port of call.

[bar_20]

he would cause a huge kerfluffle. they will raise a big stink since they ship won't leave without everyone on on board until they absolutely have to, causing extra work for the pier side crew, the ship's crew and lots of other people.

 

once they realize he deliberately bailed he will get into a lot of trouble and yes get fined if not worse.

 

Take his card and find some homeless person on Market St. that looks like him. Tell him he can spend three days on a cruise ship and eat all the food he wants and even take a shower. I bet you will find some takers. :D

[Gonzo70]

Take his card and find some homeless person on Market St. that looks like him. Tell him he can spend three days on a cruise ship and eat all the food he wants and even take a shower. I bet you will find some takers. :D

 

That might actually work! :cool::D

[ORV]

Take his card and find some homeless person on Market St. that looks like him. Tell him he can spend three days on a cruise ship and eat all the food he wants and even take a shower. I bet you will find some takers. :D

 

That's funny, and creative.

[rebeccalouiseagain]

The cruise line will charge the passenger $300 and either the passengers credit card or the person traveling in the same cabin will be required to pay for this prior to disembarking.

 

This happened to my step-father. He did not realize that there would be this fine and had made plans to disembark in Alaska prior to returning to Seattle. He paid the fine but was not happy about it.

[BEAV]

An acquaintance of mine, not having knowledge of the PVSA, innocently disembarked Infinity in the port of Hilo. His plan was to spend the night on the Big Island with friends and rejoin the ship the following day in Kona. When he boarded in Kona, the alarms and bells went off when he entered his card into the security machine at the gangway. He had to go to Guest Relations and pay the $300 fine. An expensive overnight on the Big Island and new-found knowledge of the PVSA......

[Hapytocruise]

Celebrity also has the right to ban individuals from future cruises on them and their other brands. Not that this would cause them to do it - but they could.

[Aloha 1]

High time this "law" and the Jones Act were repealed.

[CanWeGoYet?]

Take his card and find some homeless person on Market St. that looks like him. Tell him he can spend three days on a cruise ship and eat all the food he wants and even take a shower. I bet you will find some takers. :D

 

LOL. I'd be tempted and I'm not homeless.

[BEAV]

I live just 30 minutes from SF. When the OP's brother disembarks the ship, I'll be there to "accept" his sea pass card and complete the rest of the voyage from SF to LA on his behalf.

 

Works for me! :D:eek::D

[jan-n-john]

High time this "law" and the Jones Act were repealed.

 

You appear to be Hawaiian so are likely to be considerably more knowledgeable about and sensitive to the Jones Act and similar legislation than are most folks. For those who are less familiar with these laws, suffice it to say that repealing them simply isn't going to happen in the lifetime of anyone reading this. No way Congress is going to go along with allowing foreign companies to provide transportation within US borders. The definition of what is "domestic" and what is "foreign" gets a bit odd at times, but in the case of ocean-going vessels, a ship flying a foreign flag (registered in a country outside the US) is foreign even if its owners are majority or even totally American.

[sasset]

That's why NCL launched NCLA for their Hawaii route.

[Gonzo70]

High time this "law" and the Jones Act were repealed.

 

Why? The last time congress debated the PVSA (again the Jones act has NOTHING to do with cruising) it was to consider making it MORE stringent, not repealing it. No way will it be repealed anytime in the near future.

[sailandcruise]

Take his card and find some homeless person on Market St. that looks like him. Tell him he can spend three days on a cruise ship and eat all the food he wants and even take a shower. I bet you will find some takers. :D

 

totally impractical. How would this person re-enter the US at the end of the cruise? By using your brother's passport and impersonating him? :confused::eek:

[upwarduk]

You appear to be Hawaiian so are likely to be considerably more knowledgeable about and sensitive to the Jones Act and similar legislation than are most folks. For those who are less familiar with these laws, suffice it to say that repealing them simply isn't going to happen in the lifetime of anyone reading this. No way Congress is going to go along with allowing foreign companies to provide transportation within US borders. The definition of what is "domestic" and what is "foreign" gets a bit odd at times, but in the case of ocean-going vessels, a ship flying a foreign flag (registered in a country outside the US) is foreign even if its owners are majority or even totally American.

 

All passengers had to disembark Century in Ensenada on a cruise that was advertised as finishing in San Diego. We had embarked in Honolulu and only visited the 'Islands'

56 coaches took the passengers through the border, from Mexico, where some of the coaches were impounded as not being fit to travel in USA. The passengers then had to drag their cases up a hill, where replacement coaches were waiting. Other drivers got lost.

A complete nightmare.

When we arrived at San Diego airport, Century was already in the port.

 

Please tell me what sense there was in that exercise?:eek:

[4774Papa]

High time this "law" and the Jones Act were repealed.

Ditto, but I am sure there are some unions out there that would fight that.

[Aloha 1]

The Jones Act was intended to protect and foster American ship building and shipping. It's greatest proponent was the late Senator Dan Inouye. It has been a total failure in both regards. Examples such as Celebrity's bus trip from Ensenada or NCL's having to run to Kurabati in order to sail the Hawaiian islands beginning and ending in Honolulu are prime exhibits of the stupidity of this law. NO cruise ships are being built in the US, all the major lines flag their vessels elsewhere. Time to let the free market work.

[jan-n-john]

All passengers had to disembark Century in Ensenada on a cruise that was advertised as finishing in San Diego. We had embarked in Honolulu and only visited the 'Islands'

56 coaches took the passengers through the border, from Mexico, where some of the coaches were impounded as not being fit to travel in USA. The passengers then had to drag their cases up a hill, where replacement coaches were waiting. Other drivers got lost.

A complete nightmare.

When we arrived at San Diego airport, Century was already in the port.

 

Please tell me what sense there was in that exercise?:eek:

 

I never said there was any sense in it. I just pointed out that the law is not likely to be repealed anytime soon.

 

There is a very big constituency in favor of reserving US internal transportation service for US companies using US citizens as crew, and a very small constituency, if any, for even a very tiny opening up to foreign companies, which is viewed as the camel getting its nose under the tent. There are very big dollars involved in this issue, far far beyond any inconvenience a few cruise passengers may occasionally suffer as a result of its application. Cruise ships, which fly foreign flags due to the extreme high cost of operating under the US flag, thus will have to conform to the laws and not serve directly between US ports, as would have been the case for the voyage you spoke of had the ship gone straight to San Diego.

 

You can always call your Congressman, but personally I wouldn't bother. It's just one of those things that one has to put up with. I'm currently planning a trans pacific B2B in 2015 on the Solstice that will call in Hawaii and then drop us all off in Vancouver, for the same reason.

[BosoxI]

Take his card and find some homeless person on Market St. that looks like him. Tell him he can spend three days on a cruise ship and eat all the food he wants and even take a shower. I bet you will find some takers. :D

 

And, the brother's wife might find the change extremely exciting