Seabourn Odyssey - Restaurant

[lincslady]

In spite of what Ableseaman H says, I did feel that the seating hostess was somewhat surplus to requirements. On Sojourn recently I felt that lovely Mireille, normally at the door of the Colonnade at breakfast and lunch, was slightly demoted - maybe I am wrong, and also actually that the two hostesses we have met so far were not as charming and helpful as other staff. Obviously just a personal opinion.

[jenidallas]

What's interesting to me is how many people that are happy with just the buffet seem so dead set against keeping the restaurant open for breakfast and lunch. It's almost like they're saying to those who want choice "Stop liking what I don't like" If people don't want to patronize the restaurant aside from dinner - fine, but why begrudge others the option? It's not like doing so will allow hordes of ill behaved smoking children onboard :D

 

And then there are plenty of us in the middle ground who DO like having options but also understand the operational reality that no business is going to provide a staffed (server/kitchen) amenity that it being utilized by a small fraction of guests (ie the MDR on port days at breakfast/lunch).

 

When numerous posters report that on port days (and really, that's still the issue at hand despite 300+ posts of histrionics that would lead a casual reader to believe otherwise) you are talking about less than 10% of the ships passengers (and I think 45 is very generous given the numbers that others report and that I've personally observed) utilizing a service that requires several servers and dedicated stations in the kitchen then I think the business case is clear.

 

What I'm still perplexed by is the exact timing of when this became an issue. I only started sailing in the summer of 2013 but the ships have *never* had the MDR open for lunch on my four sailings when the ship was in port with the exception of a morning-only port on one itinerary. It was always open for breakfast albeit very poorly utilized on those port days. It has always been open on sea days. Others have reported this as well. I ask because this seemed to suddenly crop up last spring but seems to have occurred long before that on the O-class ships based on my reading going back several years.

 

I would thing that after as long as our forum has been knashing teeth over this that Seabourn management would either take notice and fix the issue (if it views it as one) or understand that this small corner of the interwebs is not worth worrying about and swept it under the rug. It seems that they have done the latter... and yet the raging continues.

 

I am not a cheerleader. I would still like to be able to get my onion rings and enjoy a nice leisurely lunch on a rainy port day away from the hustle of the Colonnade. But I also recognize that change happens and if I can't do so, thereby at night be a valid business case as to why.

Edited November 5, 2015 by jenidallas

[lincslady]

jeni - to me the real issue is honesty - Seabourn apparently say in their advertising that the dining room will be open for all meals, and that does not happen. In fact on our last two cruises, it has been open, on port days as well as sea days, but it is not a consistent policy. So, something should be done - either make sure the dining room is open for all meals, or stop telling potential customers that it will be. In which case those to whom is is of great importance can take their business elsewhere.

[Able Seaman H]

In spite of what Ableseaman H says, I did feel that the seating hostess was somewhat surplus to requirements. On Sojourn recently I felt that lovely Mireille, normally at the door of the Colonnade at breakfast and lunch, was slightly demoted - maybe I am wrong, and also actually that the two hostesses we have met so far were not as charming and helpful as other staff. Obviously just a personal opinion.

 

We are very undemanding guests but actually found her quite helpful. We had a particularly high number of hosted tables this cruise and it was reay convenient having her ask whether we were intending to take up the invites as we entered the Colonnade for breakfast that morning.

 

She also nipped a potential problem one morning in the bud. The clocks had gone forward at 2.00am and for some reason breakfast was scheduled to finish at 9.30am rather than the usual 10.00am. Not an ideal combination. We like many others arrived at 09.45 to be told a la carte was finished but the buffet was still going. Food had run out in the buffet though so she stepped in and ensured food was cooked & the buffet replenished.

 

She also offered us restaurant 2 one morning when the Colonnade was particularly busy.

 

Many guests seemed to bid a very fond farewell to her as they were leaving so it seems she added to their cruise.

 

Henry :)

Edited November 5, 2015 by Able Seaman H

[MARIANH]

And then there are plenty of us in the middle ground who DO like having options but also understand the operational reality that no business is going to provide a staffed (server/kitchen) amenity that it being utilized by a small fraction of guests (ie the MDR on port days at breakfast/lunch).

 

Interesting.

 

If a fully worked Business Case really does justify keeping the MDR closed then the least that Seabourn should do is be honest and adjust their brochures/ publicity accordingly IMHO. But perhaps I am being naive and expecting too much. It seems you are very well travelled and have used other cruise lines. Are you aware if they are also "economical with the actualite" ( ref Alan Clarke - Matrix Churchill trial) in their promotional information?

 

Of course one of the attractions of Seabourn was its catering for a broad church of tastes and preferences, so underpinning it's "luxury" image. Historically this has delivered a niche product that provided for the minority as well as the majority. Seabourn's price structure reflects this. What a pity if this Business model is to be sacrificed on the alter of the Bean Counters who are alleged to know the cost of everything and the value of nothing. And what will be next to go?

 

Thank you for the link to your blog. I was taken by your reference to pyjama clad teenagers with ugly feet dragging dirty pillows. Hopefully not the future for Seabourn!

[jenidallas]

I hope the pyjama clad pillow luggers stay far away from Seabourn too!

 

The marketing material is definitely misleading but not dishonest. They say you FB eat breakfast, lunch and dinner in the MDR. That statement is true. They do not say you can eat ALL meals in the MDR.

 

They also at one point advertised that you could dine, by course, in your suite whenever you wished. (Not true.)

 

They heavily touted the pull-down marina. (Rarely utilized.)

 

They glamorize caviar in the surf. (Only available on select itineraries if the weather cooperates.)

 

They tout complimentary massage moments. (I have yet to ever see one.)

 

Yes, I agree the marketers are liars... and the copywriters have probably never been onboard to verify the claims they are writing.

 

That's truly sad... I personally don't like to write about something unless I've experienced it (and I've suffered through some regrettable travel experiences with that belief) but alas, that's not the case.

[Emperor Norton]

Emperor Norton - I think it is a bit sweeping to suggest that there are many people (presumably you mean the 'cheerleaders') who are dead set against the restaurant being open for all meals. While I am happy to be categorised as something of a cheerleader, I and most others of like mind are more than willing to criticise aspects of the way Seabourn is run when necessary. And have done so, regarding this topic and smoking - and I will now add another: I can see no useful purpose for the recently introduced 'seating hostesses'.

 

Have a look at some of the other forums - you will find far more biased cheerleaders on a few of them!

 

I think you have me confused with someone else. I don't recall mentioning cheerleaders here (if I did I don't recall mentioning names). I definitely understand what you mean about the other forums cheerleaders, there are some so bad you have to wonder if they aren't just shills for that line.:eek:

 

 

I'm not sure what to think about a seating hostess as that seems to be a job that was already taken care of by a different crew member.

Edited November 5, 2015 by Emperor Norton

[Haworth]

Based on our experience of eight cruises and 90 nights I would comment as follows:

I hope the pyjama clad pillow luggers stay far away from Seabourn too!

 

The marketing material is definitely misleading but not dishonest. They say you FB eat breakfast, lunch and dinner in the MDR. That statement is true. They do not say you can eat ALL meals in the MDR.

 

They also at one point advertised that you could dine, by course, in your suite whenever you wished. (Not true.) Never tried or wanted to try

 

They heavily touted the pull-down marina. (Rarely utilized.) 3 cruises and busy on every occassion

 

They glamorize caviar in the surf. (Only available on select itineraries if the weather cooperates.) 3 cruises

They tout complimentary massage moments. (I have yet to ever see one.), Freely available on 6 or 7 cruises

Yes, I agree the marketers are liars... and the copywriters have probably never been onboard to verify the claims they are writing.

 

That's truly sad... I personally don't like to write about something unless I've experienced it (and I've suffered through some regrettable travel experiences with that belief) but alas, that's not the case.

[lincslady]

jeni - I disagree about the marketing material with you in two cases, surely the ability to say you can eat breakfast, lunch and dinner in the dining room is essentially dishonest, suggesting that it is possible every day. The 'massage moments' have happened on about 50% of our voyages; you must have been unlucky not to have seen/taken part in them.

 

I do remember the ridiculous ad suggesting you could have a 7 course dinner in your suite at midnight; that one really took the biscuit. I wonder if anyone actually tried to get them to provide it?

 

Sorry, Emperor, I did not confuse you with anyone else, just assumed you meant the cheerleaders as that is how your post read to me.

[wripro]

Wripro, I am quite sure that you are probably making a tiny joke here, but just in case...the other passenger meant that she was too old to invest any more time in shopping around for another cruise line.

 

TV24,

 

My tongue was, indeed, in my cheek.

[Emperor Norton]

Remember CC posters are probably less than 5% of Seabourns passengers. So whatever goes on here is fairly insignificant to Seabourn - hence not having something akin to Azamaras CBO position.

 

On my cruise in 2013 that was port intensive the MDR was indeed open for breakfast and lunch. It was also fairly well utilized (when I was there - I wont claim to have some kind of super knowledge of what goes on when I'm not there).

 

I only saw the massage moments on my first cruise, but then perhaps they only happens on the pool deck?

 

I've never tried the course by course room service option, but I don't recall it being offered whenever you wish, I thought it was with the caveat that it was during MDR hours. Interesting to hear that its no more - source for that?

Edited November 5, 2015 by Emperor Norton

[lincslady]

Yes, the massage moments are on the pool deck.

 

As far as I am aware, you can order a course by course dinner in your suite within dining hours- this ridiculous ad. suggested that you could do so at midnight. I think it has luckily disappeared from SB advertising.

[sananda]

Jenidallas, I completely agree with your post 331. Based on my experiences with Seabourn the list of things they failed to deliver upon is much larger than yours. I was hard pressed to find anything that met the level of superlative Seabourn presents in the marketing materials I received. I came away feeling the line was the most over-hyped experience that I have ever witnessed. Given the numerous things you have noticed are absent from an actual cruise, don’t you feel cheated? The victim of a well-orchestrated bait and switch marketing campaign?

 

But back to the original topic of this thread, I just can’t equate a buffet meal with a luxury vacation. Buffets are more suitable to the cattle crowd who are more interested in their all-you-can-eat nature and are willing to overlook the unsanitary serving conditions, the lack of any presentation as the manhandled food is slopped onto your plate, and most importantly, the decrease in food quality and quality of preparation when compared to a made to order dining experience. Not to mention the decreased quality of service and noisy, unrelaxing atmosphere.

 

So when Seabourn arbitrarily forced me to eat in the Collonade for breakfast I had a problem. When I asked them to open the MDR and they refused I had a problem. When I complained to the director and pointed out that they were not delivering the experience they hype on their website, including the MDR serving all three meals, and they did nothing but say sorry, I had a big problem. This is a luxury vacation? Not only were they providing an inferior product, but Seabourn’s service was far below industry standard on other main-stream cruise lines.

 

To illustrate what I deem to be high quality service worthy of a luxury establishment, let me relate my experience with hotels. I travel a lot for business. Often, my internal clock is completely out of whack with local time. It is a somewhat common occurrence that I would like to eat in the middle of the night local time. I do not like room service and want to eat in the hotel’s restaurant. It doesn’t matter why I don’t like room service. That is not the point. Consider two very different service experiences.

 

I frequently stay at Hyatt hotels. I have the highest level status possible in their rewards programs. I repeatedly stay at the same properties where almost everyone knows me by name. When I ask them to open the restaurant for me at 3 A.M., there is much hand wringing, explaining of the difficulties for them to re-open the restaurant and lots of apologizing. In the end, the answer is a very polite no. The best I can get them to do is to deliver room service to the lobby.

 

When I vacation with Aman resorts, it is often my first time at the property and nobody knows me by sight. I am just a simple customer. When I ask them to open the restaurant in the middle of the night, a litany of excuses doesn’t spew forth from their mouths. The answer is always “Yes sir. Right away sir. We are so sorry we didn’t anticipate your need to make use of our restaurant at this time of night.” And then they somehow make it happen.

 

This is the very real difference between the high quality service of a true luxury property and that of a property that is only luxurious in its marketing materials. Seabourn is clearly luxurious in name only.

[Able Seaman H]

So you want Seabourn to open the restaurant for you at any time of the day or night?

 

Actually, given the restaurant isn't ever actually closed off to guests - you walk through it to get from the L4 cabins to the lifts (elevators) you probably could get room service delivered there. It would save them a walk:)

 

The sporadic opening of the MDR is duely noted, as is the fact that to some people it's failure to open obliterates their cruising experience.

 

Cruise Critic members as usual have 100% transparency on the issue, are aware that reality might clash with marketing promises and can vote with their feet as they see fit.

 

Henry :)

[Emperor Norton]

So you want Seabourn to open the restaurant for you at any time of the day or night?

 

Actually, given the restaurant isn't ever actually closed off to guests - you walk through it to get from the L4 cabins to the lifts (elevators) you probably could get room service delivered there. It would save them a walk:)

 

The sporadic opening of the MDR is duely noted, as is the fact that to some people it's failure to open obliterates their cruising experience.

 

Cruise Critic members as usual have 100% transparency on the issue, are aware that reality might clash with marketing promises and can vote with their feet as they see fit.

 

Henry :)

 

I'm wonder how long until someones attorney sends Seabourn a harshly worded letter about their marketing materials. Seabourn doesn't need to sink to Regent levels of dishonesty.

[pdx13]

So you want Seabourn to open the restaurant for you at any time of the day or night?

 

Actually, given the restaurant isn't ever actually closed off to guests - you walk through it to get from the L4 cabins to the lifts (elevators) you probably could get room service delivered there. It would save them a walk:)

 

The sporadic opening of the MDR is duely noted, as is the fact that to some people it's failure to open obliterates their cruising experience.

 

Cruise Critic members as usual have 100% transparency on the issue, are aware that reality might clash with marketing promises and can vote with their feet as they see fit.

 

Henry :)

 

That's a good question. I wonder if you could have room service delivered to someplace other than your room?

I have never stayed at a property where I would even considering requesting that they open their dining venue at 0300, and nothing I would ever expect when traveling. Granted, I may not be the most sophisticated traveler, but have had some fantastic experiences, both on cruises and land based hotel that made me feel extraordinarily pampered. And I hope that our first cruise on Seabourn will be one of those experiences, it is what I expect at this level. But open the dining room just for me in the middle of the night? I don't think that would be a criteria for a luxury experience. But then I do not have people waiting on me 24/7 at home. I cook my own meals, do my laundry, clean, and make my bed, and I shop for my groceries. For those who live like royalty I guess I can understand how their expectations might differ.

[Emperor Norton]

That's a good question. I wonder if you could have room service delivered to someplace other than your room?

...

 

I have. On the little sisters you used to be able to get room service deliveries at the Skybar and the Club.

[sananda]

Able Seaman - I didn't ask anyone with Seabourn to open the MDR at 3 AM. When I boarded the ship they gave us a bunch of paperwork describing the various dining venues and their respective hours of operation. I only wanted them to open the MDR during the hours of operation they provided me. Re your second question, it's funny you should ask, because I did ask them to deliver room service to me inside the MDR as a compromise, but they refused. They said that other passengers would see me eating there and think the MDR was open and want to eat there as well.

 

The point I was trying to make with the hotel service examples is that true luxury properties have exceedingly well trained staff. This staff also has the leeway to think for themselves and the power to make any reasonable guest request happen. When the hotel operates the kitchen 24 hrs a day, getting some food any time of day and allowing me to sit at a proper dining table is not unreasonable. The contrast between the staff at an Aman resort and on the Sojourn and Odyssey was tremendous. I don't know how Seabourn was able to pull together such a collection of dejected, disinterested, merely going through the motions group of people. They clearly didn't want to be there.

 

So yes, I have spoken with my money. Seabourn (Carnival) will never get another cent.

[Laylam]

........ The contrast between the staff at an Aman resort and on the Sojourn and Odyssey was tremendous. I don't know how Seabourn was able to pull together such a collection of dejected, disinterested, merely going through the motions group of people. They clearly didn't want to be there.

 

So yes, I have spoken with my money. Seabourn (Carnival) will never get another cent.

 

I am guessing, if you have sailed on both the Sojourn and Odyssey, that your experience of the crew on the Sojourn was not " a collection of dejected, disinterested, merely going through the motions group of people"?????????

 

I would be really interested to know, given your very high expectations, why you chose a second Seabourn cruise?

[Host Dan]

I have. On the little sisters you used to be able to get room service deliveries at the Skybar and the Club.

Yes, I remember those days, and remember when it all stopped. Its like the condo I live in.... I pay $1450 per month for the monthly condo fee. I use the gym, as many do not. Do we close the gym because the majority doesn't use it? NO! why? Because I live in a luxury community! Same with Seabourn. It should be all about daily choices and alternatives... We are paying for it! BTW, a friend is currently on Crystal Symphony, only half full and the MDR is open for all meals.

 

PS This is from a line who's motto USED to be "what is it about "yes" you don't understand?"

Edited November 5, 2015 by Host Dan

[Emperor Norton]

Yes, I remember those days, and remember when it all stopped. Its like the condo I live in.... I pay $1450 per month for the monthly condo fee. I use the gym, as many do not. Do we close the gym because the majority doesn't use it? NO! why? Because I live in a luxury community! Same with Seabourn. It should be all about daily choices and alternatives... We are paying for it! BTW, a friend is currently on Crystal Symphony, only half full and the MDR is open for all meals.

 

PS This is from a line who's motto USED to be "what is it about "yes" you don't understand?"

 

They also used to be the Yachts of Seabourn:(

[jenidallas]

I'm wonder how long until someones attorney sends Seabourn a harshly worded letter about their marketing materials. Seabourn doesn't need to sink to Regent levels of dishonesty.

 

Seabourn's marketing materials as they read now do not promise that breakfast, lunch, and dinner will all be served in the MDR every day. Only that those meals are served in there (true).

 

I think any legal claim would be trumped by the contract of carriage.

[Emperor Norton]

Seabourn's marketing materials as they read now do not promise that breakfast, lunch, and dinner will all be served in the MDR every day. Only that those meals are served in there (true).

 

I think any legal claim would be trumped by the contract of carriage.

 

I think we've gone down the silly rabbit hole. Following that logic theres no requirement they have any venue open any day save one. So long as on one day the venues are open , they've fulfilled what was written.

Edited November 6, 2015 by Emperor Norton

[Silver Sweethearts]

In all of my travel, 80+ cruises and hundreds of land vacations I have only felt compelled to complain twice (excluding the airlines). One of those times was the 2012 Sojourn trip.

 

We wonder what standards you applied to all of those other cruises??

[jenidallas]

I think we've gone down the silly rabbit hole. Following that logic theres no requirement they have any venue open any day save one. So long as on one day the venues are open , they've fulfilled what was written.

 

Yes. That's how contracts work. Contract of carriage documents are interesting creatures. The thought of involving an attorney to contest marketing tools is the apex of silly season.