MSC prejudice against solo travellers - morally repugnant

[anniegb]

It's good to look on the bright side - but it's got to be freaking irritating to be forced into a position where you have no option but to do so!

 

I just tried booking a single person onto a Magnifica sailing in Oct next year and it wouldn't let me. GRRRRRRRRRR!!!!

 

Frustrating isn't it :)

 

I have only sailed 3 repos with MSC and enjoyed them. However as Amo says we now consider other vacation choices and the risk MSC may run is that this solo customer base may not return.

 

BTW I can find plenty of land vacation options with no solo penalty including safaris.

 

Annie

[JSnow789]

MSC website here in the US is horrible. Well, worse than that. It's useless. I'm very surprised that such seasoned travelers as yourselves are not working with a travel agent. Agents get perks. Agents have Reps that will help them circumnavigate local rules or issues. Agents get you upgraded. Agents get paid by the cruise line. Agents send you bottles of wine. Agents make sure your cabin is decorated for your special occasion. Just saying (and I'm not an agent, but I do know a great One!). :)

[riclop]

My friend just booked 2 solo cruises on the Divina. USA

[The_Big_M]

MSC never discounted for solos. Sometimes, on less popular, under-sold, itineraries they would not charge a supplement. Those days have gone.

 

Yes, was referring to the discounted supplement.

 

If there was prejudice though, they wouldn't have done that discounting in the past.

[Bra_BE2014]

We are gay and so far not discriminated by anyone at MSC, that goes against the catholic theory.

 

I'm sorry but I don't agree, 2 single people can book a double occupancy room an no one checks whether they are a couple or not.

 

Do you get a 50% rate when you book a standard hotel room for just one person? You might sometimes, but that is certainly not the norm.

 

How can you prove such discrimination, when it can just be a business decision? You just can't force them to sell you something at half the price.

 

That being said, I think that it would be ok to have special inside smaller cabins for singles, like NCL does, at a much cheaper price. But again, you could always accuse them of not giving you a balcony. MSC might be missing the potential of a big market, I agree, and it looks like it's not appealing to them, but in the end it will be their loss.

 

And by the way, who can be against single people? Everyone has been single at some point!!! That sounds really weird., Tim.

 

I'm an avid reader of the reviews in this forum and after Tim started this thread I searched for solo reviews of MSC cruises and I can count on one hand the ones I found. So I tend to agree with the business decision theory: maybe since there weren't too much solos in the past and their ships tend to go full capacity (if I believe the reviews) then they target couples and families. It doesn't suck any less though :-)

[moomoocow]

MSC website here in the US is horrible. Well, worse than that. It's useless. I'm very surprised that such seasoned travelers as yourselves are not working with a travel agent. Agents get perks. Agents have Reps that will help them circumnavigate local rules or issues. Agents get you upgraded. Agents get paid by the cruise line. Agents send you bottles of wine. Agents make sure your cabin is decorated for your special occasion. Just saying (and I'm not an agent, but I do know a great One!). :)

 

 

Hi Jsnow

 

Travel agents in the USA are a completely different animal from the ones in the UK. None of the above applies to UK travel agents (irrespective of how many times you use them)

 

And the UK website is just as horrific as the US one. :)

 

After my first MSC cruise I have booked all the others by phoning their call centre. Which can also be a trial by fire depending on which agent you get. Last time I phoned I was asked to call back in an hour. Clearly the young man answering the phone couldn't be bothered to take my booking.

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[sidari]

Travel agents in the UK are no longer allowed to discount cruises! another unlevel playing field in my opinion, I have around six to eight agents that i usually get prices from and everyone comes up with the same figures regardless of cruiseline you are wanting to book.

[bobstheboy]

Travel agents in the UK are no longer allowed to discount cruises! another unlevel playing field in my opinion, I have around six to eight agents that i usually get prices from and everyone comes up with the same figures regardless of cruiseline you are wanting to book.

 

An online cruise agent is selling a 10 night cruise and stay on 2nd December from Tenerife ( 3 night stay followed by 7 nights cruise on the Armonia) for £499. The MSC has the cruise for £599, so how is that done if what you say is true ?

[anniegb]

An online cruise agent is selling a 10 night cruise and stay on 2nd December from Tenerife ( 3 night stay followed by 7 nights cruise on the Armonia) for £499. The MSC has the cruise for £599, so how is that done if what you say is true ?

 

Guessing - packaged group fare ?

 

Annie

[Skipper Tim]

MSC website here in the US is horrible. Well, worse than that. It's useless. I'm very surprised that such seasoned travelers as yourselves are not working with a travel agent. Agents get perks. Agents have Reps that will help them circumnavigate local rules or issues. Agents get you upgraded. Agents get paid by the cruise line. Agents send you bottles of wine. Agents make sure your cabin is decorated for your special occasion. Just saying (and I'm not an agent, but I do know a great One!). :)

 

I have to agree with Moomoo, UK agents don't offer anything above and beyond what the cruise line does. I have checked availability online with the awful MSC website then got in touch with one of the large cruise specialists and they offer the same price to the penny, the same range of cabin no.s and no discounts, perks, OBC or other benefits whatsoever. What is the point of them existing? They actually make things worse because an agent booking cannot be accessed online. There is certainly no chance that they could offer a cabin for sole-occupancy that is not available for sole-occupancy direct from MSC.

 

It makes me wonder how MSC would behave if two people booked to share a cabin and one person could not go. If they don't allow sole-occupancy even with a 100% supplement, would they cancel the booking?

 

Elmartellama, there is a law against discrimination on the grounds of sexuality but no law against discriminating against solo travellers. Not accepting solo bookings is almost certainly on business grounds but it is still discrimination when solo travellers are not accepted at any fare. MSC may be gay-friendly because they have to be by law. They are even more family-friendly ('kids go free' etc.) but no solo travellers, on an increasing proportion of cruises, are allowed.

 

Like Amomondo, MSC's solos policy this year has forced to me to do things I would not otherwise have considered - in my case buy a yacht in Greece. I will be sailing her for two weeks from this Sunday 24th. Follow our journey with the link below.

 

A tip for other solo travellers out there: another family-friendly country is Turkey. Consequently, there are no single rooms in the resort hotels. None! There are plenty of 'family rooms' (two bedrooms sharing one bathroom), suites for the well to-do but otherwise is is double and twins. Due to the massive hotel room capacity - I used to live in the resort of Side which is thought of as a village but there were still quarter of a million hotel beds within the Side area - off-season, November-April, there are mostly no single supplements, i.e. for sole-occupancy of a double or twin room. On the Antalya coast the Winter only lasts around 6 weeks centered on February while November is sublime and December still beautiful sunbathing and swimming weather as can January mostly be with a bit of luck. The sea is colder in March and April but the sun stronger and days longer. Most of the hotels that remain open all year are luxury five-star and all-inclusive, often at a nightly rate less than the cost of Allegrissimo alone. For solo travellers, or friends who simply prefer their own rooms, it is a hard destination to beat.

 

I will make a point that I have made before about solo-friendly holidays. It is not just the price, whenever there is a supplement to pay it will deter some solos and therefore there will be proportionally fewer solos on board. A large number of couples and families are content to do their own thing or prefer to socialise with other couples and families. A solo traveller has to make an effort to socialise or have a miserable holiday. This is not the case for couples and families. It has to be said that some partners even see a single person as a threat and deliberately keep their distance. The more solo travellers there are, the more solo-friendly the atmosphere. Any form of supplement is therefore off-putting as it negatively affects the atmosphere for single people. Conversely, when there is no single surcharge, there will be many more solo travellers aboard and the atmosphere for them lifted.

 

This is why, when I check the single and double-occupancy rates of a hotel, I am more concerned that there is no single supplement than I am about the resulting rate. I would rather pay more with no single supplement than less where there is one.

 

MSC's new preference to sail with empty cabins rather than solo occupants is so far removed from any sort of solo-friendly policy that I find it wrong in every way a policy can be wrong: business-wise, morally and reputationally. It has already caused a lot of offence to some of MSC most loyal past guests by, in one subtle measure that most people won't notice, excluding them from future cruises.

[TheCaveman]

Skipper Tim,

 

 

Last year, when we came back from our first MSC cruise, and we mentioned on here, that we received the absolute worse customer service ever, and that they actually laughed in our faces when we had a problem, you told us, when in Rome, do as the romans, and, if you don’t like it, leave.

This is the Mediterranean way of doing things

 

It is not MSC fault / problem that you are single and don’t have a partner.

 

RCI, NCL all offer single rooms, cruise with them

 

Ps, maybe it is because you insulted the CEO of MSC, when you posted about his suit…

 

The end

 

 

 

.

 

Ok, now that that is said and done, I just wanted to show, what I did was not really nice…, I know that

 

but,

 

You feel you can do it to people, and threat them bad, but, if it is the other way around, well…

 

now you feel you have the right to complain, as, things are not going the way you want it to go …

 

PS,

 

I really don’t want to argue, etc, just wanted to get my point across… you are one of the most respected members that post here on MSC, and your advice are always great… just the way you treat other people sometimes,

 

enjoy your day...

[Elmartellama]

Well, to begin with. I do not think is anyone fault to be single ??? Some people may want to be single, period. We will all be single at some point of our lives, even if we do not want to. And who are we to judge other people? as if all couples were happy...

 

My point had nothing to do with that. I respect everyone, or at least I try. My point has to do with the financial aspect of single occupancy. And even if you do not agree with me, it has a its logic.

 

I don't consider to MSC to be gay-friendly, or not gay-friendly. They are just a company that wants our money, even if they don't like us! Therefore I believe the focus on single - discrimination is very weak from my point of view. Maybe they target other markets and that's it.

[Elmartellama]

I will make a point that I have made before about solo-friendly holidays. It is not just the price, whenever there is a supplement to pay it will deter some solos and therefore there will be proportionally fewer solos on board. A large number of couples and families are content to do their own thing or prefer to socialise with other couples and families. A solo traveller has to make an effort to socialise or have a miserable holiday. This is not the case for couples and families. It has to be said that some partners even see a single person as a threat and deliberately keep their distance. The more solo travellers there are, the more solo-friendly the atmosphere. Any form of supplement is therefore off-putting as it negatively affects the atmosphere for single people. Conversely, when there is no single surcharge, there will be many more solo travellers aboard and the atmosphere for them lifted.

 

I really think this is way too extreme. Most people just want to see happy people around, regardless of anything else.

 

And who cares about what other might think!

[Skipper Tim]

I really think this is way too extreme. Most people just want to see happy people around, regardless of anything else.

 

And who cares about what other might think!

 

Elmartellama,

 

I really respect your views. Yours are some of the most sensible and insightful available.

 

It is not what solo travellers think - it is how they are received. As a compulsive/incurable/'sad to other folk' solo traveller, these things are noticeable, observable and could be easily documented if the research was funded :).

 

I travel regardless but I will document my experiences. I am an observer of more experience than I would care to choose.

 

I have re-read what I wrote and I cannot take back a semi-colon or reinflect a verb.

 

This is how it is! A perfectly-balanced view when booking has to take into account the booking policy so as to judge the likely mix of people one will encounter. This is hardly 'extreme'! Solo travellers may have to be more sensitive to the booking policy. This is not 'extreme' - just pragmatic.

Edited August 19, 2014 by Skipper Tim

[Skipper Tim]

If solos are not allowed or will be surcharged heavily, there will be far fewer of them.

 

If you have not had the experience of being in a holiday hotel or on a ship as a solo traveller, you will not know the experience of being ostracised by couples - gay or straight. The fewer solos there are, the fewer people there are to talk to. It is just that many, and far from all, couples and families are relatively introverted. A solo-unfriendly policy has huge implications beyond cost for those who travel solo.

[AmoMondo]

If solos are not allowed or will be surcharged heavily, there will be far fewer of them.

 

If you have not had the experience of being in a holiday hotel or on a ship as a solo traveller, you will not know the experience of being ostracised by couples - gay or straight. The fewer solos there are, the fewer people there are to talk to. It is just that many, and far from all, couples and families are relatively introverted. A solo-unfriendly policy has huge implications beyond cost for those who travel solo.

 

You only have to nip over to the solo forum on here to learn of people who encounter what Tim is describing.

 

I'm fairly introverted, don't tend to bother about others opinion of me and have a fairly thick skin, so I tend not to"suffer" from this type of ignorant behaviour by some who seem to see us a threat, an oddity or an easy target. That said, I do find it more enjoyable when there is more interaction on a cruise as it is a more sociable experience and that tends to happen more when you are not the only solo passenger onboard where even the Maître D' is at a loss what to do with you!

 

To be fair, some people have never travelled alone and just can't imagine being able to do it, never mind enjoy it and I think this sometimes leads to some of their weird questions or reactions.

 

Fortunately these people tend to be in the minority and the majority leave me alone or are friendly.

[Katgoesonholiday]

There were times in our recent trip where I would have quite happily preferred being a solo traveller! I am likewise somewhat introverted and with my husband working and my kids at school I spend a lot of time alone - which is how I like it. Spending two weeks rubbing elbows constantly with my beloved put a strain on things - especially when he thought he could work out directions! :P

 

It was fun meeting new people and whilst those we spent the most time with (meals, excursions, drinks etc) were couples, I would have been quite comfortable doing the same with a solo traveller.

[MsTabbyKats]

There are also times when people just want their own cabin...for privacy.

 

If DH and I were to take our grown son on a cruise....I certainly would get him his own room.

 

I'm glad to hear someone was able to book the Divina as a solo....because...this is America....where we sue. I'm sure some lawyer would "do something" if a solo was barred.

Edited August 19, 2014 by MsTabbyKats

[anniegb]

If solos are not allowed or will be surcharged heavily, there will be far fewer of them.

 

If you have not had the experience of being in a holiday hotel or on a ship as a solo traveller, you will not know the experience of being ostracised by couples - gay or straight. The fewer solos there are, the fewer people there are to talk to. It is just that many, and far from all, couples and families are relatively introverted. A solo-unfriendly policy has huge implications beyond cost for those who travel solo.

 

OK I am confused.

 

I have travelled solo on land and sea vacations.

 

I have travelled solo on 5 cruise lines including MSC.

 

The line with the lowest solo penalty was MSC and the line with the least solo friendly atmosphere is MSC. That said - I had a good time with couples.

 

JMO - with the hike in MSC pricing and the further hike in solo penalties, MSC product no longer represents value for money. Solution - I move on to other vacation choices.

 

Annie

[sidari]

The first cruiseline to actually build a ship that has at least one half deck of single cabins will never regret their choice.

[anniegb]

The first cruiseline to actually build a ship that has at least one half deck of single cabins will never regret their choice.

 

Will depend heavily on price and services offered.

 

Apparently on NCL the facilities/activities of the Epic solos lounge is open to all solos on the ship not just those occupying the studios. They have their own dedicated concierge etc

 

MSC are nowhere near that level of service - JMO.

 

Annie

[Katgoesonholiday]

For all that MSC says its family oriented, things aren't that rosy for those of us with kids either. Its fine if you have one or two kids but three is a problem. No cabin takes a family of five - not even the YC. We'd have to get two cabins and there are limited ones that have internal doors and these are over $6k each in NZD. None of my children are old enough to be in a cabin without an adult.

 

So the moral of the story is that anyone who wants to cruise should be partnered and must have no more than two young children.

 

This seems to be the target demographic - which seems a little daft as couples with two kids often are the ones with the least amount of disposable income for spending on board!

[papcx]

So that settles it then.

 

Solos - not welcome.

 

Family's (of 5 or more) - not wanted.

 

It would seem I'm perfectly placed for MSC. A couple, with disposable income. Shame I don't want them due to their poor customer service.

 

MSC is the largest cargo company in the world. I think they'll manage without any of us.

[AmoMondo]

 

MSC is the largest cargo company in the world. I think they'll manage without any of us.

 

So true!

[earn]

I can't fathom why they would not take bookings for solo travellers, but I know that when I go on a cruise with my husband and two sons we spend very little. We just don't drink that much and don't spend more than a few pounds on the slots. My spending profile would be the same, whether I was single or had no kids. I hope they don't in invent an algorithm that uses shared holiday company data to work out how much you spend on average and adjust your basic holiday cost accordingly! Then we would be done for. :p