Forbidden from disembarking in India

[bob278]

I think this is a good illustration that we should not even assume the cruise line knows everything. Technically, they should not have let him board since he was not legally entitled to enter India. It is more clear with airlines as they expect you to get off when you land, but I think the rule for airlines and cruise lines is you must be legally able to enter all countries on your itinerary in order to board.

 

In this case, Azamara check-in people either did not follow the rules or did not know that his business visa would not suffice. Many people failed him by not providing him with technical support/advice, but in the end, it was his responsibility to determine if he met all requirements. It was fortunate that he did not lose his entire cruise (and no insurance I have heard of would have reimbursed him for a loss based on lack of documentation).

 

We've all learned a lesson. He just paid a much higher price for it.

[LHT28]

I think this is a good illustration that we should not even assume the cruise line knows everything. Technically, they should not have let him board since he was not legally entitled to enter India. It is more clear with airlines as they expect you to get off when you land, but I think the rule for airlines and cruise lines is you must be legally able to enter all countries on your itinerary in order to board.

 

In this case, Azamara check-in people either did not follow the rules or did not know that his business visa would not suffice. Many people failed him by not providing him with technical support/advice, but in the end, it was his responsibility to determine if he met all requirements. It was fortunate that he did not lose his entire cruise (and no insurance I have heard of would have reimbursed him for a loss based on lack of documentation).

 

We've all learned a lesson. He just paid a much higher price for it.

 

He can still enjoy the cruise to the other ports

It is not like he will never be allowed off the ship

 

Not sure what Azamara has to do with it :confused:

[bob278]

He can still enjoy the cruise to the other ports

It is not like he will never be allowed off the ship

 

Not sure what Azamara has to do with it :confused:

 

I recognize that he is on the cruise and can enjoy all the sea days and other ports.

 

I'm not saying Azamara did anything wrong. My point is just that they didn't know the rules either. If they had, he would have at least been aware of the problem before the first Indian port (not that he could have resolved it). I think too many people depend on someone else to know the details of their individual condition. It's a case of not taking the ultimate responsibility for your self and letting others determine what you need.

 

The following is lifted directly off of Azamara's website (the bold text is my mark-up):

Getting documents and proof of vaccinations in order is an important task that will make it much easier for you to embark, disembark and move through customs, no matter where your voyage takes you.

Guests without appropriate documentation are subject to fines, and can be prevented from boarding airlines or ships, or disembarking in certain ports.

 

Azamara Club Cruises® requires guests to be personally responsible for bringing aboard all required documents, including passports, visas and proof of vaccinations. Azamara cannot be held responsible for fines, costs, penalties or interrupted or terminated trips due to a lack of proper documentation, nor can we offer refunds to guests who fail to comply with documentation requirements.

 

We can never know what questions the OP asked of what people, but, as theorized before, he may have been asked if he had a visa for India and said yes. If that happened, the failure was that the question and answer were not detailed enough. Hard to say whose "fault" that was but the responsibility falls on the OP.

 

Given Azamara's disclaimer, he could easily have been denied boarding thereby losing the entire cruise. That is why I said he was fortunate that all he has lost is the Indian ports (not an inconsequential thing, but not an entire cruise).

[LHT28]

 

I'm not saying Azamara did anything wrong. .

 

I must have missed something :confused:

 

I thought he was on Oceania since he posted here

[bob278]

I must have missed something :confused:

 

I thought he was on Oceania since he posted here

 

My bad. I have been embroiled in getting my Indian visas for our upcoming Azamara cruise in March and had them firmly embedded in my mind. Replace every reference to Azamara with Oceania and it reads more accurately. I still think blindly depending on any other entity (cruiseline, TA, etc.) is fraught with danger.

[qldtraveller]

Hi

Have been reading all this with great interest since we have been to India twice using Oceania and private tours.

Oceania has always issued documents(notice) to the wholesaler who passes onto the TA' s who notify us by e-mail that we need to get a Tourist Visa for India, Myanmar, Vietnam etc.

They even indicate no-one can board w/o Indian Visa.

Question is : the Oceania crew have to know what the look of a business visa and tourist visa is? No much difference in looks?

Why should a TA be responsible if info. Passed on?

Also some reading on entry requirements into India on the Internet helps as with other countries. Does not require a lot of time and application can be do on-line. And the process only requires a few days w/o passport.

We have the same notification from Oceania for some countries in Africa where visas are required.

The small print says you are responsible for obtaining the correct visa type for what one is doing not the cruise line or TA as you have to fill in the forms.

Never assume anything re : visas. Read and research s the things change from month to month.

[Hambagahle]

[font="Comic Sans MS"

 

I do remember that Immigration officials boarded in Dubai and sailed across to Mumbai, holding a day long affair where we all had to show our passports and other documents to be stamped. India is quite different in many ways![/font]

 

Not SO different Rickey 88 -

 

Whenever we have stopped in Key West the US immigration officials have boarded the ship and grilled the non-US passport holders before "granting them" entry. Even when my US passport holder husband came along with me (Swiss passport - me) HE got grilled too. And "Re-admitted" to his own country. The Indians are no different from the Americans. It is just that from your experience as an American (US that is) you see it differently..

[mbrjhabq]

But the program is not very clear. In most places, the e-visa discussion is tied to Visa on Arrival. And that program works only at nine airports in India and there is nowhere I can find that clearly states the new program is for entry everywhere. And here is the most clear statement I can find anywhere (and, believe me I've looked as we are on an Azamara cruise in March of next year).

 

This can be found at: https://indianvisaonline.gov.in/visa/tvoa.html and then on Instructions for Applicant

 

Instructions for Tourist Visa on Arrival (Enabled by ETA)

1. Applicants of the eligible countries may apply online minimum 4 days in advance of the date of arrival with a window of 30 days. Example : If you are applying on 1st Sept then applicant can select arrival date from 5th Sept to 4th Oct.

2. Recent front facing photograph with white background and photo page of Passport containing personal details like name,date of birth, nationality , expiry date etc. to be uploaded by the applicant. The application is liable to be rejected if the uploaded document and photograph are not clear and as per specification.

3. Tourist visa on arrival (TVoA) fee is US$ 60/- per passenger excluding interchange charge for credit/debit cards.The fee must be paid 4 days before the expected date of travel filled by you otherwise application will not be processed.

4. TVoA fee once submitted is non refundable.

5. Applicant should carry a copy of ETA along with him/her at the time of travel.

6. Biometric details of the applicant will be mandatorily captured at Immigration on arrival in India.

7. The validity of visa will be 30 days from the date of arrival in India.

8. Electronic Travel Authorisation (ETA) is valid for entry through 9 designated Airports i.e. Bangalore,Chennai,Cochin,Delhi ,Goa, Hyderabad,Kolkata,Mumbai & Trivandrum .

9. This facility is in addition to the existing Visa services.

10. Tourist Visa On Arrival (TVoA) is allowed for a maximum of two visits in a calendar year.

11. Tourist Visa On Arrival (TVoA) once issued on arrival is non-extendable , non-convertible & not valid for visiting Protected/Restricted and Cantonment Areas.

12. Applicants can track the status of their application online by clicking visa status.

13. For any assistance call 24 * 7 Visa support center at +91-11-24300666 or send email to

indiatvoa@gov.in

 

Notice that item 8 indicates this is only good for people arriving at an airport. And this is the only place among many sites I've searched that talks much at all about ETA.

Hi. My wife and I are cruising on the Ryndam from Venice to Singapore (departing 8/3), with 3 ports of call in India. In Holland America's case, their suggested visa service is CIBT. A call to their help number revealed that they don't know whether or not cruise passengers can use the e-Tourist visa -- and, not surprisingly, they suggest getting the "regular" visa through them, which entails mailing in our passports, which makes us very nervous and puts us in a bit of a timing jam, since we need our passports for an 8/15-22 cruise to Canada.

I, too, found the Indian government e-Tourist visa site, though I didn't go on to the specific instructions in the application once I saw that the last step in the outline of the application process was "Fly to India". I have, however, sent an email to the e-Tourist help/customer service address asking whether (and, if so, how) cruise passengers can avail ourselves of the e-Tourist visa. I'll re-post if and when I get a reply.

[Tansy Mews]

Just be aware that things may be different depending which passport you hold.

[rallydave]

Your cruise dates appear to overlap so think you need to look at the dates and correct them since you can't be in two places at the same time. If you need the India Visa for this August, not sure of how but, appears you might need to go to the India Consulate in person to get your Visa. Otherwise any emergency Visa agency should be able to help you. You don't have to use the hal recommended agency, any one that gets you the visa will work.

 

Reading the quoted material in your post very clearly states your electronic visa is only valid at airports, sincerely doubt hal will allow you to board with that visa. Personally I wouldn't gamble on the electronic Visa and would be scrambling at this point depending on the actual dates.

 

Good luck,

Edited July 9, 2015 by rallydave

[mbrjhabq]

Oops. The Venice-to-Singapore cruise departs 10/3, not 8/3. We need to hold onto our passports until after the Canadian cruise 8/15-8/22 (with a couple of nights in Montreal after disembarking). That would then leave us with only about 5 weeks to get our India tourist visa. I agree that the e-Tourist instructions don't sound very promising with respect to being able to use an e-Tourist visa on a cruise.

[PaulMCO]

Hi. My wife and I are cruising on the Ryndam from Venice to Singapore (departing 8/3), with 3 ports of call in India. In Holland America's case, their suggested visa service is CIBT. A call to their help number revealed that they don't know whether or not cruise passengers can use the e-Tourist visa -- and, not surprisingly, they suggest getting the "regular" visa through them, which entails mailing in our passports, which makes us very nervous and puts us in a bit of a timing jam, since we need our passports for an 8/15-22 cruise to Canada.

I, too, found the Indian government e-Tourist visa site, though I didn't go on to the specific instructions in the application once I saw that the last step in the outline of the application process was "Fly to India". I have, however, sent an email to the e-Tourist help/customer service address asking whether (and, if so, how) cruise passengers can avail ourselves of the e-Tourist visa. I'll re-post if and when I get a reply.

 

 

Please read the terms. E-Visa does not apply to most CRUISES.. Further most cruises stop at several ports -- meaning you need a multiple entry visa. ENTRY is only permitted at an airport!!!

 

Quote from the site ---

eTV is valid for entry through 9 designated Airports i.e. Bengaluru,Chennai,Cochin,Delhi ,Goa, Hyderabad,Kolkata,Mumbai & Trivandrum .However, the foreigner can take exit from any of the authorized Immigration Check Posts (ICPs) in India.

 

Use CIBT -- they are a good VISA service. This is the Company that O uses and they give excellent instructions... I would suggest you stop procrastinating and do it NOW before your next cruise. They can do this in 2 weeks with expeditious processing. INDIA requires a lot of papers plus photos etc...

Edited July 9, 2015 by PaulMCO

[Tansy Mews]

Oops. The Venice-to-Singapore cruise departs 10/3, not 8/3. We need to hold onto our passports until after the Canadian cruise 8/15-8/22 (with a couple of nights in Montreal after disembarking). That would then leave us with only about 5 weeks to get our India tourist visa. I agree that the e-Tourist instructions don't sound very promising with respect to being able to use an e-Tourist visa on a cruise.

 

We used CIBT and it took just under 3 weeks to get the visa. They do ask you about your timelines.

 

We (Canadians) had to fill in a form online plus a few pages of a checklist and print it all. The checklist pages had to be signed too (Says it is only for Toronto, but if your form has them, be sure to sign them.) Of course we needed passport photos.

 

O told us to use the port agent and they supplied the information. There is another thread about Indian visas (I think on the roll call and I posted the info.)

 

You could do all the busy work before you need your passport for Canada and then send it in as soon as you get back home. If you can get to one of the visa agent offices, they will look through it to make sure you have it right.

Edited July 9, 2015 by Tansy Mews

[sanmyn]

I am an American from San Francisco, retired and living in Thailand. I visited the India Embassy in Bangkok to get an India Visa. After filling out all the paperwork and spending the day, they informed me that Visas were only issued for arrivals by air. I am booked on Insignia from Dubai to Singapore. I was told I would either have to apply in India or my home country. Fortunately I still have current utility bills from my SF condo and was able to use a SF Visa Service to get the Visa. I feel that Oceania was derelict in not disclosing this, as without that utility bill I would have lost the cruise fare along with my air and hotel reservations. I much later received an Oceania notice that I could not board without that Visa. Gary Hacker (sanmyn@yahoo.com)

[SellaVee]

I do understand your frustration regarding obtaining the visa but I wonder if it's realistic to expect a cruise line to know the rules for every single passenger's circumstances. I'd also suspect that there is a small print that says visas are the responsibility of the passenger - unless you're on a world cruise where I believe Oceania uses CIBT to provide visas.

 

Perhaps it is reasonable to expect a travel agent or cruise line to mention visas upfront before the cruise is booked (IN LARGE PRINT) so that everyone knows the score. I'd no idea you had to be in your home country to apply for a certain visa until I had to get one for China, which has the same rule as India.

 

Visas are a bit of a minefield and I think your post provides a useful warning.

 

Did you use a travel agent?

[sanmyn]

Sellavee, I agree that cruise lines cannot keep up with all the Visa requirements. BUT, I just figured that I could always read a book by the pool and stay on the Ship.

Then long after my problem surfaced, Oceania sends me a large framed email announcement that nobody boards without an India Visa. Now that should have been made clear and with all the India Visa problems, I would not have booked that cruise.

I was lucky. I had a Stateside address. If not, I would have lost not only my cruise fare, but my airfare and hotel cost.

Oceania should have made a full disclosure.

Azamara would have been on top of that.

Gary H.

[sanmyn]

SellaVee, I enjoy your postings; very informative. I wrote you a long reply. It must have got lost somewhere high in the clouds. My only problem with Oceania is that I feel they should have disclosed to me early: 1) that getting an India Visa can be difficult for foreigners living in Asia and 2) that you can not board without that Visa.

[Giacomo 1]

I fall in the camp that the TA should have known what was needed to disembark in India and everywhere else the OP's cruise lands.

 

In a world where it's rather easy to make your own travel plans, a TA has to go the extra mile for their customers and have all bases covered for you, most especially proper documentation! That personal service is what you pay for. This is their profession, it's not ours, and they should know, or have the ability to find out the rules for any given trip anywhere in the world. Is that really so difficult?

 

We booked our cruise through Oceania, and I'm glad we did. They have been very professional and thorough in every respect, and notified us that we needed Visas for Turkey and they secured them for us well ahead of our departure.

[rallydave]

I fall in the camp that the TA should have known what was needed to disembark in India and everywhere else the OP's cruise lands.

 

In a world where it's rather easy to make your own travel plans, a TA has to go the extra mile for their customers and have all bases covered for you, most especially proper documentation! That personal service is what you pay for. This is their profession, it's not ours, and they should know, or have the ability to find out the rules for any given trip anywhere in the world. Is that really so difficult?

 

We booked our cruise through Oceania, and I'm glad we did. They have been very professional and thorough in every respect, and notified us that we needed Visas for Turkey and they secured them for us well ahead of our departure.

 

Sorry but, have to disagree with your comment that the TA should have known everything regarding the cruisers Visa requirements and how to get the visa. Every cruise we have been on and that includes most current cruise lines and some that no longer exist clearly state "it is the customers responsibility to get the proper visas/documents for every port on the cruise". Much as it is difficult for a cruise line to cover every eventuality such as a citizen one country living in another and every combination thereof, this is exaserbated by the many different bookings and types the TA makes. The cruise line is bringing from 500 to 5000 people to those ports while the TA may be booking 2 to 10 people on any particular cruise.

 

Afraid this is similar to many of the young people who take no personal responsibility, blame others for their failings and have to get participation trophies so as to not affect their self-esteem.

 

Yes, it is nice when the TA or the cruise line goes the extra yard to take care of every eventuality but, it is ultimately the cruisers responsibility to have the correct paperwork to board the ship. With us in the internet age, answers to almost every question is readily available and people need to read and understand all of the terms and conditions and receipts they receive and if they have questions, ask them here, to their TA or directly to the cruise line.

 

Every case is different and can't expect anyone to know the requirements for every situation.

[LHT28]

I am an American from San Francisco, retired and living in Thailand. I visited the India Embassy in Bangkok to get an India Visa. After filling out all the paperwork and spending the day, they informed me that Visas were only issued for arrivals by air. I am booked on Insignia from Dubai to Singapore. I was told I would either have to apply in India or my home country. Fortunately I still have current utility bills from my SF condo and was able to use a SF Visa Service to get the Visa. I feel that Oceania was derelict in not disclosing this, as without that utility bill I would have lost the cruise fare along with my air and hotel reservations. I much later received an Oceania notice that I could not board without that Visa. Gary Hacker (sanmyn@yahoo.com)

 

Did you read your contract with the cruise line?

 

It is the Guest’s sole responsibility to obtain and have available when necessary the appropriate valid travel documents, including without limitation, passports, visas, proof of citizenship, re-entry permits, minor’s permissions, medical certificates and all other documents necessary for ports of call in the countries to which Guest will travel. We reserve the right to consider this Ticket Contract as canceled and the applicable fare forfeited if You do not use this Ticket Contract for the Ship or other Ships substituted, or land arrangements for the date mentioned, for Your failure to bring proper travel and/or health documents as required, or should this Ticket Contract become lost or mislaid, or if You use this Ticket Contract for only part of the voyage or tour indicated hereon, for any reason, whether or not due to causes beyond Your control.

Edited August 4, 2015 by LHT28

[LHT28]

They have been very professional and thorough in every respect, and notified us that we needed Visas for Turkey and they secured them for us well ahead of our departure.

You can get this online at 1/2 the price ;)

[hypercafe]

I was waiting for someone to brake out the cruise contract. As to it the line can do anything they want to you with no liability and if the ship sinks its probably the passengers fault. What is talked about here is just giving a person a heads up to avoid a bad situation.

[rallydave]

I was waiting for someone to brake out the cruise contract. As to it the line can do anything they want to you with no liability and if the ship sinks its probably the passengers fault. What is talked about here is just giving a person a heads up to avoid a bad situation.

 

Wondering what type of heads up you mean?? I just checked our next cruise documents which is about a year away and we got notifications contained on both invoices, one from the TA and the other from the Cruise Line. Am confident that this is done by all cruise lines as well as TA's.

 

The requirements are clearly stated on both invoices and sure the OP had the same information. If you are talking about specific information that covers people of every natinality and place of residence, as I stated in a previous post, the possibilities are endless as was identified by the OP stating that he could have gotten his visa in Thailand but, only for arrival by plane. A simple solution for that would have been for the OP to have purchased a fully refundable airline ticket, send in that information with his visa request and once the visa was in his passport, simply cancel the flight for a full refund and get on the ship with the requisite visa.

 

Information is provided for all cruise line guests and they simply need to read all the information provided so he and others do get a heads up.

[Giacomo 1]

We trust our doctors for our medical care, our accountants to do our taxes, and financial advisors to take care of our money, our dentists to take care of our teeth, our plumbers to fix our pipes, etc. etc.. So it goes with our TA's.

 

We trust them because they are the experts in their fields. We as individuals cannot be expected to know their jobs, just as we wouldn't expect them to know ours. They should take pride in what they do, just as I'm sure you take pride in what you do, and if they don't you need to move on and find somebody that does.

 

As for the fine print, do you honestly read it all? Of course not, who has the time or can stay awake long enough to finish it? You trust to a great degree.

 

The following quote has absolutely nothing to do with this conversation. :confused:

 

Afraid this is similar to many of the young people who take no personal responsibility, blame others for their failings and have to get participation trophies so as to not affect their self-esteem.

 

Have you never been upset with somebody that didn't do there job right? You just accept the blame for their failings?

[Giacomo 1]

You can get this online at 1/2 the price ;)

 

Yeah, I hear you.

 

But honestly, I'm just happy that they pro's and they notified us that we needed them. I'm sure the OP of this thread would have been happy to pay more had he been notified!:)