How old of a ship is too old?

[miketheExbaker]

I was wondering how everyone felt about cruising on older ships. I know they go into dry dock for refurbishment every so often, and there are beautiful 20+ year old ships. But when do ou try to steer clear of the boat because it hasn't been in dry dock for say.... 5,6,7 years?

[LHT28]

There are some ships 40+ yrs old that are still in good condition

 

depends on how they are maintained

 

BTW Oceania ships go in every 3 yrs ;)

Edited February 17, 2015 by LHT28

[chengkp75]

I was wondering how everyone felt about cruising on older ships. I know they go into dry dock for refurbishment every so often, and there are beautiful 20+ year old ships. But when do ou try to steer clear of the boat because it hasn't been in dry dock for say.... 5,6,7 years?

 

It is a requirement of classification societies that all ships are inspected twice within 5 years. Newer ships can do an "in water" survey of underwater areas, negating the need for "drydocking" or shipyard periods for the intermediate period. So these newer ships are required to drydock every 5 years. Older ships, once they reach 15 years, must drydock twice in 5 years. So, the older the ship, the more frequent the drydock is required. In between the drydockings, and as part of the intermediate surveys for younger ships, the class societies inspect all equipment, structure (hull), and safety procedures as part of the annual survey. These classification societies are the "insurance underwriters" of the maritime business. Without your class certificate, you cannot obtain insurance for the ship, and you cannot renew your ship's certificate of registry (think a car's title). So, if you don't pass class survey, you don't sail.

 

Now, if you mean "refurbishments" to passenger areas as "drydocking", then yes, some ships can go a while between these, but the ship usually will do "refreshing" of limited areas (new carpet, upholstery, etc., based on doing the worst first) while the ship is still in service.

[Hlitner]

Much depends on your point of view. If you want a huge glitzy newer ship then you do not want an old ship. But some of us long time cruisers love the older ships since they have lots of character and do not waste space on some of the newer amenities designed to generate more onboard revenue. One of our favorite ships is HAL's Prinsendam which was actually built in 1988. And even this is not all that old when compared to ships like the Marco Polo (still cruising in Europe) that was built in 1965.

 

We would find either of these ships much more desirable then something like the Oasis of the Seas (which DW wanted to name the Monstrosity of the Seas).

 

Hank

Edited February 18, 2015 by Hlitner

[miketheExbaker]

Yeah i was kind of thinking more like looks wise. Roughed up furniture, dirty worn carpet, gross mattresses, wear and tear/outdated looks. I have always had a blind faith that the ship is safe...

[lisiamc]

It is a requirement of classification societies that all ships are inspected twice within 5 years. Newer ships can do an "in water" survey of underwater areas, negating the need for "drydocking" or shipyard periods for the intermediate period. So these newer ships are required to drydock every 5 years. Older ships, once they reach 15 years, must drydock twice in 5 years. So, the older the ship, the more frequent the drydock is required. In between the drydockings, and as part of the intermediate surveys for younger ships, the class societies inspect all equipment, structure (hull), and safety procedures as part of the annual survey. These classification societies are the "insurance underwriters" of the maritime business. Without your class certificate, you cannot obtain insurance for the ship, and you cannot renew your ship's certificate of registry (think a car's title). So, if you don't pass class survey, you don't sail.

 

Now, if you mean "refurbishments" to passenger areas as "drydocking", then yes, some ships can go a while between these, but the ship usually will do "refreshing" of limited areas (new carpet, upholstery, etc., based on doing the worst first) while the ship is still in service.

 

Thanks for this - very informative and interesting!

[chengkp75]

Yeah i was kind of thinking more like looks wise. Roughed up furniture, dirty worn carpet, gross mattresses, wear and tear/outdated looks. I have always had a blind faith that the ship is safe...

 

The thing is, while the ship is in drydock, she isn't generating revenue, and there are no guests, so the lines utilize this time to refurbish the guest areas. The main line cruises realize their demographic requires the guest areas not to look seedy. Sometimes, when a ship gets to around 20+ years, the class inspections require quite a lot of time (money) and steel renewals (money), so they will sell them to other lines that have a different demographic and a different profit structure. These lines sometimes go a bit longer between refurbishments.

[miketheExbaker]

The thing is, while the ship is in drydock, she isn't generating revenue, and there are no guests, so the lines utilize this time to refurbish the guest areas. The main line cruises realize their demographic requires the guest areas not to look seedy. Sometimes, when a ship gets to around 20+ years, the class inspections require quite a lot of time (money) and steel renewals (money), so they will sell them to other lines that have a different demographic and a different profit structure. These lines sometimes go a bit longer between refurbishments.

 

 

Interesting, something to think about! Thank You!

[fishywood]

Virtually every ship goes no more than three years between routine drydocks.

 

As for major refitting and additions to public areas on the ship...they are in no way a panacea to stop aging and maintain competitiveness with the new floating amusement park/shopping mall hybrids. It is far more important for ships to modernize what you don't see, such as the galleys and the passenger services infrastructure. Example: Royal Caribbean just spent millions on upgrading their circa 15 year old Vision Class ships with additional cabins, bars and restaurants and other new revenue opportunities. But they did not increase the crew capacity of those ships, which two different officers confirmed to me has necessitated a reduction in hours and menu of all the non-upcharge food service, as well as severely curtailing hours and staffing of the shore excursions desk even though the promised interactive booking system was not installed.

 

The first generation of mega-ships (though hardly "mega" by today's standards) are now over 15 years old. Princess' Grand-class ships, while showing some of the quirks of age, are still more than adequately maintained. While the RCI Sovereign-class ships--larger and better laid-out than the Vision-class referenced above--are soon to be history, the last one's transfer to a budget European line now set to happen. Which makes me wonder if this "only the newest is good enough for me" attitude is strictly North American, as many Europe and Australia-based lines are almost entirely composed of "recycled" ships transferred from the "big three" corporations.

 

And Holland America is doing just fine with a fleet that includes seven (to be reduced from nine late this year) ships of twenty year-old vintage. Yes, they still have DVD players rather than on-demand movies in the cabins, but no ship sails without 21st century safety and security for its passengers--even the ones who prefer the old-fashioned comfort and service of ships with larger cabins and less over-the-top flash than the newest generation.

Edited February 18, 2015 by fishywood

[fishywood]

Yeah i was kind of thinking more like looks wise. Roughed up furniture, dirty worn carpet, gross mattresses, wear and tear/outdated looks. I have always had a blind faith that the ship is safe...

 

OK while I was taking the time to compose my long-winded post above you responded with this, revealing your real concern is routine maintenance which actually has little if anything to do with the age of the ship or how often it is drydocked :confused:

 

Furniture, carpet and mattresses are routinely repaired and replaced on turnaround days and even long port calls.

Painting, varnishing and deep cleaning of fixtures goes on all night, every night.

If you are reading reports here that the above is not being done up to snuff on a certain ship, it is the behind-the-scenes maintenance crew (mainly their supervisors) of that particular ship that is to blame.

 

As for outdated looks...that is a risk taken by the lines that prefer to decorate their ships like an artsy-fartsy boutique hotel rather than a ship, the classical decor of which never goes out of style.

Edited February 18, 2015 by fishywood

[cb at sea]

How old is too old for an airplane? Most of them are 30+ years!!!!

 

It's all about the "upkeep"!

[CruiserBruce]

How old is too old for an airplane? Most of them are 30+ years!!!!

 

It's all about the "upkeep"!

 

I doubt it is "most" (implying a good number over 50%), but it is a surprising number.

Edited February 18, 2015 by CruiserBruce

[cruisemainiac]

I think a reasonable measure is a ship is too old when it stops floating. ;)

[zqvol]

I was wondering how everyone felt about cruising on older ships. I know they go into dry dock for refurbishment every so often, and there are beautiful 20+ year old ships. But when do ou try to steer clear of the boat because it hasn't been in dry dock for say.... 5,6,7 years?

 

 

Ships are required to go into drydock about every 3 years. You will never find a ship that has gone 5 years between drydocks.

 

The oldest and nicest ship that I have been on is 30 years old, and I don't hesitate to sail that ship.