DSC cannot be removed onboard anymore

[spidybabe]

I'm ok with this. We never remove them, and wouldn't. It's such a small amount. I understand your argument about not knowing if it goes to the crew or not. They aren't under the protection of American labor laws, or the protection of a union. What NCL does with the money is not my concern. That may sound harsh, but it's true .. and I honestly don't care. They state it's a gratuity, which is made abundantly clear by offering "free gratuities" as a perk on their own website. I pay it. That's all I need to know. As for the double dipping, I resolved that by not dining in their speciality restaurants.

 

DITTO

Very well said!

Safe sailing

[watchdiva]

Have never/would never remove DSC, tips, etc. If I don't like the policies of a particular cruise line I don't sail on them. I find it hilarious the number of pax who say when I get onboard "I'm going to do this and I'm going to that" every time something changes that they do not like. If you don't like how they do business you have many other cruise lines to do business with. Wish NCL would make the DSC mandatory and roll the cost into the ticket price.

Edited September 13, 2015 by watchdiva

[phoenix1181]

I'm happy they've made the change. It's time those who remove the DSC have to put some effort into getting a refund. After all, the people they're taking it away from certainly work hard enough for it!

 

If I remember correctly, when a customer files a credit card dispute, the reason for a chargeback (credit to customer, debit to merchant) was generally for non receipt of the goods or services. It will be interesting to hear how MasterCard & Visa handle a DSC dispute. How will people satisfactorily explain what service they didn't receive?

[jingle5616]

The DSC is only a device for the cruise line to advertise the cruise at a lower price than what it actually costs.

 

I've never taken a DSC off my bill, and I generally tip my room steward extra for his/her hard work. However, if I had a big problem, I do want to reserve the ability to take that money away for cause. And I don't want to email the crappy shore-side customer service in Miami to do it. It has been utter awful for the 20 years that I've cruised with NCL. The newest regime is only a continuation of bad. The ship service has always allowed me to simply use a travel agent and ignore the rude, poorly trained personnel that I've come across over the years.

 

In any event, I don't see myself cruising with NCL after my coming Alaska cruise next week. They have irritated me to the point of not wanting to do business with them anymore. Lot's of choices when it comes to Vacation and NCL has violated the 1st rule of hospitality. "Don't **** with someones Vacation." :eek: That's just me.

Edited September 13, 2015 by jingle5616

[Snowrose]

NCL (all cruise lines) should just list the price of the cruise inclusive of DSC charges (same way they list tax and port charges) and be done with this whole mess. No tipping required and employees of NCL are contracted for a set rate. If you want to tip above that its up to you but tipping would not ever be mentioned other than "tipping is not required"

 

I definitely agree with that as it would mean the crew would be paid a more fair wage, and it also means that tipping would go back to what it should be - a way to reward exemplary service rather than just an addition to a meager wage.

 

Interestingly, last month I saw this article about a restaurant that dropped tipping and actually saw their profits increase. NCL could learn a lot from that.

 

Restaurant Sees Profits Triple

[LoveyHowell]

It is true. Also, Solo DSC going to $18.95 per day.

 

You heard it here first.

[maywell]

I'm happy they've made the change. It's time those who remove the DSC have to put some effort into getting a refund. After all, the people they're taking it away from certainly work hard enough for it!

 

If I remember correctly, when a customer files a credit card dispute, the reason for a chargeback (credit to customer, debit to merchant) was generally for non receipt of the goods or services. It will be interesting to hear how MasterCard & Visa handle a DSC dispute. How will people satisfactorily explain what service they didn't receive?

 

Exactly - I can see getting a refund the 1st time around but 2nd, 3rd, 4th, etc times you sail on same line with the same exact issue? That's called a pattern and the credit card company is going to noticed. Like I said - karma, simply the best catch-22 that can happen to a cheapskate; either fill out the form and wait for the refund ~or~ dispute with your credit card every time.Perfect - I want to know who in NCL thought that one up, they deserved credit for that one.

[SuiteCruiser]

The DSC has never gone directly in the pocket of the crew, so that is nothing new. NCL uses it to pay it's staff, provide their healthcare, parties and other incentives.

 

If people removed their DSCs in the past, it went down as a black mark against the staff member who caused the issue. Too many of those and you're out of a job.

 

I hope what PokerPro is saying is real as I think people need to consider these charges as part of their cruise fare, just as people have to pay resort fees at most "happening" hotels.

Edited September 13, 2015 by SuiteCruiser

[SuiteCruiser]

This falls under the following statement..........."If you can't afford to tip you can't afford to eat out" The term TIPS stands for "To Ensure Proper Service". It is not a reward for good service after the fact. I actually give my steward a tip on the first day and then I tip him/her more on the last day if his service warrants it. By tipping at the start I ALWAYS get excellent service. People that want the DSC removed are people that are always trying to "game" the system. I has nothing to do with good vs bad service.

 

The To Insure Proper Service thing is an old wives tale, it isn't true.

[NLH Arizona]

The DSC has never gone directly in the pocket of the crew, so that is nothing new. NCL uses it to pay it's staff, provide their healthcare, parties and other incentives.

 

If people removed their DSCs in the past, it went down as a black mark against the staff member who caused the issue. Too many of those and you're out of a job.

 

I hope what PokerPro is saying is real as I think people need to consider these charges as part of their cruise fare, just as people have to pay resort fees at most "happening" hotels.

Hope it is real as well, because it won't be a black mark for the crew, but also NCL will be able to keep track on who is a serial remover.

[SuiteCruiser]

Hope it is real as well, because it won't be a black mark for the crew, but also NCL will be able to keep track on who is a serial remover.

 

That would be amazing data to have!

[SuiteCruiser]

... and do what with that information?? :confused:

 

Make sure future stewards and other staff don't have black marks against them, knowing the person is just a DB?

[LoveyHowell]

The term TIPS stands for "To Insure Proper Service". It is not a reward for good service after the fact..

 

http://www.snopes.com/language/acronyms/tip.asp

 

It's ensure, not insure.

[Sauer-kraut]

It is true. Also, Solo DSC going to $18.95 per day.

 

You heard it here first.

 

What!?!? Why would a solo cruiser pay what a suite guest pays? :eek::mad:

[LoveyHowell]

What!?!? Why would a solo cruiser pay what a suite guest pays? :eek::mad:

 

Solos not paying their weight into the pool as ships are built with more solo cabins, solo lounge, group coordinator, etc. I did read solos will get some more amenities/luxuries, but there you have it. $18.95 per solo, per day.

[DebJ14]

If this is going to be NCL's new policy, I think it is long overdue! For years folks have "gamed" the system by encouraging and teaching some how to stiff the crew. There are literally hundreds of posts out here of folks claiming "if NCL didn't want us to remove the DSC anytime for any reason, they wouldn't allow it. And they can change the rules if they don't want it to happen". Well, NCL listened! NCL always said you could adjust the DSC if you brought an issue to their attention and they couldn't correct it. Many chose to just lower/delete it because they could. Now you might have to work for it. Good for NCL!!!

As to this being proof that NCL never gave the money to the employee's, this proves nothing of that at all. Any time I've worked with people on commissions or advance draws, you can collect your "normal" pay and if you don't make as much in commission as you thought, they reclaim it next billing cycle.

NCL made a good move IMO.

Thank you NCL!!!:D;)

 

I could not have said it better myself!

[rochelle_s]

This falls under the following statement..........."If you can't afford to tip you can't afford to eat out" The term TIPS stands for "To Insure Proper Service". It is not a reward for good service after the fact. I actually give my steward a tip on the first day and then I tip him/her more on the last day if his service warrants it. By tipping at the start I ALWAYS get excellent service. People that want the DSC removed are people that are always trying to "game" the system. I has nothing to do with good vs bad service.

 

Just clarifying;

 

The word “tip” is often inaccurately claimed to be an acronym for terms such as “to insure prompt service”, “to insure proper service”, “to improve performance”, and “to insure promptness”. However, this etymology contradicts the Oxford English Dictionary and is probably an example of a backronym. Moreover, most of these backronyms incorrectly require the word “insure” instead of the correct “ensure”.

 

source

 

 

Rochelle

[triptolemus]

Just clarifying;

 

The word “tip” is often inaccurately claimed to be an acronym for terms such as “to insure prompt service”, “to insure proper service”, “to improve performance”, and “to insure promptness”. However, this etymology contradicts the Oxford English Dictionary and is probably an example of a backronym. Moreover, most of these backronyms incorrectly require the word “insure” instead of the correct “ensure”.

 

source

 

Well... don't let facts get in the way of someone's huge bold and italic post!

[EyeSeaEwe]

Not so fast.

 

This "rebate" situation makes it fairly clear that your DSC does NOT directly land in the hands of the hardworking NCL crew.

 

Why?

 

Because you have 30 days from the end of your cruise to submit the form, and it takes them another 2 weeks to profit it -- which means that 44 days can pass since the cruise before a refund is issued.

 

So how would that work for employees? Do they reach into their wallets and take the "tips" back?

 

Obviously not.

 

This new policy pretty much clarifies exactly what I always suspected:

 

The DSC simply reimburses/subsidizes NCL's payment of employees, and raising it or lowering it does not affect their pay.

 

If you think I'm wrong, explain how they can retroactive remove tips that are opted out of 30 days after the cruise. Some of those employees may not even be working for NCL at that point!

 

 

You are ASSuming that the DSF is paid immediately to the crew and staff. That is a poor assumption.

[EyeSeaEwe]

Read what I wrote above.

 

DSC is not tips.

 

DSC goes directly to NCL, and doesn't affect employee compensation. This policy change confirms it.

 

 

No it does not. It has bearing on the allocation of the DSC what so ever.

[EyeSeaEwe]

NCL (all cruise lines) should just list the price of the cruise inclusive of DSC charges (same way they list tax and port charges) and be done with this whole mess. No tipping required and employees of NCL are contracted for a set rate. If you want to tip above that its up to you but tipping would not ever be mentioned other than "tipping is not required"

 

Then I could just sit back and enjoy my cruise .....er I mean reading cruise critic.

 

-Sean

 

As it is not tipping is not required.

[Gig103]

In my opinion, if it is not longer optional, then the published rate should include it, like on Regent.

[Guest phd1003]

In my opinion, if it is not longer optional, then the published rate should include it, like on Regent.

 

It is optional - just not immediate

[triptolemus]

It is optional - just not immediate

 

This is the rub for the typical American consumer who requires instant gratification.

[pokerpro5]

I don't know why people keep making up scenarios where NCL deducts from staff's future paychecks if people remove the DSC 30+ days after they get back. A lot of reaching is going on here.

 

Let's face it -- the DSC is not a tip, has never been a tip, and we have been misled for a long time about it. It's a clever pricing trick NCL (and plenty of other lines) use to make their base fares lower, and to guilt people away from removing that extra portion of the fare. If you think you are deducting from NCL, you might say, "Screw the big corporation" and do it. If you think you are deducting from low-earning, hardworking staff members, you want to leave it in place. Psychology 101, people. That's why NCL is so evasive about how the DSC is distributed -- because the truth would result in a lot more removals of it.

 

Given this new piece of information -- along with the DOUBLE increase of DSC within a few months -- I would be absolutely shocked if DSC removals/additions affected staff pay.

 

So for those of you patting yourselves on the back, believing that keeping the DSC "supports the hardworking crew" or "helps them pay bills", you are living in dreamland. When you pay the DSC, you are padding NCL's pockets, and no one else's.

 

With that said, I am going to leave the DSC in place due to this new policy. I still object to being hit with a double service charge for dining in the specialties, but I'm not going to adjust the DSC because I don't want the Miami office black-marking my account in any way for the future.

 

I assume this recent change was simply to make it tougher on those wishing to remove the DSC, but I am also a bit concerned that this will also be used for "negative marketing" purposes, so I want to stay away from that.

 

So well played, NCL. You win this round!

 

Oh, and don't bother disputing this with your credit card company. NCL is on good legal footing on this one, and will win the dispute. And if you get lucky and win (probably from NCL failing to respond in time), they can ban you from the cruise line for retroactively taking back fare. So this is not a good idea at all.

Edited September 13, 2015 by pokerpro5