Carnival Weirdness...

[Taters]

We are booked on the Miracle for a 13 day Journeys cruise to the Mexican Riviera on 1/31/2016. That is just 56 days away. Out itinerary includes Ixtapa/Zihuatanejo.

 

Zihuatanejo is a tender port that utilizes the Municipal Pier for dropping guests off. This pier was damaged in a storm in the spring of 2014 and has not been repaired. No cruise ships have called on Ixtapa/Zihuatanejo in all of 2015 due to safety issues. The city of Zihuatanejo has stated that they will repair the pier in 2016/2017, but there are no definite plans in place that I've been able to find.

 

Yet! Carnival still insists that we are going there. Ixtapa/Zihuatanejo is still on our itinerary. There are no excursions to book. The message that you get when you click on the excursions for this port is, "We are still scheduling shore excursions for this port."

 

Several of us have asked John Heald if we are going. His response to me was that he will look into it and get back to me. That was a few months ago and I never heard anything back. His response to others on our sailing has been that we will be going to Ixtapa/Zihuatanejo.

 

Carnival says that we are going.

 

Holland America and NCL ships that were scheduled changed their itineraries.

 

I will repeat that no ships have called there in 2015. I know we are not going there.

 

I personally think it may be a marketing ploy - Ixtapa/Zihuatanejo does sound exotic and lovely. The ship is sold out. The day we are supposed to be there is February 7th - Superbowl Sunday. I think they are going to give us another day at sea and sell lots of beer on board. JMHO

 

Really - I don't care whether we go there or not... I will be on a cruise on my favorite ship with some awesome friends! It will be warm and sunny and I will have a ball!

 

However, to drag this thing out like this when the port is closed to cruise ship tendering is just weird. Do they really want people that are NOT aware we are not going there having a fit? Are they going to wait for us to be on board to tell us that we are not going? I've only missed ports due to weather or mechanical issues. Some passengers get up in arms when this happens. I roll with it, but my trust in Carnival has certainly been diminished in this situation.

 

Has anyone else encountered anything like this before?

 

Thanks!

Edited December 6, 2015 by Taters

[ferfoodle]

Unless a miracle (no pun intended), you already know you won't make that port. I don't think that Carnival is maliciously not cancelling it early though. The Amsterdam was scheduled to call there this coming Saturday and the passengers were notified just a few days prior to sailing the port was cancelled. Perhaps Carnival is just hoping it will be ready by then....

 

Anyway, link to the roll call for Amsterdam that mentions the above on last page of it:

 

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=2134315&page=12

[sanmarcosman]

Carnival waited until the day we boarded the Spirit to inform us we would be going to Mazatlan as scheduled. This was during the troubles there and there was much discussion here whether we would port there or not. My example is not about a pier being out of order but it does reflect a history of Carnival's penchant for taking a wait and see attitude generally.

Have a fun time on the Miracle, she's a good ship as you know.

[Taters]

Thanks for the replies. I would understand them dragging their feet if there was hope for a resolution prior to our scheduled arrival date, but there is not. Sigh... I guess I am just frustrated with Carnival not acknowledging the problem to the passengers at all. Their claim that we will be calling on the port as scheduled is annoying and unprofessional.

 

Thanks for letting me rant. Much appreciated.

[Lil2Angelic]

Thanks for the replies. I would understand them dragging their feet if there was hope for a resolution prior to our scheduled arrival date, but there is not. Sigh... I guess I am just frustrated with Carnival not acknowledging the problem to the passengers at all. Their claim that we will be calling on the port as scheduled is annoying and unprofessional.

 

Thanks for letting me rant. Much appreciated.

 

JMHO..If you can absolutely say that the pier rebuild will not be completed then I would think Carnival should also know this. Assuming this is the case then yes I do think Carnival is being deceptive in their marketing especially if the damage occurred back in 2014.

 

If you are wrong and there is a chance that it may be completed then I would say no, and that Carnival is just hopeful that it will be completed. Honestly, I do think either way they should be honest and let passengers/customers know that there is at least a chance that they will not be able to make that port due to the pier rebuild issue.

 

We were contemplating scheduling this particular itinerary earlier this year but decided against it. Zihuatanejo/Ixtapa is one of our favorite ports in Mexico. The opportunity to revisit was one of the reasons we considered booking this cruise. Although we love sea days, if we had booked this itinerary only to find out later that the Miracle didn't tender in Zihuatanejo due to something that Carnival could have foresaw but didn't disclose we would have most likely felt that Carnival was acting deceptively.

 

Do you think that maybe since it's going to be the day of the Super Bowl that possibly Carnival is thinking passengers won't care as much when/if they have to announce that the ship can't tendor? Are there any other possible options for tendering? Maybe another pier in the bay?

[riffatsea]

It's too bad as Ixtapa is gorgeous!

Maybe they are hoping that something will be fixed by the time you get there??

[Taters]

There are no other nearby piers. Other ships (NCL) have been replacing this stop with Manzanillo, and it looks like HAL's Amsterdam gifted their passengers with a second day in Huatulco.

 

I really do not mind that we are not going, but I would like to know whether our port will be replaced with another or if we will have a day at sea instead. It would be nice to be able to plan.

[Lil2Angelic]

There are no other nearby piers. Other ships (NCL) have been replacing this stop with Manzanillo, and it looks like HAL's Amsterdam gifted their passengers with a second day in Huatulco.

 

I really do not mind that we are not going, but I would like to know whether our port will be replaced with another or if we will have a day at sea instead. It would be nice to be able to plan.

 

I don't blame you at all. I would want to know the same thing. Have you posted this info on the roll call for your cruise? Or maybe, start another thread with a topic title to get the attention others passengers booked on this cruise? It is definitely a worthy topic for discussion.

 

It's one thing to miss a port due to weather but this is entirely different. There are probably many other passengers booked on this cruise that would like to about this but may not see it because the thread topic says "Carnival weirdness". Just a thought.

[RaiderFaninNM]

Well in all honesty they do not have to stop at the listed ports, weather among 100 other reasons, so go on your cruise have fun.......;)

[Lil2Angelic]

Well in all honesty they do not have to stop at the listed ports, weather among 100 other reasons, so go on your cruise have fun.......;)

 

That's true but if what OP is saying is true then Carnival is being deceptive. There may be many passengers who booked this itinerary because they want to see Zihuatanejo/Ixtapa or revisit that specific port. I know that is one reason we considered booking it.

 

We haven't been to Huatulco but in my opinion Manzanillo doesn't compare. Zihuatanejo is a beautiful and very popular port. One of the reasons we love it is because the people there are very humble and they don't approach you like they do in many of the other ports in Mexico. You also don't really need to book an excursion there because you can just spend the day walking around and hang out at the restaurant/bars near the ship. In Manzanillo, you have to take a bus into town or book an excursion. We've been there twice and have done both. We don't have much desire to go back, especially for 2 days.

[Laurie S.]

I'm on this cruise, too, and have corresponded with the dive shop we planned on using. The owner checked into it and said the pier absolutely will not be repaired in time for our arrival. It is still useable for the local fishing boats and it is the state's responsibility to repair and the town's. It probably won't get fixed for a year.

 

We're p.o.ed because Zihuatanejo was one of the main reasons we booked this cruise. We're divers and this would have been the best dive spot.

 

If they were to give us a second day in Manzanillo, we would be very happy. We will not be with another sea day as there are plenty enough already on this cruise and we find them very boring. And, we have no interest in watching the Super Bowl that day. But, it's out of our hands per the contract.

Edited December 7, 2015 by Laurie S.

[Lil2Angelic]

IMHO and assuming OP is correct here..

 

A contract has to be entered into in "good faith" or it is considered null and void. This a case where the question has to be asked and answered..What did Carnival know and when did they know it? And even more serious..Did Carnival purposely deceive it's customers?

 

It looks to me like Carnival has been and continues to be deceptive by advertising that this particular cruise is going to Zihuatenejo/Ixtapa by not stating "tentative" next to that port on the itinerary when they knew it was possible that the pier would not be complete. In addition, when Carnival knew that the pier was not going to be complete but continued to advertise that this cruise is going to Zihuatenajo/Ixtapa then they have some very serious contract issues.

 

I know OP said that this cruise is sold out and that is true, but just in the past week I have seen some cabins for this particular sailing open up only to be sold out again. It's possible and my guess is that Carnival's risk management team has looked at this and said most passengers won't sue/ask for a complete fare refund or press the issue. We can always refund them their port fees. Most passengers will just go with the flow or think.."well it does say in the contract that they have the right to change the itinerary".

 

Again, JMHO and assuming OP is correct..Lets just hypothetically follow the money here. Carnival stands to make more money or book more cabins by continuing to advertise Zihuatanejo/Ixtapa a part of this itinerary as this is a very desirable Mexican port, especially for those passengers that have already been there and desire to return.

 

Carnival stands to make much more money if they change the itinerary to a sea day or port in Manzanillo. I would think that if they substitute another port they may get away with not having to refund the port fees unless maybe it's to the guest(s) that really pitch a fit. If it's a sea day they make more money with passengers on the ship. If it's Manzanillo they perhaps make more money on possible booking of excursions. Manzanillo is not as far as Zihuatanejo/Ixtapa so perhaps they save on fuel. I haven't been to Huatulco so I can't speak to that port at all.

 

I am not an attorney but I have had 2 years of contract law so this is MHO based on what I was taught. Anybody else with more experience/knowledge please feel free to chime in. Either way, if OP is correct, then I am very disappointed in Carnival and very happy I read this thread as we were seriously contemplating booking the advertised itinerary.

[Drazil65]

Thanks for the replies. I would understand them dragging their feet if there was hope for a resolution prior to our scheduled arrival date, but there is not. Sigh... I guess I am just frustrated with Carnival not acknowledging the problem to the passengers at all. Their claim that we will be calling on the port as scheduled is annoying and unprofessional.

 

Thanks for letting me rant. Much appreciated.

__________________

 

How about you let Carnival run the cruise and make the decisions when to tell cruisers things and you just pack and have a good time ;).

 

Point is, you do not know everything in the works behind the scenes or the how's and the where's, you will know when you need to know period. Ports are changed all the time for many reasons, be flexible and just enjoy your cruise. Don't take it so personally as it appears you already are convinced you are not going to that port so don't plan to go to that port, anything else you may do will be bonus! You are stressing about things you have no control over and cannot change (hmmmm, maybe there in lies the answer ;) ).....

 

Have a great trip!!!

[Cruisin 4 Ever]

Thanks for the replies. I would understand them dragging their feet if there was hope for a resolution prior to our scheduled arrival date, but there is not. Sigh... I guess I am just frustrated with Carnival not acknowledging the problem to the passengers at all. Their claim that we will be calling on the port as scheduled is annoying and unprofessional.

 

Thanks for letting me rant. Much appreciated.

__________________

 

How about you let Carnival run the cruise and make the decisions when to tell cruisers things and you just pack and have a good time ;).

 

Point is, you do not know everything in the works behind the scenes or the how's and the where's, you will know when you need to know period. Ports are changed all the time for many reasons, be flexible and just enjoy your cruise. Don't take it so personally as it appears you already are convinced you are not going to that port so don't plan to go to that port, anything else you may do will be bonus! You are stressing about things you have no control over and cannot change (hmmmm, maybe there in lies the answer ;) ).....

 

Have a great trip!!![/Q

Edited December 7, 2015 by Cruisin 4 Ever

[Cruisin 4 Ever]

How about you let Carnival run the cruise and make the decisions when to tell cruisers things and you just pack and have a good time ;).

 

Point is, you do not know everything in the works behind the scenes or the how's and the where's, you will know when you need to know period. Ports are changed all the time for many reasons, be flexible and just enjoy your cruise. Don't take it so personally as it appears you already are convinced you are not going to that port so don't plan to go to that port, anything else you may do will be bonus! You are stressing about things you have no control over and cannot change (hmmmm, maybe there in lies the answer ;) ).....

 

Have a great trip!!!

 

How about you let the OP decide for herself what she thinks and what she posts. To say "you will know when you need to know period" is ridiculous. You need to know when you are booking where Carnival says the ship is going. Then you need to know when you are planning on what to do when you are there. Being condescending is a very unattractive feature, you might want to work on that;)

[mmckm]

You never know for sure what ports may get cancelled due to weather, problems in the country, sickness, problems with the ships thrusters. Ports are changed all the time once on board. There not going to schedule a change of a sea day just to make a little more money because of the Super bowl. If I thought a company would do this I would ne longer cruise with them. I don't care if they change ports or when they tell me. I will make new plans and have a good time.

[SadieN]

IMHO and assuming OP is correct here..

 

A contract has to be entered into in "good faith" or it is considered null and void. This a case where the question has to be asked and answered..What did Carnival know and when did they know it? And even more serious..Did Carnival purposely deceive it's customers?

 

..................... .

 

 

Need to read the contract. They have the right not to go to any port. This issue has been known for a long time, way before the final payment was due.

 

My family has sailed on the Miracle in October, November and are currently on her. The crew isn't saying anything about it. Personally, I'm hoping for Loreto if Zihua is no longer a viable option.

[Lil2Angelic]

Need to read the contract. They have the right not to go to any port. This issue has been known for a long time, way before the final payment was due.

 

My family has sailed on the Miracle in October, November and are currently on her. The crew isn't saying anything about it. Personally, I'm hoping for Loreto if Zihua is no longer a viable option.

 

Hi Sadie!..When you say "this issue has been known for a long time, way before the final payment was due"..What do you mean? How and when was it known? or Who made it known?

[Laurie S.]

We, the passengers going on this cruise, have known it for at least six months. The dock was damaged last year. We have corresponded with Carnival, so they know it. When the issue first came to light, I contacted the dive shop owner, who talked to the Harbor Master. The dock will not be repaired until, at best, late next year.

 

Carnival is doing the passengers a disservice by not communicating with us. They also are committing fraud by advertising this itinerary knowing the ship cannot tender or dock there. It's a whole other problem if a port cannot be reached due to weather or other problems once the cruise has started, or even shortly before (i.e., projected hurricane path).

 

We still want to go on this cruise, and we are looking forward to it. All we want to know is what will replace Zihuatanejo. If it's Loreto (my hope) or Manzanillo, then we need to make reservations with the dive shops. If we wait too long, there might not be space.

 

Carnival needs to let us know and not not pretend that there is no problem. There most definitely is.

[SadieN]

Hi Sadie!..When you say "this issue has been known for a long time, way before the final payment was due"..What do you mean? How and when was it known? or Who made it known?

 

 

The issue has been known on the roll call for a long time. Carnival either hasn't made a decision or isn't saying what the decision is.

[Taters]

This problem has been discussed at length on our roll call and we are all disappointed, though I do not know of any cancellations due to this situation.

 

I am all about going with the flow and have had ports cancelled due to weather, political circumstances and mechanical hicups. But I have never known of a cruise line intentionally listing a port on an itinerary that they do not have access to. I definitely feel deceived. However, I will not cancel and am excited for the cruise!

 

The point of my original post was to find out if anyone had experienced this type of thing before. It seems that NCL and HAL have informed their passengers of a change a few days ahead of time. My hope now is that we will at least get that consideration, too.

 

Cheers!

[RaiderFaninNM]

Is tendering out of the question?

[Laurie S.]

It is a tender port. The damaged dock is not safe for the large tenders, only smaller fishing boats.

[mmckm]

If your so mad about this cancel and cruise another cruise line. Instead saying carnival is screwing you, its one port if it means that much to you fly there and stay a week. I can't believe all the people speculating that know nothing about what is going on. The port is closed but Carnival may know something you don't, and they don't have to tell you everything. People quote a contract is this and they have to do this. All there thinking is to take them to court and get a free cruise.

[Lil2Angelic]

We, the passengers going on this cruise, have known it for at least six months. The dock was damaged last year. We have corresponded with Carnival, so they know it. When the issue first came to light, I contacted the dive shop owner, who talked to the Harbor Master. The dock will not be repaired until, at best, late next year.

 

Carnival is doing the passengers a disservice by not communicating with us. They also are committing fraud by advertising this itinerary knowing the ship cannot tender or dock there. It's a whole other problem if a port cannot be reached due to weather or other problems once the cruise has started, or even shortly before (i.e., projected hurricane path).

 

We still want to go on this cruise, and we are looking forward to it. All we want to know is what will replace Zihuatanejo. If it's Loreto (my hope) or Manzanillo, then we need to make reservations with the dive shops. If we wait too long, there might not be space.

 

Carnival needs to let us know and not not pretend that there is no problem. There most definitely is.

 

Hi Laurie! So are you saying that "all" the passengers on this cruise have known for six months? If so, how were you all notified?