St Petersburg to Moscow

[timbo89]

The cruise lines work pretty hard to have you use their tours. They try to engender fear (expensive visas, delays, etc. etc.)

What actually happens is The tour company collects passport info from you prior to you arriving in St Pete. They then email you a document that allows you to go through immigration. It avoids having to get a visa and it costs $0. You do have to be with them all the time.

Taking the Sapsan high speed train is actually quicker than flying as there is no security delays like the airport.

The "on time " record is actually very good on the Sapsan train, if you check (which I did)

This was my actual experience........

 

 

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[Johnthesailor]

As Rallydave pointed out, there may be nuances. I've been to Russia multiple times, including three times to St.Pete. I've been with ship tours at times and at other times with private guides. Perhaps both required some type of visa (if so, arranged by the ship or guide agency behind the scenes) but neither required me to pay an expensive visa fee or to send my passport anywhere. No visa was inserted in my passport (unlike, say, Brazil or China or India). Both required me to stay with the group or individual guide. Neither way allowed me to wander on my own or freely leave the ship at any time. The private guides had to be arranged ahead of time. So maybe there was some type of visa required but it was not the "normal" type of individual visa where you have to pay a substantial fee, fill out extensive paperwork, get a picture, send passport to agency or consulate, etc. We have considered going to Russia on our own and to do that we will be required to get the full blown visa (which, I'm told, requires more paperwork, expense and time than even China or India).

 

Just relating my personal experiences but it is what I've experienced personally on multiple occasions in that port as well as other points of entry and is not just speculation on what may be required.

 

For us, the ship tours were perfectly acceptable but the private guides were incredible, allowing us to completely customize what we wanted to do or see, even on the fly. The guides somehow got us into places without waiting on lines and arranged to get us to things we wanted to see at times when there were no crowds. And, we did not have to stop for the usual "shopping experience" common with most tours.

 

Best,

John

[UUNetBill]

Thanks to everyone for your replies. I'm looking into private tours and I have my TA looking as well. He's always done us right, so hopefully we can find something nice - and with 4 of us traveling, it could be a significant cost saving.

[Gilly]

As we are in the middle of getting full blown visas for a visit to Russia this Spring, I can vouch for the fact that it is an expensive, time consuming and arduous process and involves a face to face interview as well. I would consider it a disproportionate effort for the sake of a day or two.

[flossie009]

IMO, everything in Russia is better seen on private excursions. Your experience sounds so much better than what others have posted. We have been to St. Petersburg twice - there was so much to see that we have yet to see Moscow (given the time it takes to get there and back, it is unlikely that we will ever see it).

 

I am sure private excursions are very good, but when we went to St Petersburg we thoroughly enjoyed Regent's excursions

We did not try the trip to Moscow

 

 

I did the train to Moscow on the last voyage of the season on the Voyager Sept 25, 2016. Your questions. We left the ship at 4:30 am. Bus to the St Pete train station and left about 7:00am. While the train does have 3 classes, all of the tour was in the economy class. Seats are comparable to airplane economy plus seats. That is to say not that great. You can not upgrade. Our group of 45 were all in one car. The ride is 4 hours each way, with 2 stops along the way. Not much to see along the way, a few small farms and rivers. Left Moscow about 7:30 pm and back to the ship just before midnight. Yes it is a long day and the train ride is not that comfortable. As to why Regent didn't use a better class in the train, I was told that it was the vendor decision. This train is not the same as quality as the "Bullet" or TGV trains in western Europe.

 

I cannot understand why Regent does not offer the opportunity to travel in first or second class on the train, even at additional cost. 'Vendor decision' does sound as if Regent are not bothering to manage their on shore suppliers very well

[hvsteve1]

If you check the Sapsan (train) web site, you will see the cost each way for economy is about $100. For business class it doubles. Premium triples it. I don't think all pax want to spend an extra $300 to $500 for a round trip to Moscow as it's four hours each way. As some people would likely opt out of the upgrade, this would have Regent folks spread all over the train which would probably not be allowed as you are traveling in a group. Even if Regent upgraded everyone to business or premium (at a big increase in the expense of the tour) the fewer number of seats in those cars might also spread people over too many cars to be acceptable.

 

As for visas, when we got our full visas it was, indeed, expensive and a pain, However, it did not involve a personal interview. The Russians do require the paperwork to be filed in person at the embassy but our tour company had people at their DC office to do that for us.

[Gilly]

The personal interview is a relatively recent development, I believe, involving fingerprinting (as needed by other immigration services too)

[newlondon]

Visas are always a pain, but if you do a private tour even with an approved Russian guide in our experience you will need a Visa in your passport.

[UUNetBill]

Visas are always a pain, but if you do a private tour even with an approved Russian guide in our experience you will need a Visa in your passport.

 

 

That's different than everything I've read so far - I've read that there's a provision for cruise passengers for up to 72 hours that waives the requirement for a separate visa unless you want to venture off on your own. Ships tours and other approved third-party tours don't need a visa as long as you stay with the tour group.

 

Either way, it's in the hands of my TA right now, I'll let him sort it out.

[rallydave]

UUNetBill almost positive you are correct. For sure if on ships tours no separate visa and many of the private tour operators do ask for passport and other information so that you are covered to tour in Russia.

 

Perhaps newlondon is talking about guides who don't have approval to take people without individual visas but too many reports of people taking private tours and getting documents from tour operator allowing the people thru immigration and on shore to take their private tours without a visa in their passport

 

Simply don't believe newlondon comment

 

 

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[Travelcat2]

That's different than everything I've read so far - I've read that there's a provision for cruise passengers for up to 72 hours that waives the requirement for a separate visa unless you want to venture off on your own. Ships tours and other approved third-party tours don't need a visa as long as you stay with the tour group.

 

Either way, it's in the hands of my TA right now, I'll let him sort it out.

 

Based on all of the scare tactics used by most cruise lines that you "must" take a ship's excursion or you will need a visa have many believing it. OTOH, as our relationship with Russia takes twists and turns, so could requirements for visiting their country. As has been posted, in order to get a visa, there needs to be a personal interview and possibly fingerprinting. This is new and it is a good idea to watch out for any other "new" requirements.

 

Bill, have a great time in Russia!

[newlondon]

Sorry folks, My experience was pre-cruise and done solely with my TA and an agency in St. Pete.

[UUNetBill]

Sorry folks, My experience was pre-cruise and done solely with my TA and an agency in St. Pete.

 

 

That may be the difference. Might only apply to cruise passengers transiting St Petersburg, not pre- or post-cruise. I'm pretty sure there's a 72 hour limit, and I also think the cruise lines perpetuate the visa issues to get people to stick with ship's excursions.

 

I think Regent's Moscow day tour via Sapsan runs $1,200-1,300 pp, and I've seen similar tours on third-party websites for around $600-650. Of course, you'd need to make sure the tours are equivalent, but from some posts I've read, you can get a better experience with an independent tour for less. Sounds good to me...

[kihei228]

Hi Bill,

I've been around this board long enough to know you are quite the traveler. My DH and I did the Baltic cruise last July on Voyager with 3 days in St. Petersburg. Here's what we did. Flew to Moscow and paid the deviation. Stayed @ the Ritz Carlton and had fabulous views of Red Square and the Kremlin. The club rooms are worth the money. Having the time to really see Moscow was worth the extra expense. Likewise, we then flew to Berlin for 3 days, rather than have the long haul day from Warnemunde. Then a couple of days in Copenhagen prior to boarding.

I have been on board the ship watching the tired masses return from their long haul to Cairo and the pyramids and knew then that the days we spent in Egypt prior to that cruise was well worth it. In addition, having the visa to travel freely in St. Petersburg was invaluable. We spent quite a bit of time on our own exploring and experiencing that city [and Moscow] and know we saw more than people on a tour. There were people we met onboard that did the Moscow train excursion, and they spent the next day lounging on deck too tired to see Catherine's Palace or Petershof.

Just my 2 cents. Laurie

That may be the difference. Might only apply to cruise passengers transiting St Petersburg, not pre- or post-cruise. I'm pretty sure there's a 72 hour limit, and I also think the cruise lines perpetuate the visa issues to get people to stick with ship's excursions.

 

I think Regent's Moscow day tour via Sapsan runs $1,200-1,300 pp, and I've seen similar tours on third-party websites for around $600-650. Of course, you'd need to make sure the tours are equivalent, but from some posts I've read, you can get a better experience with an independent tour for less. Sounds good to me...

[UUNetBill]

Hi Bill,

I've been around this board long enough to know you are quite the traveler. My DH and I did the Baltic cruise last July on Voyager with 3 days in St. Petersburg. Here's what we did. Flew to Moscow and paid the deviation. Stayed @ the Ritz Carlton and had fabulous views of Red Square and the Kremlin. The club rooms are worth the money. Having the time to really see Moscow was worth the extra expense. Likewise, we then flew to Berlin for 3 days, rather than have the long haul day from Warnemunde. Then a couple of days in Copenhagen prior to boarding.

I have been on board the ship watching the tired masses return from their long haul to Cairo and the pyramids and knew then that the days we spent in Egypt prior to that cruise was well worth it. In addition, having the visa to travel freely in St. Petersburg was invaluable. We spent quite a bit of time on our own exploring and experiencing that city [and Moscow] and know we saw more than people on a tour. There were people we met onboard that did the Moscow train excursion, and they spent the next day lounging on deck too tired to see Catherine's Palace or Petershof.

Just my 2 cents. Laurie

Laurie, thanks for your input. My challenge here is that my wife and I have been to St Petersburg and seen a few of the sights already, but my in-laws are traveling with us and this is their first time in the Baltic. So we have us (40s-50s, been to STP before) and my in-laws (mid-70s, first time to STP) but they want to see EVERYTHING. :D

 

Good thing is they're both fit and healthy, and pretty active. Bad thing is they want to see EVERYTHING. We're booked for an evening excursion on our first night in STP, then Moscow the second day, then two shorter excursions the third. This would be pretty grueling at age 30, never mind 55 or 75...but it's what they wanted to do, so we'll see how it goes. I wouldn't be surprised to see some changes to the day three plans.

[newlondon]

Laurie, I am a Bill also so I'm not sure who your post was directed to as we are trying to figure out the same issues you commented on. We also have already been to St. Pete and therefore were looking intensely at the train trip. BTW we love trains, have crossed the US three times, and if younger would do the TS Express.

No matter which Bill we will take your comments under advisement and Thanks.

[FromHomeToRoam]

whi

[FromHomeToRoam]

New to this board so bare with me, but for Timbo890 who described your trip to Moscow:

Which tour company did you use? Were you doing this off of a ship or from the land - i.e. did you already have a Russian Visa or were you using the blanket visa from the Tour company?