Thetrail Posted October 6, 2016 #101 Share Posted October 6, 2016 "totally ruined" is an exaggeration to me. Much ado about nothing.Some people just look for something to b---- and moan about!....K.O. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tarnished45 Posted October 6, 2016 #102 Share Posted October 6, 2016 Really not worth worrying about . . . . Many more important matters in life Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
troykahack Posted October 6, 2016 #103 Share Posted October 6, 2016 Not sure where you are getting your information, but all ships, regardless of whether they are installing scrubbers or not, have to meet the emissions standards set for the US ECA as of 1 January, 2015 (for the newer sulfur level of 0.1%). Yes, they are testing the scrubbers to get them to meet the ECA requirements, but until they do, they have to meet the standards by burning low sulfur diesel fuel within the ECA. Depending on how much time the ship spends in the ECA, the scrubbers will have a payback period of 5-6 years. The only mention of 2020 is that the worldwide sulfur limit is set to reduce to 0.5%. Not an expert on the regulation.... I thought it was those ships that ventured into within 200 miles of the US had to meet that standard, by 2020. So, if it is really 2015, does Royal yet meet the requirements... from what I read, they are testing the scrubbers.... are they burning the low sulfur fuel? What other countries require these emissions to enter within 200 miles...?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chengkp75 Posted October 6, 2016 #104 Share Posted October 6, 2016 Not an expert on the regulation.... I thought it was those ships that ventured into within 200 miles of the US had to meet that standard, by 2020. So, if it is really 2015, does Royal yet meet the requirements... from what I read, they are testing the scrubbers.... are they burning the low sulfur fuel? What other countries require these emissions to enter within 200 miles...?? Nope, just like my ship, we have to either have a functioning scrubber or burn low sulfur diesel fuel as of 1 Jan 2015. Since our tanker is under time charter, and the charterer pays for the fuel, we have not gone the scrubber path, but burn diesel fuel exclusively. Royal must burn diesel fuel, and can only switch to residual fuel when outside the ECA. The Baltic Sea is an ECA, since 2005, the North Sea is an ECA, since 2006 (those two dates may be switched). Canada is part of the North America ECA (the US ECA). The EU has adopted a sulfur limit of 0.1% for all ships while in port. The Med is being considered for an ECA, and some nations there are considering unilaterally declaring ECA's for their countries. Some states in Australia have passed sulfur limits, and Japan, Australia (nationally), and Norway are working on ECA's. China is working on one as well, hoping for implementation in 2020. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bocker3 Posted October 6, 2016 #105 Share Posted October 6, 2016 Not an expert on the regulation.... I thought it was those ships that ventured into within 200 miles of the US had to meet that standard, by 2020. So, if it is really 2015, does Royal yet meet the requirements... from what I read, they are testing the scrubbers.... are they burning the low sulfur fuel? What other countries require these emissions to enter within 200 miles...?? Dude, your Donald act is getting old. What other countries spend over half a trillion dollars on their military? What other countries allow mass shootings to go on every week? What other countries let banks open millions of accounts without customer authorization and don't jail those responsible - in fact, let them walk away with over $100,000,000? Shall I go on? You seem to be saying if "they aren't doing it, we shouldn't". Well, let's apply that across the board then. Otherwise -- get back on topic -- this is a forum for CRUISES. If you want to talk about all this stuff -- go tweet Trump. M Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ocean Boy Posted October 6, 2016 #106 Share Posted October 6, 2016 Really not worth worrying about . . . . Many more important matters in life That applies to about 95% of what we talk about on Cruise Critic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DirtyDawg Posted October 6, 2016 #107 Share Posted October 6, 2016 That applies to about 95% of what we talk about on Cruise Critic. Only 95%:confused: Heck, I thought it was closer to 99%.:eek: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodyren Posted October 6, 2016 #108 Share Posted October 6, 2016 Due to our regulations, it puts US based industries at a disadvantage to other countries that do not regulate. It costs us more to produce the same product with the added expenses and cost to meet the regulation. The US continues to fail as our costs to build a similar like product is so much more than those countries that have very little regulation. So I suppose you would be all for paying workers peanuts and abandoning working conditions and OH&S regulations as well? There are many things that put progressive countries behind others when it comes to competition. That is exactly why I referred to them as progressive. I guess those who are just focussed on the bottom line so they can take what they "deserve" would see things a little differently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alfaeric Posted October 7, 2016 #109 Share Posted October 7, 2016 (edited) The EPA was sued buy Friends of the Earth environmental group sponsored by WHO? Did our current administration fight it? Do you not get it yet? And you hit the nail on the head when you blamed the last administration. So you make your side obvious. You are for MORE Government regulations.... more restrictions on businesses.... I'm going by timing, that's all. Facts. Like the MARPOL rules, the EPA was sued over CO2 and lost back in the previous administration. You really have no evidence that regulations are job killers, they are not. For just the scrubbers: A group of engineers and techs had to design, fabricate, test, and show that the concept would work on a large scale diesel. Then another group had to design the system so that it would fit on the ship- and another ship based group had to also design the integration of the parts into the ship both for appearance and function. Then two groups of fabricators had to make all the scrubber and and the ship integration as well as the ship design changes. And then, finally, there's a group of people who are installing the parts onto the ship. All of those are highly paid and highly skilled job. So in that, where are jobs being lost? I mentioned before that I work in a regulated industry- for a publicly traded multi-billion dollar company. My job, as well as hundreds in my company and thousands in my industry are 100% to meet the regulations that have to be met for our product. All of our jobs are engineering jobs- which are high paying jobs. While the industry is world wide, much of the manufacturing is located here in the US- both for domestic companies as well as foreign companies. And ALL of the foreign countries that our product is made in are regulated as well. There's no real impact on manufacturing location based on the regulations plus thousands of high paying jobs are a direct result of the regulations. You can tell me that I'm wrong, but my paycheck and the others that do what I do totally disagree with your "feelings" and "beliefs". Yes, I'm in favor of good regulations. Good ones are very good for jobs. I get it just fine. You are the one who wants to ignore reality. Edited October 7, 2016 by alfaeric Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tamalero Posted October 7, 2016 #110 Share Posted October 7, 2016 Exactly, stricter regulations in US, our industry packs up and moves elsewhere. Administration job elimination program. My point about China is the are still a very high polluting country regardless of what changes they have made. They are 10x the US. As a Mexican, trust me.. we would prefer if these kind of industries didn't come to our side. Politicians will always claim "they are jobs for everyone!" (very LOW paid jobs with very long hours, abusive bosses trying to shove the weight of production expectations to workers and polluting horribly) You can google "maquiladoras". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rtazz17 Posted October 14, 2016 #111 Share Posted October 14, 2016 Never noticed,dont care Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trainman-2 Posted October 14, 2016 #112 Share Posted October 14, 2016 It's called more Government restrictions.... And we all know that government knows what is best for us! But consider this. What is the total cost of installation and then the cost to operate and maintain them? Can you guess who is gonna pay for this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poncho1973 Posted October 14, 2016 #113 Share Posted October 14, 2016 These eyesores really put me off the feed! Actually... doesn't bother me at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chengkp75 Posted October 14, 2016 #114 Share Posted October 14, 2016 And we all know that government knows what is best for us! But consider this. What is the total cost of installation and then the cost to operate and maintain them? Can you guess who is gonna pay for this? The capital cost is about $1-1.5 million per engine, but the savings in fuel give a payback period of 5-6 years, depending on how much time is spent in the US ECA. After the payback period, it is all savings for the cruise line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cuizer2 Posted October 14, 2016 #115 Share Posted October 14, 2016 Whatever happened to the OP? Sent from my HTC One_M8 using Forums mobile app (S)he probable saw the responses, got scared and decided to stay away, thus proving the OP has more brains than the rest of us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cuizer2 Posted October 14, 2016 #116 Share Posted October 14, 2016 and the water slides don't spoil the look? Not if you are the one on the waterslide. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cuizer2 Posted October 14, 2016 #117 Share Posted October 14, 2016 To me, it is hard to see the slide while looking at the side view of the ship. If our current administration didn't order these regulations, the ship would not have changed. They can sail out of other ports without these scrubbers. So they just increase the price of a cruise out of the US. Hopefully one day we will be on equal footing with the other countries . What the US does for a Green Planet matters not until the other polluting countries decide to adapt. Until then, it hurts US Jobs and business. Somebody has to be first and lead the way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cuizer2 Posted October 14, 2016 #118 Share Posted October 14, 2016 Well, I must admit, this has been very interesting reading. Not so much for the cruise related information, of which there was some. Not so much for the technical side of things, of which there was plenty. But for the education on global politics. We can't get ten people from the same country, with somewhat shared goals and morals (and a shared interest in cruising), to agree air pollution. How are we ever going to get one hundred countries, with differing goals and morals, to agree on air pollution, or anything else for that matter? BTW, I'm not bothered by the look of either the scrubbers, the slides, or the hull are on the NCL ships. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cuizer2 Posted October 14, 2016 #119 Share Posted October 14, 2016 By the way, how much do scrubbers make? Are there any special skills or education needed to become a scrubber? Are scrubbers included in the tipping pool? Which pool on the ship is the tipping pool? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thetrail Posted October 14, 2016 #120 Share Posted October 14, 2016 Whatever happened to the OP? Sent from my HTC One_M8 using Forums mobile app Maybe he was tired of having his thread hijacked by troykahack....K.O.:D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
troykahack Posted October 15, 2016 #121 Share Posted October 15, 2016 By the way, how much do scrubbers make? Are there any special skills or education needed to become a scrubber? Are scrubbers included in the tipping pool? Which pool on the ship is the tipping pool? Good one. Lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saab4444 Posted October 15, 2016 #122 Share Posted October 15, 2016 Somebody has to be first and lead the way. By the way: The US is not first in this, Northern Europe countries startet this and are much more advanced in their requirements. Sent from my iPhone using Forums mobile app Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paulxyz2004 Posted October 15, 2016 #123 Share Posted October 15, 2016 Maybe he was tired of having his thread hijacked by troykahack....K.O.:D Ah, another strike from "3T" aka Troy the Troll;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heather1972 Posted October 15, 2016 #124 Share Posted October 15, 2016 How does this affect the cruising experience? Oh, that's right... it doesn't. :rolleyes: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rare John&LaLa Posted October 15, 2016 #125 Share Posted October 15, 2016 How does this affect the cruising experience? Oh, that's right... it doesn't. :rolleyes: Actually it does. The card room is tied up, the deck outside DL is closed. 😉 Sent from my HTC One_M8 using Forums mobile app Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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