BUMP IN THE NIGHT: Looking for you thoughts when things go awry

[Mosaic]

It sure does and that is all well understood. What was odd was that no-one was told that there was a schedule change. Ya, that makes a big difference. Devil is in the details

[Lady Arwen]

As I posted in another thread but was laughed at, HAL should guarantee their itineraries or provide compensation for the pain and suffering caused by the above deviations. At what point can we count on the schedule being set in stone? When we reserve the cruise? When we pay for it? When we arrive at the port? I have great sympathy for the OP. What if she had been left in port because the captain decided he wanted to leave two hours early without telling anyone? She could have been stranded in a foriegn country for weeks!

How on earth can any cruiseline guarantee an itinerary? What pain and suffering are you referring to? Disappointment, yes, but there was no injury, no disaster. So many variables in cruising, you have to be flexible or decide that cruising is not for you. No captain is going to leave people behind because he decides to leave two hours early and not tell anyone. "She could have been stranded in a foreign country for weeks"...now this is just a silly comment. I'm not surprised that your comments on another thread were not taken seriously.

[moorerf]

It's a good idea to proofread, especially longer posts, for readability.

I concur on this, I am a bit confused exactly what all the issues were. If you sail you are at the discretion of the captain concerning ports and times. You must check and recheck and recheck each port. I find making lots of on my own port experiences is not a good idea unless they involve walking around or picking up a cab etc once in port. There are no gurantees and using ship excursions for ports where it is a long distance to the site is a good idea.

[bUU]

How on earth can any cruiseline guarantee an itinerary?

To be fair there is a way to insure an itinerary. Nationwide Insurance does it. However it is really important to understand that not everybody wants to pay the premium for that level of insurance. So it makes the most sense to not include that in the cruise fare and instead those who want that level of insurance can go to Nationwide and purchase it. That's really key here. The cruise line isn't in business to serve one particular customer. They're in business to serve all of us. Just because one customer wants something packaged a certain way doesn't mean the cruise line should package it that way. As a matter of fact because so many more customers want it packaged in a different way, it is that different way, with the insurance for the itinerary not included in the cruise fare, that the cruise line should be offering.

 

This division of risk thing is really critically important. All customers but especially Cruise passengers need to come to grips with their lack of understanding of the division of risk. They need to understand that that division of risk directly affects the price they pay. That means that if they're not happy with the division of risk and they want more risk pushed over from them towards the seller then that's only rational if they're willing to pay a higher price. And at that point why not just pay the extra amount as an insurance premium?

 

 

This post may have been entered by voice recognition. Please excuse any typographical errors.

[Lady Arwen]

To be fair there is a way to insure an itinerary. Nationwide Insurance does it. However it is really important to understand that not everybody wants to pay the premium for that level of insurance. So it makes the most sense to not include that in the cruise fare and instead those who want that level of insurance can go to Nationwide and purchase it. That's really key here. The cruise line isn't in business to serve one particular customer. They're in business to serve all of us. Just because one customer wants something packaged a certain way doesn't mean the cruise line should package it that way. As a matter of fact because so many more customers want it packaged in a different way, it is that different way, with the insurance for the itinerary not included in the cruise fare, that the cruise line should be offering.

 

This division of risk thing is really critically important. All customers but especially Cruise passengers need to come to grips with their lack of understanding of the division of risk. They need to understand that that division of risk directly affects the price they pay. That means that if they're not happy with the division of risk and they want more risk pushed over from them towards the seller then that's only rational if they're willing to pay a higher price. And at that point why not just pay the extra amount as an insurance premium?

 

 

This post may have been entered by voice recognition. Please excuse any typographical errors.

You're talking about insuring an itinerary and I'm talking about a cruiseline guaranteeing an itinerary. You can take out insurance for just about anything, but no cruiseline will guarantee that they will stop at every port.

[bUU]

You're talking about insuring an itinerary and I'm talking about a cruiseline guaranteeing an itinerary.

 

The effective impact on the consumer is roughly the same. What I'm saying is the fact that insurance exists means that expecting the cruise line to effectively ensure their own itinerary is not reasonable. The insurance is a product. It has a cost. Not everybody wants to pay that cost. It's a separate item. And it should stay as separate item.

 

This post may have been entered by voice recognition. Please excuse any typographical errors.

[cbr663]

See above. If a traveler cannot live with the uncertainties of timing and possibilities that ports may be skipped, I truly think s/he is better off choosing a different type of vacation. No reason to go through all the stress....

I've been in nine Mediterranean cruises. I've missed one port, once. (Civitavecchia, by the way), had two ports rescheduled and have had port times truncated three times. This kind of thing happens.

 

It seems to me that the OP's is more concerned with not being told that they were missing a port. What obligation is there to HAL to communicate a missed port? For me, not communicating the change in a timely and transparent manner is poor customer service.

[bUU]

What obligation is there to HAL to communicate a missed port? For me, not communicating the change in a timely and transparent manner is poor customer service.

That's debatable but in terms of your original question about what the obligation is, there is no such obligation. This question came up an awful lot during this most recent hurricane season. And folks who Cruise during Hurricane Season really need to get this clear and their heads: there really is no obligation and moreover the major cruise lines generally will make such things known later than you would prefer they would.

 

 

This post may have been entered by voice recognition. Please excuse any typographical errors.

[cbr663]

It's a good idea to proofread, especially longer posts, for readability.

 

The OP most likely used a word processing program to compose the post and then copied and pasted it into CC. This creates the spacing issues with the post. The work around to this is to use a plain text editor to compose you post, or to convert your post to plain text prior to copying it into CC.

[cruisemom42]

It seems to me that the OP's is more concerned with not being told that they were missing a port. What obligation is there to HAL to communicate a missed port? For me, not communicating the change in a timely and transparent manner is poor customer service.

 

From reading OP's post, they did not miss a port. Port time in one port was shortened from 11pm departure to 5pm departure. And although the poster says that the itinerary received one week in advance indicated the departure was still 11pm, s/he fails to say what the port time was indicated to be in either the port lecture or the daily log.

 

The other port-related issue is that OP waited until mid-day to leave the ship and was apparently not made aware by HAL that the port-operated shuttles do not run consistently throughout the day (they change routes at mid-day for a certain period). In my experience, no mass-market lines routinely provide detailed info about shuttles that are NOT run by the ship but rather by a port or town. They may indicate that such shuttles exist but it's more or less up to the cruiser to get the details.

[OlsSalt]

........

The 400.00 and 2,000.00 comment was in regards to it was my wife's 60 birthday and we will never be back to that port again. I do think that HAL is responsible for either amount. Period. But they did cause the problem. It was their bad infomation.

The table snafu, ya maybe a bottle of wine. But it was very disheartening when the concierge did not take our safety as a concern. The guy was threatening! And they knew that.

The port change can happen anytime, of course. IT WAS NOT ANNOUNCED! EVER. That is the problem.

............

 

I do not share your ultimate conclusions on these quoted matters. Nor are all the facts on the table about the painting project next door or the port change announcement. Many of us have routinely been near painting projects. Fact of life at sea. I would also want to hear HAL's position on the issues you raised to get a fuller picture. However, I get that you are unhappy. And for that, I am sorry.

[OlsSalt]

It seems to me that the OP's is more concerned with not being told that they were missing a port. What obligation is there to HAL to communicate a missed port? For me, not communicating the change in a timely and transparent manner is poor customer service.

 

You need to get HAL's side of this story. I cannot imagine HAL ever not communicating something as significant as a port change since many of us have also experienced them too. It is inconceivable any passenger vessel would just act on whim and caprice leaving their passengers in the dark. I simply cannot by this poster's version as the final version of this events. Common carriers have a higher duty of care to their passengers. Abandoning them at whim is not one of them.

[bUU]

You need to get HAL's side of this story.

Good point. It would be important to know what the cruise line said in response to the concern the OP expressed to them.

[OlsSalt]

It sure does and that is all well understood. What was odd was that no-one was told that there was a schedule change. Ya, that makes a big difference. Devil is in the details

 

I want to hear HAL's side of your story.

[LH25]

I haven't read the HAL contract, but Princess has this in theirs:

 

"You should not make any important arrangements or meetings based on the scheduled Cruise, which may change without liability to Carrier"

[Underwatr]

From reading OP's post, they did not miss a port. Port time in one port was shortened from 11pm departure to 5pm departure. And although the poster says that the itinerary received one week in advance indicated the departure was still 11pm, s/he fails to say what the port time was indicated to be in either the port lecture or the daily log.

The important lesson IMO is not to make any nonrefundable reservations based on a port call or the timing of a port call. Most independent tour operators catering to cruise passengers will issue a refund if the ship cancels a port call or the revised timing of the call makes a tour impractical. A resort hotel geared more toward longer term guests will generally be less forgiving about the reason why you booked a room that you'll be unable to use at the last minute (but it's worth a try to see if there's sympathy at the other end of the line). As others observe, the line doesn't make any advance guarantees about where you're going.

[SetAnOpenCourse]

The OP most likely used a word processing program to compose the post and then copied and pasted it into CC. This creates the spacing issues with the post. The work around to this is to use a plain text editor to compose you post, or to convert your post to plain text prior to copying it into CC.

 

Interesting. I'm always using Notepad in-between like that, to take out excess formatting and images before printing .

[dag144]

I had a noise problem on a Ryndam transatlantic just prior to dry-dock. We were in a Neptune suite and the scraping noise was quite bad in the afternoons halfway through the cruise. I went to the front desk (not the concierge). The lady at the front desk came up to the room. We had dinner with the captain and got a $500 credit toward our next cruise. I did not even have to ask for the credit.

 

On another HAL cruise we could not stop at La Paz bad weather. I did not blame HAL. Just thanked the good lord that he gave HAL the common sense not to mess with passenger safety.