PRINCESS SHIPS & CORONA VIRUS

[bluesea321]

10 minutes ago, terry&mike said:

That is not reflective at all in what I have seen from my clients. My bookings are up over this time last year by a good percent.

 

I am glad for your business. However the link I posted is hardly the only one. Here is another:

 

Based on conversations with several booking agents, we believe that over the last five or six days volumes have fallen from 5% to 15%, as Coronavirus headlines continue to dominate the news cycle.

https://www.barrons.com/articles/cruise-line-stocks-slip-coronavirus-fears-51581357041

[RMMariner]

26 minutes ago, Cruzinforpeace*** said:

Unless of course you’re a passenger on the Diamond Princess right now.  It’s actually really bad for them right now.  That is real; not “fake news”. All from 1 passenger who had the virus on their cruise.  It can happen anywhere on any ship as we are a world of “travelers” and come in contact with people from all over the world every day.  I don’t think it’s an over reaction at all.  This is a very fluid situation.  There are still a lot of unknowns in regards to transmission and actual infections.  

I agree with you. It is a terrible situation for the people on the ship. Even worse for the people in China, but if this thread is not the definition of over reaction, I don't know what is.

 

It is a fluid situation, and the virus is certainly very transmissible.. I would not travel to Asia at this time. More because of the upheaval in transportation etc, but of course I would not want to get the virus.

 

Every plague through history has had a panic attached to it, and most of the time the panic has done as much or more damage than the disease.

 

I am not denying the severity of the passengers and crews situattion. I am just saying to keep things in perspective. I very much hope, and I think that everyone on this board is agreement on this, that the people on the Diamond have better days ahead. I am not trying to diminish what they are going through. 

 

[richstowe]

1 hour ago, RMMariner said:

 

Yes, it certainly has. Not a particularly brave or level headed bunch are we. We sure seem to like conspiracy theories and litigation. When a post suggesting that most smokers are healthy people is not one of the least thought out posts on the thread there is a bit of problem with perspective.

 

Stop panicking. It only makes things worse.

 

 

 

 

Having watched the media's coverage , seen people actively avoiding contact with Asians (any Asian) and talked to non-cruising non-CCers  , we are exactly standard issue . Neither better or worse . Nobody is covered with glory here . 

[iMarco46]

https://www.usnews.com/news/world/articles/2020-02-11/japan-confirms-39-new-virus-cases-174-total-on-cruise-ship

 

Japan Confirms 39 New Virus Cases, 174 Total on Cruise Ship

[sfaaa]

16 hours ago, Wehwalt said:

I suspect Diamond will have to be pulled from the Asian market. We don't actually know of course but I suspect bookings are deeply suffering for the "plague ship". It might be better to move her to another line and let her sail the Med as the Costa Morbus.

I agree. Diamond is now stigmatized and a damaged goods. People will remember her name for a long time. She needs a makeover and new ship name.

[sfaaa]

1 hour ago, RMMariner said:

 

 

 

Stop panicking. It only makes things worse.

 

 

 

 

You can call it panicking, others prefer to call this mitigating risk exposure. 

[perditax]

54 minutes ago, sfaaa said:

You can call it panicking, others prefer to call this mitigating risk exposure. 

Humans are notoriously bad at risk assessment.

 

https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/the-inertia-trap/201303/why-are-people-bad-evaluating-risks

[kitkat343]

I'd need to hold off booking for awhile, because we travel with our 9, 4 and 1 year old, and if we were quarantined in our room for weeks things would not go very well.  And I hope that there are no small children on this sailing.  But if I didn't have kids, I'd be fine with cruising right now to the Caribbean or Europe.

[in rod we trust]

even if cruising goes bad for a yr or until they work out this virus . these cruise companies have made billion's .  you can replace a ship  you can replace cruise destination's . you  cant replace your life  so take every precaution .    I hate when people say stop over reacting  .. this over reacting is what has stop the spread of it so far.  if they didn't stop flights and checked people before boarding  this virus would be even more rampant.  prevention is better than cure .

 

 

Edited February 13, 2020 by in rod we trust

[Maya1234]

I think the Diamond Princess just made people aware of a risk of something they never envisioned. Being cooped up in a small room for a long time. I have friends whose husband was in China and they decided to self quarantine when he returned as news was breaking that you could transmit before symptoms. But they were in their nice big house for their kids to run around in. They can all go outside in their big backyard ( no close neighbors) They can easily do laundry. They can have alone time in one of the many rooms of their home. They Had access to any food they wanted ( friends have been picking up and leaving outside their front door). Those on the Princess have it  much rougher. The unique situation of a long  quarantine inside a windowless room (even though Princess is doing as much as they can to help  passengers) is spooking people 

Edited February 13, 2020 by Maya1234

[SunNFunCruzer]

4 hours ago, Cruzinforpeace*** said:

All from 1 passenger who had the virus on their cruise.  It can happen anywhere on any ship as we are a world of “travelers” and come in contact with people from all over the world every day.  

 

I am not sure that it's been proven that "patient 0" is the ONLY one that infected people on the ship.  As I understand it, a number of people embarked and disembarked from areas where the virus was present. We know "patient 0" is a possible source of the Diamond outbreak because he was on the ship and was later diagnosed with the virus. But, I have not read anything official that states that one or many of the 174 that are now infected could not have had the virus independent of "patient 0".  Has anyone read that there is some marker in the strain that allows officials to trace the virus the 174 have, back to the man known as "patient 0"?  

 

At this point, with the information about the virus in the rest of the world, I think it's more likely that there were a number of carriers that infected others on the Diamond.  That's my opinion and I believe that's true, because if it were not, I think there would be more mass infection events.  It's highly unlikely, in my opinion, that if "Patient 0" is solely responsible for the outbreak on the ship, he would not have infected others on his way to/from the ship and after walking around shopping in high density areas, etc. and there are no other reported giant clusters of illness outside China and off the ship.

[Tamerton]

I think a ship would be easy to fumigate, you could get everyone off, lock it up and us an antiviral agent.

Staff can go in a few days later and wipe the ship clean. Soft furnishings would be taken care of that way.

We're booked for the 15th March and not worried of the disease just worried we may get stuck in quarantine.

I also think the most dangerous place for infection would be the queues before boarding when no one is screened and everyone is in a hurry to get on the ship.

[SunNFunCruzer]

25 minutes ago, Tamerton said:

We're booked for the 15th March and not worried of the disease just worried we may get stuck in quarantine.

I also think the most dangerous place for infection would be the queues before boarding when no one is screened and everyone is in a hurry to get on the ship.

 

Also booked for March 15th.  We're nervous about the virus, the closing of ports prophylactically, the risk of quarantine and the fact that we will no longer feel comfortable going in to the pool, hot tub, spa, etc.  We're going to the Caribbean, so we expect it to be hot and sweaty.  

 

In 30 days, if the virus has "silently" spread, then I think there will be reports of illness on other ships and in other areas.  If not, then I think we'll go saying a prayer, crossing our fingers and avoiding any virus breeding grounds like the pool/spa.  

Edited February 13, 2020 by SunNFunCruzer

[npcl]

1 hour ago, in rod we trust said:

even if cruising goes bad for a yr or until they work out this virus . these cruise companies have made billion's .  you can replace a ship  you can replace cruise destination's . you  cant replace your life  so take every precaution .    I hate when people say stop over reacting  .. this over reacting is what has stop the spread of it so far.  if they didn't stop flights and checked people before boarding  this virus would be even more rampant.  prevention is better than cure .

 

 

Cruise lines operate on fairly narrow margins, they have lots of debt.  If there is any substantial reduction in the number of cruisers for a year  they will be in trouble.  Keep in mind that even during the recession fares came down, but the ships basically sailed full. You get ships going at 70 or 80 percent of capacity for a year and the cruise lines will pretty much hope for a very large line of credit.  Take a look at the numbers in the 10k and 10q filings for CCL, NCLH and RCL. They pretty much need steady cash flow.

[Tamerton]

13 minutes ago, SunNFunCruzer said:

 

Also booked for March 15th.  We're nervous about the virus, the closing of ports prophylactically, the risk of quarantine and the fact that we will no longer feel comfortable going in to the pool, hot tub, spa, etc.  We're going to the Caribbean, so we expect it to be hot and sweaty.  

 

In 30 days, if the virus has "silently" spread, then I think there will be reports of illness on other ships and in other areas.  If not, then I think we'll go saying a prayer, crossing our fingers and avoiding any virus breading grounds like the pool/spa.  

If it gets worse and the cruise goes ahead, which I don’t think it would, we will cancel and do something else. We’re fit and healthy and I think there is a lot of panic mongering by the media.

[npcl]

12 hours ago, Kmkub said:

Agree completely. People don't tend to move out of their homes if someone in the home was sick with something highly contagious. We (as a species) know how to clean things. 🙂

 

Does anyone really think a major cruise line is going to put future passengers at risk by not thoroughly cleaning the ship and putting it through rigorous inspection?

 

They will clean it and age it out.  If the virus can only live on a surface for X days or hours, then let it sit idle for longer than that and then do an extensive cleaning. No problem at all.

[brisalta]

14 minutes ago, SunNFunCruzer said:

  

7 minutes ago, SunNFunCruzer said:

In 30 days, if the virus has "silently" spread, then I think there will be reports of illness on other ships and in other areas.  If not, then I think we'll go saying a prayer, crossing our fingers and avoiding any virus breading grounds like the pool/spa.  

 

Virus do not "breed" outside of a compatible host.  To put it in extremely simple terms they need  a compatible host's cellular mechanism's to replicate by "using" cells the dna or rna replication.

It is quite possible that the chlorination in the pools will destroy the virus particles. It will be of interest to wait to see what is published in the scientific literature regarding that.

 

 

[brisalta]

6 minutes ago, npcl said:

They will clean it and age it out.  If the virus can only live on a surface for X days or hours, then let it sit idle for longer than that and then do an extensive cleaning. No problem at all.

 

From what I have read once the quarantine is over is to move the Diamond Princess to a special service facility and completely clean her. It will be interesting to find out what techniques they use to do that so any remaining virus particles are destroyed/removed without damaging essential equipment. I am sure that there are people currently researching that.

Edited February 13, 2020 by brisalta

[SunNFunCruzer]

1 minute ago, brisalta said:

Virus do not "breed" outside of a compatible host.

 

I'm nervous about the moisture.  If someone coughs/sneezes in the pool, hottub, spa areas --  areas that are moist and often [over]crowded environments -- where I think you can more easily inhale something, then I think that's a risk and a breeding ground (thanks for the correction!). 

[brisalta]

7 minutes ago, SunNFunCruzer said:

 

I'm nervous about the moisture.  If someone coughs/sneezes in the pool, hottub, spa areas --  areas that are moist and often [over]crowded environments -- where I think you can more easily inhale something, then I think that's a risk and a breeding ground (thanks for the correction!). 

 

Inhaling in a pool tends to lead to drowning! 😉 Keep your head above water when inhaling unless you have some sort of assisted breathing apparatus on.

Kidding aside, a properly maintained pool / spa is probably a lot safer than most toilet facilities.

The main thing to worry about pools is fungal infections. Make sure to rinse and dry your feet well before putting socks back on.

If I see people not using the shower by a pool before they get in I either get out of the pool or do not enter the pool with them in it.

 

Edited February 13, 2020 by brisalta

[SunNFunCruzer]

1 minute ago, brisalta said:

 

 

Kidding aside, a properly maintained pool / spa is probably a lot safer than most toilet facilities.

 

 

If it's not common knowledge, it should be, to ALWAYS close the lid on the toilet before flushing.  Particles are often expelled from the toilet in to the air when you flush. If a lid is not available, I hold my breath (link below).  Since we know that the virus can be spread by feces, that's another important Safety Tip.

 

https://www.self.com/story/toilet-plume-poop-spray

 

[Tamerton]

17 minutes ago, npcl said:

Cruise lines operate on fairly narrow margins, they have lots of debt.  If there is any substantial reduction in the number of cruisers for a year  they will be in trouble.  Keep in mind that even during the recession fares came down, but the ships basically sailed full. You get ships going at 70 or 80 percent of capacity for a year and the cruise lines will pretty much hope for a very large line of credit.  Take a look at the numbers in the 10k and 10q filings for CCL, NCLH and RCL. They pretty much need steady cash flow.

I think you could park a ship for say 4 months with very few costs involved and the bottom dollar may be better than sailing half empty ships.

Edited February 13, 2020 by Tamerton

[brisalta]

7 minutes ago, SunNFunCruzer said:

 

If it's not common knowledge, it should be, to ALWAYS close the lid on the toilet before flushing.  Particles are often expelled from the toilet in to the air when you flush. If a lid is not available, I hold my breath (link below).  Since we know that the virus can be spread by feces, that's another important Safety Tip.

 

https://www.self.com/story/toilet-plume-poop-spray

 

 

The nice thing about the vacuum toilets on Princess ships is they cannot be flushed with the lid up.

The problem tends to be contamination from peoples unwashed hands.

[brisalta]

7 minutes ago, Tamerton said:

I think you could park a ship for say 4 months with very few costs involved and the bottom dollar may be better than sailing half empty ships.

 

A couple of years ago the Salesforce Convention in San Francisco could not find enough hotel rooms so to get additional rooms they chartered a cruise ship that just remained tied to the dock throughout the conference. I am sure the line made extra profit as it did not have to burn bunker fuel to move the ship around.

I can imagine some ships in some locations being used as temporary docked hotels in future.

[perditax]

15 minutes ago, brisalta said:

I can imagine some ships in some locations being used as temporary docked hotels in future.

That’s been done for big sports events like the Olympics and the Super Bowl. Off the top of my head I know the NCL getaway went to Rio.