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1 hour ago, relldy01 said:

According to my email from AMX I will receive credits.  I have asked them to explain how that works and have not heard yet!  Very disappointed in AMX.  I like Lois are going crazy trying to deal with this.

Hi Relidy,  not going crazy trying to get the refund but if I have to go on line and read all the fine print? That will do it LOL

 

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2 hours ago, relldy01 said:

According to my email from AMX I will receive credits.  I have asked them to explain how that works and have not heard yet!  Very disappointed in AMX.  I like Lois are going crazy trying to deal with this.

 

Why are you disappointed?  Remember...they are in the middle of the situation, with passengers on one side and suppliers on the other.  They merely act as agents, and have no control over either end.

 

Or did you expect them to make refunds out of their own pocket?  Serious question.

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I have a serious answer.  As a AMX Platinum, I have had issues before and yes, they have given me credit until the dispute is decided.  If I am wrong they add the charge back on if and if I am right, they keep the charge off.  That has always been the case until this flight.  What has changed??

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3 minutes ago, relldy01 said:

I have a serious answer.  As a AMX Platinum, I have had issues before and yes, they have given me credit until the dispute is decided.  If I am wrong they add the charge back on if and if I am right, they keep the charge off.  That has always been the case until this flight.  What has changed??

I suspect they're taking your complaint as expressing a concern with their performance as a travel agent.  You would want to call and advise simply that you want to dispute the charge.

 

However, from your account of events, it's my understanding is you didn't just use your AMEX to purchase the ticket, you had AMEX purchase the ticket for you, putting them in the position of being your travel agent.  You can still dispute the charge, but since they are the vendor, they may be instantly seeing something that invalidates the dispute; for example if you cancelled the flight before TAP did, or some other factor is making it so that you will not prevail. 

 

Harris

Denver, CO

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On 4/10/2020 at 8:34 PM, omeinv said:

Had I inserted a comma after the word "refunding" it would say what you apparently think it does.  As written should modifies "refunding", not "dragging their feet".  For Heaven's sake I even provided the OP a link to the rules requiring the airline to do so, and advised how to initiate a credit card dispute. 

 

Harris

Denver, CO

LOL, often times posters have a difficult time understanding grammar, correctly and/or its' application.

 

I have to try to interpret what some posts really mean vs its' literality.

 

Gotta thank them for trying though...

 

bon voyage

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18 hours ago, Lois R said:

Hi Harris----yes, I paid with a VISA and I agree, I am not really wanting to go the "dispute route" yet.  I guess I could

call VISA…...looking at all the stuff on line makes me crazy LOL

LOL, L - yes, one can go crazy by reading some of the posts on CC about it all....

 

It is refreshing to read that there is another member who is, at least not yet, allowing some posters drive them into the sea without the ship!! LOL

 

Thank you again and bon voyage

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On 4/10/2020 at 5:34 PM, omeinv said:

Had I inserted a comma after the word "refunding" it would say what you apparently think it does.  As written should modifies "refunding", not "dragging their feet". 

 

Let's hear it for the Oxford Comma!!!

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Well, after all this-----I just got an email from TAP saying I have a voucher for the amount I paid originally. I DON'T WANT A VOUCHER.

I want my VISA credited back.   I guess I will have to call TAP tomorrow about it.

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On 4/10/2020 at 12:37 PM, omeinv said:

Why would TAP refund your ticket price? You purchased a ticket, and you chose to cancel that ticket.  Your reason was certainly valid, you know longer needed to fly to the destination.  The fact that they are issuing you a voucher, presumably for your purchase amount, minus change fees, is exactly what they were contracted to do. 

 

You used AMEX as your travel agent, since you made the booking through them, rather than directly with TAP.  For that reason, of course TAP will not discuss the booking with you, and is directing you back to AMEX.

 

TAP is the national airline of Portugal, and 50% owned by Portugal itself, so they probably have a better chance of surviving this downturn than most.  Also, they're part of Star Alliance, so you may (emphasizing "may") have opportunities to use your voucher on another Star Alliance airline. 

 

Harris

Denver, CO

 

 

Interesting answer but I believe you are wrong. I purchased 2 REFUNDABLE business class tickets in May of 2019 for a one way flight from Lisbon to Newark. Per TAP Terms and Conditions for Refunds, the European Union governing authority and the US DOT (because they land on our shores) a refund to a bank account or the original method of purchase is due within 7 days of the official request. Having said all that, if we are talking about a non refundable ticket, a voucher is appropriate. TAP is doing everything they can to avoid a true refund. They surprised me with email vouchers, a month after I requested a refund on my "refundable" tickets, they provided a web link for resolution of issues (it doesn't work), they do not answer their "contact us" site and they are ignoring all terms, conditions and laws regarding refunds. I would ot have such a bad attitude towards them if they would condition their Voucher with some terms of......if you are unable to use this voucher within 1 year, we will provide a real refund.

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1 minute ago, MRGACRUZR said:

Interesting answer but I believe you are wrong. I purchased 2 REFUNDABLE business class tickets in May of 2019 for a one way flight from Lisbon to Newark. Per TAP Terms and Conditions for Refunds, the European Union governing authority and the US DOT (because they land on our shores) a refund to a bank account or the original method of purchase is due within 7 days of the official request. Having said all that, if we are talking about a non refundable ticket, a voucher is appropriate. TAP is doing everything they can to avoid a true refund. They surprised me with email vouchers, a month after I requested a refund on my "refundable" tickets, they provided a web link for resolution of issues (it doesn't work), they do not answer their "contact us" site and they are ignoring all terms, conditions and laws regarding refunds. I would ot have such a bad attitude towards them if they would condition their Voucher with some terms of......if you are unable to use this voucher within 1 year, we will provide a real refund.

You present a completely different situation than the original poster, to whom my answer was directed. 

 

You clearly state you purchased a refundable ticket.  Those tickets are cancellable by the purchaser, and a refund will be issued.  One usually pays more for a refundable ticket.  Additionally, regardless of whether the ticket purchased was refundable or a non-refundable ticket, if the airline cancels the flight, it must refund the purchase price to the customer.  That's the DOT rule you reference above. 

 

That being said, pretty much all airlines are doing all they can to avoid refunding those tickets for flights they've cancelled.  Most have been fairly transparent that they are trying to hold cash, for business survival cash flow; and therefore offering vouchers.  Their motive is understandable, but the US DOT has been very clear that the current crisis does not change the rule. 

 

In the position you describe, your best course of action would be to initiate a charge back with your credit card company.  You will be asked to document your efforts to resolve the issue with TAP, and you've clearly taken reasonable steps without success, so the credit card dispute process will be fairly simple. 

 

The original post presented a less clear scenario.  I'm still not clear on whether the OP cancelled their flight before TAP did.   Their original post sounded as if they cancelled first,a nd later posts didn't really clarify. 

 

Your post presents a much clearer picture, and you've already made reasonable efforts to resolve your issue with TAP, so the credit card dispute is the perfect route for you to follow. 

 

Harris

Denver, CO

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On 4/10/2020 at 1:56 PM, kwokpot said:

that

TAP is a European airline, and by law they MUST refund your money

https://fortune.com/2020/04/02/flight-refund-plane-tickets-coronavirus-travel-canceled-trip/

Edit: They are flouting the rules, and regulators are trying to hold them accountable.

So far, they're ignoring their own T&C, European Union Laws and US DOT Laws. I purchased 2 refundable business class tickets, last May. Due to cruise cancellation, I requested a refund on March 13, 2020, before TAP changed their policy to "vouchers" as the only form of refund. They emailed vouchers to me a month after I requested the refund back to my Amex. So far, all contact with them leads to dead ends and web sites, they provided on the vouchers for contact, that dont exist. Because I have a refundable ticket and I requested the refund before their "policy" change they have allowed me to contact their refund department (by email only). If I had a non refundable ticket, I would be grateful for the voucher. 

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19 hours ago, Lois R said:

Well, after all this-----I just got an email from TAP saying I have a voucher for the amount I paid originally. I DON'T WANT A VOUCHER.

I want my VISA credited back.   I guess I will have to call TAP tomorrow about it.

Hi Lois, Tap offered m a voucher also, I did not complete the form,  have filed a dispute with my bank.

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7 minutes ago, skings said:

Hi Lois, Tap offered m a voucher also, I did not complete the form,  have filed a dispute with my bank.

They emailed two vouchers to me, last night, for a refund requested March 13th on a refundable ticket. I did not see any form to complete for the vouchers. Just a "contact us" website that goes nowhere. I contacted them this morning and they referred me to the refunds department. Not sure if this us going anywhere but, I'll play along, for now.

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, omeinv said:

You present a completely different situation than the original poster, to whom my answer was directed. 

 

You clearly state you purchased a refundable ticket.  Those tickets are cancellable by the purchaser, and a refund will be issued.  One usually pays more for a refundable ticket.  Additionally, regardless of whether the ticket purchased was refundable or a non-refundable ticket, if the airline cancels the flight, it must refund the purchase price to the customer.  That's the DOT rule you reference above. 

 

That being said, pretty much all airlines are doing all they can to avoid refunding those tickets for flights they've cancelled.  Most have been fairly transparent that they are trying to hold cash, for business survival cash flow; and therefore offering vouchers.  Their motive is understandable, but the US DOT has been very clear that the current crisis does not change the rule. 

 

In the position you describe, your best course of action would be to initiate a charge back with your credit card company.  You will be asked to document your efforts to resolve the issue with TAP, and you've clearly taken reasonable steps without success, so the credit card dispute process will be fairly simple. 

 

The original post presented a less clear scenario.  I'm still not clear on whether the OP cancelled their flight before TAP did.   Their original post sounded as if they cancelled first,a nd later posts didn't really clarify. 

 

Your post presents a much clearer picture, and you've already made reasonable efforts to resolve your issue with TAP, so the credit card dispute is the perfect route for you to follow. 

 

Harris

Denver, CO

I have to admit that Delta has been outstanding to us regarding refunds, vouchers, miles redeposit and Sky Miles Medallion membership extensions. Considering their position, they've been generous. I also have to say that if this ever ends we will fly with them 10 to 15 times a year and that makes a voucher, for a nonrefundable ticket, useful. The chances of travelling on TAP Air by 4/12/2021 is slim and none. Useless voucher. Thanks for your advice about contacting Amex for a dispute. I've been saving that as a last resort and trying to work the system as it was meant to operate. In the end we may have to invent a trip to use the voucher. That may not be that bad.

Edited by MRGACRUZR
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It has been two weeks and I am still waiting for AMX to send me the vouchers from TAP as email stated.  UGG!!!

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53 minutes ago, MRGACRUZR said:

They emailed two vouchers to me, last night, for a refund requested March 13th on a refundable ticket. I did not see any form to complete for the vouchers. Just a "contact us" website that goes nowhere. I contacted them this morning and they referred me to the refunds department. Not sure if this us going anywhere but, I'll play along, for now.

 

Hi, I emailed them today as well.    I spoke with a rep on the phone and she provided me an email address to

refunds. I know this may sound a bit odd, but my flights were really cheap and I am not going to stress over this

thing.  I will give it a couple of more times but if they don't issue the actual refund? I am going to just leave things

as they are...…..if I don't use the vouchers? Oh well.

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Posted (edited)
6 minutes ago, Lois R said:

 

Hi, I emailed them today as well.    I spoke with a rep on the phone and she provided me an email address to

refunds. I know this may sound a bit odd, but my flights were really cheap and I am not going to stress over this

thing.  I will give it a couple of more times but if they don't issue the actual refund? I am going to just leave things

as they are...…..if I don't use the vouchers? Oh well.

Me too but, dont tell TAP. It shouldn't be that easy for them to steal.

Edited by MRGACRUZR
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19 hours ago, MRGACRUZR said:

So far, they're ignoring their own T&C, European Union Laws and US DOT Laws. I purchased 2 refundable business class tickets, last May. Due to cruise cancellation, I requested a refund on March 13, 2020, before TAP changed their policy to "vouchers" as the only form of refund. They emailed vouchers to me a month after I requested the refund back to my Amex. So far, all contact with them leads to dead ends and web sites, they provided on the vouchers for contact, that dont exist. Because I have a refundable ticket and I requested the refund before their "policy" change they have allowed me to contact their refund department (by email only). If I had a non refundable ticket, I would be grateful for the voucher. 

 

If you bought refundable tickets, requested a refund and did not get it, then I would dispute the charge with American Express, providing them proof that you bought a refundable ticket and received vouchers in lieu of a refund.

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My tickets were nonrefundable, but Tap cancelled flight. As did Norwegian and MSC.  Chase says it will take more than normal time to investigate my 

dispute. Since I wont be travelling anywhere Tap or Norwegian flies, I will wait and see how this all pans out.

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Very interesting reading.

TAP cancelled our outbound flight (YUL-FCO via LIS) on June 15th, subsequently, my cruise was cancelled.

Our return flight (DUB-YUL via LIS) is still flying.

 

I have looked through my ticket and cannot find if it is refundable or not.  I have not called TAP, as I do not know what is going to happen in midJuly,  a family wedding was planned, but has not been cancelled, though they have a Plan B ... to date not cancelled.   I booked the tickets in Plus category ... I did see a price for Refund (USD80) per segment, I hate to assume it is refundable.

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On 4/29/2020 at 12:38 AM, br_luv2travl said:

Very interesting reading.

TAP cancelled our outbound flight (YUL-FCO via LIS) on June 15th, subsequently, my cruise was cancelled.

Our return flight (DUB-YUL via LIS) is still flying.

 

I have looked through my ticket and cannot find if it is refundable or not.  I have not called TAP, as I do not know what is going to happen in midJuly,  a family wedding was planned, but has not been cancelled, though they have a Plan B ... to date not cancelled.   I booked the tickets in Plus category ... I did see a price for Refund (USD80) per segment, I hate to assume it is refundable.

 

The easy answer is that if you could afford the ticket, it was probably a non-refundable ticket.  Typically, the cost of refundable tickets is exorbitant, and the reason most people take their chances with non-refundable tickets.   That said, due to current circumstances, airlines may be allowing refunds on otherwise non-refundable tickets, but charging a fee to do so. 

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Bit late to the party here, but just to say that the Portuguese government will not let TAP go down. They have said they will nationalise it if that is what it takes to ensure its survival.

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Add me to the list frustrated by the ever growing push by carriers to insist on us having vouchers. Since my July 2020 cruise has now officially been cancelled, our extended European vacation is also a no-go. I booked TAP in business class Toronto-Lisbon-Amsterdam to get over there. I also booked same class for Stockholm-Lisbon-Toronto with a 4 day stopover in Lisbon on the way home. I carefully read the tickets and the booking does say there will be a smallish charge for the cancellations if I need to but essentially the point is that most of the fare paid would be refunded. At least this is back in 2019 when I booked the tickets almost a year in advance.

 

Now that I am trying to cancel I get TAP only offering a voucher for the refund. Like what? I feel much more secure if I had my money back especially if we don't plan to go to Europe in the next year. To add insult to injury I found they even had already cancelled my Toronto to Lisbon direct flights and replaced them with a change of planes in the Azores which meant an additional stop on the way in each direction. There was no previous emails on that change so I only became aware of that last night. 

 

I realize the airlines need to have cash to stay operational but why should we who have worked hard for the money have to be the ones to lose out?

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