Air Canada, West Jet, & Pearson

[DHP1]

3 minutes ago, Oceangoer2 said:

Absolutely no offense...thought it was a nice way to thank him for being so helpful.

Thanks. 

[mousefan73]

Just my last two cents as an American here in this board. I highly doubt anyone is quarantining  for 11 days in the US. If you test positive in the US and you have no symptoms, consider it an extended vacation. On the negative side, there’s cost and additional time off involved with that

[DirtyDawg]

4 hours ago, bcwife76 said:

Changes are coming.....

 

https://www.cbc.ca/news/business/pcr-test-travel-canada-1.6347334

The Feds may drop PCR test requirement for "fully vaccinated" Canadians next week but I suspect that "fully vaccinated" will also be changed to those who have had their booster shot too. 

[lots-of-km2]

7 minutes ago, mousefan73 said:

I highly doubt anyone is quarantining  for 11 days in the US.

 

Nah -- Canadians are generally pretty compliant with rules.  Big cultural difference between Americans and Canadians.  

[Liverpoolfan181]

7 hours ago, ceilidh1 said:

I'm nervous about testing positive on a PCR even if not contagious (supposedly you can still test positive for up to 6 months after having had Covid?) We all got it in January but we have no PCR test proof of it since we can't get PCR testing in BC, or any testing for that matter...lol

 

Exactly this! Ontario as well. 

[mom says]

33 minutes ago, DirtyDawg said:

The Feds may drop PCR test requirement for "fully vaccinated" Canadians next week but I suspect that "fully vaccinated" will also be changed to those who have had their booster shot too. 

I certainly hope so.

[1kaper]

2 hours ago, mousefan73 said:

Just my last two cents as an American here in this board. I highly doubt anyone is quarantining  for 11 days in the US. If you test positive in the US and you have no symptoms, consider it an extended vacation. On the negative side, there’s cost and additional time off involved with that

Assuming everyone in your group tests positive at the same time. 
 

I followed one Canadian who was cruising with her husband. He tested positive. She didn’t. 
When they got off the ship, she was allowed to go out the entire time but didn’t. Even after he was over his quarantine period they didn’t do much because if she picked it up somewhere else and tested positive before their return, it would mean staying longer. 
 

spoiler alert - she did end up picking it up but only tested positive when she got home. 
 

[broberts]

5 hours ago, mousefan73 said:

Let me give a perspective from a non-Canadian view. The real issue is not the preflight PCR test for us. Because if we’re positive we just stay home. Unlike you Canadians you’re kind of screwed because then you can’t get home. The issue for us, especially those I have cruises booked from Vancouver is that let’s say you fly and fully maxed, negative PCR preflight test and are chosen for random testing. How are you guaranteed you’re going to make your ship on time. Are the days now gone where you fly in the morning of?Which IMO was  always a risky thing anyways and I would never personally do. So my mom and I booked a flight  to arrive two days before our sailing. Reading immigration experience is like some posted above makes me wonder what if I’m randomly chosen, which I found out means basically everyone anyways from overseas, how long do I have to wait until I get my test results. That folks is the conundrum for people who have cruises booked out of Canada right now. People in my Vancouver departingCruise group are dropping like flies And canceling. It’s 12 weeks until our sail date It’s simply too much money on the line with flights and hotels with  the big unknown. 

 

Canadians can always return to Canada. It is a mistake to say that we can't go home while COVID positive.

 

We will have to see what GOC decides, but there is no reason why it couldn't treat catching a cruise as voyage continuation. People selected for a test are allowed to continue their voyage before and regardless of test results.

 

 

4 hours ago, Russ Lomas said:

...

 

-being forced to quarantine in the US for 11 days before being permitted to reenter my home country.  Our provincial government and the CDC is saying 5 days, our federal government is still saying 11 days

 

-loss of wages when forced to stay in the US when if we were permitted to return to Canada and isolate there (for only 5 days) you could likely work from home for many of us

 

-issue of what happens if you must isolate in the US but the rest of your party tests negative.  Do you send you wife and kids back home while you stay in the US, or keep the whole family together?

 

 - with testing done AFTER you disembark, we run the risk on not getting our results in time for our noon flight (when we booked originally, RCCL was doing the tests ON the ship the day prior to disembarkation, so this was not a risk, so the noon flight time was fine)

 

People are not forced to quarantine for 11 days before returning to Canada. It's advice, just like the advice not to cruise at this time.

 

Don't blame the government for the consequences of personal decisions.

Edited February 12, 2022 by broberts

[broberts]

5 hours ago, mousefan73 said:

Let me give a perspective from a non-Canadian view. The real issue is not the preflight PCR test for us. Because if we’re positive we just stay home. Unlike you Canadians you’re kind of screwed because then you can’t get home. The issue for us, especially those I have cruises booked from Vancouver is that let’s say you fly and fully maxed, negative PCR preflight test and are chosen for random testing. How are you guaranteed you’re going to make your ship on time. Are the days now gone where you fly in the morning of?Which IMO was  always a risky thing anyways and I would never personally do. So my mom and I booked a flight  to arrive two days before our sailing. Reading immigration experience is like some posted above makes me wonder what if I’m randomly chosen, which I found out means basically everyone anyways from overseas, how long do I have to wait until I get my test results. That folks is the conundrum for people who have cruises booked out of Canada right now. People in my Vancouver departingCruise group are dropping like flies And canceling. It’s 12 weeks until our sail date It’s simply too much money on the line with flights and hotels with  the big unknown. 

 

Canadians can always return to Canada. It is a mistake to say that we can't go home while COVID positive.

 

We will have to see what GOC decides, but there is no reason why it couldn't treat catching a cruise ad voyage continuation. People selected for a test are allowed to continue their voyage before and regardless of test results.

 

 

4 hours ago, Russ Lomas said:

...

 

-being forced to quarantine in the US for 11 days before being permitted to reenter my home country.  Our provincial government and the CDC is saying 5 days, our federal government is still saying 11 days

 

-loss of wages when forced to stay in the US when if we were permitted to return to Canada and isolate there (for only 5 days) you could likely work from home for many of us

 

-issue of what happens if you must isolate in the US but the rest of your party tests negative.  Do you send you wife and kids back home while you stay in the US, or keep the whole family together?

 

 - with testing done AFTER you disembark, we run the risk on not getting our results in time for our noon flight (when we booked originally, RCCL was doing the tests ON the ship the day prior to disembarkation, so this was not a risk, so the noon flight time was fine)

 

People are not forced to quarantine for 11 days before returning to Canada. It's advice, just like the advice not to cruise at this time.

 

Don't blame the government for the consequences of personal decisions.

[waiting2retire]

1 hour ago, broberts said:

Canadians can always return to Canada. It is a mistake to say that we can't go home while COVID positive.

Currently, if I test positive while in Costa Rica, I can’t get on a plane to Canada. Therefore I can’t go home. I don’t understand your statement. 

[broberts]

48 minutes ago, waiting2retire said:

Currently, if I test positive while in Costa Rica, I can’t get on a plane to Canada. Therefore I can’t go home. I don’t understand your statement. 

 

Sure you can. Drive, charter a private plane, probably several other ways. Why would you want to put others on a commercial flight at risk?

[DirtyDawg]

8 hours ago, broberts said:

 

Sure you can. Drive, charter a private plane, probably several other ways. Why would you want to put others on a commercial flight at risk?

When we were planning our trip to the Dominican Republic in December I looked into chartering a private plane as a 'Plan B' just incase one of us tested positive. (The swim, drive combo was ruled out right away as I couldn't fit my water wings into our luggage 😁) I soon found out that chartering a private plane was a wee bit too expensive just to get back up to the frozen northland. So, we got the best roaming packages we could get to be able to stream my lectures, and for Mrs. Dawg to work, and we prepared to quarantine in the DR for the required period (15 days at that point). We ended up testing negative on the PCR test (btw the cost was $200 Cdn - heck I tipped more that that during the trip) but I tested positive after we landed back in Toronto. The results took forever to get back which was annoying, but our previous planning made that isolation really a non-issue. 

 

As travelers we always have had to do lots of research and comply with regulations regarding international travel; getting passports, visa, shots, etc. Why is Covid so different?  Sure PCR testing is inconvenient but it is not stopping anybody from travelling if they really want to. 

 

Enjoy your next trip!

 

 

Edited February 12, 2022 by DirtyDawg

[1kaper]

8 hours ago, broberts said:

 

Sure you can. Drive, charter a private plane, probably several other ways. Why would you want to put others on a commercial flight at risk?

Sure but that isn’t realistic for many of us. 
 

In my situation if one of us tests positive we are staying out until negative or past the 10 days. 
well. Maybe some of us will go home but whoever is positive will stay. 
a private jet and even flying is way more costly than staying. 

[broberts]

39 minutes ago, 1kaper said:

Sure but that isn’t realistic for many of us. 
 

In my situation if one of us tests positive we are staying out until negative or past the 10 days. 
well. Maybe some of us will go home but whoever is positive will stay. 
a private jet and even flying is way more costly than staying. 

 

I understand. My point was that the claim that GOC was not allowing Canadians to return is false.

 

[lx200gps]

10 minutes ago, broberts said:

 

I understand. My point was that the claim that GOC was not allowing Canadians to return is false.

 

As it currently stands right now, as I understand the current rules, if you present yourself at any Canadian border crossing without a negative COVID test result, you would be subject to about $CAD6000 in fines, though they are not usually enforcing that.  AFAIK, that makes it technically illegal to enter your own country if you are COVID positive.

[broberts]

53 minutes ago, lx200gps said:

As it currently stands right now, as I understand the current rules, if you present yourself at any Canadian border crossing without a negative COVID test result, you would be subject to about $CAD6000 in fines, though they are not usually enforcing that.  AFAIK, that makes it technically illegal to enter your own country if you are COVID positive.

 

No, it just makes it potentially expensive. 

 

If one choses to travel for leisure, against the advice of nearly every country in the world, don't expect any government to make it easy.

[lx200gps]

22 minutes ago, broberts said:

 

No, it just makes it potentially expensive. 

 

If one choses to travel for leisure, against the advice of nearly every country in the world, don't expect any government to make it easy.

We'll have to agree to disagree on that. If one is subject to a fine for doing something (or in this case not doing something like providing correct paperwork), regardless of whether the fine is actually levied, then that act could only be defined as illegal.

[Fouremco]

Under the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms "Every citizen of Canada has the right to enter, remain in and leave Canada." Consequently, the act of entering Canada can never, in and of itself, be considered illegal.

 

On the other hand, consider Canadians who enter Canada while in the possession of prohibited items or undeclared goods in excess of their duty free limit. Or who fail to provide proof of a negative molecular test. Each has entered Canada quite legally, but their actions (or lack thereof) when doing so are what cause the possible infraction.

 

 

 

 

[lx200gps]

1 hour ago, Fouremco said:

Under the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms "Every citizen of Canada has the right to enter, remain in and leave Canada." Consequently, the act of entering Canada can never, in and of itself, be considered illegal.

 

On the other hand, consider Canadians who enter Canada while in the possession of prohibited items or undeclared goods in excess of their duty free limit. Or who fail to provide proof of a negative molecular test. Each has entered Canada quite legally, but their actions (or lack thereof) when doing so are what cause the possible infraction.

 

 

 

 

Very murky waters here, the stuff of what pedants are made of ;o).   This seems to be a contradiction and I'm not sure I agree that they have "entered Canada "quite legally". You are saying that they are entering Canada "legally", yet can be fined more than $6000 for doing so by failing to provide proper documentation.   Yes, I absolutely agree, no Canadian will be turned away at the border, but being threatened by, or receiving, what for some is a crushing legal penalty makes this considered an illegal act. How could he feds fine someone for doing something that is legal?

[broberts]

17 minutes ago, lx200gps said:

Very murky waters here, the stuff of what pedants are made of ;o).   This seems to be a contradiction and I'm not sure I agree that they have "entered Canada "quite legally". You are saying that they are entering Canada "legally", yet can be fined more than $6000 for doing so by failing to provide proper documentation.   Yes, I absolutely agree, no Canadian will be turned away at the border, but being threatened by, or receiving, what for some is a crushing legal penalty makes this considered an illegal act. How could he feds fine someone for doing something that is legal?

 

The action subject to administrative penalty is entering without correct documentation, (lack of a recent negative molecular test). It is not much different than a fine that might be levied by entering without declaring amounts over $10,000.

[lots-of-km2]

There's no prohibition.  But the possible fine is a huge deterrent to flying home with a positive test diagnosis. 

 

In practice, has the fine been levied much, or at all?

[Fouremco]

3 hours ago, lx200gps said:

Very murky waters here, the stuff of what pedants are made of ;o).   This seems to be a contradiction and I'm not sure I agree that they have "entered Canada "quite legally". You are saying that they are entering Canada "legally", yet can be fined more than $6000 for doing so by failing to provide proper documentation.   Yes, I absolutely agree, no Canadian will be turned away at the border, but being threatened by, or receiving, what for some is a crushing legal penalty makes this considered an illegal act. How could he feds fine someone for doing something that is legal?

If I drive into Canada with a .50 cal machine gun hidden in the trunk of my car that I didn't declare, my entry into Canada is perfectly legal but the possession of an undeclared prohibited weapon is not.

 

If I drive into Canada without proof of a negative molecular test, my entry into Canada is perfectly legal but my lack of required documentation is not.

 

There are two separate elements in each case, and we need to treat them as such.

 

And that's all that this pedant has to say on this matter! 😇