Simply more's impact on current bookings?

[Rainbow3fe]

7 hours ago, Hlitner said:

I think the problem with your analysis is doing a direct comparison to private vs cruise line excursions.  They are two completely different things.  A cruise line excursion is generally going to be a large group (the most common will be a bus-load of 50-60 per group). often with stops at touristy shops, restaurants, etc.  A private tour can be as few as 1 person, and can often be customized to the group's own specifications.  A great example is a recent private tour we took in Osaka, where we joined with 1 other couple, hired a private guide, and went off to do our pre-arranged itinerary.  The cost of that tour was actually less than any near-comparable cruise line excursion and we had complete control over our itinerary.

 

Hank

Hi Hank,

  Our Trip to Japan has been rescheduled for 2025. I would appreciate you emailing the Osaka guide's info.

Rainbow3fe at hotmail dot com

     Thanks, 

Felice 🌻😎🌊

[See_More]

8 minutes ago, osandomir said:

I hope that’s the way how it will work. Simple or not simple - it makes a lot of sense for those who utilize ship tours. It’ll allow to book some of your excursions for the discount price that’s cheaper than the regular tour price. I realize that we’re paying for the part of the discount (excursion credit) upfront with Simply More, but there’s an additional discount when you’re booking a certain amount of tours.

I don’t see the shore excursion as a fixed dollar amount as good a deal.  The old O Life choice of shore excursions gave you eg. 4 shore excursions and charged you $100 each which you could use for shore excursions worth up to $199 each.  I found you only needed one one more shore excursion and you were already in the 25% off tours bracket. Now with SM with the dollar value they give you it may only buy 3 or less tours.  It will now make it much more expensive to even reach the 25% off level. 

 

[NYAS]

This is something I’m not clear on yet. If I keep my O life booking with 3 “free” excursions pp, can I still select 3 excursions priced at $199 or less at no charge and then add more for 25% off of 5 or more (including those 3), as in the YWYW offer previously? The excursion ordering mechanism online now does not make that clear, so it’s difficult to compare the SM excursion credit (in my case $400 pp) to the 3 excursions included with O Life. Any thoughts on this?

 

 

 

[Rainbow3fe]

3 minutes ago, NYAS said:

This is something I’m not clear on yet. If I keep my O life booking with 3 “free” excursions pp, can I still select 3 excursions priced at $199 or less at no charge and then add more for 25% off of 5 or more (including those 3), as in the YWYW offer previously? The excursion ordering mechanism online now does not make that clear, so it’s difficult to compare the SM excursion credit (in my case $400 pp) to the 3 excursions included with O Life. Any thoughts on this?

 

 

 

I believe so. At this time I would not do anything online. Wait to speak directly to an Oceania Representative.  Obviously,unless you're leaving within the next few weeks, wait a while.  The phone lines will be jammed.

F

Good luck 😎🌊

[davencl]

30 minutes ago, Rainbow3fe said:

Not true. If you want to get rid of the $199 limit you're going to have to switch to SM and you will

1. Pay a different price for the cruise.

2. Lose your free/ included excursions.

3. Get the "free" beverage package .

    If you choose to use your excursion $$ allowance and book 5 excursions or more pp, you'll get a 25% discount on the excursions. 

 

Good luck 

I went back and rechecked.  Yes you appear to be correct.  My balance due was $0 which I thought meant it was free but the balance was $0 because credits were applied.  Thanks for pointing this out.  FWIW I did not complete the transaction.

Edited July 2, 2023 by davencl

[ak1004]

2 hours ago, pinotlover said:

#2 has been addressed ad naseum. O is going more all inclusive because a much greater audience than us wants them to. Vegans don’t get discounts because they don’t eat lobster and filet. I don’t get a discount because I prefer not to rush back to the ship for lunch and lunch wines. Cruisers going to bed pre 21:30 still pay proportionally for the evening entertainment. On and on. 
 

If you’re obsessed with this drinks issue, you’ll just have to do your own calculations for future voyages. I avoid Oceania shorex, but it’s soon to be in the price. I have to weigh my options.

 

This post is probably the best summary of the last 20 pages of this crazy thread..

 

When we started looking at SS, I was a bit concerned about paying for other people's drinks. We ended up booking 3 SS cruises because the itinerary and the price was right even including drinks. I ended up paying for other people's drinks, but the amount of black caviar that I consumed probably exceeded several drink packages. Other people were paying for my black caviar because some don't like it, and many just didn't know that they can have anywhere anytime, unlimited.

 

I looked at Windstar. Looks very nice, we might consider it. They don't included drinks (positive for me), but they also don't include Wi-Fi and charge $35/day for it. Gratuities are also not included, while for many O regulars they are already included as part of the loyalty program. So for many people this would be an extra $50/day that has to be added to the cruise price. Yes, I noticed that some sailings say "all inclusive" (drinks, Wi-Fi and gratuities for presumably the same price), but we all know there are no free lunches (and no free drinks, free excursions or free Wi-Fi despite O trying to convince us otherwise for the last 20 years).. 

 

So maybe we (non drinkers) should be less obsessed with paying for other people's drinks and more obsessed with the overall value? Things like the overall ship experience, service, food, itineraries, cabins etc. are more important than the extra $50/day. If we want the small ship experience, we are inevitably going to pay for something we don't use, no matter which line we select.

Edited July 2, 2023 by ak1004

[AMHuntFerry]

9 minutes ago, NYAS said:

This is something I’m not clear on yet. If I keep my O life booking with 3 “free” excursions pp, can I still select 3 excursions priced at $199 or less at no charge and then add more for 25% off of 5 or more (including those 3), as in the YWYW offer previously? The excursion ordering mechanism online now does not make that clear, so it’s difficult to compare the SM excursion credit (in my case $400 pp) to the 3 excursions included with O Life. Any thoughts on this?

 

 

 

Ask for the most recent shorex pdf from your TA or O rep. It will have the info that specifically applies to you and your booking.

[AMHuntFerry]

2 minutes ago, ak1004 said:

 

 the price was right

 

 

I'm going to claim that this was the best summary 😉

[JKrise]

2 hours ago, pinotlover said:

If you’re obsessed with this drinks issue….

PinotLover, Well you missed the point, there are some of who like the Oceania product who CANNOT DRINK, but now are forced to purchase an alcohol package.  

BTW,  It is not an ‘obsession’ as you stated, it’s a necessity.  
 

 

[AMHuntFerry]

13 minutes ago, ak1004 said:

 Yes, I noticed that some sailings say "all inclusive" (drinks, Wi-Fi and gratuities for presumably the same price), but we all know there are no free lunches (and no free drinks, free excursions or free Wi-Fi despite O trying to convince us otherwise for the last 20 years).. 

 

So maybe we (non drinkers) should be less obsessed with paying for other people's drinks and more obsessed with the overall value? Things like the overall ship experience, service, food, itineraries, cabins etc. are more important than the extra $50/day. If we want the small ship experience, we are inevitably going to pay for something we don't use, no matter which line we select.

Re Windstar: They have an all-inclusive-package for something like $90 (can't remember) per day, so they have it as a "freebie" on some sailings...similar to O's Ultimate OLife promo.

 

Re: added wine/beer costs for non-drinkers. Let's remember that we are talking about cheap wine and beer. I've seen (from people more savvy than me) that most of the wine offerings RETAIL at about $10 per bottle. The wholesale cost will be significantly less. I'd be surprised if the wine costs O more per serving than the sodas or Vero water we all have access to.

Edited July 2, 2023 by AMHuntFerry
my proofreading stinks!

[grifdoglover]

Que sera, sera

[pinotlover]

14 minutes ago, JKrise said:

PinotLover, Well you missed the point, there are some of who like the Oceania product who CANNOT DRINK, but now are forced to purchase an alcohol package.  

BTW,  It is not an ‘obsession’ as you stated, it’s a necessity.  
 

 

To me it’s an obsession!

 

Which Islamic Airlines are you flying so you don’t pay for anyone’s alcohol? I flew Turkish Airlines BC on my recent Vista cruise. They were tremendous and served great adult beverages! Teatotallers didn’t get a no alcohol discount. They just didn’t imbibe. It’s part of the fare. Starting 7/1 with SM , it’s all part of the O fare. OLife is gone. Moving on may take people on different paths, but we’ll all be moving on regardless.

[Hlitner]

1 hour ago, Rainbow3fe said:

Hi Hank,

  Our Trip to Japan has been rescheduled for 2025. I would appreciate you emailing the Osaka guide's info.

Rainbow3fe at hotmail dot com

     Thanks, 

Felice 🌻😎🌊

Am away from home a few days and will look to see if we still have his card...when we get home,  It was actually booked by the other couple and I think they used Viator (no favorite of mine) but the guide was actually quite good.

 

Hank

[Hlitner]

4 hours ago, Vineyard View said:

I did not know this about SB air. Great information. Thank you. 
I need to check into this. Wonder if they allow miles to be used for upgrade. 

Not sure but I do know it would not be an online option.  That is one of those things you would have to call the cruise line (and maybe get transferred to their air folks).  But keep in mind there are no custom air fees for those kind of calls )

[Hlitner]

6 hours ago, Hanoj said:

Windstar? Im not familiar with them but was on their website yesterday and they offer a cruise only fare.

We have never cruised on Windstar, but the folks we know who have cruised that line we pleased.  Our problem with Windstar is that most of their cruises are quite short (often 7 days) and we tend to book cruises that are much longer (often over a month).

 

Hank

[Jayne E]

Bottom line is it’s a price increase with some “extras” thrown in. Product is still good, so not easy to change. For 1st time since 2007, we will look at Explora1, SS & SB. These previously were not considered, as we always booked Cruise Only. After upcoming 5 cruise only trips, we will take a look.  Explora 1 ship looks beautiful….large cabins and verandahs. Looking forward to reviews after maiden voyage. 

[ak1004]

28 minutes ago, Jayne E said:

Bottom line is it’s a price increase with some “extras” thrown in. Product is still good, so not easy to change. For 1st time since 2007, we will look at Explora1, SS & SB. These previously were not considered, as we always booked Cruise Only. After upcoming 5 cruise only trips, we will take a look.  Explora 1 ship looks beautiful….large cabins and verandahs. Looking forward to reviews after maiden voyage. 

 

I looked at Explora, but their sailings to Europe are around $1,000 USD per night. Sounds a bit steep even for a ultra luxury ships..

 

SB and SS are more reasonable, and in some cases are actually comparable to O. Some sailings start under $500/night. And you will still be paying for things you don't use (like drinks and excursions on SS).

[JKrise]

1 hour ago, pinotlover said:

To me it’s an obsession!

 

Which Islamic Airlines are you flying so you don’t pay for anyone’s alcohol? I flew Turkish Airlines BC on my recent Vista cruise. They were tremendous and served great adult beverages! Teatotallers didn’t get a no alcohol discount. They just didn’t imbibe. It’s part of the fare. Starting 7/1 with SM , it’s all part of the O fare. OLife is gone. Moving on may take people on different paths, but we’ll all be moving on regardless.

Wow....thanks for setting me straight.

Now I know I am on the right path.

[osandomir]

2 hours ago, See_More said:

I don’t see the shore excursion as a fixed dollar amount as good a deal.  The old O Life choice of shore excursions gave you eg. 4 shore excursions and charged you $100 each which you could use for shore excursions worth up to $199 each.  I found you only needed one one more shore excursion and you were already in the 25% off tours bracket. Now with SM with the dollar value they give you it may only buy 3 or less tours.  It will now make it much more expensive to even reach the 25% off level. 

 

That was correct with the OLife if you were able to find tours  which you liked priced close to $199 that wasn’t always possible. With the new program it’ll work better if you choose more or significantly less expensive tours. 

I’ve already said before that new Simply More will work better for some people than others and will have no benefits for those who don’t want to book ship tours at all.

[IWantToLiveOverTheSea]

On 6/16/2023 at 10:12 AM, grifdoglover said:

Basically it’s the same as Viking now.

Yes, that was my first thought, getting closer to Viking's model -- add some excursions so Oceania can say they offer free excursions, plus beer & wine with certain meals, and internet for both people in a room.  And in a way I think they're getting closer to Regent with it's almost completely "included" model.  But for people like myself and spouse, this will make our cost go up, as we almost always book JUST cruise, with nothing else.  And since we rarely drink anything, the alcohol additions are worthless.  So is the internet for a second person.  But some people really hate the one internet account per room, so i guess overall that's a good move for Oceania now that it's getting Starlink.  And I suppose if I have a lot of excursion credit to offset my increased cruise only cost, it won't hurt me to go on more excursions. So we'll see.....

 

I priced out my currently booked cruise (final payment due in August) on the website and it looked like we'd be paying $2K more (for the two of us)  for a 15 day cruise in a B3.  It appears we'd still be getting the "early booking discount" if we switched now (if it's possible to switch to More now).  But we'd gain $1K to use for excursions.

 

Overall, I loved that Oceania used to be so a la carte.  But many people are confused by the choices, so perhaps it's better for O to gravitate toward a simpler model.  But I need to start budgeting more $$ for their "MORE" program.

 

Edited July 3, 2023 by IWantToLiveOverTheSea

[IWantToLiveOverTheSea]

On 6/16/2023 at 2:46 PM, susiesan said:

Azamara pricing includes gratuities, self service laundry, wine and beer with meals. You don't have to pay for shore ex you don't want to use or an upgraded beverage package that has the spirits on it. Azamara does not include dining in the specialty restaurants. You can buy the extras if you want. Their prices are comparable to oceania's prices now for cruise only. before I booked a Croatia intensive cruise for Sept. 24, I looked at O's version of the same cruise. AZ came out ahead plus I get a $500 rebate check after the cruise. Also, AZ has not shortened port times like O has done on all of their itineraries.

Much has been said about Oceania's shortening of port times.  However, on our April cruise, on a 14 or 15 day cruise to at least 10 ports, only 4 hours were shaved off.  While I love being in port as long as possible, I didn't find the loss of 3 hours problematic.  Many times I'm back on board an hour early anyway, so it was no big deal.

 

[1985rz1]

One needs to be careful in assuming that under OLife one always doubles the value of the nominal $100 paid per excursion.  While it's true that one can chose excursions up to $199 for each OLife excursion, the reality is not every choice will be at that maximum value.  We've found that averaged over all the OLife selections on a given cruise, the actual value is more like $160 to $175 per excursion.

[osandomir]

25 minutes ago, IWantToLiveOverTheSea said:

Yes, that was my first thought, getting closer to Viking's model -- add some excursions so Oceania can say they offer free excursions, plus beer & wine with certain meals, and internet for both people in a room.  And in a way I think they're getting closer to Regent with it's almost completely "included" model.  But for people like myself and spouse, this will make our cost go up, as we almost always book JUST cruise, with nothing else.  And since we rarely drink anything, the alcohol additions are worthless.  So is the internet for a second person.  But some people really hate the one internet account per room, so i guess overall that's a good move for Oceania now that it's getting Starlink.  And I suppose if I have a lot of excursion credit to offset my increased cruise only cost, it won't hurt me to go on more excursions. So we'll see.....

 

I priced out my currently booked cruise (final payment due in August) on the website and it looked like we'd be paying $2K more (for the two of us)  for a 15 day cruise in a B3.  It appears we'd still be getting the "early booking discount" if we switched now (if it's possible to switch to More now).  But we'd gain $1K to use for excursions.

 

Overall, I loved that Oceania used to be so a la carte.  But many people are confused by the choices, so perhaps it's better for O to gravitate toward a simpler model.  But I need to start budgeting more $$ for their "MORE" program.

 

I really like your attitude. We’ve been sailing with Oceania since 2012, so obviously we like what they were offering. In the beginning we booked a lot of private tours or just explored independently. Lately we started to book more ship tours because on every cruise we normally have a significant amount of OBC from different sources. We use it mostly on the ship tours as we’re not interested in spending on the overpriced spa treatments or shopping in the boutiques.

 

I think we’ll keep our current bookings with the OLife, but the new model will probably work for us in the future. Yes, Oceania wants all of us to book their tours to bring more revenue and don’t want to sell a la carte cruises anymore. I’d like to have more options, but from the business point of view I can understand that, and I definitely don’t want them to go bankrupt like Vantage just did. Overall, the prices will go up anyway, but look around - almost everything is more expensive now.
So why would one expect the cruises to be different. At least we all have a choice to book with any of the cruise lines or not book at all.

[Hlitner]

I will admit to not liking either Viking or O's new model.  Why?  DW and I are very independent travelers and strongly dislike most large group cruise line (or private) excursions.  In most ports around the world we simply do our own thing and will sometimes join with a very few others to book a private tour (usually when we cannot reasonably do it on our own).  When forced to pay for shore excursions as part of a fare, we will look at the options and try to find the least offensive (to us) shore excursion or just eat the cost.  But since we routinely compare many cruise lines (and look for the best itinerary/value) the new O model will generally drive us towards other cruise lines that do not include the cost of excursions (i.e. Seabourn, Silverseas, Princess, Azamara, etc).  We have never booked O until our recent booking because we never thought that O offered a reasonably value when compared to some of the competition.  Consider that we have previously booked several Seabourn cruises for under $400 per person day (which includes a suite, tips, all drinks, unlimited internet) which also got us a luxury line with space ratios above 70 (tons per person).  O, on the other hand, usually cost over $300 per person day for a basic veranda cabin and did not include booze, tips, Internet for 2 persons, caviar, etc.  

 

While Flatbush Flyer disagrees, we have long argued that the major negative of "O" (in terms of value) is their awful air program for anyone that wants Business Class and customized perks.  Most other cruise lines do not have extra charges for custom air and many lines have online booking engines which let folks choose their flights, airports, dates, airlines, etc.  We once were able to pay for a Princess European cruise with the savings we got from booking our Biz Class Air through their air booking engine vs the normal business class fare.  No way would we ever trust a cruise (or river cruise) line to simply book our air without letting us choose the flights.

 

Hank

 

 

[ak1004]

19 minutes ago, Hlitner said:

I will admit to not liking either Viking or O's new model.  Why?  DW and I are very independent travelers and strongly dislike most large group cruise line (or private) excursions.  In most ports around the world we simply do our own thing and will sometimes join with a very few others to book a private tour (usually when we cannot reasonably do it on our own).  When forced to pay for shore excursions as part of a fare, we will look at the options and try to find the least offensive (to us) shore excursion or just eat the cost.  But since we routinely compare many cruise lines (and look for the best itinerary/value) the new O model will generally drive us towards other cruise lines that do not include the cost of excursions (i.e. Seabourn, Silverseas, Princess, Azamara, etc).  We have never booked O until our recent booking because we never thought that O offered a reasonably value when compared to some of the competition.  Consider that we have previously booked several Seabourn cruises for under $400 per person day (which includes a suite, tips, all drinks, unlimited internet) which also got us a luxury line with space ratios above 70 (tons per person).  O, on the other hand, usually cost over $300 per person day for a basic veranda cabin and did not include booze, tips, Internet for 2 persons, caviar, etc.  

 

While Flatbush Flyer disagrees, we have long argued that the major negative of "O" (in terms of value) is their awful air program for anyone that wants Business Class and customized perks.  Most other cruise lines do not have extra charges for custom air and many lines have online booking engines which let folks choose their flights, airports, dates, airlines, etc.  We once were able to pay for a Princess European cruise with the savings we got from booking our Biz Class Air through their air booking engine vs the normal business class fare.  No way would we ever trust a cruise (or river cruise) line to simply book our air without letting us choose the flights.

 

Hank

 

 

Hank, two small corrections.

 

SS does include excursions and does charge air deviation fee.