New Mobility Scooter Restrictions that weren't in force earlier in 2023

[Sarah W.]

10 hours ago, chengkp75 said:

I sympathize with your situation, but I feel it is more of a "caveat emptor" situation, where you did not read/understand all the terms and conditions of your booking, regardless of how many previous times you booked a cruise, thinking you met those terms and conditions.

Given that I was not told anything about this issues prior to ANY of my 3 previous cruises, or for the upcoming one until weeks after I was booked; and the disability sheets for each cruise line; and had 3 successful cruises without issues, makes me wonder why you would seem to be critical of me for "thinking" that I had met the terms!

 

It is Cunard who has changed the rules, and they admit that. Their decision is hopefully going to backfire on the company, since they have very definitely dropped the ball as far as how they have dealt with me, previously a loyal Cunard passenger (going back to 1966 when I was a child). 

[Victoria2]

37 minutes ago, Sarah W. said:

Given that I was not told anything about this issues prior to ANY of my 3 previous cruises, or for the upcoming one until weeks after I was booked; and the disability sheets for each cruise line; and had 3 successful cruises without issues, makes me wonder why you would seem to be critical of me for "thinking" that I had met the terms!

 

It is Cunard who has changed the rules, and they admit that. Their decision is hopefully going to backfire on the company, since they have very definitely dropped the ball as far as how they have dealt with me, previously a loyal Cunard passenger (going back to 1966 when I was a child). 

If you managed to board a Cunard ship with a foldable scooter for an inside cabin, you slipped through the usual net. There have been one or two threads over the past year or two on how folk didn't read the blurb [an Australian passenger rings a bell] and weren't able to take their micro foldable scooter with them as they were booked into a regular cabin.

 

Bottom line is Cunard have NOT changed 'the rules'. The rules have been there for years and in their T&Cs [I looked at the UK '22'23 brochure and they are there] and this is from the 21/22 US brochure

Mobility scooters will only be permitted on board if guests have booked into a wheelchair-accessible stateroom, or a suite, as these are the only types of accommodation where mobility scooters can safely be stored.

 

What they have changed is making 'the rules' more prominent for those who weren't aware of them/ didn't read the T&C/blurb and unless Canada was totally out of sync with most other countries, without being rude, that means your agent and yourself.

 

They have not dropped any balls and in fact, by pointing their policy out in almost banner headlines, will have saved some folk heartache by being denied boarding at their own expense and will have doubled  down on any safety aspects for any form of disablement in an emergency at sea.

 

I for one am very happy the ship will be a safer place for all passengers.

 

 

[Sarah W.]

1 minute ago, Victoria2 said:

I for one am very happy the ship will be a safer place for all passengers.

You have made it abundantly clear what your position is, and your biases, no matter how much it hurts people who (for no clear reason), have previously and successfully gone on cruises without issues and with their scooters, including after filling in each line's  "On-board needs’ questionnaire." And given the huge corporations such as the one under which Cunard is, this movement is likely to spread to other cruise lines. As I mentioned to one individual, it is only when you lose rights yourself that you realize what you have lost, and those rights are not likely to be reclaimed.

 

By the way, on the QE, I was in Cabin 7053 (Deck 7) on cruise Q320 that left Vancouver on June 8th, 2023, and it was NOT a disabled cabin.

 

I could easily be insulted by your inference that I didn't really go on any of the 3 cruises I went on this year in regular inside cabins (1 with Cunard, 1 with Princess, and 1 with Holland America), without any issues with any of the 3 cruise lines. But that is not a reflection on me. All 3 by the way, are members of the same owners group as far as I am aware.

 

As one other commenter stated who is currently booked on 3 upcoming Cunard cruises, he also saw the prominent virtual sticker about this changed policy that is there any time you open up your Cunard Booking Confirmation. But you know what, there is NO mention that you must be in a Disabled Cabin if you bring a scooter, or plan to use one. I have already paid a 74% Single Supplement as a single cruiser, but the now required Disability cabin would tack on an additional almost $500 additional to the cruise that I didn't have to pay when in cabin 7053. I had zero issues when initially boarding all 3 ships since I had done what was required. And that was the feeble excuse Cunard used for making this change! I was not denied boarding on any 2023 cruise.

 

One paragraph that I find quite laughable is the following, given that it is doublespeak while actually doing the absolute opposite:

We take pride in being inclusive and we want to make sure we get it right. That’s why we’re working with Shaw Trust, a leading UK charity dedicated to challenging inequality and breaking down barriers to enable social mobility, to continue to improve the on-board experience for guests with accessibility requirements.  

[Victoria2]

 

Insulted?  I believe I said if you travelled on QE this year and I will also repeat, you slipped through the net. That does not infer you didn't travel. It says. you slipped through the net. I have no knowledge of any other cruise line.

 

You can argue 'til you're blue in the face but the facts are, the need to book a suitable cabin are  in black and white in the brochure/online brochure.

 

The idea is, you read the blurb before you book, not afterwards so there will be little or no surprises

 

and to double down, this is from 2019 US brochure so nothing has changed in the actual policies, just the method of bringing it to the fore for those who don't read T&Cs

 

Can guests with disabilities travel? All guests requiring specific assistance, facilities or equipment on board, or wishing to bring such equipment on board, must advise Cunard Line at the time of booking and are requested to complete a questionnaire after booking to ensure we have all the information we need to cater adequately for your requirements...

 

...Mobility scooters will only be permitted on board if guests have booked into a wheelchair accessible stateroom, or a suite, as these are the only types of accommodation where mobility scooters can safely be stored. The minimum door width of suites is 53 cm (21 in). The minimum door width of the wheelchair accessible staterooms is 80 cm (31 in). At the time of booking, please let us know if you intend on bringing a mobility scooter with you, and we will in turn provide you with a questionnaire for completion to ensure that the accommodation you have booked is appropriate.

 

The facts are there. You must have missed them but now you are aware for any  uture cruises, if you ever decide to cruise with Cunard again.

 

edit

and to quote chengkp75  I sympathize with your situation, but I feel it is more of a "caveat emptor" situation, where you did not read/understand all the terms and conditions of your booking, regardless of how many previous times you booked a cruise, thinking you met those terms and conditions.

 

and I would add, were allowed to board in spite of the rules. In this case, it seems as if Cunard policies are now being enforced, as they should have been all along.

Edited December 20, 2023 by Victoria2

[Winifred 22]

26 minutes ago, Sarah W. said:

You have made it abundantly clear what your position is, and your biases, no matter how much it hurts people who (for no clear reason), have previously and successfully gone on cruises without issues and with their scooters, including after filling in each line's  "On-board needs’ questionnaire." And given the huge corporations such as the one under which Cunard is, this movement is likely to spread to other cruise lines. As I mentioned to one individual, it is only when you lose rights yourself that you realize what you have lost, and those rights are not likely to be reclaimed.

 

By the way, on the QE, I was in Cabin 7053 (Deck 7) on cruise Q320 that left Vancouver on June 8th, 2023, and it was NOT a disabled cabin.

 

I could easily be insulted by your inference that I didn't really go on any of the 3 cruises I went on this year in regular inside cabins (1 with Cunard, 1 with Princess, and 1 with Holland America), without any issues with any of the 3 cruise lines. But that is not a reflection on me. All 3 by the way, are members of the same owners group as far as I am aware.

 

As one other commenter stated who is currently booked on 3 upcoming Cunard cruises, he also saw the prominent virtual sticker about this changed policy that is there any time you open up your Cunard Booking Confirmation. But you know what, there is NO mention that you must be in a Disabled Cabin if you bring a scooter, or plan to use one. I have already paid a 74% Single Supplement as a single cruiser, but the now required Disability cabin would tack on an additional almost $500 additional to the cruise that I didn't have to pay when in cabin 7053. I had zero issues when initially boarding all 3 ships since I had done what was required. And that was the feeble excuse Cunard used for making this change! I was not denied boarding on any 2023 cruise.

 

One paragraph that I find quite laughable is the following, given that it is doublespeak while actually doing the absolute opposite:

We take pride in being inclusive and we want to make sure we get it right. That’s why we’re working with Shaw Trust, a leading UK charity dedicated to challenging inequality and breaking down barriers to enable social mobility, to continue to improve the on-board experience for guests with accessibility requirements.  

Why is this laughable ?  They are allowing people with mobility issues onboard with their equipment and being pro active with regards to catering before boarding for those with a variety of issues. With all due respect it seems your gripe with Cunard is that you have to now have to pay extra for an accessible cabin albeit probably a better cabin in a  better position so attracts a premium. Your issues with  paying a single supplement is irrelevant to the accessibility argument.  I don’t know the booking regulations in Canada but you may be able to get a refund? I  hope you manage to find a more suitable line in the future for your needs but I would suggest you read their T and C’s thoroughly before booking  to avoid disappointment, in case  you miss something relevant again.  

[exlondoner]

None of us think the ship is going to sink, and it probably won’t. But shipping companies are bound to plan on the basis it might. Imagine if it did, and there were too many wheelchair users for the crew to find and evacuate. Imagine the gripping headlines: ‘Disabled passengers abandoned and left to drown by heartless cruise line.’

[maggielou362]

I can only speak from my very limited experience, but when booking directly with Cunard online from Australia I recall that the booking form specifically asks if mobility assistance is required, and if "yes" is selected, various "pop-up" reminders, advice and conditions appear, to which the passenger needs to acknowledge acceptance of those conditions. Also, the booking confirmations I have received for two voyages clearly state that mobility scooters are not permitted in the allocated cabin as below:

 

Received 4th October 2022:

 

Stateroom / Cat :	5023  / BZ
Beds:	King Bed
Cabin Document Notes: No Mobility Scooters shower Only Metal Front Balcony Sheltered Balcony

 

and received 8th November 2023:

Stateroom / Cat :	6095  / BA
Beds:	King Bed
Cabin Document Notes: No Mobility Scooters shower Only Balcony

 

(my red emphasis added)

I am not "making excuses for cruise lines" nor am I "not...really concerned about human rights issues".

I hope you can find a way to enjoy your next cruise, @Sarah W.

[Sarah W.]

8 hours ago, maggielou362 said:

I can only speak from my very limited experience, but when booking directly with Cunard online from Australia I recall that the booking form specifically asks if mobility assistance is required, and if "yes" is selected, various "pop-up" reminders, advice and conditions appear, to which the passenger needs to acknowledge acceptance of those conditions. Also, the booking confirmations I have received for two voyages clearly state that mobility scooters are not permitted in the allocated cabin as below:.........

Received 4th October 2022:

 

Stateroom / Cat :	5023  / BZ
Beds:	King Bed
Cabin Document Notes: No Mobility Scooters shower Only Metal Front Balcony Sheltered Balcony

 

and received 8th November 2023:

Stateroom / Cat :	6095  / BA
Beds:	King Bed
Cabin Document Notes: No Mobility Scooters shower Only Balcony

 

(my red emphasis added)

I hope you can find a way to enjoy your next cruise, @Sarah W.

Thanks for your kind thoughts. By the way, I didn't receive anything like what you received in regards to your staterooms. The big problem that I have had was NOT on my previous 3 cruises, but a few weeks after I booked what was to be my next cruise, after I had booked and sent in the completed disability form. The email just added confusion since it wasn't clear, so I responded asking for clarification. My agent has also been trying to obtain clarification, without much luck. Then today I received another email from Carnival/Cunard that just adds more confusion:

 

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Subject:	Completed mobility questionnaire
Date:	Wed, 20 Dec 2023 12:06:12 +0000
From:	Accessibility <Accessibility@carnivalukgroup.com>
To:	Sarah W.

 

Good Morning,

 

Booking reference: Example Booking Ref
Dear Example Title Example Lastname,

We are delighted you have chosen to sail with us.

We can see that you have requested a medical or mobility on-board needs questionnaire to ensure your holiday is as comfortable and enjoyable as possible.

We have recently updated how you can let us know about your on board needs. It's vital to inform us if, for example, in the unlikely event of an emergency, you would need: 

 

a.  An evacuation chair – this is a mandatory requirement for anyone who is unable to use the stairs due to mobility or other circumstances, or for anyone bringing a wheelchair or mobility scooter. 

or 

b.  One-to-one assistance – this is a mandatory requirement for anyone who requires someone to guide and steady them on the stairs, due to mobility or other circumstances. For anyone who uses a mobility aid, such as a walking stick or walker, this is the recommended level of assistance. 

Please visit My Cunard for more information and, if necessary, to complete the questionnaire.

Please consider the following information about our standard staterooms and contact your booking agent if you have any concerns regarding the suitability of your chosen stateroom:

·        The average doorway width for standard staterooms is 50 cm

·        There is a step up to access the bathroom, in the case of a bathroom with a bath, the shower is over the bath (please see details of individual ships and staterooms as this may differ)

·        There is a step up to access the balcony (where applicable)

 

For further information, please visit our website.

We look forward to welcoming you on board. 

 

Kind regards

(I have deleted the name of representative for privacy reasons) 

 

Guest Support Representative　

Accessibility　

 

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

 

Anyway, even though I have been booked for around a month, along with the lack of any clear answers from the cruise line, it looks as if I will have to cancel this cruise, along with not having any ideas of any future cruises with Cunard.

 

From my Internet and YouTube searches, It sure looks as if there is a good deal of antipathy towards mobility scooter users, especially in the UK. I have been able bodied for nearly all of my life, but now have an appreciation of what disabled people go through on a continual basis. I had hoped that this blog would be informative and helpful, but the inverse has happened in just about all ways.

 

So I am not planning on responding further, but have one final thought:

I truly hope that the people who have responded to my comments negatively and have fully supported how Cunard has dealt with this issue, don't find themselves having to deal with your own disability issues in the future, and not just in regards to scooter use. Bye for now.    

 

Edited December 20, 2023 by Sarah W.

[D&N]

13 minutes ago, Sarah W. said:

I truly hope that the people who have responded to my comments negatively and have fully supported how Cunard has dealt with this issue, don't find themselves having to deal with your own disability issues in the future,

I haven't posted previously on this thread. We don't have any mobility issues so I don't feel qualified to do so.

Could you perhaps add this to your final thoughts?:

Some of the folk who have responded negatively in your opinion, may in actual fact already have the disability issues you mention, and been carefully following Cunard's rules themselves for many years.