Does HAL have Champions?

[bepsf]

Brian...Laura states she never gave Royal Carib. posters names & e-mails..She only offered to forward RCL's request to posters..Perhaps you might want to read Laura's open forum letter on the RCL board on the closed thread...

 

Oh, thank you Betty - I must have missed that part when I read her statement.

I feel much better about CC's involvement now too.

[Seavoyage]

Hi All -

Stupid question..just trying to follow..

So does all this mean that some people are getting compensated for posts?

I'm confused...

[RuthC]

So does all this mean that some people are getting compensated for posts?

On Royal Caribbean, yes. That's exactly what it means.

[Seavoyage]

Hey Ruth -

Wow-why is that allowed? Then how can you tell who is being objective vs. who is being honest? Does not seem fair - people could be misled by biased contributors..not fair for any board - if cc knows about these folks then they should have to identify themselves...

[Copper10-8]

On Royal Caribbean, yes. That's exactly what it means.

 

Aha!

[RuthC]

Hey Ruth -

Wow-why is that allowed? Then how can you tell who is being objective vs. who is being honest? Does not seem fair - people could be misled by biased contributors..not fair for any board - if cc knows about these folks then they should have to identify themselves...

You're preaching to the choir, Seavoyage.

[HALFans]

The bread pudding consistently gets rave reivews. I detest the stuff. My husband can't get enough of it. Only thing that matters is if you like it, or not.

 

LOL. I like it enough that a chronic shortage gained mention in my review, even though not having fruit bowls in the rooms anymore didn't. :o

[jtl513]

Hi All -

Stupid question..just trying to follow..

So does all this mean that some people are getting compensated for posts?

I'm confused...

Not compensated in money, but by invitations to events, and other favored treatment.

[serendipity1499]

On Royal Caribbean, yes. That's exactly what it means.

 

 

Hey Ruth -

Wow-why is that allowed? Then how can you tell who is being objective vs. who is being honest? Does not seem fair - people could be misled by biased contributors..not fair for any board - if cc knows about these folks then they should have to identify themselves...

 

The Royal Caribbean official statement & Cruise Critic offical stetements states otherwise:

see post 1979 on this thread:

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=944526&page=99&highlight=cheerleaders

Betty

[HALFans]

The Royal Caribbean official statement & Cruise Critic offical stetements states otherwise:

see post 1979 on this thread:

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=944526&page=99&highlight=cheerleaders

Betty

 

I highly recommend a reading of 1984 by George Orwell before taking anything posted on Cruise Critic with less than 1/2 lb (not just a grain) of salt...

[CowPrincess]

HALfans, I see you've got "X" for 2009 to Alaska -- have you reviewed their smoking policy? (and please let's NOT turn this into another smoking thread, PLEEEEZZZZEE!!) :D

[RuthC]

The Royal Caribbean official statement & Cruise Critic offical stetements states otherwise:

 

see post 1979 on this thread:

 

It reads like compensation (payola) to me.

[serendipity1499]

It reads like compensation (payola) to me.

Ruth...I understand where you are coming from & also am not sure that RCL's idea is a good one, but will not go so far as saying their Champions are getting paid..The official RCL statement states otherwise..

We have provided the Royal Champions with the opportunity to experience our product during pre-inaugural sailings so that they can provide their independent opinions in the online spaces they are participating in. On a few occasions, they also have served as focus groups providing us with valuable feedback on a number of topics. Royal Champions have been invited - along with traditional media, top travel partners, and loyal Crown & Anchor Society members - to preview new ships and programs and share their opinions if, when and how they see fit. They are responsible for their own travel arrangements and expenses, which are not paid by Royal Caribbean. Royal Champions do not receive any compensation for their participation nor do we influence what they share, where they share it, or how they participate in their online discussions.

 

So how does this sound like payola...Haven't many HAL Psgrs & Mariners, been invited to experience HAL products on pre-inaugural sailings, luncheons, previews of new ships etc.. I can name a few on this board, who have been invited to luncheons, pre-inaugural parties, & pre-views of new ships etc..Right now there is a thread (on page 4)asking if the powers to be in Seattle would invite local Mariners to the pier 91 opening festivities in Seattle.. Do you consider this payola?

And if RCL Champions are responsible for their own travel arrangements & expenses & RCL says they do not compensate them in any way, how can their official statement be misconstrued as payola? Do you have any other proof of payola?

I realize that you can't believe everything you read on this board, & only 50% of what is written, but I don't think its a good idea to accuse a company of paying off their customers without proof.. Making statements like that can be considered libelous unless you have proof..

 

As Laura stated when closing the thread:

 

As you can see, we've closed this thread to further discussion as it was veering far off from its intended purpose, plus there were numerous personal attacks that we had to remove. Here, once again, is the official Cruise Critic statement regarding this issue, as well as the official Royal Caribbean statement.

JMO..Betty

 

 

[HALFans]

HALfans, I see you've got "X" for 2009 to Alaska -- have you reviewed their smoking policy? (and please let's NOT turn this into another smoking thread, PLEEEEZZZZEE!!) :D

 

I did read it yesterday. It seems that Celebrity has a few more designated smoking areas than on the Ryndam...

 

Never did care to smoke inside the house (or staterooms), and now I ONLY smoke on cruises. :o

 

So, even though all =X= staterooms are non-smoking, it's a more liberal smoking policy as far as I'm concerned because there are more inside and outside smoking areas than there were on the Ryndam... or maybe it's just on par with the Vista/Signature class ships?

 

But, everything's fluid these days, and by the time August/September rolls around who knows what anyone's policy will be? ;)

 

I do agree with Jim & his wife re: the Ocean Bar though. <SIGH>

[RuthC]

but will not go so far as saying their Champions are getting paid..So how does this sound like payola...

Income in kind is as much compensation as cash. The "opportunities" given to their "Champions" have a monetary value, and they are not available to the average passenger.

Haven't many HAL Psgrs & Mariners, been invited to experience HAL products on pre-inaugural sailings, luncheons, previews of new ships etc.. I can name a few on this board, who have been invited to luncheons, pre-inaugural parties, & pre-views of new ships etc..Right now there is a thread (on page 4)asking if the powers to be in Seattle would invite local Mariners to the pier 91 opening festivities in Seattle.. Do you consider this payola?

The difference between what HAL is doing, and what Royal Caribbean does is that on HAL there has been no meeting of the minds; on Royal Caribbean, there has been.

A HAL passenger who gets invited to special functions may wonder if their posts have had anything to do with it, but they cannot know for certain. The Royal Champions do know that they have been selected because of what they write. An observer would have to wonder if the perks will continue, or end, based on their posts. That makes what they post suspect.

[travelite]

No way, no how!!!

 

I post everything I post because that is what I think and how I feel.

No one has ever offered nor would I ever accept goodies asking me to post a certain way. They don't need me or anyone else doing that. Their product, their ships, their crews are their assets....... HAL does not need any 'paid posters' IMO

 

I do believe that some have met folks on the ships maybe not have met and some have mentioned going to a cocktail party because of the Meet and Greet but that is a WHOLE Different thing than asking someone to post on these boards any suggested messages.

 

 

 

 

 

 

The Meet and Greets on HAL are by request of those CC members on a roll call. HAL does not initiate it. HAL provides bare bones for the M&G, usually coffee, tea, and small sweet rolls or cookies. The most I've have heard of is hot hors d'oeuvres with a cocktail. I hardly think CC members would be swayed by this small gesture.

Pay backs of any kind by cruise lines to CC members would destroy this site. I for one will not even consider cruising RCCL if this is truly their practice.

[travelite]

[/size]

 

Ruth...I understand where you are coming from & also am not sure that RCL's idea is a good one, but will not go so far as saying their Champions are getting paid..The official RCL statement states otherwise..

 

[/b]

 

So how does this sound like payola...Haven't many HAL Psgrs & Mariners, been invited to experience HAL products on pre-inaugural sailings, luncheons, previews of new ships etc.. I can name a few on this board, who have been invited to luncheons, pre-inaugural parties, & pre-views of new ships etc..Right now there is a thread (on page 4)asking if the powers to be in Seattle would invite local Mariners to the pier 91 opening festivities in Seattle.. Do you consider this payola?

 

And if RCL Champions are responsible for their own travel arrangements & expenses & RCL says they do not compensate them in any way, how can their official statement be misconstrued as payola? Do you have any other proof of payola?

 

I realize that you can't believe everything you read on this board, & only 50% of what is written, but I don't think its a good idea to accuse a company of paying off their customers without proof.. Making statements like that can be considered libelous unless you have proof..

 

As Laura stated when closing the thread:

 

 

JMO..Betty

 

 

I thought only holders of over 500 shares of Carnival stock get these invitations (on all Carnival company owned lines). Could it be the CC Mariners Society members that were invited fall in the stock holder category?

[HeatherInFlorida]

Now I'm getting a little confused. When it states that RCI offers "the opportunity to experience" the product, does that mean that the Royal Champions pay for the pre Inaugural mini cruises? Or does it mean RCI offers them gratis? This is where I'm confused. Because it further states that they are "responsible for their own travel arrangements and expenses".

 

Now if the Champions are paying for everything, there's no payola. If RCI is paying for their cruise "experience" then there is.

 

Still, I don't think many would disagree with me that the more a cruise line does for someone, the more impressed that person is going to be with that cruise line. That's just a given.

 

Personally I've never been loyal enough to any cruise line to get so much as an extra flower in my cabin or peanut on my pillow, but if I did I would come on CC and talk about how amazing the line is. So whether there are actual dollars changing hands or not makes no difference. If the cruise line is adding perks to a person's cruise "experience" it will make that line look better in that passenger's eyes.

 

So the guy reading about all this great stuff will be very disappointed when he hops on board and it just treated like all the other passengers if they got the impression there would be wining, dining and upgrades based on what they read here.;)

 

This is just simple human nature. Don't even need a PhD to figure it out.:D

[hulamoon]

Thanks Heather, Betty and Hammybee,

 

Yes that makes sense that if you know a lot of people who cruise their opinion would carry influence over that of a CC reviewer. I am happy to know you are all real people.:rolleyes:

 

I am not sure what percentage of those who visit CC are like us and are looking for clues as to which ship to take, but we do not know a community of cruisers. We know 5 other couples who have cruised a handful of times and the rest take their own boats sailing, or are happily land locked.

 

Thanks Betty I will keep working on trying to get spell check to work while on CC.

 

Heather, I have read other posts that said some champions got free nights at sea during the inaugural and free booze. As I have said before that sounds like payola to me. They all said they had to pay their way to the port.

[RuthC]

Now I'm getting a little confused. When it states that RCI offers "the opportunity to experience" the product, does that mean that the Royal Champions pay for the pre Inaugural mini cruises? Or does it mean RCI offers them gratis? This is where I'm confused. Because it further states that they are "responsible for their own travel arrangements and expenses".

Heather, it's been a while since I read it, so I doubt I could locate it again, but there was a statement from one of the Royal Champions to the extent that it was costing him/her due to the expense of getting to/from the events. There was no expense for the events.

That makes the costs for Royal Champions and HAL invitees to special events a wash.

It's the fact that Royal Champions are wined and dined because of the nature of their posts ---and they know it!---that crosses the line. If they want more of these lovely invitations all they have to do is keep posting nice things.

[CC Help Michell]

My reaction to this whole thing was -- well, duh! :) It was a matter of time before the companies found ways to influence message boards -- and it's the message board's operators' job to try to prevent it as much as possible.

 

Taking anything one finds in the public domain (message boards) on the internet at face value is like sticking a "kick me" sign to your back end. That does not mean that everyone with nice things to say is an "employee" of the cruiseline, nor does it mean that everyone with a negative thing to say is "employed" by another cruiseline. But it does mean everyone still needs to do their homework, look for indications that what you are reading is authentic, etc. Someone with only positive things to say raises my "spidey sense" as much as someone with only negative things to say.

 

I've had my longest email account since January 1994, so I've been around the web a long time -- there's still no substitute for reading hundreds of posts and getting a "feel" for what's authentic and what isn't... there are no short cuts.

[serendipity1499]

[/size][/size]

Income in kind is as much compensation as cash. The "opportunities" given to their "Champions" have a monetary value, and they are not available to the average passenger.

The difference between what HAL is doing, and what Royal Caribbean does is that on HAL there has been no meeting of the minds; on Royal Caribbean, there has been.

A HAL passenger who gets invited to special functions may wonder if their posts have had anything to do with it, but they cannot know for certain. The Royal Champions do know that they have been selected because of what they write. An observer would have to wonder if the perks will continue, or end, based on their posts. That makes what they post suspect.

 

OK Ruth, now understand what you mean & in a way I do agree with you..First of all I've been on enough cruises to know that RCCL is def. not our cup of tea..However some of our friends love RCCL.. ;) And, I only believe about half of what I read...

I respect that Sarah, came onto this board & assured us that HAL does not have paid cheerleaders...However, I honestly believe that some on this board have been accorded perks only because of the consistently nice things they have said about HAL in the past 9 years or so..I don't begrudge them, those perks..It's good Business & only human nature to give perks to those who say nice things about your product..

I also believe several posters on HAL, who are well known on this board, will never experience poor service or glitches in service which "Non HAL cheerleaders" have experienced..

Perhaps I'm naive, but some of those HAL "cheerleaders" actually accuse new posters of either lying by saying it never happened to them...Others will say the poster was over reacting about some of the negative things which happened on their cruise, about their "Beloved HAL"

Don't get me wrong, we love HAL & as Hammey says it's our Cruise Line of choice..We've been on more HAL cruises than any other line, & realize that no cruise can be completely perfect.. However, if something negative is reported about HAL, I certainly would not tell them they are completely wrong, because it's never happened to us, even when I believe they over-reacted..DH & I have often enjoyed the group singing in the Piano Bar after dinner & have never noticed that it was very smokey, even though others have said it was..If a place gets too smokey for me, we'll move & have often moved when the casino gets too smokey..

We had a glitch in service on one of our last cruises, & because of this board, I knew enough to not report, but ask the correct Dept. Head about it..That evening the Steward came to our cabin to apologize for his mistake..I felt so bad for him, as he told us one more mistake like this & he would be out of a job...Word got around to all the DR & Cabin Stewards..Our normally excellent service turned into extraordinary service thereafter! Even those who didn't know our names before, deferred to us & welcomed us by name! :D:D .LOL

Yes it seemed nice at first, but I actually was embarrassed by it later on..

Thanks Ruth for giving us your thoughts & I apologize once again for another long post..;)

Cheers..:)Betty

 

 

[serendipity1499]

Now I'm getting a little confused. When it states that RCI offers "the opportunity to experience" the product, does that mean that the Royal Champions pay for the pre Inaugural mini cruises? Or does it mean RCI offers them gratis? This is where I'm confused. Because it further states that they are "responsible for their own travel arrangements and expenses".

 

Now if the Champions are paying for everything, there's no payola. If RCI is paying for their cruise "experience" then there is.

 

Still, I don't think many would disagree with me that the more a cruise line does for someone, the more impressed that person is going to be with that cruise line. That's just a given.

 

Personally I've never been loyal enough to any cruise line to get so much as an extra flower in my cabin or peanut on my pillow, but if I did I would come on CC and talk about how amazing the line is. So whether there are actual dollars changing hands or not makes no difference. If the cruise line is adding perks to a person's cruise "experience" it will make that line look better in that passenger's eyes.

 

So the guy reading about all this great stuff will be very disappointed when he hops on board and it just treated like all the other passengers if they got the impression there would be wining, dining and upgrades based on what they read here.;)

 

This is just simple human nature. Don't even need a PhD to figure it out.:D

 

Heather, I agree with you, however I would bet my last dollar that there are those on this HAL board who have been afforded perks, because they are always defending HAL! Sometimes they can even become nasty & it's laughable !!!;)

 

Thanks Heather, Betty and Hammybee,

 

Yes that makes sense that if you know a lot of people who cruise their opinion would carry influence over that of a CC reviewer. I am happy to know you are all real people.:rolleyes:

 

I am not sure what percentage of those who visit CC are like us and are looking for clues as to which ship to take, but we do not know a community of cruisers. We know 5 other couples who have cruised a handful of times and the rest take their own boats sailing, or are happily land locked.

 

Thanks Betty I will keep working on trying to get spell check to work while on CC.

 

Heather, I have read other posts that said some champions got free nights at sea during the inaugural and free booze. As I have said before that sounds like payola to me. They all said they had to pay their way to the port.

 

Perhaps you might want to look at the complete thread again & find those posts...It's such a long thread...Good luck with making spell check work..

 

Heather, it's been a while since I read it, so I doubt I could locate it again, but there was a statement from one of the Royal Champions to the extent that it was costing him/her due to the expense of getting to/from the events. There was no expense for the events.

That makes the costs for Royal Champions and HAL invitees to special events a wash.

 

It's the fact that Royal Champions are wined and dined because of the nature of their posts ---and they know it!---that crosses the line. If they want more of these lovely invitations all they have to do is keep posting nice things.

 

Ruth, Heather & hulamoon et al..

The RCCL Champion thread is closed however I have the URL for the entire thread in my PC, which was started by Cecelia (admin) Laura's Assistant & finally believe it was closed by Laura...

It's 99 pages long & has 1979 posts..:eek:

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=944526&highlight=cheerleaders

The first two posts seem to discount the payola, but perhaps some of the others are more open about their status..

Unfortunately, don't have the time to re-read it as must make DH's dinner & finish balancing our checkbook tonight..

If anyone has the time to read it, I'll assume you will give us the appropriate Post Numbers which you are referring to in order for us to re-read them & form our own conclusions....I'll gladly defer to your observations..

Betty

[hammybee]

LOL. I like it enough that a chronic shortage gained mention in my review, even though not having fruit bowls in the rooms anymore didn't. :o

 

And you also mentioned that eel :eek: is no longer available in the LIDO.

My reaction was " thank goodness".;)

[travelite]

What about the travel agents that get perks all the time from cruise lines, hotels, etc.?