NCL Discretionary charge! when does NCL say NO?

If your experience with NCL, is so pitiful, why even bother with your FCC?

 

I would let it go. That's me, I wouldn't remove the service fees either.

 

But to each their own. Happy cruising.

 

 

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Funny how you read my experience with Ncl is so pitiful.

So when a seasoned cruiser explores other lines other than Ncl you consider it pitiful?

That's interesting...and amusing

That's more of a reflection on you rather than the possibility that I might tip in cash or book on different cruise line or type of vacay

Oh and where in my post that you quoted did you surmise that I was using a FCC?

Just because Ive had them in the past doesn't mean I still do or that I didn't already use them

So...according to you my Ncl experience is pitiful

I own fcc's that you think I should dump

I should only cruise Ncl and never any other line

Hmm....you are drinking too much kool aid I'm afraid because you are making up things that were NOT in my post that you quoted

This is part of the problem in America today...

People just can't ...

1. Read clearly

2. Think things through

3. Believe in personal freedoms

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Recently i read a thread where someone can remove those charges as many times as they want to just because they are not mandatory which makes me wonder two things;

 

1) how long until NCL catches on and decides to not grant these people their petition because of the amount of times they ask for it.

 

2) i wonder if NCL bans them from their fleet completely if it gets out of hand :eek:

 

I used to work in retail many many years ago in a particular high end store. I remember 2 people that always returned merchandise and ask for refunds until the store manager decided not to grant them their refunds and in particular case banned him from the store entirely.

 

So I am wondering if NCL pays attention to these things! no flaming please just curious :D

no flaming? you can't be serious! ask a wide open question and of course you will get some flames.

Twice we have had the charges removed, because the dining and buffet service was horrible. We then paid the room stewards in cash. We made multiple complaints daily in the box and to the managers about the service and cold food. No improvements, all the food on the buffet was cold and you could go an entire meal without any water refills. The staff was wandering around carrying a pile of napkins or tablecloths. Many people on the cruise were doing the same thing. I am not demanding, but I do think, I should have my water refilled after asking multiple times and the food on the buffet to be at the correct temps.

wow, I have rarely been to a buffet, anywhere and found the food hot: warm maybe. Buffets are designed to get a quick meal, at a reasonable price, just like a fast food restaurant: nothing more: removing gratuities punishes so many when only a few have made someone's experience bad. I find it hard to believe you had bad service every meal on two different cruises. Most of us have had a few issues but not the entire cruise.

PokerPro5: All cruise lines as well as restaurant pay below min wage with the tips adding up to min or better, usually much better. Remember crew members get free room and board plus most come from countries where the salaries are about 10% of what they make on a ship. If the company pockets most of the service charge why do you think most of the crew on any ship, any line continue to renew their contracts? We have talked to some who have been with NCL for as many as 20 years.

Funny how you read my experience with Ncl is so pitiful.

 

So when a seasoned cruiser explores other lines other than Ncl you consider it pitiful?

 

That's interesting...and amusing

 

That's more of a reflection on you rather than the possibility that I might tip in cash or book on different cruise line or type of vacay

 

Oh and where in my post that you quoted did you surmise that I was using a FCC?

 

Just because Ive had them in the past doesn't mean I still do or that I didn't already use them

 

 

So...according to you my Ncl experience is pitiful

 

I own fcc's that you think I should dump

 

I should only cruise Ncl and never any other line

 

Hmm....you are drinking too much kool aid I'm afraid because you are making up things that were NOT in my post that you quoted

 

This is part of the problem in America today...

 

People just can't ...

 

1. Read clearly

 

2. Think things through

 

3. Believe in personal freedoms

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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No actually some of us can follow a whole thread. See your post 39. If it's not yours I apologize.

I am sorry you chose to respond in such a rude manner. Your FCC's were mentioned in a previous comment. I I didn't go into a tirade of what I really think you are.

Also You forgot to add one item, people can't remember what they posted.

You have every right to do what you want. I have only had 5 cruises, on 4 different lines. I wouldn't repeat any of them if my experience was less than great.

By the way I don't drink Koolaid, it's unhealthy for you.

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PokerPro5: All cruise lines as well as restaurant pay below min wage with the tips adding up to min or better, usually much better. Remember crew members get free room and board plus most come from countries where the salaries are about 10% of what they make on a ship. If the company pockets most of the service charge why do you think most of the crew on any ship, any line continue to renew their contracts? We have talked to some who have been with NCL for as many as 20 years.

The crew renews their contracts because they're getting paid a lot more than they would make at any job they could get in their home countries.

The restaurant example is a poor one for a few reasons. First off, most servers make substantially above minimum wage, to where a lower base wage for them makes sense. Second, the server makes money with every additional tip that comes in. NCL is not the same. When more "tips" come in (for example, when the DSC gets raised, or when they remove other employees from the DSC pool), that does not result in much of a pay increase for the crew. Instead, NCL just lowers their base pay, thus meaning they keep it. This does NOT happen at restaurants. If more tips come in, the server directly get that extra money. Not on NCL.

Look, as I've said, NCL just needs to be transparent about where our "tips" are going.

Then we can all make intelligent, informed decisions as to what to do with removing it or keeping it.

I don't know why so many people are bending over backward to defend this total lack of transparency of what is happening to our "gratuity" money.

Also, please quit repeating that most other cruise lines do it. I know that. I mention it in every post about the DSC, just so everyone knows I'm not picking on NCL. This is an industry-wide problem, not just an NCL problem.

I only mention NCL because that's the line I cruise, and that's the subject of this forum.

The crew renews their contracts because they're getting paid a lot more than they would make at any job they could get in their home countries.

 

The restaurant example is a poor one for a few reasons. First off, most servers make substantially above minimum wage, to where a lower base wage for them makes sense. Second, the server makes money with every additional tip that comes in. NCL is not the same. When more "tips" come in (for example, when the DSC gets raised, or when they remove other employees from the DSC pool), that does not result in much of a pay increase for the crew. Instead, NCL just lowers their base pay, thus meaning they keep it. This does NOT happen at restaurants. If more tips come in, the server directly get that extra money. Not on NCL.

 

Look, as I've said, NCL just needs to be transparent about where our "tips" are going.

 

Then we can all make intelligent, informed decisions as to what to do with removing it or keeping it.

 

I don't know why so many people are bending over backward to defend this total lack of transparency of what is happening to our "gratuity" money.

 

Also, please quit repeating that most other cruise lines do it. I know that. I mention it in every post about the DSC, just so everyone knows I'm not picking on NCL. This is an industry-wide problem, not just an NCL problem.

 

I only mention NCL because that's the line I cruise, and that's the subject of this forum.

But it's the same concept at work and the fact that the server makes more has no bearing. If people didn't leave any tips the staff would be left with the minimum, if everyone removed the service charges the staff would be left with the minimum. In both cases the employer would be obligated to pony up the money to make sure the minimum is being earned.

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Lots of disappearing responses ... :cool:

No actually some of us can follow a whole thread. See your post 39. If it's not yours I apologize.

 

I am sorry you chose to respond in such a rude manner. Your FCC's were mentioned in a previous comment. I I didn't go into a tirade of what I really think you are.

 

Also You forgot to add one item, people can't remember what they posted.

 

You have every right to do what you want. I have only had 5 cruises, on 4 different lines. I wouldn't repeat any of them if my experience was less than great.

 

By the way I don't drink Koolaid, it's unhealthy for you.

 

 

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You still don't know if the FCC I possess have been applied yet or if I'm planning to apply them

To suggest I just dump them and Lose money is ridiculous just because you think I should

Ill sell them first...if I wanted to or I'll take another Ncl cruise

Since when can't a seasoned cruiser consider other cruise lines? According to you its Ncl or nothing...at least in my case as you've cruised many lines you say

Btw I don't expect nor want much from crew anyway so I don't really worry about tipping as I give cash in appropriate amounts to the appropriate people but since Ncl allows refund of dsc I'm considering it next cruise because that's just how I want to do it up next time. Until Ncl comes clean about its distribution that's just how I feel. Other lines give an exact breakdown of who gets what btw

And I most certainly can remember what I post as I have an excellent memory.

Probably because I rarely drink. Don't smoke and stay out of the smoky casino. Lol

Oh and it doesn't really matter what you think of me does it? Lol because I will still post my opinions about my many years of cruising regardless.

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Ok so I posted I'm using them

 

That could actually mean I've already applied them or planning to apply them but nowhere am I suggesting I'm going to let them go to waste

 

So what you should have said is....

 

" I know you posted previously that you have some FCC and perhaps if you haven't used or applied them yet you could have Ncl refund them as you are considering changing it up a bit and considering trying other cruise lines and other types of vacations "

 

Just sayin that you have no clue if my FCC are applied or not or when I'm considering jumping ship

 

I have a dd that would love the ba and while I hate that ship I may still consider it for her enjoyment or I may consider the Ncl ship doing the Greek isles from Venice as my kids love the Greek isles or I may consider no Med cruise and just do land based

 

It could be in 2017 or 2018 or 2019

 

See you didn't know that did you?

 

All you know is I'm considering trying other cruise lines.

 

Which is actually something that is most appropriate for the Ncl boards because others might be interested in the same

 

 

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I hope one day you will not feel the need to be always right.

I have not read your full response. Nor plan to. This is not the forum for personal attacks. You really need to go back and read your quotes.

I have already told you have the right to do what you want. You will not drag me into a toxic dialogue.

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But it's the same concept at work and the fact that the server makes more has no bearing. If people didn't leave any tips the staff would be left with the minimum, if everyone removed the service charges the staff would be left with the minimum. In both cases the employer would be obligated to pony up the money to make sure the minimum is being earned.

But everyone isn't going to remove the DSC.

That isn't happening now, and it will never get close to happening.

There's no point to say "if everyone did this..." because it will never happen.

But you know what? If it did, then perhaps NCL and other lines would get the message that people aren't going for phony gratuity surcharges, and they'd move to a more transparent model.

About 2% of the people took DSC removal forms on the Dawn cruise I took last year, and I assume not all of them mailed them in.

NCL is not in danger of a mass DSC removal revolt.

But everyone isn't going to remove the DSC.

 

That isn't happening now, and it will never get close to happening.

 

There's no point to say "if everyone did this..." because it will never happen.

 

But you know what? If it did, then perhaps NCL and other lines would get the message that people aren't going for phony gratuity surcharges, and they'd move to a more transparent model.

 

About 2% of the people took DSC removal forms on the Dawn cruise I took last year, and I assume not all of them mailed them in.

 

NCL is not in danger of a mass DSC removal revolt.

And it's because the service charges are for the most part paid that NCL can pay it's crew the way that it does. I've said it before but it bears repeating- if the process changes at all it will more than likely be because the crews demand it. But they make out pretty good under the current system so they aren't likely to rock the boat in that regard. I am confident that if I pay the service charges the crew members that are supposed to get a share of it get what they are supposed to get.

Maybe they can't say no, but they can all of a sudden a sailing can be fully booked, or NCL simply tell the passenger that they are not allowed on NCL

my sentiments exactly!:D

Hilton hotels have a 100% satisfaction guarantee. Not happy with your stay? Here's your refund. No questions asked. However, if one person makes too many of these requests, they receive a letter saying Hilton is probably not the chain for them since they've been so unhappy.

I hope NCL does something similar.

 

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exactly that is what high end stores do...Llbean stores do it and so does Nordstrom but again we are talking about a cruise line..i think eventually they will make it mandatory.

But everyone isn't going to remove the DSC.

 

 

That's because most people understand that they should pay their bills.

Recently i read a thread where someone can remove those charges as many times as they want to just because they are not mandatory which makes me wonder two things;

 

1) how long until NCL catches on and decides to not grant these people their petition because of the amount of times they ask for it.

 

2) i wonder if NCL bans them from their fleet completely if it gets out of hand :eek:

 

I used to work in retail many many years ago in a particular high end store. I remember 2 people that always returned merchandise and ask for refunds until the store manager decided not to grant them their refunds and in particular case banned him from the store entirely.

 

So I am wondering if NCL pays attention to these things! no flaming please just curious :D

I haven't cruised on NCL yet but I would assume they have a loyalty program and people have a member number (like I have for RCCL and Carnival). I wonder if they mark down which "members" take back their tips? That way they could warn the room steward and others that have to serve those people. I know when I was a waitress and a notorious "non tipper" came in, we would all try to talk the hostess into not giving them to us :D:D

I haven't cruised on NCL yet but I would assume they have a loyalty program and people have a member number (like I have for RCCL and Carnival). I wonder if they mark down which "members" take back their tips? That way they could warn the room steward and others that have to serve those people. I know when I was a waitress and a notorious "non tipper" came in, we would all try to talk the hostess into not giving them to us :D:D

Amazon tried dynamic pricing once. Using analytics they provided each consumer a different price based on everything from past purchases to google searches. Imagine, I only buy highly discounted items and always shop for the best price so they offer me a book for $12.50. But you are very busy and do not care to invest the time to research and a few dollars isn't worth it for you. Your history and internet behaviour support this so the same book is offered to you for $19.99.

 

They were forced to revert back to the conventional pricing model when there was a full scale revolt. People were furious - especially loyal customers who were big spenders.

 

Cruise pricing is already dynamic based on a different set of criteria. Offering the same product, at differing price points, at the same time, to different customers will garner the same response it did for Amazon (IMO).

Amazon does offer different prices now on many items. Prime members get lower prices. If you are not a Prime member you wouldn't be aware of it since you won't necessarily get the price I get. And if you are a prime member you probably are not aware you are getting a lower price.

While it sounds like a brilliant idea, I like it, I don't think that NCL will put people who remove the DSC in a higher fare bucket. More likely if there is an increase of people removing it they will make it mandatory, no removal.

There are many false statements on this post. First of all, NCL is not going to prevent you from booking future cruises or treat you with less respect. The cruising industry is all about customer service. Since you fill out the tip removal form at the end of your cruise, your housekeeper is not going to not make up your room. Many of these employees are very thankful for their jobs and could not afford to be asked to leave. Honestly, your housekeeper would rather receive a cash tip and not share it with anyone. Think about waitresses that use a tip pool vs keep everything they worked for and don't have to report it. NCL would rather just lose out on your portion of the tip pool rather than give up your $1,000+ for the cruise fare, money that you spend on board, excursions, etc. It would make no economical sense to ask a previous passenger to not return because they decided to remove the minimal service charge. I think they are streamlining the process to corporate for two reasons. One reason is to make it more difficult for people to do it, so less people will ask for the charges to be removed. You can't just take care of it on board and passengers might forget about it when they return home or not care since it was already paid. Secondly, it will be easier for corporate to track the reasons for removal and try to address the concerns brought up. NCL is not going to offer someone a different rate or promotion than offered to everyone else. It's really impossible. You can go on any website and book the current rate without going through a NCL representative. This would be discriminatory. The only trick they could pull would be to not upgrade you when you book a guarantee cabin. But again, I don't think someone is going through and hand selecting passengers for upgrades, unless it's for a specific upsell category. The amount for tipping is discretionary, as with any hospitality industry.

Are you in the habit of walking into the kitchen and tipping the dishwasher in local restaurants?

 

 

When you pick up your dry cleaning do you just pay the bill? Or do you pay it and add 20% tip to it?

 

When I cruise going forward...I am removing dsc and tipping waiters and stewards for their helpful efficient personal service

 

 

My cruise fare covers the dishwashers the laundry staff the guest services staff and the knob polishers

 

Oh and I've stopped tipping my sanitation workers at home too at Christmas

 

Why? Because they have gone from 4 men on the truck who would come into your yard and drag your garbage out and dump it and then bring the empty can back...to....

 

To one guy on a truck that presses a button that brings a huge metal arm down to Grab your can and dump it into the truck...which I have brought out to the street along with a similar recyclable can for the arm to grab...which I then drag back

 

I'm not complaining but I'm also not tipping a driver who presses a button.

 

 

 

 

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Just grateful I have not become so cynical. I am sure it must be your sanitation worker's fault he is a one man truck. And guess what? I have witnessed my trash guys getting out and picking up debris that the "arm" missed into the street. When at home I sometimes ALSO take them cold water or soda.

Do what you must. I certainly do not agree with you. Next Feb on the Epic I think I will as my concierge to give me a galley tour and I will give the dishwasher some cash and think of you.

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Just grateful I have not become so cynical. I am sure it must be your sanitation worker's fault he is a one man truck. And guess what? I have witnessed my trash guys getting out and picking up debris that the "arm" missed into the street. When at home I sometimes ALSO take them cold water or soda.

 

Do what you must. I certainly do not agree with you. Next Feb on the Epic I think I will as my concierge to give me a galley tour and I will give the dishwasher some cash and think of you.

 

 

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Our sanitation workers are unionized pensioned city workers averaging $ 80,000 a year

That's like tipping your accountant or the train conductor or your bank manager or your grocery store manager

And before you say it....I will.....no I wouldn't do the sanitation workers job

Why? Because I don't have to as I have a different career

You say you are glad you are not cynical

I say I'm glad I'm not a bleeding heart and my kids are school loan free

And when you hand the dishwasher that cash tip I think they will just think you are a show off

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our sanitation workers are unionized pensioned city workers averaging $ 80,000 a year

 

that's like tipping your accountant or the train conductor or your bank manager or your grocery store manager

 

and before you say it....i will.....no i wouldn't do the sanitation workers job

 

why? Because i don't have to as i have a different career

 

 

you say you are glad you are not cynical

 

i say i'm glad i'm not a bleeding heart and my kids are school loan free

 

and when you hand the dishwasher that cash tip i think they will just think you are a show off

 

 

 

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+1 :)

Our sanitation workers are unionized pensioned city workers averaging $ 80,000 a year

 

That's like tipping your accountant or the train conductor or your bank manager or your grocery store manager

 

And before you say it....I will.....no I wouldn't do the sanitation workers job

 

Why? Because I don't have to as I have a different career

 

 

You say you are glad you are not cynical

 

I say I'm glad I'm not a bleeding heart and my kids are school loan free

 

And when you hand the dishwasher that cash tip I think they will just think you are a show off

 

 

 

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+1000

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I think it's obvious that NCL moved the removal process to corporate to counteract the number of passengers who were removing the service charges in protest of all of the changes that were going on, thinking that by adding a step to the process it would discourage such removals.

I'll bet that about a third of those getting the form never send it in. That's established consumer behavior with gift cards, where one third are never redeemed. NCL isn't relying on the skill of the desk agent any longer to discourage the refund; they have the consumer behavior on their side in this one.

Plus they get to delay the payout as much as they want.

I'll bet that about a third of those getting the form never send it in. That's established consumer behavior with gift cards, where one third are never redeemed. NCL isn't relying on the skill of the desk agent any longer to discourage the refund; they have the consumer behavior on their side in this one.

 

Plus they get to delay the payout as much as they want.

Exactly.