Cheap,cheap,cheap

[Capt. & Teach]

Princess is at it again. They have striped giving free Internet to suite passengers. Also the priority booking for speciality restaurants is gone. Complaining to the front desk, I was told that I was paying for a nice cabin. We are on the Grand and it just ain't so. The Elite passengers receive 250 free minutes no matter if they are in a suite or an inside cabin.

We purchase the suites mainly for the nice perks that use to go with them, as well as the extra room. However, as an Elite card holder, I think I will save some money and take a smaller cabin if I ever decide to sail with Princess again. The good old days of sailing are gone, and we will just have to rethink where we we spend our entertainment dollars.

As far as the crew we have met they are wonderful and try their best to make your cruise enjoyable,but Princess is making it harder for them.

[whatcruiseisnext]

The free internet for suite passengers has been gonoe for some time now. I find it sad that your cruise was made less enjoyable because you didn't get free unlimited internet. Since you are an elite member, you did get yoru free internet minutes. Was that not enough?

[ChevyCruiser]

I can feel your pain, so to speak, as it seems with every cruise something has been pulled back. The joke with our cruising friends is that soon the cruise lines will be like the airlines and we'll be charged for our checked bags and we'll need to buy the food for our trip in the terminal before we board.

 

However, on a serious note, I wonder at what point some sort of law of dminishing returns kicks in and a business finds that the expenses saved by cutting back on some customer niceties starts to affect the revenue stream? People do vote with their feet and wallets, and when they reach the point where they say "enough is enough" they'll go elsewhere for a similar product. Even a Business 101 class teaches that it's much, much cheaper to KEEP an existing customer than to FIND a new one.

[Coral]

When did you book your suite? They made a change and if you booked it before a certain period, you should still receive free internet but you have to demand it. Hopefully someone will post the date you have to have booked by.

 

I agree that Princess has definitely changed. Many of my friends (including myself) are looking elsewhere.

[WarEagle76]

When did you book your suite? They made a change and if you booked it before a certain period, you should still receive free internet but you have to demand it. Hopefully someone will post the date you have to have booked by.

 

I agree that Princess has definitely changed. Many of my friends (including myself) are looking elsewhere.

 

From Princess:

 

We apologize for your continued disappointment. For those passengers who have a suite booking made prior to July 15, 2012, we will honor the offer of complimentary internet for that voyage. Please see the Passenger Services Desk during your cruise and they will waive any internet charges.

 

whatcruiseisnext The free internet for suite passengers has been gonoe for some time now. I find it sad that your cruise was made less enjoyable because you didn't get free unlimited internet. Since you are an elite member, you did get yoru free internet minutes. Was that not enough?

 

What is considered "enough" will vary by passenger. Some of us have to keep in touch with work whether we want to or not. Depending upon timing (cruises are usually booked far in advance) we never know what our work requirements might be at the time we are cruising so 150 minutes is often times not enough especially when Internet on board can be slow at times.

[Shogun]

Hi Chevycruiser and all

 

Part of the problem for loyal past passengers is that the cruise industry knows it makes it biggest returns from new cruisers, who will try and spend for all the onboard extras,

 

 

 

yours Shogun

[Coral]

From Princess:

 

We apologize for your continued disappointment. For those passengers who have a suite booking made prior to July 15, 2012, we will honor the offer of complimentary internet for that voyage. Please see the Passenger Services Desk during your cruise and they will waive any internet charges.

 

 

The sad thing is that according to the OP's posts, he did book before this date. The front desk should have informed him of that.

 

Thanks for posting the date.

[ChevyCruiser]

Interesting point, shogun. I'm sure they have the brightest minds that they can afford at work on such things. I'm always fascinated by the business end of the travel and entertainment industry. I tend to avoid most of the nickle and dime tactics employed by the cruise lines, but can also understand how a new cruiser would be enamored with the specialty dining venues, the photo packages, the drink of the day, etc etc.

 

While I'm a repeat cruiser, I'm probably not the "whale" they are looking for, to use a Las Vegas term.

[CruzVinnieCruz]

I am not sure if a new cruiser is the biggest return in terms of dollars spent for the cruise line but do admit that it is the biggest pool of potential customers. Any cruise line needs to fill the ship to make a profit.

 

Maybe cruise lines are paying less attention to building "customers for life" approach because the new customer pool is so large and so far they have been very successful tapping new customers.

 

Vinnie

[Coral]

I am not sure if a new cruiser is the biggest return in terms of dollars spent for the cruise line but do admit that it is the biggest pool of potential customers. Any cruise line needs to fill the ship to make a profit.

 

 

Think of how many souvenirs, pictures, transfers and shore excursions you booked on your first or second cruise?

 

Now, many seasoned cruisers book their shore excursions direct with the vendor, they have figured out the casinos really don't pay well, bring many of their own drinks, don't buy as much with the ships' s name on it (how many coffee mugs does one need that look identical) and take their own pictures. They also arrange for their own air, hotel and transfers on their own.

[truckmaker]

As a pretty frequent cruiser on Princess, RCL, and AMA river cruises; as a Carnival Corp'n shareowner; and, as someone who spent a significant portion of my career focused on improvments to customer service and satisfaction. I suspect that there are some 'truths' at work here.

 

First - I do not believe that that there are corporate people focused on cost reduction. My suspicion is that they are focused on improving the value equation for everyone, including shareowners, customers, and profits.

 

Second - My belief is that no corporation will 'remove' anything from their customers without understanding the total impact of that change. Many of us here obviously utilize the internet. I have no feel how widespread the usage of this onboard benefit is for those who are not on these boards. I understand that there are a few.

 

Third - I agree that one can percieve that things have been removed but I also also feel tht if one looks at the whole equation there are also things that have been added. Some of these benefits may not appeal to us personally but the bottom line is that cruising still represents good value for the dollar and we feel that Princess has one of the best overall products on the market.

 

Safe journeys.

[CruzVinnieCruz]

Think of how many souvenirs, pictures, transfers and shore excursions you booked on your first or second cruise?

 

Now, many seasoned cruisers book their shore excursions direct with the vendor, they have figured out the casinos really don't pay well, bring many of their own drinks, don't buy as much with the ships' s name on it (how many coffee mugs does one need that look identical) and take their own pictures.

 

No argument that new customers have the potential to spend but have not seen any facts to say the percentage is much better than a repeat customer. There are many variables to consider such as is it better to have many one and dones or the customer who cruises multiple times a year.

 

Most all businesses build brand loyalty knowing that the repeat customer is the core of the business but as long as the cruise lines have a large pool of potential customers they are content spending their dollars attracting them.

 

If supply would start to outstrip demand then the repeat customer would become more valuable and more dollars would be spent keeping them.

 

Vinnie

[MCC retired]

Wow , what will be next to go , the glass of champagne for the MiniSuites ?

I may never book a MiniSuite ever again.

[Pam in CA]

No argument that new customers have the potential to spend but have not seen any facts to say the percentage is much better than a repeat customer. There are many variables to consider such as is it better to have many one and dones or the customer who cruises multiple times a year.

I agree with Coral. While I don't have the specific numbers, cruise lines don't make a profit on cruise fares. Profit comes from onboard spending. Experienced repeat Princess passengers know how to get more bang for their buck. They book using a discount TA, never directly with the cruise line, saving 10-20% off the cruise fare plus OBC and other perks; they buy Carnival Corporation stock to get the OBC perk; they have FCCs to use to book and get OBC; if they are former military, they get the military OBC; and they make use of the unlimited free laundry, good-sized Internet packages and 10% discount in the onboard shops. They tend not to buy from the art auction, photos, or go to bingo. They don't buy tons of t-shirts and other stuff. They tend not to book cruise line tours but use independent tours. It's not unusual for an experienced Princess cruiser to have $500-600 (or more) OBC to start the cruise.

 

I had over $40 of OBC left over after my 16-day Star cruise last March. I didn't skimp and really tried to spend it all. Not only did I have $450 in OBC to start but I also had $100's worth of free Internet

And probably $150 in free laundry. That's not that unusual.

[Nomsayin]

Experienced repeat Princess passengers know how to get more bang for their buck. They book using a discount TA, never directly with the cruise line, saving 10-20% off the cruise fare plus OBC and other perks; they buy Carnival Corporation stock to get the OBC perk; they have FCCs to use to book and get OBC; if they are former military, they get the military OBC;

 

Don't forget Princess Visa reward points that can be used for OBC's, etc.

[bbum]

I am sure that Princess has a viable reason for cutting back the unlimited internet, beyond just for kicks and giggles. Bandwidth on ships is very limited, so perhaps that came in to play, to try to please everyone. I know I was a little upset when they took away the unlimited access for plat/elite members, but I also remember 10 years ago when you had to line up in the 'business center' to access 3 or 4 computers at 75 cents a minute, with no such thing as a package available. People have constantly complained about the slow internet on the ships and I also find it frustrating when it takes 5 minutes to just log on so perhaps this is Princess's way of trying to free up some bandwidth so everyone aboard can have access. Like I said I was a little ticked when we lost our unlimited access, but I have found that we can get by with the free package that we get, although we don't have to stay in contact with work any longer so that situation doesn't apply to us. If I was forced to stay in contact with work I would see if my employer would cough up the cost of the internet package, or if self employed, see if I could write it off as a business expense. Princess has made a significant number of cutbacks, but I hope their reasoning is to stay competitive in the marketplace, and I for one am still quite happy with the perks and pricing we receive with Princess. I do believe that Princess should have included some kind of free package above and beyond plat/elite perks for suites though and not just cut suites to no perk.

 

Beachbum

[thinfool]

Princess is at it again. They have striped giving free Internet to suite passengers. Also the priority booking for speciality restaurants is gone. Complaining to the front desk, I was told that I was paying for a nice cabin. We are on the Grand and it just ain't so. The Elite passengers receive 250 free minutes no matter if they are in a suite or an inside cabin.

We purchase the suites mainly for the nice perks that use to go with them, as well as the extra room. However, as an Elite card holder, I think I will save some money and take a smaller cabin if I ever decide to sail with Princess again. The good old days of sailing are gone, and we will just have to rethink where we we spend our entertainment dollars.

As far as the crew we have met they are wonderful and try their best to make your cruise enjoyable,but Princess is making it harder for them.

 

I assume that you are aware that a large part of the problem focuses on bandwidth.

 

Free internet means that one or more persons in a suite will leave their tablet, laptop or wifi phone connected 24/7. This is great for checking email and sitting down to surf the web and read Cruise Critic.

 

It is not great for the other 3000 passengers, some of whom have limited time to use the internet and are paying per minute for the privilege. The 'always on' passengers are using a VERY limited internet connection to slow down service for everyone else, including the IT services for the purser and other administrative functions onboard that use the internet.

[swedish weave]

If I am figuring correctly, two elite passengers are given 500 minutes free internet time on a 14 day cruise. That is over 35 minutes per day. I don't consider that cheap by any means.

 

If the ship's system is reaching capacity, they either have to restrict usage or expand, so they have made wise economic decision.

[CruzVinnieCruz]

I agree with Coral. While I don't have the specific numbers, cruise lines don't make a profit on cruise fares. Profit comes from on board spending. Experienced repeat Princess passengers know how to get more bang for their buck. They book using a discount TA, never directly with the cruise line, saving 10-20% off the cruise fare plus OBC and other perks; they buy Carnival Corporation stock to get the OBC perk; they have FCCs to use to book and get OBC; if they are former military, they get the military OBC; and they make use of the unlimited free laundry, good-sized Internet packages and 10% discount in the onboard shops. They tend not to buy from the art auction, photos, or go to bingo. They don't buy tons of t-shirts and other stuff. They tend not to book cruise line tours but use independent tours. It's not unusual for an experienced Princess cruiser to have $500-600 (or more) OBC to start the cruise.

 

I had over $40 of OBC left over after my 16-day Star cruise last March. I didn't skimp and really tried to spend it all. Not only did I have $450 in OBC to start but I also had $100's worth of free Internet

And probably $150 in free laundry. That's not that unusual.

 

I agree with all of this but it would surprise most cruisers that the biggest source of revenue on board most ships is the selling of beverages. Not all cruisers buy souvenirs and pictures but cruising and drinking whether it's colas or martinis go hand in hand.

[Coral]

If I am figuring correctly, two elite passengers are given 500 minutes free internet time on a 14 day cruise. That is over 35 minutes per day. I don't consider that cheap by any means.

 

If the ship's system is reaching capacity, they either have to restrict usage or expand, so they have made wise economic decision.

 

On the other hand, there has been far more advances in internet technology and Princess always seems to be behind in this regards. I think they plan on upgrading this next year in the Caribbean. It will be long over due IMO.

 

Princess makes a ton on internet for those who pay for it. When they first introduced it on the ships, it was .35/minute.

[Wehwalt]

As a pretty frequent cruiser on Princess, RCL, and AMA river cruises; as a Carnival Corp'n shareowner; and, as someone who spent a significant portion of my career focused on improvments to customer service and satisfaction. I suspect that there are some 'truths' at work here.

 

First - I do not believe that that there are corporate people focused on cost reduction. My suspicion is that they are focused on improving the value equation for everyone, including shareowners, customers, and profits.

 

Second - My belief is that no corporation will 'remove' anything from their customers without understanding the total impact of that change. Many of us here obviously utilize the internet. I have no feel how widespread the usage of this onboard benefit is for those who are not on these boards. I understand that there are a few.

 

Third - I agree that one can percieve that things have been removed but I also also feel tht if one looks at the whole equation there are also things that have been added. Some of these benefits may not appeal to us personally but the bottom line is that cruising still represents good value for the dollar and we feel that Princess has one of the best overall products on the market.

 

Safe journeys.

 

Between my two journeys on Pacific Princess, there was obvious cost cutting. Cheaper grades of meat were obvious even to my non-foodie eye. Shuttles that were free in June were charged for in November. Most of the better prizes at trivia were reduced to lanyards and belt clips. I saw those because they passed in front of my eyes. There were probably other, less obvious ones too.

[Loonbeam]

Overall, a new cruiser will spend significantly more per cruise viia the ship than a repeat passenger. That said, there is a marketing cost associated with new passengers, so the lines try to have a mix of repeat passengers who are cost effective to retain and easier to reach to fill cabins.

 

But lets look at the bigger picture. At least based on pricing, the cruise lines are in the same position as the airlines were years ago. Costs are increasing at a rate that capacity and demand do not permit prices to rise at, thus creating a gap. The only options for the line are to increase ancilliary revenue and reduce costs. Otherwise they stop making money and eventually go out of business.

 

Fortunately, they have not gone the route of airlines with core products being moved to a la carte, and I hope they don't. More likely, you will see capacity reductions in order to increase pricing and more larger ships to gain economies of scale. It would not surprise me to see some of the smaller, older ships start to get retired over the next few years.

 

That said, you will continue to see cost reductions in food, staffing and amenities, because they can't raise prices and still fill rooms.

I am not sure if a new cruiser is the biggest return in terms of dollars spent for the cruise line but do admit that it is the biggest pool of potential customers. Any cruise line needs to fill the ship to make a profit.

 

Maybe cruise lines are paying less attention to building "customers for life" approach because the new customer pool is so large and so far they have been very successful tapping new customers.

 

Vinnie

[highheel girl]

Princess is at it again. They have striped giving free Internet to suite passengers. Also the priority booking for speciality restaurants is gone. Complaining to the front desk, I was told that I was paying for a nice cabin. We are on the Grand and it just ain't so. The Elite passengers receive 250 free minutes no matter if they are in a suite or an inside cabin.

We purchase the suites mainly for the nice perks that use to go with them, as well as the extra room. However, as an Elite card holder, I think I will save some money and take a smaller cabin if I ever decide to sail with Princess again. The good old days of sailing are gone, and we will just have to rethink where we we spend our entertainment dollars.

As far as the crew we have met they are wonderful and try their best to make your cruise enjoyable,but Princess is making it harder for them.

 

 

 

Speak with passenger services and have the internet charges removed, you booked before the change right? (June 2012).

[PunkiC]

I assume that you are aware that a large part of the problem focuses on bandwidth.

 

Free internet means that one or more persons in a suite will leave their tablet, laptop or wifi phone connected 24/7. This is great for checking email and sitting down to surf the web and read Cruise Critic.

 

It is not great for the other 3000 passengers, some of whom have limited time to use the internet and are paying per minute for the privilege. The 'always on' passengers are using a VERY limited internet connection to slow down service for everyone else, including the IT services for the purser and other administrative functions onboard that use the internet.

 

This is so right, and I must admit that at home, where I don't need to think about limited time, we always leave two or three devices on 24/7. Why not?

 

Moreover, I know of suite passengers who let their friends come into their suite and use their internet. I have also heard of suite passengers who submit laundry and dry cleaning for their friends. I really wish they would not jeopardize these perks.

 

We still work and, in addition to the elite internet package, always sign up for an equal amount of time when we are offered the less expensive package upon boarding. We always have a little time left over and are able to complete all of our work (an play a little on Facebook) during our cruise.

[janacin]

On the other hand, there has been far more advances in internet technology and Princess always seems to be behind in this regards. I think they plan on upgrading this next year in the Caribbean. It will be long over due IMO.

 

Princess makes a ton on internet for those who pay for it. When they first introduced it on the ships, it was .35/minute.

 

It's not all profit for Princess. Princess pays dearly for satellite time.