pacheco18 Posted January 6, 2013 #1 Share Posted January 6, 2013 There is a (negative) discussion about Park West on the Regent boards and a poster who is currently on Regatta states that Park West is back on Oceania! Can anyone confirm? Are they back on all the O ships? This is awful news IMO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wripro Posted January 6, 2013 #2 Share Posted January 6, 2013 I agree. The first I'd heard about it was on the Regent thread, just like you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paulchili Posted January 6, 2013 #3 Share Posted January 6, 2013 There is a (negative) discussion about Park West on the Regent boards and a poster who is currently on Regatta states that Park West is back on Oceania! Can anyone confirm? Are they back on all the O ships? This is awful news IMO They are not here on the Marina - thank goodness :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pacheco18 Posted January 6, 2013 Author #4 Share Posted January 6, 2013 I will be back on Nautica in April and I am hoping that they are not there either. What is Oceania thinking?? Next we will have ship's photographers! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiawahdon Posted January 6, 2013 #5 Share Posted January 6, 2013 Google Park West Galleries, read about the law suits and then tell me any intelligent person would buy even a poster from them. Why did RCCL kick them off their ships 2 years ago? My opinion of O just went down a notch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marebear Posted January 6, 2013 #6 Share Posted January 6, 2013 Google Park West Galleries, read about the law suits and then tell me any intelligent person would buy even a poster from them. Why did RCCL kick them off their ships 2 years ago? My opinion of O just went down a notch. How do you know it is true? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rare LHT28 Posted January 6, 2013 #7 Share Posted January 6, 2013 I believe it was posted in this thread Don did mention it was not Park West http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?p=36445187#post36445187 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jancruz Posted January 6, 2013 #8 Share Posted January 6, 2013 There were art auctions on the 12/20 Riviera BUT not Park West a different company.. Jancruz1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
orchestrapal Posted January 6, 2013 #9 Share Posted January 6, 2013 Which company hardly matters... Most O cruisers felt that NO art auctions was one of many reasons we love the line.:rolleyes: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pacheco18 Posted January 6, 2013 Author #10 Share Posted January 6, 2013 Which company hardly matters...Most O cruisers felt that NO art auctions was one of many reasons we love the line.:rolleyes: Exactly Art auctions are cheesy and sleazy -- not at all congruent with the ambiance on O. Why on earth would O bring them back???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hondorner Posted January 7, 2013 #11 Share Posted January 7, 2013 ...Why on earth would O bring them back???? Probably for the antithetical reason of why they got rid of them. Art auctions are designed to provide revenue. But, there is a cost associated with them. The auctioneer(s) do not stay in crew quarters -- they are given cabins that would otherwise provide revenue. There are handling and other expenses. At the point where revenue from the earlier Park West Galleries fell bel;ow costs, there was no point to keep them. Obviously, since Park West is still on Regent, there is sufficient revenue to cover costs and provide revenue. My guess is this new company, I think World something, has provided Oceania with some sort of guarantee as an experiment. I would further guess that if the experiment fails, the new company would go the way of Park West. The bottom line, then, is to boycott the auctions. By not buying anything, you would be doing your part. The problem, of course, is if enough people enjoy the auctions and the art enough to purchase, their "vote" will trump yours. As I pointed out earlier, the biggest detraction for me was the missing original art selected by FDR. A lot of it was still there, but enough of it was gone to make me aware of what I considered poor alternatives. Other than that, I was not even aware the auctions were being held, other than the notice in the Daily Currents. They are not cluttering up the hallways with art on easels; it's tastefully hung throughout the ship. I became fully aware of it when I saw several large pieces with small "sold" signs. It would, in my opinion, take a very narrow minded view to make it a deal breaker... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pacheco18 Posted January 7, 2013 Author #12 Share Posted January 7, 2013 It is not about being a "deal breaker." Art auctions are tacky. Declasse. I do not see a single poster anywhere who loves those art auctions. On an R ship I think those auctions would be quite conspicuous and not in a good way. My question still stands -- Oceania knows its demographic, it tries to please that demographic -- did someone tell FDR that we wanted the art auctions back? LOL Why in the world? If they need more profit, find another way!! These art auctions are antithetical to everything Oceania stands for in the cruise world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
digtexas Posted January 7, 2013 #13 Share Posted January 7, 2013 Yes, there have been art auctions on board, and they have taken up a corner of Horizons. Having said that, it hasn't really impacted us at all. I'll take ship's photographers over art auctions any day! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pacheco18 Posted January 7, 2013 Author #14 Share Posted January 7, 2013 Yes, there have been art auctions on board, and they have taken up a corner of Horizons. Having said that, it hasn't really impacted us at all. I'll take ship's photographers over art auctions any day! I hope it's the same corner as the smokers. LOL Actually, I tend to agree about the photographers being preferable to art auctions. On the Paul Gauguin the photographer was low key and we ended up with an amazing photo of ourselves that was packaged with a photo of the ship and the itinerary. Every time we look at it we think about booking the PG again. Art auctions have to go. I hope someone is listening (or reading). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
orchestrapal Posted January 7, 2013 #15 Share Posted January 7, 2013 Yes, there have been art auctions on board, and they have taken up a corner of Horizons. Having said that, it hasn't really impacted us at all. I'll take ship's photographers over art auctions any day! Wonderful if it's held in the enclosed smokers area then very few people will be bothered by the auction.:D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kissing Seahorses Posted January 7, 2013 #16 Share Posted January 7, 2013 Although I have been aware of their existence, on 25+ cruises (on 3 lines), I have never actually observed or been impacted by an art auction onboard. I guess I would put them in the same catagory as the jewelry shop on board, I might peruse the goods out of curiosity, but I prefer to purchase from my trusted jeweler at home. It doesn't bother me that they exist, but neither would I purchase from them. I sometimes think these type issues are holdover gripes from bad experiences on mass market ships. Just as some resent signing chits for drinks and consider "all inclusive" ships to be the epitome of class. I can tell you that I have been presented with checks in private clubs, resorts and the like and at the best, you barely even know it has been done. It really comes down to the way these things are handled, not their very existance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
USNUZULOOSE Posted January 7, 2013 #17 Share Posted January 7, 2013 I won't purchase, but I like looking at the art. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruin Steve Posted January 7, 2013 #18 Share Posted January 7, 2013 A friend of mine once purchased a couple of prints at one of these auctions...said he got a deal...the auctioneer told him they were worth $1000 but he picked them up via the auction for $400... I said, let's look them up on the internet... We googled the artist and the title of the work...and found out he could have bought them back at home via the internet for under $200...framed! He said, "Never again!"... First thing you need to know about auctions is that you NEVER get a bargain at an auction...The entire concept of the auction is to drive prices HIGHER...Think laws of supply and demand...In a normal sales environment, you have multiple sellers vying for your business as a "free agent" buyer...You take what you want to purchase and shop for the best price...The merchant has to be competitive... BUT, with an auction, the deal is that the Seller has multiple buyers competing for the same product...So, even in a completely on the level auction, you, the buyer, are at a disadvantage... What the auctioneer really wants is a LARGE crowd where the laws of probability are that he can get multiple bidders for each item...The psychology of the auction is that if you were willing to pay $300 for something, the fact that someone else bids $310 doesn't make you walk away--You will go to $320...after all, it's only another $20 more...and, after all, if that other guy was trying to grab it for $310, it MUST be worth at least that...and so on... Of course, if there isn't another guy willing to pay $310, no need for the auctioneer to worry...the action is moving so fast and the crowd is so large that...whoa...wait a second...$330 to the gentleman in the back of the room...Which gentlemen? How should I know...he's behind me and I didn't turn around fast enough to see him...But...I'd better up my bid to $340...Whew! Almost lost it for want of just another $20... The auctioneer knows EXACTLY what he wants for the piece at a minimum...and he's got several devices, some legal, some not, to make sure he gets it: Minimum bids, reserve...and phantom bidders... He could also use the phantom bidder to get you to, basically, bid against yourself until he gets you to go as far as you will go...Then, when you've finally had enough...Wow...that other guy, wherever he is, just bid $510...and I just cannot go over $500...I guess I lost...Well...not exactly...After the auction, the auctioneer seeks you out and tells you the "other guy" somehow flaked out...and, if you still want the piece, he will let you have it for that $500 you had offered before being outbid (doesn't really matter that you were the only real bidder even willing to buy it back at $250)... The "appraisals" by the way, are all worthless...What is an appraisal, after all, than an opinion? How accurate do you think an ART appraisal is? One done on a print or lithograph...#437/1000? Do you think that appraiser has figures on the actual selling price of the other 999? If so, where is he getting them? Who hired this appraiser and what are his credentials? Think about it? YOU are not getting it appraised...You don't have the opportunity...Park West or whioever the auctioneer may be is "hiring" the appraiser--if at all--and they have every incentive to claim the value to be WAY above what it is... And, for gosh sakes, do NOT try to compare prices with your local gallery...They are not trying to give you a good price either...These are mass produced artworks--check the internet...I GUARANTY you that you will find it considerably cheaper...If you don't, it's that you aren't really looking all that hard... So, why on earth would you race, compete and crawl over other people (or phantom people) to buy a piece knowing that, even in a completely honest auction, you are buying it at a premium? In a sale that is rigged against you? Now, if you know they are lying to you? Cheating? Using deceptive and fraudulent practices? Here's an idea: If you see a piece you especially want on the cruise ship (displayed BEFORE the auction--don't wait for the auction), then head on over to the internet cafe on that ship and Google search the piece...Do a thorough job...Know EXACTLY what you could buy it for at your leisure when you get home...Print out the web page...Then go talk to the auctioneer BEFORE the auction...and make him an offer based on a REALISTIC and REASONABLE price: "Hello, Mr. Park West...I see you have 'Four Dogs Playing Poker' by R. Tist...I know that I can buy it from three different sources for $40...$60 framed...Would you like to sell one to me for THAT price? Or should I wait until I get home or just go order it over the internet?" If he won't sell it to you, auction notwithstanding, I'd be surprised...But, if not, tell him thank you and walk away... I don't just find the art auctions irritating...I find them insulting... I DO buy art while on a cruise...in port, from local artists...Then, at least, it really means something...as a memento of your vacation...something special to remind you of a port visited on a cruise...not just a mass-produced product you could have bought anywhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spindrift Posted January 8, 2013 #19 Share Posted January 8, 2013 You know, being involved in architecture and design, these companies, as described by Steve Bruin, who is right on, these programs are a scam. What is disappointing is Oceania is backing this kind of operation for profit at the expense of their passengers. We agree with everything Steve Bruin has said, and it is disappointing that O would be behind an operation of this type. Doesn't it make you wonder what their reputation might be. We, personally like O, but it is services of this type that make you step back and say, woah, what kind of company are we dealing with. We are so shocked that O would do this again. Of course, that is their choice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hondorner Posted January 8, 2013 #20 Share Posted January 8, 2013 I have only two thoughts at this point: 1. Caveat Emptor 2. It's entertainment if you don't buy, and still entertainment if you actually like the art and then buy. Oh, yeah, one more... Trying to discern the overall reputation of an entire corporation from one miniscule act seems a bit over the top, sort of like having one disappointing meal ruin an entire vacation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Love.II.Cruise Posted January 8, 2013 #21 Share Posted January 8, 2013 We've purchased several pieces of art on other cruises and then taken them to a highly reputable art appraiser in a state next to us (since our state lacked art appraisers). The verdict? * Two pieces we returned because we were not happy with the appraisal. Our appraiser also told us to search online about these pieces and it wasn't worth keeping. * Two pieces were appraised about the price we paid. But they were so cheap and we liked them and didn't care. * Two other pieces appraised 3.5 times higher than paid. These were pieces where no matter what they appraised, we wanted to keep. * Three other pieces appraised about 35% higher than paid. * Two other pieces, originals, were much worth it. We knew this would be the case before we even bought them, but still had them appraised. Honestly, we've been to many art auctions and several times regretted not making a purchase. We finally broke that trend when we bought an original and then went from there. We are happy with our art and never felt the auctioneer had any ghost bidders. In fact, nearly all art we bought (except for one) did we actually have someone else bid against us. Art is subjective. Buy it because you like it, or maybe because you want it as a memory of your cruise. If you don't like the auctions, don't go. Personally, on our last Oceania cruise, I would have liked to see the charted map of our cruise auctioned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hypercafe Posted January 8, 2013 #22 Share Posted January 8, 2013 I find it odd that some people are so against these auctions it almost a religion. Its the same on all boards. We enjoy going to them and have gotten some pieces, the few we have my wife really liked so I have never checked the price. I don't think it's the place to invest your 401K and the auctioneer will tell you that. Our first O cruise is coming up in March and to tell the truth I didn't know or think about the fact if they had the art program. Since they do it will be fun to see their version. By the way I think bingo is very tacky, I hope they don't have that !!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cinycat Posted January 8, 2013 #23 Share Posted January 8, 2013 I was on this cruise and did not find the art auctions a problem. In fact, they were quite interesting. It was stuff you wouldn't find in a usual at sea auction. they were actually hung on the walls (and the art on Riviera is fabulous). So, they weren't a problem (at least not for me). Now photographers would be another issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A Knitter Posted January 9, 2013 #24 Share Posted January 9, 2013 I hope it's the same corner as the smokers. LOL Actually, I tend to agree about the photographers being preferable to art auctions. On the Paul Gauguin the photographer was low key and we ended up with an amazing photo of ourselves that was packaged with a photo of the ship and the itinerary. Every time we look at it we think about booking the PG again. Art auctions have to go. I hope someone is listening (or reading). Laraine, I was shocked to see the auction on Regatta on our recent cruise in November. It was held in the Regatta Lounge and it was virtually empty of passengers. Enjoy your trip!!:) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mura Posted January 9, 2013 #25 Share Posted January 9, 2013 Somehow we always missed the auctions on the ships back in the past, so they didn't bother us. We did see announcements but that was about it. So I personally don't mind if the auctions return as long as *I* am not affected! And if few people are interested, I don't think they'll continue for long. I'd be much more upset if you told us photographers were back on the scene! Mura Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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