Royal trying to attract more upscale cruisers?

[cruzeluvr]

IMHO, the direction Royal Caribbean is going is anything but "upscale". I think they are gravitating toward the NCL & Carnival models and are attempting to attract more of the mass market cruisers. If they really wanted to go more upscale, I think they would offer more of what they offered 15-20 years ago - a luxurious cruise experience aimed at an upscale clientele rather than a floating amusement park. Just my $.02. YMMV

 

While I personally do not think the changes to Oasis that were announced today:

 

OUR BIGGEST SHIP GETS EVEN BETTER

 

will have any impact on 99% of the cruisers here on Cruise Critic it sure looks like RCI is attempting to attract more upscale cruisers.

 

For example:

 

1. A full time formal dining option

2. The new higher end shops

3. More suite perks/space/dedicated dining option

 

Only time will tell if these changes end up being wildly successful, fairly uneventful, or a huge failure.

 

However, I wonder what happens when that first time RCI cruiser comes to an area of a ship and they are told "Sorry, only XYZ people can come in here".

 

Do you see this as expanding/creating 1st, 2nd, 3rd class passengers or no?

 

Shopping venues aside, I think this is more to compete with the NCL Haven Suites, which really debuted the ship within the ship concept among the mass market lines. They have matched all but the private courtyard, which is obviously difficult to create on existing ships without an extended dry dock.

 

NCL still has the edge though as (most) Haven suites are located around this exclusive area, which includes a bar, restaurant, concierge desk, and sun deck. For people looking for that type of experience and aren't quite ready for/can't afford the ultra exclusive/high end cruise lines Haven is great.

 

I'm glad those options are there when I want them, and again when I don't as they help keep non-suite cabin fares lower. If you cruise suites, this is just another perk to help keep you loyal.

 

 

The "formal" dining room is far from formal. Men are not even asked to wear a tie. The requirement for men is a coat or sweater (does a baseball jacket meet the requirement) and pants without holes or rips.

 

The dedicated dining option, although it has a beautiful view, is far from posh or upscale as shown in photos released to day. (Hopefully they will put tableclothes on these Windjammer style table). On the Quantum the suite restaurant is off to the side of the Windjammer and on the Oasis it is just above it.

 

 

My most recent observation (two weeks ago) is that Royal is attempting to Carnivalize themselves.

Yes there are perks for Suites guests )and many protest as they longingly gaze at the suite folks (who spent 4 times as much as they did to be on the same ship)..but Royal continues to cut wait staff, increase the ambient temperature of the ship, cut back on food quality, etc...all to attract the Carnival customer ....while, in my humble opinion, dissing the loyal passengers who had become accustomed to "the Royal" treatment.

[OCruisers]

IMHO, the direction Royal Caribbean is going is anything but "upscale". I think they are gravitating toward the NCL & Carnival models and are attempting to attract more of the mass market cruisers. If they really wanted to go more upscale, I think they would offer more of what they offered 15-20 years ago - a luxurious cruise experience aimed at an upscale clientele rather than a floating amusement park. Just my $.02. YMMV

 

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Exactly what I was going to say! 30 years ago RCCL was considered an upscale cruise line. Honestly, it really was!

Things change. Seems RCCL now has a loyal and expanding passenger base who really to love their current concept so I'm confused at why they would even consider changing it. :confused:

LuLu

Edited October 14, 2014 by OCruisers

[Homosassa]

The funny thing is that once upon a time, Royal Caribbean was "upscale." The targeted demographic was upper middle class that want a relaxing vacation, excellent food, and top notch service.

 

A corporation decision was made with the addition of Celebrity, and later Azamara, to down class the Royal Caribbean brand to compete with the low end Carnival and NCL.

 

They have succeed and have driven the many loyal passenger from their halcyon days to other lines that offered the cruise experience that used to be expected from Royal Caribbean.

 

I personally don't like the ship within a ship concept. Why pay way more for a cruise and then find oneself restricted to a very small portion of the ship for the cruise experience one desires instead of having the whole ship available at that level.

 

I feel the decision was made to bring the Royal Caribbean standard down to compete for what was perceived to be a larger group of passengers and the corporation has found out that the old adage of "Quality, not quantity" should have been the standard which was maintained.

[kwazi07]

The funny thing is that once upon a time, Royal Caribbean was "upscale." The targeted demographic was upper middle class that want a relaxing vacation, excellent food, and top notch service.

 

A corporation decision was made with the addition of Celebrity, and later Azamara, to down class the Royal Caribbean brand to compete with the low end Carnival and NCL.

 

They have succeed and have driven the many loyal passenger from their halcyon days to other lines that offered the cruise experience that used to be expected from Royal Caribbean.

 

I personally don't like the ship within a ship concept. Why pay way more for a cruise and then find oneself restricted to a very small portion of the ship for the cruise experience one desires instead of having the whole ship available at that level.

 

I feel the decision was made to bring the Royal Caribbean standard down to compete for what was perceived to be a larger group of passengers and the corporation has found out that the old adage of "Quality, not quantity" should have been the standard which was maintained.

You know that for ship within a ship, you aren't regulated to the suite area. It is an exclusive space, where no other guests can enter. You could spend your whole vacay in there, but most don't.

 

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk

[Spurschick]

The "formal" dining room is far from formal. Men are not even asked to wear a tie. The requirement for men is a coat or sweater (does a baseball jacket meet the requirement) and pants without holes or rips.:eek::eek:

 

The dedicated dining option, although it has a beautiful view, is far from posh or upscale as shown in photos released to day. (Hopefully they will put tableclothes on these Windjammer style table). On the Quantum the suite restaurant is off to the side of the Windjammer and on the Oasis it is just above it.

 

Would you be so kind to share where you found this dress code. All info I have seen on the Grande Restaurant is formal dress code which RC state is suit and tie.

 

 

Casual: Sport shirts and slacks for men, sundresses or pants for women

Smart Casual: Jackets and ties for men, dresses or pantsuits for women

Formal: Suits and ties or tuxedos for men, cocktail dresses for women

Edited October 14, 2014 by Spurschick

[3dog]

Exactly what I was going to say! 30 years ago RCCL was considered an upscale cruise line. Honestly, it really was!

Things change. Seems RCCL now has a loyal and expanding passenger base who really to love their current concept so I'm confused at why they would even consider changing it. :confused:

LuLu

 

30 years ago, pretty much all cruise lines were "upscale" by most considerations. Prices were often higher than they are today, and there were far fewer options and features. Folks dressed every night and food could be prepared nearly to-oder as there were far fewer passengers aboard. The change was to make it more affordable, so that everyone could partake.

 

Anyone looking for that same upscale experience need to look into the more luxurious lines.

[SamFritz]

My most recent observation (two weeks ago) is that Royal is attempting to Carnivalize themselves.

 

Yes there are perks for Suites guests )and many protest as they longingly gaze at the suite folks (who spent 4 times as much as they did to be on the same ship)..but Royal continues to cut wait staff, increase the ambient temperature of the ship, cut back on food quality, etc...all to attract the Carnival customer ....while, in my humble opinion, dissing the loyal passengers who had become accustomed to "the Royal" treatment.

 

 

Those were my thoughts too. Royal is much LESS Royal than when we started cruising ten years ago.

 

 

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[MichaelCMTX]

However, I wonder what happens when that first time RCI cruiser comes to an area of a ship and they are told "Sorry, only XYZ people can come in here".

 

For a first-time passenger that becomes an up-sell opportunity for the next time.

 

More immediate issue would be when longtime RCI cruisers are told "you can't come in here anymore." That's like when Texas raised the drinking age from 18 to 21... and you were 19.

[aurelius180]

My most recent observation (two weeks ago) is that Royal is attempting to Carnivalize themselves.

Yes there are perks for Suites guests )and many protest as they longingly gaze at the suite folks (who spent 4 times as much as they did to be on the same ship)..but Royal continues to cut wait staff, increase the ambient temperature of the ship, cut back on food quality, etc...all to attract the Carnival customer ....while, in my humble opinion, dissing the loyal passengers who had become accustomed to "the Royal" treatment.

 

I completely agree. On our first cruise in 2007 it was downright chilly onboard with the A/C and I loved it. Now it's devolved to where you can barely tell when you've entered the ship from a Caribbean port.

 

I'd pay an upcharge for that A/C all day, everyday. :cool:

[CruiserRob]

I don't mind a small area set aside for suited guests, I am more concerned that they are taking the experience for the rest of the guests down market. I am on the Allure in 3 weeks, and I don't want to feel that it was less than it was the last time I sailed her.

[Fat Paul]

At this point in my life I am only interested in sailing in a grand suite or higher. I have never cruised in less than a junior suite. I have only cruised with Royal Caribbean but that may soon change. If I book a haven owners suite with NCL we get many more benefits and exclusive areas such as pools, sun decks, bars, butler, in room alcohol and many other benefits. If Royal Caribbean doesn't keep up with other cruise lines they run the risk of loosing cruisers like me. If I spend five times what others spend on a cruise should I not expect a higher level of service?

[Sea3PO]

My most recent observation (two weeks ago) is that Royal is attempting to Carnivalize themselves.

Yes there are perks for Suites guests )and many protest as they longingly gaze at the suite folks (who spent 4 times as much as they did to be on the same ship)..but Royal continues to cut wait staff, increase the ambient temperature of the ship, cut back on food quality, etc...all to attract the Carnival customer ....while, in my humble opinion, dissing the loyal passengers who had become accustomed to "the Royal" treatment.

 

While I wouldn't phrase it quite the way you did, I totally agree!

 

Royal Caribbean IS trying to attract a more 'upscale cruiser'--on Azamara and Celebrity--but DEFINITELY NOT on Royal Caribbean. The Royal experience has slowly but steadily declined in our ten years of cruising. Just MHO, your mileage may vary....

 

Steve

[SPacificbound]

As with any business, I have no problem if RCL is attempting to attract big spenders. I applaud it a shareholder. As a cruiser, when I book, I know exactly what I will be entitled to. An example is US airplanes configurations, where there's 1st, business, extra leg seats and the common coach passengers. Every one on that plane knows exactly what they are getting.

 

Good post.

[mcatmcat]

I can't prove it but behind doors I know they want higher scaled customers.

 

 

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[Coralc]

An example is US airplanes configurations, where there's 1st, business, extra leg seats and the common coach passengers. Every one on that plane knows exactly what they are getting.

 

We didn't know and we won't ever do it again. We usually fly common coach on Southwest, American or United domestic, and it is tolerable.

 

I don't know if you meant US Airway, but we flew common coach to Europe one way with them, ONCE, and we will never, ever, ever do it again. I didn't even know they made coach seats that small, where the little TV is 4 inches in front of your face. It was a learning experience.

 

Knowledge comes from experience, and age and earnings, and we now book more comfortable seats and accommodations. :D

[Big_G]

I can't prove it but behind doors I know they want higher scaled customers.

 

 

Sent using the Cruise Critic forums app

 

I think they're trying to cover all their bases. They can't completely pass on their share of the market that could just as easily book with Carnival or Norwegian for a better price.

[Cindy]

I'm not sure about trying to attract a different customer across the board, but I do think they're trying to up the perks for suites to keep them full, and frankly they need to.

 

We always get a suite, and while the lounge is nice, the perk we like the most is being able to eat breakfast and lunch in a specialty restaurant. It somehow makes a giant ship seem more intimate, and we're NOT Windjammer people, so we've loved that, and the ability to order room service off the full menu.

 

What I'd love to see is more included in the suite price and less focus on adding dedicated "gold card" space. I think things like free laundry and dry cleaning, free internet, a bar set-up for entertaining, and specialty restaurant credits are all things offered by the competition that would be low or no cost for the cruise line. A suite on RCI is certainly better than a suite on Carnival, where all you get is the real estate, but Royal Caribbean could enhance the experience for very little money, and I think it would help keep suite passengers happy.

 

I also think Royal Caribbean needs to focus on the little things...in April on the Navigator, loungers had been removed from the balconies of all Grand Suites. We were told it was because too many people got drunk and fell off the chairs!:eek::rolleyes::eek: I did notice that it seems to be only Navigator GS passengers who have a drinking problem...those in an OS or an RFS appear to be able to hold their liquor, as do the GS passengers on other ships. Corporate told me it was because the chairs were on order, but I had a friend on the ship last week, and they had to request a lounger.:( How difficult is it to make sure your top suites at least have decent balcony furniture? Maybe they need to attend to the little details in addition to building suite lounges and restaurants.

Edited October 15, 2014 by Cindy

[StarSong2001]

I completely agree. On our first cruise in 2007 it was downright chilly onboard with the A/C and I loved it. Now it's devolved to where you can barely tell when you've entered the ship from a Caribbean port.

 

I'd pay an upcharge for that A/C all day, everyday. :cool:

 

So this is an example of "you can't please all the people all the time"

My first cruise was last year, and I was unhappily surprised at how chilly it was on the ship. I hate being cold! I had to purchase warmer clothes from their shops just so I wouldn't freeze. I brought clothes for the Caribbean, not Alaska. At least for my upcoming trip I know better now to pack for a cold indoor climate, but I'd prefer if it was warmer.

[davy jones]

A short answer to the OPs primary question is yes. A 3 class system already exists on Royal. 1. Suite passengers, 2. High C&A points, 3. Everyone else. It looks like Royal is increasing the difference between the classes. I'm not suggesting that the days of the Titantic will return, but it is a step in that direction from the "single class, except for accommodations" plan that transitioned the cruise industry from ocean transport to vacation provider.

 

Royal is a mass market cruise line and their primary competitors in that space are Carnival and NCL. The recent actions, discussed at length on these boards, are an attempt to compete with both. NCL has suite perks and multiple dining options, Carnival seems content with a single class, low cost fun model.

 

Whether it attracts new customers, or drives some away remains to be seen. That said, all three lines seem to be doing fairly well right now.

[JasonV1]

My feelings as well.

 

I can't afford the Haven Owners Suite (which is the one that includes the liquor setup, and of course the larger size cabin), but the Courtyard Penthouse Suites are still great (but admittedly not as large as Royal JR Suites).

 

I cruise mostly Royal, but I will return to the Haven for my personal milestones where I want something special. Royal has beautiful suites, but the NCL Haven suites are priced similar to comparable suites on Oasis/Quantum (if not lower), yet they include a number of perks that make *my* vacation more enjoyable.

 

That being said, the lack of a Solarium-type area means I have no plans to sail NCL unless I am in the Haven, or sailing the POA (Hawaii). They allow a limited number of people to pay for access to the Vibe beach club on their newer ships (closest thing they have to a Solarium), but that only has hot tubs/chairs/bar area (plus unless you board early the passes are likely sold out). So while NCL is innovating in some areas, even their newest ships have some design flaws (in my mind).

 

Now Royal, if you are reading this please don't think of converting the Solarium into a suite-only area. It is a key differentiator between you and the other mass market lines.

 

At this point in my life I am only interested in sailing in a grand suite or higher. I have never cruised in less than a junior suite. I have only cruised with Royal Caribbean but that may soon change. If I book a haven owners suite with NCL we get many more benefits and exclusive areas such as pools, sun decks, bars, butler, in room alcohol and many other benefits. If Royal Caribbean doesn't keep up with other cruise lines they run the risk of loosing cruisers like me. If I spend five times what others spend on a cruise should I not expect a higher level of service?

[JasonV1]

It isn't upscale, it is mass market. You can't fill an Oasis or Quantum class ship each week with upscale clientele, there aren't enough people.

 

On the bright side, more people can afford cruising now than ever before, which drives growth and innovation within the industry.

 

To keep the ships filled they need to attract a younger and wider demographic, especially if/when return guests migrate to other lines as they get older and (possibly) desire a different type of cruise vacation.

 

 

IMHO, the direction Royal Caribbean is going is anything but "upscale". I think they are gravitating toward the NCL & Carnival models and are attempting to attract more of the mass market cruisers. If they really wanted to go more upscale, I think they would offer more of what they offered 15-20 years ago - a luxurious cruise experience aimed at an upscale clientele rather than a floating amusement park. Just my $.02. YMMV

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Homosassa]

You know that for ship within a ship, you aren't regulated to the suite area. It is an exclusive space, where no other guests can enter. You could spend your whole vacay in there, but most don't.

 

Yes, I realize one is not limited to just one area. My point is, why should the upscale area be limited to just one small section of the ship. It is like buying a luxurious penthouse in a subsidized housing development. The penthouse is great but sooner or later, one needs to leave the penthouse.

[TheMastodon]

Right. I was not trying to imply they were. The example were things I felt would be more attractive to upscale purchasers. :)

 

 

 

And I would not disagree with that.

 

My post was meant to start a discussion about whether this creates or promotes a class system on a cruise (or not). Several people have already posted some very thoughtful replies that give us even more to think about.

 

RCI is way too informal for a class system.

[m*u*g*]

Tell us of the accommodations in steerage, Mr. Dawson. I hear they are quite good on this ship.

 

The best I've seen, ma'am. Hardly any rats.

[Maraprince]

While I personally do not think the changes to Oasis that were announced today:

OUR BIGGEST SHIP GETS EVEN BETTER

 

will have any impact on 99% of the cruisers here on Cruise Critic it sure looks like RCI is attempting to attract more upscale cruisers.

 

For example:

 

1. A full time formal dining option

2. The new higher end shops

3. More suite perks/space/dedicated dining option

 

Only time will tell if these changes end up being wildly successful, fairly uneventful, or a huge failure.

 

However, I wonder what happens when that first time RCI cruiser comes to an area of a ship and they are told "Sorry, only XYZ people can come in here".

 

Do you see this as expanding/creating 1st, 2nd, 3rd class passengers or no?

 

 

 

Definitely not looking for the "high end" passengers with bumper cars and the like. More for family groups and the first timers who will tend to spend more money eating at the extra charge dining venues because they will get frustrated with the system of having to make reservations at the free ones and not getting their desired time.

 

First timers also tend to purchase more from the shops on board and "buy" into all the "special promotions". I sailed with a couple, first time on a RCCL ship, who actually spent over $5,000 in just one shop on board -- almost more than it costed them to sail in an ocean view cabin! They also purchased other goodies on board along with the special photo deal (around $200). Plus, they shopped in the "recommended" shops ashore and came back with loads of receipts to present to the shopping rep.

 

MARAPRINCE