HAL no longer requires formal dress

[Wakepatrol]

I stumbled upon this thread and started reading the first few pages. Then, upon seeing the same old, same old. I skipped and skimmed - and jumped to the end.

 

This topic reminds me (and I am old enough to remember) of when my workplace decided to not require strict guidelines for dress code, as the "real world" outside was changing. Also, the new hires, relative to those of us who had been around awhile, were getting younger and younger.

 

No need to rehash the point/counter point opinions of the tread or workplace.

 

What I take from the stated rule from HAL's website is the strategic nature of what they are doing.

 

HAL has always impressed me as a well run operational company. They are difficult to beat on how they operate, maintain, service, etc., at a mid level cost structure. Nice to see they are being strategic, as well.

 

I am not sitting in the decision meeting, but the strategy and adjustment is clear. It is based on demographics. Those who are complaining the loudest may have 5, 10, maybe 20 years left to cruise. HAL has to adjust to the the changing preferences of the customers they wish to attract as times will move on. Those remaining customers may not want "formal", but prefer "gala". The old Trans Atlantic steamship days are over.

 

We have recently taken a few Princess cruises. A fairly well run cruise line, but I prefer HAL. Their demographics skew slightly younger. They have more activities, sometimes silly. When the older Princess (and other mid lines) clientele will prefer the quieter, more formal HAL like experience, will they want to wear tuxes, suits, or higher end dresses? Nope. Most of them are not CCers with these strong opinions.

 

Sure, there will be those who will not meet the intent of the rules.

 

My worst example is not someone who dressed down, but who "dressed up". While we overnighted in Hong Kong he bought a garish red and green monkey suit that depicted the worst Chinese stereotype you would find in an old old movie that did not know any better. He even wore a hat and queue (ponytail). Strictly met the dress code and the HAL staff could only look at him in horror. It took a few passengers to talk to him and point out how insulting he looked. He actually thought he looked cool. He never did understand. He at least took off his hat and queue.

 

Whatever the dress code, sh*t will happen.

 

 

Great post. My two cents is

 

They say only 20% of people have been on cruises (Americans for this example)I take it they want to get customers AND KEEP THEM.

 

I'm only 54 and my first cruise was in 2002. I was met at the gangway taken to my cabin,had delicious hors d'oeuvres in the Crows Nest, dress code was formal and smart casual. Waiters had time to chat,always was a wine guy handy. I clapped for The Baked Alaska Parade and cried at the

Love In Any Language song. I really felt special for 7 days. Yup they officially hooked the newbie first time cruiser. I then went on many more cruises.

 

Fast Forward 2015- Now there's been sooo many cutbacks,along with dumbing it down daily,never knew there was a man walking the face of the earth that didn't own a jacket,till I read it on cruise critic.

 

This all shapes up to a big resounding "Meh" don't know if you'd hook me under these conditions now. All these code words "More Relaxed" "Casual"

means "Nothing Really Special". Good luck hooking people with mediocrity,then again Golden Corral is full every evening,so what do I know?

[cruz chic]

Fixed schedule dining will lead to better ambiance and a less rushed staff.

 

No specialty dining means they can put that quality back into the MDR.

 

Where are these imaginary $299 cruises?

 

HAL stopped giving people reasons to dress for formal night by making it "just another night".

 

As far as fixed seating for breakfast and lunch; that is because people selectively pick the nostalgic things they want or do no want. I don't think anyone wants fixed breakfast and lunch seatings back.

 

Women are, by far, much more guilty of violating any sense of formal dress code than men are. Black spandex covered in shiny sequins is NOT formal in any way, shape, or form. The adherence of men to dress policies has been better than women for years.

 

Well, now HAL says the men can option for more comfort. DH will be delighted.

 

Maybe if HAL provided more special occasion events and great food they wouldn't need to sell $299 cruises (which I can't find anywhere, anyways).

 

You can easily find cruises for $299 (before port fees). Look at any online ta.

 

Black spandex and sequins. I don't have anything like this nor have I seen any woman on Hal dressed this way.

 

Even with elimination of open dining you would fill thise seats with traditional so that doesn't make any sense. People that are dining in the specialty restaurants are putting money in the Hal coffers. Getting rid of them would hurt the bottom line.

 

You should send your ideas to Hal. I'm sure they will be delighted that the answer to any financial problems will be so easily fixed.

Edited August 19, 2015 by cruz chic

[Topsham]

 

As others have said...HAL really does not make an effort to make it special so why would they expect their customers to make a big deal out of it.

 

 

 

 

You got this the wrong way around! HAL made the effort at all the time to make the best special cruise for everyone. It was the passengers that would not the effort!

[LoveyHowell]

You can easily find cruises for $299 (before port fees). Look at any online ta.

 

Black spandex and sequins. I don't have anything like this nor have I seen any woman on Hal dressed this way.

 

Even with elimination of open dining you would fill thise seats with traditional so that doesn't make any sense. People that are dining in the specialty restaurants are putting money in the Hal coffers. Getting rid of them would hurt the bottom line.

 

You should send your ideas to Hal. I'm sure they will be delighted that the answer to any financial problems will be so easily fixed.

 

If HAL wants to return to providing non-rushed service, eliminate guests coming and going willy nilly. If HAL wants to provide excellent food for all in the MDR worthy of dressing up, stop with the upcharge restaurants. If HAL wants to get away from selling $299 cruises CHARGE MORE and GIVE MORE. People will self-select in to better experiences through higher participation rates.

 

I stated my opinions and why I thought how I did about them. No need for your rudeness and condescension. However, having read your postings for quite a while (I choose not to post here due to the tone and atmosphere) I am NOT surprised in the least.

[iancal]

I was referring specifically to the food, the service,and the noise in the MDR on gala nights.

[LoveyHowell]

You got this the wrong way around! HAL made the effort at all the time to make the best special cruise for everyone. It was the passengers that would not the effort!

 

HAL absolutely has NOT made efforts at all times. Compare 2015 HAL to 2005 HAL and you'll gasp. Stop blaming pax for not participating when there is no reason to participate. HAL runs the show.

[POA1]

$299 imaginary cruises?

 

HAL has been selling last minute Alaska cruises on Zaandam, Statendam, and Oosterdam @ $299-$399(before taxes) for the past two seasons. We are a drive away from Vancouver and keep an eye out for good prices.

Ditto for Fort Lauderdale, particularly early season. There were some at less than $299 last November.

[LMaxwell]

Ditto for Fort Lauderdale, particularly early season. There were some at less than $299 last November.

2014 cruise pricing has no relation to 2015. Everything is up significantly.

[POA1]

2014 cruise pricing has no relation to 2015. Everything is up significantly.

The 2014 cruises weren't priced low originally. It's just that demand was so slack by the time the season started that all the lines operating out of Fort Lauderdale and Miami were offering fire sail prices.

[Lizzie68]

$299 imaginary cruises?

 

HAL has been selling last minute Alaska cruises on Zaandam, Statendam, and Oosterdam @ $299-$399(before taxes) for the past two seasons. We are a drive away from Vancouver and keep an eye out for good prices.

 

I'm always watching but I never see prices that low out of Vancouver for Alaska.:(

[iancal]

There is a popular on line ta ,vacation, page that lists them and others in various geographies.

 

We check weekly since we are leaving on a land trip and may want to snag a last minute Med offer.

 

HAL, Princess cruises (usually insides or obstructed ocean views) have been offered consistently for these prices over the last two seasons. Just checked this AM....there is one for $399.

 

Last summer they went down as low as $249 for 7 days on Zaandam...inside cabin. Lowest we have seen this summer has been $299 inside/$399 outside on both HAL and Princess.

 

At some point our plan is to do two.....one in each direction, different cruise lines going up and coming back.

Edited August 19, 2015 by iancal

[Dasbeak]

We have reservations at Manny's Steakhouse in Minneapolis Sunday evening...from their web site: "Manny’s does not observe a dress code. You'll feel comfortable both in formal or upscale casual attire." Sweat suit and green Crocs it is!!!

[cruz chic]

If HAL wants to return to providing non-rushed service, eliminate guests coming and going willy nilly. If HAL wants to provide excellent food for all in the MDR worthy of dressing up, stop with the upcharge restaurants. If HAL wants to get away from selling $299 cruises CHARGE MORE and GIVE MORE. People will self-select in to better experiences through higher participation rates.

 

I stated my opinions and why I thought how I did about them. No need for your rudeness and condescension. However, having read your postings for quite a while (I choose not to post here due to the tone and atmosphere) I am NOT surprised in the least.

 

Just because you don't agree doesn't make my posts rude and condescending. Perhaps a read of the guidelines would be in order for you. If you feel my posts are rude and condescending I invite you to hit the red triangle and I'll be doing the same for this one.

[dakrewser]

LoveyHowell & cruz chic:

 

Neither of you posted rude comments, neither post is worth reporting. You both have strong opinions and stated them. That's what chat boards are for.

[caladezi]

HAL absolutely has NOT made efforts at all times. Compare 2015 HAL to 2005 HAL and you'll gasp. Stop blaming pax for not participating when there is no reason to participate. HAL runs the show.

 

I totally agree that it is the cruise lines (not just HAL) that have dumbed down the formal nights and the dress. There is no difference these days in the MDR between a regular night and a formal night. When we started cruising over 15 years ago on Celebrity (which I consider equal to HAL) the formal nights had the wait staff dressed in tuxes, white linen chair covers, and 13 pieces of silverware set around a charger at your place setting. The meals were wonderful and presented beautifully on the plate. Now the meals are more like a moderate priced restaurant and nothing at all special. There is no longer any reason to dress up when the ones throwing the party have eliminated the incentive to dress up for anything special.

[LMaxwell]

I totally agree that it is the cruise lines (not just HAL) that have dumbed down the formal nights and the dress. There is no difference these days in the MDR between a regular night and a formal night. When we started cruising over 15 years ago on Celebrity (which I consider equal to HAL) the formal nights had the wait staff dressed in tuxes, white linen chair covers, and 13 pieces of silverware set around a charger at your place setting. The meals were wonderful and presented beautifully on the plate. Now the meals are more like a moderate priced restaurant and nothing at all special. There is no longer any reason to dress up when the ones throwing the party have eliminated the incentive to dress up for anything special.

Spot on. It's just another night. No different. For better and for worse

[Wakepatrol]

I totally agree that it is the cruise lines (not just HAL) that have dumbed down the formal nights and the dress. There is no difference these days in the MDR between a regular night and a formal night. When we started cruising over 15 years ago on Celebrity (which I consider equal to HAL) the formal nights had the wait staff dressed in tuxes, white linen chair covers, and 13 pieces of silverware set around a charger at your place setting. The meals were wonderful and presented beautifully on the plate. Now the meals are more like a moderate priced restaurant and nothing at all special. There is no longer any reason to dress up when the ones throwing the party have eliminated the incentive to dress up for anything special.

 

But it's really a moot point. If they had $9,000 worth of silverware on the table and served kobe beef you're still up against

 

 

It's my cruise,and I'll dress how I want

 

I dress up for work everyday

 

Those airlines are charging baggage fees Blah blah blah

 

and the myriad of other excuses I'm constantly reading.

[LMaxwell]

But it's really a moot point. If they had $9,000 worth of silverware on the table and served kobe beef you're still up against

 

 

It's my cruise,and I'll dress how I want

 

I dress up for work everyday

 

Those airlines are charging baggage fees Blah blah blah

 

and the myriad of other excuses I'm constantly reading.

 

That's a total cop out and just more blame on pax and defending the company for not doing anything to make the night special. Sorry; but if cruise lines want people to dress for a costume party, throw a party to dress for! More courses. Table side preparation of food. Staff up so that there is refined, efficient services, not waiters scrambling like chickens without a head. Bring live strolling string music into the MDR on formal nights (has been many years since I have seen this on any line). Create more activities beyond just dinner to make it a "formal evening".

 

But, THEY WON'T. It's DONE. Specialty Dining killed it. They will never bring back the exemplary service and special foods to the MDR because there is too much profit to be made with specialty dining and people line up for it.

 

So long as the cruise line isn't giving me a reason to drag a suit...I won't. There's nothing wrong with being casual on vacation.

Edited August 19, 2015 by LMaxwell

[dakrewser]

That's a total cop out and just more blame on pax and defending the company for not doing anything to make the night special. Sorry; but if cruise lines want people to dress for a costume party, throw a party to dress for! More courses. Table side preparation of food. Staff up so that there is refined, efficient services, not waiters scrambling like chickens without a head. Bring live strolling string music into the MDR on formal nights (has been many years since I have seen this on any line). Create more activities beyond just dinner to make it a "formal evening".

 

 

Well said. I'll gladly dress formally - on a ship, in a restaurant, at a hotel or in a private home - for a meal which deserves that level of respect. Invite me to The Olive Garden and I'll also dress accordingly. But please don't try to tell me that if I wear a tux then my food will taste better!

Edited August 19, 2015 by dakrewser

[Wakepatrol]

That's a total cop out and just more blame on pax and defending the company for not doing anything to make the night special. Sorry; but if cruise lines want people to dress for a costume party, throw a party to dress for! More courses. Table side preparation of food. Staff up so that there is refined, efficient services, not waiters scrambling like chickens without a head. Bring live strolling string music into the MDR on formal nights (has been many years since I have seen this on any line). Create more activities beyond just dinner to make it a "formal evening".

 

But, THEY WON'T. It's DONE. Specialty Dining killed it. They will never bring back the exemplary service and special foods to the MDR because there is too much profit to be made with specialty dining and people line up for it.

 

So long as the cruise line isn't giving me a reason to drag a suit...I won't. There's nothing wrong with being casual on vacation.

 

 

I keep saying,Hal should have a dining room that's formal only. Have passengers pay an extra $100 per cruise to eat in there every night. Have better cuts of meat,bigger shrimp and more lobster. They'll be fighting to get in the door and dress formally. Food trumps everything.

 

Hal could even get into selling jackets

[DaveOKC]

I keep saying,Hal should have a dining room that's formal only. Have passengers pay an extra $100 per cruise to eat in there every night. Have better cuts of meat,bigger shrimp and more lobster. They'll be fighting to get in the door and dress formally. Food trumps everything.

 

Hal could even get into selling jackets

 

They sort of have this with the Pinnacle Grill. Most (not all of course) get dressed up while dining there. All they would have to do is require jackets and ties to dine there. Easy solution IMO.

[LMaxwell]

I keep saying,Hal should have a dining room that's formal only. Have passengers pay an extra $100 per cruise to eat in there every night. Have better cuts of meat,bigger shrimp and more lobster. They'll be fighting to get in the door and dress formally. Food trumps everything.

 

Hal could even get into selling jackets

Like a halfway house to specialty?

 

Or first and second class...[emoji51]

[LMaxwell]

They sort of have this with the Pinnacle Grill. Most (not all of course) get dressed up while dining there. All they would have to do is require jackets and ties to dine there. Easy solution IMO.

Of course you are correct, however I don't think they are going to increase the barrier of entry for pay venues. Historically people would pay, in part, to dine there with a more relaxed code than the MDR.

 

It would be interesting to see if HAL could make it work. I don't think so.

 

Quantum class on RCI has a complimentary formal restaurant with better food. Even then formal is basically just a jacket. Or a tie. I don't think both are required.

 

I genuinely have no problem if there was a formal required venue. I just think costs and quality should be equal for all included venues. I'm happy to pay for quality in the cruise fare AND be resort casual too.

[JimJoan]

I totally agree that it is the cruise lines (not just HAL) that have dumbed down the formal nights and the dress. There is no difference these days in the MDR between a regular night and a formal night. When we started cruising over 15 years ago on Celebrity (which I consider equal to HAL) the formal nights had the wait staff dressed in tuxes, white linen chair covers, and 13 pieces of silverware set around a charger at your place setting. The meals were wonderful and presented beautifully on the plate. Now the meals are more like a moderate priced restaurant and nothing at all special. There is no longer any reason to dress up when the ones throwing the party have eliminated the incentive to dress up for anything special.

 

I agree .. All the cruise lines seem to have turned into lets please everyone and everything as cheaply as possible. It used to be something special, now its just mediocrity at sea most of the time

[Fouremco]

All the cruise lines seem to have turned into lets please everyone and everything as cheaply as possible.

Isn't that what most successful businesses try to do: please their customers and provide their product as inexpensively as possible?