Wasted/Inefficient Public Space on Reflection

[AlexDouglass]

We hugely enjoyed our week (11/14) on Reflection, but all week it struck me - more even than on our previous trip - how under used some of the public spaces are. Given the general trend toward maximizing revenue onboard, it seems even more surprising. For example:

 

- Probably a short-term issue, but with the Molecular contract lapsed and World Bar not in place, that lovely area was more or less a ghost town - increasing pressure on more popular bar areas (from 5:00 p.m. everywhere seemed to be either too crowded or perfectly empty);

- I know I'm not the first to bemoan how underused the Sky Lounge is - it would make a fine place for an afternoon tea or for dancing anytime, but it seemed either to be used for Elite events, art auctions (and boy were there a lot more of them than I remember from '14) - or it was abandoned;

- Celebrity Central (small theater) had a couple of smaller events and occasionally showed (second run) films - but all live entertainment was in the theater;

- the games court just outside Celebrity Central is such a handsome space, and it does has a (seemingly nearly unused) bar. With the double-height ceiling, why not install a few potted palms and some small tables and chairs and call it a Wintergarden Café or such?

- Cellar Masters is a tragic waste - rarely occupied at all, and prime real estate;

- the public "rooms" (really wide balcony spaces) off the atrium - the Library, game room, and Hideaway - also seem mostly empty. Not quite sure what could be done with them, and it's nice to have some places just to relax;

- even, on a much smaller scale, the second, unstaffed bar at the Martini Bar. Clearly more a design feature than anything practical, but in tandem with not having any roving service in this area, it just means another place to sit.

 

One does feel the lack of a nightclub, as well as more varied evening options. The Ensemble and Martini bars are packed, and people gather for the foyer events, but then scatter. One misses offerings such as Cunard's Golden Lion pubs, Commodore's Clubs, and Chartrooms - interestingly themed "destination" spaces that provide some variety.

 

That said, it did seem to me that both Bistro on Five and Café al Bacio did much brisker business than I recalled, and the Porch's seafood offerings did seem to be bringing people in for sea-day lunches.

 

If you could change up one or more design feature and/or venue use, what would it be? I know that complimentary destinations are probably out of the questions, but there must be some ways to change things up without lightening our wallets all that much more...

[Balconyaft]

Thanks for your observations, great run down. We will sail this Saturday and hope that the Sunset bar will always have a couple of seats available for us. Maybe the new World bar or whatever the name is, will be up and running , replacing the Molecular bar by then. I'm so looking forward to those long days at sea, first time for us on a cruise with so few port days. Cheers.

[AlexDouglass]

It's indeed a terrific itinerary for sea days, and the Sunset Bar is terrific - our weather was iffy, but it was still a popular spot. Pity it's still a smoking destination, but that aside a gem.

[kayehall]

I did not enjoy the Sunset Bar on the Reflection as much as I did on the Summit. Not enough seating in the shade. And it looks and feels sterile. Not friendly and cozy like the Summit. The Sky lounge was always empty. As was Cellars. The Sky would be a perfect place for dancers before and after dinner...then do the nightclub thing around 10pm. Just a thought......

[WAVTAM]

Just off Equinox doing month b2b sailing. Similar observations.

Wasted space.......never used venues.

 

Molecular bar,

Gastro Pub,

Quasar,

Bistro,

Specially restaurants (all three)....... censuses , priced to high.

[masspector]

Will be first time on Celebrity in April. Seems crazy but I am glad about what you reported. Several cruises on RC and one Carnival. With ships sailing full it is usually a challenge to find a nice quiet spot to relax or read a book. I look forward to some quiet spots.

[hcat]

So called "game room" is supposed to be Quasar...a club which had a great bar and nice booth seating...nice contained space for a DJ...

 

They should also utilize Sky upstairs as a club, and go for a variety of quieter music in the atrium areas...so more than one act can play at same time at diff venues without driwning out others..

 

Aft bar on Ref is more for drinking....hard to enjoy music back there the way it is segmented..very crowded..

 

odd that the solarium and spa are on two sep levels! spa however is awesome...

 

Original S class design made more sense to us...so going back to Equinox..

[SuzCruise]

I was on the same cruise and couldn't agree more about the waste of a fabulous space that the Sky Lounge is. We won't cruise again on Reflection because of the absence of a lounge with a sea view where we can be served a drink. We thought Cellar Masters would have been awesome if they had some music and decent staff. The woman who worked the room was a grouch, to be kind.

[AtleeH]

Reflection doesn't have Quasar. During design and construction the Quasar space was taken over as a meeting room, and I believe, Future Cruise sales office.

 

What was supposed to happen is what's left of the Sky Lounge was supposed to double as a "night club" type space at night. at least 1/3 of the Sky Lounge in the other S class ships was made into the super huge Relection Suite which includes 2 showers, one of which is sort of sticking out of the ships structure. Supposedly, the way the lighting is, folks can't see in. Te space where the old meeting room used to be was turned into large high on the hog suites also. These suites and the Reflection suite can only be gotten to with a special sea pass.

 

The rest of the rif raf on the ship, including those in all other suites are excluded from this rarified space.

 

So called "game room" is supposed to be Quasar...a club which had a great bar and nice booth seating...nice contained space for a DJ...

 

They should also utilize Sky upstairs as a club, and go for a variety of quieter music in the atrium areas...so more than one act can play at same time at diff venues without driwning out others..

 

Aft bar on Ref is more for drinking....hard to enjoy music back there the way it is segmented..very crowded..

 

odd that the solarium and spa are on two sep levels! spa however is awesome...

 

Original S class design made more sense to us...so going back to Equinox..

[bhughey]

I have felt the same about various spaces on various ships and have most noticeably some of our more recent X cruises. I feel it's a reflection of X and their lack of an "investment" in their activities/cruise director staff. The "Celebrity Today" is filled with crappy stuff like, tanzanite seminars, or "discover the latest skin regimen" @ the spa & art auctions. None of this is fun and no one is remotely interested! What about concerts on the lawn (haven't seen since our cruise on Eclipse in 2011)? Nightly movies & popcorn in the Celebrity Central (how costly could that be)? Happy hour/bites in various bars? Poolside dessert/ice cream bar? There just seems to be little to no creativity on enhancing the cruise experience via activities. Nine times out of 10, there is really nothing in the dailies that interests me.

[jelayne]

I have felt the same about various spaces on various ships and have most noticeably some of our more recent X cruises. I feel it's a reflection of X and their lack of an "investment" in their activities/cruise director staff. The "Celebrity Today" is filled with crappy stuff like, tanzanite seminars, or "discover the latest skin regimen" @ the spa & art auctions. None of this is fun and no one is remotely interested! What about concerts on the lawn (haven't seen since our cruise on Eclipse in 2011)? Nightly movies & popcorn in the Celebrity Central (how costly could that be)? Happy hour/bites in various bars? Poolside dessert/ice cream bar? There just seems to be little to no creativity on enhancing the cruise experience via activities. Nine times out of 10, there is really nothing in the dailies that interests me.

 

I agree that there could be more creativity and more activities or lectures and fewer sales presentations. On our recent TA there were days with nothing after noon that wasn't a sales pitch.

 

We also miss the concerts on the lawn and popcorn & movies in Celebrity Central. On the other hand there needs to be some quiet spaces. On our recent cruise the game room was in pretty full every day from morning to evening. Everytime I passed the hideaway or library they were about half full- which means they are being used but if you are looking for a place to read or have a cup of coffee away from 100 or more others you could go there.

[kitty9]

I have felt the same about various spaces on various ships and have most noticeably some of our more recent X cruises. I feel it's a reflection of X and their lack of an "investment" in their activities/cruise director staff. The "Celebrity Today" is filled with crappy stuff like, tanzanite seminars, or "discover the latest skin regimen" @ the spa & art auctions. None of this is fun and no one is remotely interested! What about concerts on the lawn (haven't seen since our cruise on Eclipse in 2011)? Nightly movies & popcorn in the Celebrity Central (how costly could that be)? Happy hour/bites in various bars? Poolside dessert/ice cream bar? There just seems to be little to no creativity on enhancing the cruise experience via activities. Nine times out of 10, there is really nothing in the dailies that interests me.

 

I've been saying this for at least two years. On my last Equinox cruise, I counted the events listed in the daily, and more than 58% had some sort of monetary component, meaning that the "activity" either cost extra or had the potential for selling something. Celebrity is no longer interested in providing free, fun activities as evidenced by their reducing their entertainment staff to 2. Pathetic, imho.

[hcat]

Reflection doesn't have Quasar. During design and construction the Quasar space was taken over as a meeting room, and I believe, Future Cruise sales office.

 

What was supposed to happen is what's left of the Sky Lounge was supposed to double as a "night club" type space at night. at least 1/3 of the Sky Lounge in the other S class ships was made into the super huge Relection Suite which includes 2 showers, one of which is sort of sticking out of the ships structure. Supposedly, the way the lighting is, folks can't see in. Te space where the old meeting room used to be was turned into large high on the hog suites also. These suites and the Reflection suite can only be gotten to with a special sea pass.

 

The rest of the rif raf on the ship, including those in all other suites are excluded from this rarified space.

 

Wow... Did not realize all that...not much left for the rest of us...and pushes the noisy DJ into the atrium....but after one trip on Ref..we prefer the other S class ships anyhow..

[Chazteach1]

Just off Equinox doing month b2b sailing. Similar observations.

 

Wasted space.......never used venues.

 

 

 

Molecular bar,

 

Gastro Pub,

 

Quasar,

 

Bistro,

 

Specially restaurants (all three)....... censuses , priced to high.

 

 

We were on Equinox last summer during the world cup. Gastro Bar was always busy.

[AtleeH]

IIRC, Gsatro Pub is only on the Equinox. It was not rolled out to the other S Class ships.

 

We were on Equinox last summer during the world cup. Gastro Bar was always busy.

[BrendaJ]

Lots of interesting comments here. It makes me ponder what changes will be coming with the Edge class. I have to assume they will be completely different from M and S class, but I'm having a hard time guessing what they might be like, other than perhaps a Quantum-type dynamic dining system.

 

In my opinion, they need to maximize on the spots that are generally over-crowded on the older ships. For example, a larger martini bar (or perhaps two - a loud and a quiet one), and a larger Sunset bar. They also need somewhere other than the foyer for dancing pre/post dinner, or at least make the foyer big enough that the dancing doesn't impede traffic flow.

 

To me, it seems the big problem is that spots are busy either during the day or in the evening, and very few spaces are maximized for both evening and daytime use. We'd all love a larger pool deck and more lounge chairs for warm itineraries, but that area generates no income at night. Maybe they could somehow turn the pool deck into an evening bar with dancing, perhaps with some type of cover over the pools. A large, fun bar near the pool would be great and might get some use both day and night.

 

As for the existing ships, there's not a whole lot of changes they can make without spending a lot of money, so I expect that any improvements to space use will be minimal.

[greydog]

I'm not disputing many of the remarks about underused space but also consider rainy or chilly weather when pool area is deserted - a lot of interior space gets used then. Friends were on the new RCL Anthem with its 000's of pax - during inclement weather they said the interior public areas were overcrowded. Happy Cruising

[gwesq]

I agree that there could be more creativity and more activities or lectures and fewer sales presentations. On our recent TA there were days with nothing after noon that wasn't a sales pitch.

 

 

Which is why I now call the line SELLebrity!

[jagoffee]

I've been saying this for at least two years. On my last Equinox cruise, I counted the events listed in the daily, and more than 58% had some sort of monetary component, meaning that the "activity" either cost extra or had the potential for selling something. Celebrity is no longer interested in providing free, fun activities as evidenced by their reducing their entertainment staff to 2. Pathetic, imho.

 

I wonder if Celebrity has changed back or it varies by ship. I just completed the Silhouette TA and Celebrity offered many (mostly) fee free activities. I was actually surprised after reading comments on CC. There always seemed to be something going on. I would guess that you could find one or two activities at all times without a fee. Of course there were also fee based activities. I was impressed on how active the Activity Manager (assistant CD) was on this cruise leading the high energy exercise dancing sessions. (That I am almost certain did not include a fee). Based on this cruise I can assure you that it is incorrect to say that Celebrity is no longer interested in providing free fun activities. I also assure you that there were more than a staff of 2. I will let you know if this is the case on the Eclipse in January as it is not a TA which may have been different. I can be unbiased because I could not really care less about most of the activities. Relaxing and reading are my favorite activity outside of my cabin.

 

If you are no longer cruising Celebrity because of the "facts" you gathered on the Equinox you might want to try a different ship/cruise.

[hcat]

We're headed back to Equinox for two cruises...expecting a great time.

We have enjoyed all the ships.....including M class..before and after the partial update..but the Reflection just did not have the layout or vibe that worked for us.,...Silhouette was great on both of our cruises on her.

 

We hope they leave some of the ships alone for awhile. When they change the layout, add rooms, etc, it changes the flow and feng shui

 

As for the new ones...looking forward to them unless they have dynamic dining or buffet only.

[BrendaJ]

As for the new ones...looking forward to them unless they have dynamic dining or buffet only.

 

hcat - I'm curious - have you experienced dynamic dining, and if so, what didn't you like about it? I must confess I've never sailed with RCCL, but in reading their website with the list of restaurants on Quantum, I must say, it sounds very interesting to me. From the website, it looks like there are several included restaurants that sound intriguing. It also appears that you can choose to dine at the same time every night with the same wait staff and tablemates, and can rotate to the different free restaurants. Sounds cool to me, but maybe I'm missing something.

 

I've been on all but two of the current Celebrity ships multiple times, and I guess I'm hoping for something a little different with Edge.

[AlexDouglass]

We've never been big MDR fans, and having tried Luminae this go, we're now talking about trying out the other pole and seeing what we think of a week in an inside or ocean view, mostly relying on the buffet (which really impressed us on Reflection last week). The husband doesn't like getting up for breakfast, I like the curries for lunch, and we'd vary dinners (although I could easily make a meal on the sushi).

 

As for coming Edge-innovations, we had an interesting chat with a much more experienced cruiser, who passed on (supposedly from an officer) the rumor that there won't in fact be an MDR, but rather "fifteen different free and fee outlets." Take that FWIW...

[hcat]

hcat - I'm curious - have you experienced dynamic dining, and if so, what didn't you like about it? I must confess I've never sailed with RCCL, but in reading their website with the list of restaurants on Quantum, I must say, it sounds very interesting to me. From the website, it looks like there are several included restaurants that sound intriguing. It also appears that you can choose to dine at the same time every night with the same wait staff and tablemates, and can rotate to the different free restaurants. Sounds cool to me, but maybe I'm missing something.

 

I've been on all but two of the current Celebrity ships multiple times, and I guess I'm hoping for something a little different with Edge.

 

Re dynamic dining...Did not experience it and probably won't....not an appealing concept to us, We eat plainly and consistently ...I am type 2 diabetic and that helps alot with keeping things on an even keel.. We also like to settle in...same time, same place with a few nights at Specialty restaurants of our choice. Don't need to rotate with the staff to various places and no longer enjoy shared tables for duration of cruise. BLU on X is perfect for us!

 

Another reason we would not be exposed to it on Royal, is that once on Oasis was enough of a large ship experience for us.,,it was not for us....big mall, mediocre food and sevice for the most part! Quantum had some interesting concepts highlighted in the brochure but the dining was the turn off for us in terms of considering it. We also have no need to float in space , hang over the ocean in a big contraption or have a robot make a drink...

 

The all buffet concept was mentioned in a Cruise Critic article today that seemed to indicate one or more Carnival ships were buffet only...too much like a food court..We rarely eat at the buffet.

 

We are looking for something fresh on Edge...but hoping for a great spa, elegant informal dining, good music, fewer bars (good luck with that) and not alot of gimmicks...sort of the next step up from S class...

 

Anyhow...diff strokes for diff folks...but no dynamic dine around for us.

Edited November 25, 2015 by hcat

[hcat]

We've never been big MDR fans, and having tried Luminae this go, we're now talking about trying out the other pole and seeing what we think of a week in an inside or ocean view, mostly relying on the buffet (which really impressed us on Reflection last week). The husband doesn't like getting up for breakfast, I like the curries for lunch, and we'd vary dinners (although I could easily make a meal on the sushi).

 

As for coming Edge-innovations, we had an interesting chat with a much more experienced cruiser, who passed on (supposedly from an officer) the rumor that there won't in fact be an MDR, but rather "fifteen different free and fee outlets." Take that FWIW...

 

Probably we would seek out whatever category, if any, came with a dedicated dining room AQ or suite if we could...do not want to line up or hold a beeper....or be burdened with making res...it was alot of work on Oasis for the shows, events etc...and even with res, most of the Specialty dining was not so special! Esp Compared to X.

 

But some of the floated design concepts look very interesting!