NORO on Nautica

[SedonaJoel]

Joel, was there a specific cruise you were on that made you feel that way or is it due to reports here?

 

We were on the Rivera in the southern Caribbean that disembarked in Miami on April 3. The reason we booked a Viking Ocean cruise was not just this constant outbreak of Moro (3 times on Rivera in 4 months) but what we saw in the degradation of attitude and service from the Maitre d's, cruise director, restaurant manager, hotel manager and other ships senior staff.

 

We've been home almost two weeks and we've gotten nothing from Oceania in the way of explanation or offer of compensation after the worst cruise of our lives. We generally do 4-5 ocean cruises a year and we were loyal Oceania fans. We're now looking at Seaborne, Viking and maybe even Regent.

[PaulMCO]

--

 

Do you know how many cases have been reported to date? What percent of passengers have been sick?

 

If you are talking to any passengers who come out of quarantine, please let us know what they said happened while they were in quarantine. Food, etc.

 

Hope you keep well and do not come down with this terrible illness.

 

Thanks.

--

 

Latest counts 30 persons have contracted gastro

12 remain under quarantine

2 new cases yesterday

Last case was yesterday at 1900h (7pm)

 

Two idiots who were under quarantine tried to use the GDR last night.

Their excuse was that room service was too slow... OMG...

 

Ships staff is doing a remarkable job under situation. Definitely housekeeping under stress with extra work, they were up early cleaning rails, door and extra work in cleaning and applying solution to everything.

 

Up in the internet center even the keyboards are sanitized after each use.

Edited April 17, 2016 by PaulMCO

[CruiserPK]

We were on the Rivera in the southern Caribbean that disembarked in Miami on April 3. The reason we booked a Viking Ocean cruise was not just this constant outbreak of Moro (3 times on Rivera in 4 months) but what we saw in the degradation of attitude and service from the Maitre d's, cruise director, restaurant manager, hotel manager and other ships senior staff.

 

We've been home almost two weeks and we've gotten nothing from Oceania in the way of explanation or offer of compensation after the worst cruise of our lives. We generally do 4-5 ocean cruises a year and we were loyal Oceania fans. We're now looking at Seaborne, Viking and maybe even Regent.

 

You might want to reconsider Regent....same ownership as Oceania.

[rustyrabb]

Am on the Riviera right now , we have only heard of one passenger with a vomiting issue Hope no more !

My first time on the Riviera .

Excellent staff, service , and food

 

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Forums mobile app

[riandei]

Am on the Riviera right now , we have only heard of one passenger with a vomiting issue Hope no more !

My first time on the Riviera .

Excellent staff, service , and food

 

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Forums mobile app

 

thanks for the update

[S2000ap1]

Please do correct me if I am wrong here, but having quick look on tinternet I note the following:-

 

1) the term Noro virus covers a number of infections that are viruses and cause problems in the digestive tract

2) The main viruses tend to be ones that continually mutate , and there for there are no effective inoculations for this group

3) being a virus antibiotics are a total waste of time for treatment , might make you feel better but then a sugar pill will have the same effect along with a story to make it sound like it will work

4) a person may well be infected 48 hrs before and after all symptoms have either manifested themselves or disappeared , occasionally a person might hold onto the virus for a bit longer without any symptoms exhibiting themselves

5) the viruses are usually distributed by poo, pee and other direct contact with a carrier , bodily fluids and stuff , I suppose

6) avoid contact

7) best agents for cleaning contain good old fashioned bleach

8) for hand washing good old fashioned soap and hand gels containing alcohol

9)toilet cleanliness is next to godliness especially when some one has the problem

10) typical locations for out breaks , schools , hospitals , public gatherings and re erm cruise ships any where, where a load of people get stuffed into close proximity

11) good places to pick it up , public toilets , flush handles , taps , door handles , toilet seats , stair balustrades , light switches , lift ( elevator buttons I actually know a company who make a coating for lift buttons that kills bugs on contact they came up with product for hospitals after some, tests they conducted found the buttons were like Petrie dishes growing bugs ) so avoid contact and then avoid touching mouth nose etc until you can wash or Disenfect

12) the viruses are not long lived out side the body or in dry conditions , sort of makes a nonsense of the "sick ship" comments , I dare say the out breaks are taken on board from buses , planes and generally elsewhere.

13) I still am amazed by people I see literally avoiding the hand cleansing stations out side the restaurants on board , do they have the units just out side the,public loos , tricky to open door without touching again after hand washing ! Isn't it?

14) so you might have to have rough or chapped hands whilst on board, nice pretty, nice smelling hand wash stuff is maybe not the way to go , man up, and scrub with soap and have rough hands for a few weeks , you never know ladies he might like a bit of rough!

 

 

Just the rambling thoughts of an idiot who seems to be almost immune to such things , but I do take care on board , but at home often seen with cuts and. Grazes dripping blood covered in dirt , and not worrying one iota, splinters if they won't come out , usually do several days later easily but fine, In fact he usual first aid for a cut is some electrical tape ! But then maybe this is why don't normally have a problem i build up a resistance , but with these Noro viruses that wouldn't be then case as they mutate all of the time ! , who knows ?

Edited April 17, 2016 by S2000ap1

[Paulchili]

Generally agree with above except:

8 Hand gels with alcohol are not effective against Noro (but good for other "bugs")

13 Same problem with gels as above (either at bathrooms or food stations)

Also, they have special tissues for opening the doors AFTER one has washed their hands

[S2000ap1]

Well I only reported what various gov agencies advise , world wide ! Alcohol based gels are to some extent effective not perfect by any stretch but ok , bleach and old fashioned soap are the most effective. Bleach wouldn't bother me on hands LOL , but soap is fine surely for most people bit drying in the long run so says the wife , but on balance soft hands or an intimate relationship with the big white telephone !

[GeezerCouple]

Well I only reported what various gov agencies advise , world wide ! Alcohol based gels are to some extent effective not perfect by any stretch but ok , bleach and old fashioned soap are the most effective. Bleach wouldn't bother me on hands LOL , but soap is fine surely for most people bit drying in the long run so says the wife , but on balance soft hands or an intimate relationship with the big white telephone !

As Paulchili mentioned, alcohol-based treatments are *not* effective against Norovirus, period.

The alcohol-based agents *are* effective against a variety of other organisms, so it's not "wasted", but when Noro is the problem, it won't help.

 

You can review the USA CDC (Centers for Disease Control) posts, and you will not find any alcohol-based agents listed.

 

(There are "claims" made by others, especially some marketing hype, but they are not correct.)

 

Finally, IF there is an outbreak, don't forget potential contamination by menus.

And if you plan to disinfect your cabin or hotel room, etc., don't forget drawer pulls, the telephones and, especially, the TV remote.

(Given all the crevices in that last, we typically put the remote in a thin "baggie", where it is easy to press all the controls.)

[Paulchili]

And if you plan to disinfect your cabin or hotel room, etc., don't forget drawer pulls, the telephones and, especially, the TV remote.

(Given all the crevices in that last, we typically put the remote in a thin "baggie", where it is easy to press all the controls.)

 

An excellent yet simple solution for the remote control - I haven't thought about it.

Will keep it in mind - thanks.

[S2000ap1]

Hmmm interesting didn't think of a bag either , logical really see lots of stuff that can't be sterilised in hospital,s wrapped up like that .

 

I did read the CDC stuff , NHS and a couple of others , but then the NHS is free and third world !

Edited April 17, 2016 by S2000ap1

[travelling pair]

If 30 people have contracted the virus does this not mean that there are approximately 570 healthy people on board , not counting staff ,who are enjoying their cruise. I know we have to practice diligent hygiene but really the amount of time scaring future cruisers seems a little over the top don't you think ??

[S2000ap1]

Pair , yes I think so to , tried to show a bit objectivity and try to put forward some less excited info , which is for all to see.

 

People get these bugs all of the time , fact , just a bloody nuisance on ones hols I suppose , I do wonder how many pick these things up on shore or on route to the ship , or dare I say at home before coming,

 

In the UK a device used around the domestic kitchen is a " tea towel " not sure if it has another name else where , any way terrible things and not allowed in commercial kitchens , pubs and wine bars etc . We have them but rarely if ever now use them for drying China and cutlery , as that gets done by the dishwasher , and no that's not me ! Although I am charged with the loading and unloading of the dammed thing !, their all at the wrong height to, dishwashers that is.

[travelling pair]

I agree the virus can be obtained anywhere...mm thinking of the tea towel hanging on my stove handle here in Ontario Canada LOL..used mostly to dry the tops of the cups in the dishwasher that never seem to dry [emoji4]

[RJB]

Pair , yes I think so to , tried to show a bit objectivity and try to put forward some less excited info , which is for all to see.

 

People get these bugs all of the time , fact , just a bloody nuisance on ones hols I suppose , I do wonder how many pick these things up on shore or on route to the ship , or dare I say at home before coming,

 

In the UK a device used around the domestic kitchen is a " tea towel " not sure if it has another name else where , any way terrible things and not allowed in commercial kitchens , pubs and wine bars etc . We have them but rarely if ever now use them for drying China and cutlery , as that gets done by the dishwasher , and no that's not me ! Although I am charged with the loading and unloading of the dammed thing !, their all at the wrong height to, dishwashers that is.

Just a bunch of B.S to me. Get back in the real world.

[Christine Frances]

As Paulchili mentioned, alcohol-based treatments are *not* effective against Norovirus, period.

The alcohol-based agents *are* effective against a variety of other organisms, so it's not "wasted", but when Noro is the problem, it won't help.

 

You can review the USA CDC (Centers for Disease Control) posts, and you will not find any alcohol-based agents listed.

 

(There are "claims" made by others, especially some marketing hype, but they are not correct.)

 

Finally, IF there is an outbreak, don't forget potential contamination by menus.

And if you plan to disinfect your cabin or hotel room, etc., don't forget drawer pulls, the telephones and, especially, the TV remote.

(Given all the crevices in that last, we typically put the remote in a thin "baggie", where it is easy to press all the controls.)

 

As I was wondering about the effectiveness of the hand sanitizer on board I email Celebrity and they replied. This was posted on the Princess board and I am posting the link. They state in the "Celebrity Today" and on the TV that the sanitizer does work against Noro. I tend to believe Celebrity.

 

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showpost.php?p=48511966&postcount=6

 

I also tweeted to Dr Tom Frieden, the Director of the CDC. Will let you know lol

Edited April 17, 2016 by Christine Frances

[Paulchili]

As I was wondering about the effectiveness of the hand sanitizer on board I email Celebrity and they replied. This was posted on the Princess board and I am posting the link. They state in the "Celebrity Today" and on the TV that the sanitizer does work against Noro. I tend to believe Celebrity.

 

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showpost.php?p=48511966&postcount=6

 

I also tweeted to Dr Tom Frieden, the Director of the CDC. Will let you know lol

 

Sounds good but other than being "special" did Celebrity tell you what is in that hand sanitizer that cruise lines use that makes it "special" ?

That would be helpful to know.

PS Is it "New and improved" :D :D

Edited April 18, 2016 by Paulchili

[Christine Frances]

Sounds good but other than being "special" did Celebrity tell you what is in that hand sanitizer that cruise lines use that makes it "special" ?

That would be helpful to know.

PS Is it "New and improved" :D :D

 

Whatever Paul:rolleyes: Just passing on some info I received.

[Paulchili]

Whatever Paul:rolleyes: Just passing on some info I received.

 

Not trying to nit pick but just because Celebrity says "it works", that alone does not make it so. Lots of manufacturers make a vague claim of their product being effective against Noro when it is not in reality.

However, if we know the active ingredient, we can make a more accurate assessment.

Would be interesting to hear what CDC will have to say about it.

[chengkp75]

Not trying to nit pick but just because Celebrity says "it works", that alone does not make it so. Lots of manufacturers make a vague claim of their product being effective against Noro when it is not in reality.

However, if we know the active ingredient, we can make a more accurate assessment.

Would be interesting to hear what CDC will have to say about it.

 

I think Dr. Frieden has a lot more important things to think about right now (zika virus) than hand sanitizers.

 

In the US, the FDA regulates hand sanitizers. The FDA does not recognize ANY active ingredient in ANY hand sanitizer as being GRASE I (generally regarded as safe and effective, level I)(actually alcohol 60-95% and 5-10% povidone-iodine are GRASE I, but the alcohol is not considered GRASE I for certain viruses). The closest any come is GRASE III, which is indicated as meaning there is not sufficient evidence that the ingredient is effective. You can google lists of "desist orders" where the FDA has had manufacturers of hand sanitizers remove claims from advertising because there wasn't sufficient proof.

[Paulchili]

I think Dr. Frieden has a lot more important things to think about right now (zika virus) than hand sanitizers.

 

In the US, the FDA regulates hand sanitizers. The FDA does not recognize ANY active ingredient in ANY hand sanitizer as being GRASE I (generally regarded as safe and effective, level I)(actually alcohol 60-95% and 5-10% povidone-iodine are GRASE I, but the alcohol is not considered GRASE I for certain viruses). The closest any come is GRASE III, which is indicated as meaning there is not sufficient evidence that the ingredient is effective. You can google lists of "desist orders" where the FDA has had manufacturers of hand sanitizers remove claims from advertising because there wasn't sufficient proof.

 

Thank you.

If I understand you correctly, are you saying that Celebrity's claim that their hand sanitizer is effective against Noro is not exactly accurate?

[chengkp75]

Thank you.

If I understand you correctly, are you saying that Celebrity's claim that their hand sanitizer is effective against Noro is not exactly accurate?

 

All hand sanitizers are effective, to some degree, against noro. Whether that degree of effectiveness is significant or not is something else (mainly due to loosening of surface tension and removal of virus to things like napkins). Not to parse things too finely, but Princess says the sanitizer has "a formula created to target Norovirus", there is no claim that the formula actually is effective against Noro. This, plus government inertia, is why many product claims (and not just sanitizers) are allowed to be out there for quite some time.

[Paulchili]

All hand sanitizers are effective, to some degree, against noro. Whether that degree of effectiveness is significant or not is something else (mainly due to loosening of surface tension and removal of virus to things like napkins). Not to parse things too finely, but Princess says the , sanitizer has "a formula created to target Norovirus" there is no claim that the formula actually is effective against Noro. This, plus government inertia, is why many product claims (and not just sanitizers) are allowed to be out there for quite some time.

 

(underlining mine)

Semantics :D

Thank you for the clarification. Your informative input is always appreciated.

[chengkp75]

(underlining mine)

Semantics :D

Thank you for the clarification. Your informative input is always appreciated.

 

Semantics are the basis of good advertising. On another thread, I think about Riviera's Noro, someone linked a study done on the oft quoted Purell 481, and the study did show a marked improvement of viral reduction of this product over others, but then concluded with the comment that whether the amount of viral reduction WAS SIGNIFICANT OR NOt in reducing transmission of the virus was not part of the study.

[RJB]

Semantics are the basis of good advertising. On another thread, I think about Riviera's Noro, someone linked a study done on the oft quoted Purell 481, and the study did show a marked improvement of viral reduction of this product over others, but then concluded with the comment that whether the amount of viral reduction WAS SIGNIFICANT OR NOt in reducing transmission of the virus was not part of the study.

So what does this really mean in English that most of us regular people can understand. And what can we do to prepare ourselves when going on a cruise. Most of this stuff is well above my pay grade. Need to make it simple for me and probably most passengers. Thanks