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Fix Anytime Dining

cruzsnooze

By cruzsnooze,
in Princess Cruises

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travellover3

travellover3

Posted
Posted
NCL has the advantage of onboard tech (as does RCCL) that Princess has chosen not to implement, plus with no traditional dining there is no need to attempt to balance the two groups, which lets them use space more effectively....

 

I wonder if this possibility has been explored. In TD, if the assigned parties have not arrived within 15 min of their seating, the Maitre D' could call the Maitre D' in ATD to suggest he/she send any diner waiting for a table, the option to go to the TD and join a table with empty seats? That way, the other tablemates in TD won't have to wait longer to be served. Just asking!

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paul929207

paul929207

Posted
Posted
I wonder if this possibility has been explored. In TD, if the assigned parties have not arrived within 15 min of their seating, the Maitre D' could call the Maitre D' in ATD to suggest he/she send any diner waiting for a table, the option to go to the TD and join a table with empty seats? That way, the other tablemates in TD won't have to wait longer to be served. Just asking!

I am not sure that filling out tables in TD will work. The TD people will have been sitting for 15 minutes or so already. Then they will have to wait while people in the AD line are selected, sent to the other dining room, brought to a table, given menus and time to make choices. Finally they can order. I think the TD people will be put out by then.

 

It would work much better to fill an empty TD table.

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JimmyVWine Great Review Rare

JimmyVWine

Posted
Posted
I am not sure that filling out tables in TD will work. The TD people will have been sitting for 15 minutes or so already. Then they will have to wait while people in the AD line are selected, sent to the other dining room, brought to a table, given menus and time to make choices. Finally they can order. I think the TD people will be put out by then.

 

It would work much better to fill an empty TD table.

I agree. As I discussed above, the timing would have to be pretty precise. Besides, the TD people chose TD because of the atmosphere of dining with the same people every night. If they wanted to be seated with randoms, they could have selected ATD.

 

There is a simple solution that seems to get overlooked. As time marches forward, the traditions of classic cruising wane. (Formal Night, anyone?). More and more people will be selecting ATD, and the shift is already occurring. Right now, the MDRs have what amounts to three TD seatings, (an early in the TD dining room, an early in the Transitional Dining Room and a late in the TD dining room) and 3 ATD seatings. While it is true that ATD doesn't have "seatings", it more or less works out that way. The Always Anytime has what amounts to an early seating where the room fills up between 5:00 and 6:00. Those people leave around 6:30-7:00 when the room fills up a second time. In addition, the Transitional Dining Room clears out of TD diners around 7:00 and a new wave of people fill the place at 7:15-7:30. By the time all of these people have dined, and after factoring in the Horizon Court and other dining venues, 90% of the people have been fed, leaving the ATD MDRs available to late eaters, of which there aren't that many. So when you add it up, that is 3 TD seatings and 3 ATD seatings. 50/50. Problem is, the trend is moving more and more toward ATD and away from classic TD. So the solution is to eliminate the use of a Transitional Dining Room and have two TD seatings. An early and a late. Let the ATD rooms be ATD rooms. This would have an incredible effect on the availability of ATD. Will it make it a bit more difficult to reserve TD? Yes, but not if you book early. And as more and more people convert to ATD, this will become less of an issue. I suspect that when Princess implemented the Transitional Dining Room concept, there was a definite need as cruisers broke 50/50 on their selection. I suspect that this has moved closer to 45% TD and 55% ATD, or even more like 40% TD and 60% ATD. (A poster on another thread suggested that their Rollcall revealed closer to a 25% TD and 75% ATD split.) If this is even close to being true, then having 3 TD seatings and 3 de facto ATD seatings is simply the wrong ration. Perhaps it is time to convert only half of the Transitional Dining Room into a Transitional Dining Room creating 2.5 TD seatings and allowing for 3.5 ATD seatings. I would bet that this would help immensely. (But when CLCL Dining starts, all bets are off.)

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pablo222

pablo222

Posted
Posted
And yet there is always (always) a waitlist for early TD, even with two seatings...

 

I have noticed no matter how early a dining room opens,

there are people waiting to enter.

 

5:15 is too early for me personally, but I have seen people lined up...

 

Just open at 4:00, and let people start lining up at 3:30.

Problem solved.

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JimmyVWine Great Review Rare

JimmyVWine

Posted
Posted (edited)
And yet there is always (always) a waitlist for early TD, even with two seatings...

The two concepts are not incompatible. There will always (always) be a wait list for TD. And that is as it should be if ATD is to work. The only question is how many people can get confirmed seats in TD before the wait list starts to form. But even if Princess wants to keep the 50/50 approach, a better solution would be to convert one of the MDRs into a 50/50 dining room instead of a Transitional Dining Room. So half of the dining room is Traditional at 5:30, and that same half continues to be Traditional at 8:00. But the other half of the dining room is used for ATD. That would add 50% more ATD seats at 5:30 with the only downside being that one quarter of the people who now have early TD will have to be assigned to late TD. Using real numbers....assume:

 

TD MDR holds 400 people

Transitional MDR holds 400 people

ATD MDR holds 400 people

 

Under the current system, at 5:30, 800 TD people are accommodated, (400 in the TD and 400 in the Transitional) and 400 ATD people are accommodated, (all in the ATD room). Then, at 7:30, 400 more TD people are accommodated (all in the TD) and 800 ATD people are accommodated, (400 in the ATD room and 400 in the Transitional). That is 1200 of each type of dining.

 

Now turn the the Transitional dining room into a 50/50 dining room and you get this: At 5:30, 600 TD people are accommodated (400 in the TD room and 200 in the 50/50 room) and 600 ATD people are accommodated, (400 in the ATD room and 200 in the 50/50 room). Then, at 7:30, 600 more TD people are accommodated (400 in the TD room and 200 in the 50/50 room) and 600 ATD people are accommodated, (400 in the ATD room and 200 in the 50/50 room). That is 1200 or each type of dining.

 

No change to the total numbers, but instead of having a heavy load of early TDs, 25% of them, (200 out of 800), have to move from early to late so that you now have an even flow. And 50% more ATDs (600 instead of 400) got early seats. The demographics (and entertainment schedules) on a cruise ship favor early dining, but the current system only allows for 400 out of 1200 ATD people to dine early. Convert the Transitional into a 50/50 and you allow 600 ATD people to dine early. Perhaps not perfect, but definitely better.

Edited by JimmyVWine
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kennicott

kennicott

Posted
Posted

 

Now turn the the Transitional dining room into a 50/50 dining room and you get this: At 5:30, 600 TD people are accommodated (400 in the TD room and 200 in the 50/50 room) and 600 ATD people are accommodated, (400 in the ATD room and 200 in the 50/50 room). Then, at 7:30, 600 more TD people are accommodated (400 in the TD room and 200 in the 50/50 room) and 600 ATD people are accommodated, (400 in the ATD room and 200 in the 50/50 room). That is 1200 or each type of dining.

 

No change to the total numbers, but instead of having a heavy load of early TDs, 25% of them, (200 out of 800), have to move from early to late so that you now have an even flow. And 50% more ATDs (600 instead of 400) got early seats. The demographics (and entertainment schedules) on a cruise ship favor early dining, but the current system only allows for 400 out of 1200 ATD people to dine early. Convert the Transitional into a 50/50 and you allow 600 ATD people to dine early. Perhaps not perfect, but definitely better.

 

We had this discussion some time back on another thread about the split MDR. It seems to me that this would be a much better and fairer solution to MDR use than what they have now:

 

Like I've posted before: One of the reason we have been having MDR problems are the huge waits. We like to eat around 6:15 PM but have been subject to almost 45 minute average waits when we go at that time. Princess has three MDRs on the Regal and Royal. One dining room is relegated to "traditional" only, another is closed to "anytime" until about 7:00 P.M. when it then opens for "anytime", the third is used for "anytime" all the time. The problem is that a long line forms for the "anytime" MDR around 5:00 PM.

 

It appears to me, based on "Roll Call" listings that almost 75% of the guests prefer "anytime". So, during our preferred time at 6:00 PM, 66% of the MDR space is relegated to "traditional" only, or for 33% of the guests."

 

The trouble the line(s) apparently have with the 50%-50% dining strategy for the one MDR is that logistically it would be difficult to accomplish without having to increase staff, and they are already are having fits over the labor intensive MDR business concept. They pretty much would have to split that dining room down the middle so that the TD get their same staff each evening. Right now, all early TD are accommodated since 66% of the space is devoted to them. There isn't much of a problem for the late TD as things have really slacked off by that time and AD diners have no real problem then either. So, by cutting in half the number of early TD tables in that one MDR would mean some TDs would not get the guaranteed dining times they desire. But, it unquestionably would reduce the mess early ADs now get into with long lines and harried wait staffs.

 

As far as the so called "reservations" for the ADs, this has turned out to be a joke on every cruise where we have tried it. They tell you to do it, but when you call for reservations, no can do, almost every time.

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IECalCruiser

IECalCruiser

Posted
Posted (edited)

As I said before, the real problem, I believe, is that well more than half of cruise passengers on U.S. based cruises want to eat early. If you reduce the number of early TD spots, many of those people might consider ATD rather than dining later. As in a land based restaurant, once all of the tables are full there will be a wait. If the DR opens at 5:30 and all tables are full by 6:00 you will not be able to get a table until well after 6:30. As I said before, ATD is anytime you want to eat within a half hour of opening and after 7:30/8:00. There won't be any tables in between those times without a wait. On our two European cruises we didn't experience any wait times between 6:00 and 8:00 in ATD. I haven't sailed on other cruise lines in the past 14 years so I don't know if other lines do it better.

 

Sent from my iPad using Forums

Edited by IECalCruiser
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cclvr

cclvr

Posted
Posted
The two concepts are not incompatible. There will always (always) be a wait list for TD. And that is as it should be if ATD is to work. The only question is how many people can get confirmed seats in TD before the wait list starts to form. But even if Princess wants to keep the 50/50 approach, a better solution would be to convert one of the MDRs into a 50/50 dining room instead of a Transitional Dining Room. So half of the dining room is Traditional at 5:30, and that same half continues to be Traditional at 8:00. But the other half of the dining room is used for ATD. That would add 50% more ATD seats at 5:30 with the only downside being that one quarter of the people who now have early TD will have to be assigned to late TD. Using real numbers....assume:

 

TD MDR holds 400 people

Transitional MDR holds 400 people

ATD MDR holds 400 people

 

Under the current system, at 5:30, 800 TD people are accommodated, (400 in the TD and 400 in the Transitional) and 400 ATD people are accommodated, (all in the ATD room). Then, at 7:30, 400 more TD people are accommodated (all in the TD) and 800 ATD people are accommodated, (400 in the ATD room and 400 in the Transitional). That is 1200 of each type of dining.

 

Now turn the the Transitional dining room into a 50/50 dining room and you get this: At 5:30, 600 TD people are accommodated (400 in the TD room and 200 in the 50/50 room) and 600 ATD people are accommodated, (400 in the ATD room and 200 in the 50/50 room). Then, at 7:30, 600 more TD people are accommodated (400 in the TD room and 200 in the 50/50 room) and 600 ATD people are accommodated, (400 in the ATD room and 200 in the 50/50 room). That is 1200 or each type of dining.

 

No change to the total numbers, but instead of having a heavy load of early TDs, 25% of them, (200 out of 800), have to move from early to late so that you now have an even flow. And 50% more ATDs (600 instead of 400) got early seats. The demographics (and entertainment schedules) on a cruise ship favor early dining, but the current system only allows for 400 out of 1200 ATD people to dine early. Convert the Transitional into a 50/50 and you allow 600 ATD people to dine early. Perhaps not perfect, but definitely better.

 

 

I think your idea makes alot of sense and could possibly even things out between TD and ATD....also...the 50/50 dining room could more easily implement the suggestion to put ATD passengers into empty TD spots since both would be in the same dining room.

 

We have always done ATD on Princess, our best experiences were our first 3 cruises in 2006, 2009 and 2011, at that time on the Crown, Ruby and Emerald, there was one TD room and two ATD rooms. Our next cruise in 2012 we started to experience the current set up of one TD room, one ATD room and one as TD then ATD...which has not seemed to work out as well.

 

On our 2012 cruise aboard the Caribbean Princess I did witness them checking cruise cards at the door of the ATD room and directing TD passengers to go to their TD room. They were also told they could return around 9 pm and that they could be accommodated then after the ATD passengers were all seated. I have not witnessed this since. Seems all ships and maitre d's handle their dining rooms differently. We were also told on this same cruise that we could not make reservations for two - all tables for two were first come first serve. We have never had much of a wait with or without a reservation for a table for two...we usually show up at 8 pm

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kennicott

kennicott

Posted
Posted
As in a land based restaurant, once all of the tables are full there will be a wait. If the DR opens at 5:30 and all tables are full by 6:00 you will not be able to get a table until well after 6:30. On our two European cruises we didn't experience any wait times between 6:00 and 8:00 in ATD.

Sent from my iPad using Forums

 

Well, can't argue that at a shore based fine restaurant you have to wait a bit, that is if you don't have reservations. We eat out a lot at the higher end restaurants and always have reservations and no wait, ever.

 

With respect to the cruise business, we have been on Princess over the last year and half for a total of almost three months, 5 cruises, two European, two TAs. We prefer ATD at about 6:00 P.M. but as I've posted before we probably had an average wait of about 45 minutes before getting into a MDR (that is, at the times we did try the MDRs). But the wait time isn't really the problem, its the confusion, crowding, bellyaching, shoving and pushing and general mayhem that accompanies getting ready to dine. Certainly not a good lead in to a quality dining experience. Takes all the fun and interest out of it all. That is not how it used to be in the Princess MDRs in the days of yore, for us anyway.

 

Now, having said all of that, we have adjusted and learned how to cope. Granted, it cost us more but we take advantage of the different venues and specialty restaurants, make reservations, eat without a wait, and in most cases enjoy a fine gourmet dinner. For instance, on our last cruise, here is where we ate dinner. Sabatini's (5). Crown Grill (1), Seafood Terrace (2), Crab Shack (2), MDR (2). Alfredo's (3). That made for a good cruise and saved us the hassle of dealing with the ever degenerating MDRs.

 

Hey, we aren't complaining. But, then, as suggested here in this thread, there might be a better way for the industry to handle their MDRs. Maybe not.

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caribill

caribill

Posted
Posted
I suspect that when Princess implemented the Transitional Dining Room concept, there was a definite need as cruisers broke 50/50 on their selection.

 

Reality is that when cruising started, only Traditional Dining was offered including on Princess. Even lunch and breakfast in the dining room was set up for traditional dining with two seatings.

 

It was anytime that was implemented at a later date on Princess.

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JimmyVWine Great Review Rare

JimmyVWine

Posted
Posted
Reality is that when cruising started, only Traditional Dining was offered including on Princess. Even lunch and breakfast in the dining room was set up for traditional dining with two seatings.

 

It was anytime that was implemented at a later date on Princess.

I think you misread the sentence. It says "Transitional" not "Traditional". The quoted sentence presumes that Traditional pre-dated Anytime. But when Princess introduced the Transitional Dining Room, (using one of the MDRs for TD early and ATD later), it did so because people were choosing between the two methods at close to an even pace.

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greenie082756

greenie082756

Posted
Posted

Another caveat to dining on a cruise ship that affects us all is the show and entertainment times.

 

My husband and I look @ the entertainment and then plan our dinner accordingly.

This is why we like anytime dining and usually no wait for us as we like meeting new people and will join a table of 8. :)

 

We schedule our dinner depending on what we want to do or see that night. We eat anywhere from 5:30 pm to 8pm.

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kennicott

kennicott

Posted
Posted

I've already mentioned that I agree with JimmyVWine and his suggestion that they take the "transitional" (note: not Traditional) MDR and transform it into a 50/50 split from the get-go in the evening, where one half is TD the other ATD. I suspicion though the cruise line has a problem with this due to the necessity of increasing the staff significantly when they do so.

 

However, at the tail end of the last cruise we witnessed an event which convinced me that the cruise line could accommodate everybody looking for seating around 6:00-6:30 PM or so with a minimum wait and a minimum of all the hassle that so many experience now. At least on the Regal and Royal. Gave me a modicum of encouragement anyway.

 

Granted, it took extra senior staff, but they managed to coordinate the three MDRs effectively. The line was long as usual at the full time ATD-MDR (Two long lines actually) but they were extra diligent this time in coordination with the other two MDRs which were both in the TD mode at the time. Maybe this occurred because they were very busy due lobster night and formal night.

 

So, when they got the word a table was empty and ready in one of the two TD (and yes, that included the MDR that was normally TD all the time) they would personally escort those in the front of a line to one these other MDRs. Worked pretty slick, we even got a table in the all the time TD-MDR. This tells me with some effort there are alternatives available that can alleviate much of this heartburn.

 

There were some discrepancies, of course, but I'm sure they were relatively minor and without much problem can be remedied. For instance, folk who weren't in the physical line but were actually there first and given pages didn't get in on this (All they needed to do was activate their pagers though). Another annoyance, folks back a ways in line would overhear that they were moving, say a party of four, at the front of the line to another MDR, they would then pull out of line and hot foot it to that other MDR, once there they would make out that they were the party sent over to "this" MDR. I observed one instance where the waiter escorting a party of six had to go slow due a mobility issue with one of the party, another group beat them to it (All they needed to do though was let the other MDR know who the waiter was that was escorting the deserving party. It may have been that over in the full time TD that people showing up past the deadline for their assigned table were turned away, for a change, (maybe sent over to the ATD-MDR to get in line, hope, hope) so I'm sure they were unhappy. There likely was other problems, but you get the drift, they can do this if they really want to.

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coconut cruiser

coconut cruiser

Posted
Posted

Tradional dining was instituted when the MDR was the ONLY place to dine onboard. Now there are many alternative dining rooms and of course TD passengers often dine in those other locations but that doesn't free up seats for others. There isn't space to enlarge the MDR because of the alternate dining rooms. Princess execs look at the available seats all over the ship and think that there is adequate space for everyone but in reality there isnt. I challenge them to come onboard ship and stand outside the dining rooms at dinner time. Passengers are VERY angry and things are getting nasty. It is going to lead to fights and the type of problems the airlines are experiencing. Princess needs to fix this problem NOW!!!

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rgmacm

rgmacm

Posted
Posted
On the Star Princess last month they were checking cruise cards at ATD. Some put up a fuss after they were told to go to their assigned DR. I told them "thank you!".

 

I'm SO glad to hear this. We're not going to be on the Star until this time next year. Here's hoping they don't change MD before then and are still doing this.... :)

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