Carnival's Bread and Butter

[Towel Critter]

In your opinion, or in a few cases based on knowledge - accurate or not - is Carnival's bread and butter repeat customers or new customers? I got to thinking about that because of the apparent constant increase in ship size and thus decrease in the amount of ports that can be visited. This, in my mind, seems to cater more to new cruisers who haven't yet grown weary of the same three or four Caribbean itineraries. On the other hand, new cruisers become experienced cruisers over time (at least some of them) and they too will grow tired of visiting the same few islands over and over. Just something to ponder and perhaps discuss. My fear is it will get to the point for us Carnival loyalists where our only option is a handful of cruise line run ports. Do you think that is where we are headed, or do you see something different down the road? Discuss.

 

Yes, I do realize there are other lines that have more varied itineraries, but that doesn't pertain to my question and is a different discussion for a different day. I also realize Carnival has "Journeys" cruises on occasion, but those aren't available on a constant basis.

 

Thanks in advance for your thoughts. Please, keep it friendly.:)

[BoDidly]

Definitely new cruisers . The eon cruiser knows all the ends and outs on how to save money while the new cruisers don't know squat, except how to receive a high sail and sign bill at the end of their cruise :p

[evandbob]

In your opinion, or in a few cases based on knowledge - accurate or not - is Carnival's bread and butter repeat customers or new customers? I got to thinking about that because of the apparent constant increase in ship size and thus decrease in the amount of ports that can be visited. This, in my mind, seems to cater more to new cruisers who haven't yet grown weary of the same three or four Caribbean itineraries. On the other hand, new cruisers become experienced cruisers over time (at least some of them) and they too will grow tired of visiting the same few islands over and over. Just something to ponder and perhaps discuss. My fear is it will get to the point for us Carnival loyalists where our only option is a handful of cruise line run ports. Do you think that is where we are headed, or do you see something different down the road? Discuss.

 

Yes, I do realize there are other lines that have more varied itineraries, but that doesn't pertain to my question and is a different discussion for a different day. I also realize Carnival has "Journeys" cruises on occasion, but those aren't available on a constant basis.

 

Thanks in advance for your thoughts. Please, keep it friendly.:)

 

 

I'll say that Carnival gets more income pp from new cruisers, say people who've cruised maybe up to 3x, than from persistant repeat cruisers like myself. I don't think the itineraries are that important to their "bread and butter". From a purely business point of view, the newly cruising are more apt to spend more on excursions, photos, drinks, etc. than a long time repeater.

[Towel Critter]

Definitely new cruisers . The eon cruiser knows all the ends and outs on how to save money while the new cruisers don't know squat, except how to receive a high sail and sign bill at the end of their cruise :p

So, in your opinion, is their strategy to constantly woo new cruisers primarily, with perhaps little interest in retaining those new cruisers for more than two or three cruises? In other words, do you think Carnival prefers a high turnover when it comes to customers?

[Towel Critter]

I'll say that Carnival gets more income pp from new cruisers, say people who've cruised maybe up to 3x, than from persistant repeat cruisers like myself. I don't think the itineraries are that important to their "bread and butter". From a purely business point of view, the newly cruising are more apt to spend more on excursions, photos, drinks, etc. than a long time repeater.

So you believe Carnival's main interest is in new cruisers? I take it that is what you meant. If so, I agree itinerary becomes of lesser importance. I wonder if this is a sound strategy over a long period of time? I don't pretend to know... just wondering. My initial thought is it is not. I could certainly be wrong about that though.

[evandbob]

Seems like Carnival is doing okay with their present strategy. If retaining high volume repeat customers is their game, then the VIFP program rewards will have real benefits added, rather than removed.

[IntrepidFromDC]

I would think repeat customers that once were new customers would be what they're after. While it's true some experienced cruisers may find ways to "save money" with each cruise, others don't have that mentality for a variety of reasons. Myself, for example, I spend more money as I cruise more because I earn more money and have more disposable income. I think I'm bread and butter for carnival, and we leave on our 9th cruise tomorrow on the Pride!!!

[Cafedumonde]

It seems like it would be a lot harder to attract new cruisers to fill every ship than repeats. They are probably trying to attract both. Funny but we spent nothing when we first started cruising and spend more now as repeats.

[BoDidly]

So, in your opinion, is their strategy to constantly woo new cruisers primarily, with perhaps little interest in retaining those new cruisers for more than two or three cruises? In other words, do you think Carnival prefers a high turnover when it comes to customers?

That's it in a nutshell . They prefer it specifically as the newbie spends more cash. While the repeat customer is still income , but with less cash offered to the cruise line.

[BoDidly]

It seems like it would be a lot harder to attract new cruisers to fill every ship than repeats. They are probably trying to attract both. Funny but we spent nothing when we first started cruising and spend more now as repeats.

Cruise long enough and you may notice the color of the passengers sail and sign cards. Every now and then you may see a white or silver card ,just not as often as the other colors.

[ray98]

As with any company that sells a vacation experience...it is a balance.

 

You want to draw new guests and make the past guests want to return. Both are separate focus groups, both just as important to the overall strategy.

[okgirl]

What ever strategy they are using, they sail virtually full every time.

 

I think Carnival values all cruisers and each loyalty level brings different things. The newer cruiser is still learning and in most cases playing it safe with Carnival excursions, on board purchases etc.

 

But they also value the Diamond and Platinum guests because of the repeat revenue that we bring them. I don't care too much about any loyalty perks, because I love cruising and will continue to do so.

 

As a Diamond cruiser, I would think that I'm their bread and butter since I cruise 3 or 4 times a year, as compared to a Red or Gold member who has only cruised a hand full of times.

[Towel Critter]

So... some of you are saying repeat customers spend less on a cruise and others are saying the opposite. Obviously, some repeat customers do cruise with an open pocketbook, while others are looking to keep cost down. I'd love to see some statistics and find out which is more common. I doubt any of us are privy to that sort of statistic. I at least wouldn't know where to look for it.

 

Thanks for all input, opinions, and thoughts thus far. I'm sure we won't settle this with any certainty. It's just something I was thinking about, and it's interesting to discuss.

[Towel Critter]

What ever strategy they are using, they sail virtually full every time.

 

I think Carnival values all cruisers and each loyalty level brings different things. The newer cruiser is still learning and in most cases playing it safe with Carnival excursions, on board purchases etc.

 

But they also value the Diamond and Platinum guests because of the repeat revenue that we bring them. I don't care too much about any loyalty perks, because I love cruising and will continue to do so.

 

As a Diamond cruiser, I would think that I'm their bread and butter since I cruise 3 or 4 times a year, as compared to a Red or Gold member who has only cruised a hand full of times.

Yes, Carnival seems to be enjoying a peak time right now. Good for them. I'm not sure it's good for us though, except maybe stock holders.:)

[BlerkOne]

Carnival's bread and butter is mass market with emphasis on newer cruisers. It ALWAYS has been. That is still the largest pool to draw from. However, they won't turn down repeat business. They just aren't as dependent on it a some other lines.

 

I fail to see how that has anything to do with ports or ship size. On size, Royal still has the largest ships and NCL some whoppers, too. They also have private islands.

 

There are only so many ports available and the number of cruise ships continues to increase. Company owned ports capture more cruiser money for the cruise line than public ports. One cruise line that comes to mind tries to make the ship the destination, to capture even more of the cruiser money.

[mississauga]

I think that Carnival's bread and butter are the short 3 and 4 day cruises. They are catering to new cruisers who want to get a taste of cruising and since its a short cruise, do not mind a high bill for 3 or 4 days.

 

However, they also need us oldies to fill the ships. We do cruise more fequently and our bills are probably lower per cruise but overall we may be spending just as much per year on cruising. Maybe more. We cruise 5-7 times a year vs the newbies who may cruise only once or twice a year. We continue to cruise because we love cruising, not for the small perks we get. We appreciate them but the ones we enjoy really do not cost Carnival any money. Boarding early and being able to access our cabin upon boarding are our favorite perks.

 

As far as the itinerairies, there are only so many islands in the Caribbean. Some are more cooperative with the cruise lines/tourists and some are not as much so I think that goes into the choice of itineraries too.

[Towel Critter]

I fail to see how that has anything to do with ports or ship size. On size, Royal still has the largest ships and NCL some whoppers, too. They also have private islands.

 

My thinking on ship size (and I may be wrong) is that big ships with lots of bells and whistles appeals more to new cruiser than those with lots of cruises under their belts, and that huge ships are limited in the ports they can dock at, thusly Carnival is willing to turn off SOME of their loyal customers in an effort to gain new ones. Just a thought. I could be totally wrong, but that was my thinking.

[BNBR]

I don't think the bigger ship strategy has much, if anything, to do with "new cruisers vs return cruisers." It has to do with the fact that cruisers, in general, even regular/repeat cruisers, prefer the larger ships with more to do. And Carnival is quickly getting left behind and their strategy of smashing more people on the same tired small ship design isn't going to work. Making the same ships slightly bigger, making the venues smaller and then adding more and more guests sucks.

 

 

Also consider Carnivals price point. They fill their ships because they offer a lower price. For Carnival, that kind of sucks. Who actually talks much about Carnival's ships? So it becomes "Allure, or Escape, or whatever other big awesome ship is XX amount, is it worth spending XX more than just going on Carnival?" Most people I know, that's the discussion they have. Do we "settle for Carnival to save money" or spend more to go on the better ship? The itinerary generally seems secondary - and for good reason. How many visit a hotel, or Disney, or wherever - it doesn't move, it doesn't go to new places. As long as a ship goes somewhere, I think most don't care too much for the variety. I could visit the same ports over and over and often do, and while I may select something with new ports, all else being equal, it doesn't matter much to me as I enjoy all the ports.

 

I think Carnival would like to actually compete with the larger ships that draw guests willing to pay a higher base fare.

[Towel Critter]

I think that Carnival's bread and butter are the short 3 and 4 day cruises. They are catering to new cruisers who want to get a taste of cruising and since its a short cruise, do not mind a high bill for 3 or 4 days.

 

However, they also need us oldies to fill the ships. We do cruise more fequently and our bills are probably lower per cruise but overall we may be spending just as much per year on cruising. Maybe more. We cruise 5-7 times a year vs the newbies who may cruise only once or twice a year. We continue to cruise because we love cruising, not for the small perks we get. We appreciate them but the ones we enjoy really do not cost Carnival any money. Boarding early and being able to access our cabin upon boarding are our favorite perks.

 

As far as the itinerairies, there are only so many islands in the Caribbean. Some are more cooperative with the cruise lines/tourists and some are not as much so I think that goes into the choice of itineraries too.

I think I can agree with all you've said, except on limited ports in the Caribbean. There are LOTS of ports a smaller ship could visit. Unfortunately, mega ships are the trend, thus indeed limited ports of call. You certainly may be right about some ports having no interest in the cruise industry. I wouldn't know. But it seems many, if not most, Caribbean island nations would benefit greatly from the money they would gain.

[Towel Critter]

I don't think the bigger ship strategy has much, if anything, to do with "new cruisers vs return cruisers." It has to do with the fact that cruisers, in general, even regular/repeat cruisers, prefer the larger ships with more to do. And Carnival is quickly getting left behind and their strategy of smashing more people on the same tired small ship design isn't going to work. Making the same ships slightly bigger, making the venues smaller and then adding more and more guests sucks.

 

 

Also consider Carnivals price point. They fill their ships because they offer a lower price. For Carnival, that kind of sucks. Who actually talks much about Carnival's ships? So it becomes "Allure, or Escape, or whatever other big awesome ship is XX amount, is it worth spending XX more than just going on Carnival?" Most people I know, that's the discussion they have. Do we "settle for Carnival to save money" or spend more to go on the better ship? The itinerary generally seems secondary - and for good reason. How many visit a hotel, or Disney, or wherever - it doesn't move, it doesn't go to new places. As long as a ship goes somewhere, I think most don't care too much for the variety. I could visit the same ports over and over and often do, and while I may select something with new ports, all else being equal, it doesn't matter much to me as I enjoy all the ports.

 

I think Carnival would like to actually compete with the larger ships that draw guests willing to pay a higher base fare.

I'm right there with you on the strategy of building slightly larger ships, decreasing the size of public spaces, and drastically increasing the amount of passengers. I'm not sure that will be appealing to people on a long term basis. We'll find out I guess.

[meatloafsfan]

I think Carnivals bread and butter are "newish" cruisers. Those who think they will just cruise once but end up enjoying it so they book 1 cruise a year. People who are going to take one vacation a year probably will splurge on pictures, excursions, drinks, shopping, etc because it's their one chance to blow off steam.

 

I think a bunch of us who cruise frequently splurge less on board than those who have limited time on ships.

 

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[Cinders411]

I would agree with the "bread & butter" being new cruisers. I know when I looked for my first cruise I selected Carnival due to the lower price. I did not want to spend a lot in case I didn't enjoy cruising. As you can tell from my signature. I found that I enjoyed it very much! :D

[Towel Critter]

I would agree with the "bread & butter" being new cruisers. I know when I looked for my first cruise I selected Carnival due to the lower price. I did not want to spend a lot in case I didn't enjoy cruising. As you can tell from my signature. I found that I enjoyed it very much! :D

I've never thought about Carnival as a "gateway" cruise line, but now that you've mentioned it, I suppose for many it is. Good thing for Carnival that a significant portion of those first time cruisers stick around. Ironically, my first cruise was with RCCL and I wasn't sold on cruising after that first cruise. It was just okay, but my second cruise, on the Conquest, is the one that hooked me. I really enjoy the Conquest class ships, not too big and not too small. Part of that, I suppose, is that on my second cruise I knew more of what to expect and felt more comfortable. That first cruise, my new at the time wife, booked, her having cruised a few times before. I didn't do any research and was clueless as to what cruising was all about.

[supertop]

I am going on my first cruise in 3 weeks. We chose Carnival mostly due to price. If I cruise again, I will want to go to a different place or if I return to the same port, I will want to do something different. Excursions are important to me; I want something interesting but not too expensive. I don't go just to swim or relax on a beach. I can do that without the expense of a cruise.

[cruizergal70]

So, in your opinion, is their strategy to constantly woo new cruisers primarily, with perhaps little interest in retaining those new cruisers for more than two or three cruises? In other words, do you think Carnival prefers a high turnover when it comes to customers?

It's not about preference. It's about their target market. The more experienced cruisers will look at more than price point. Some people will get snooty after a few cruises and decide they have issues with certain passengers. Some believe paying more means a better cruise.

 

Core Carnival cruisers don't believe any of that.

 

FYI, loyalty programs on all cruise lines are just marketing gimmicks that convince people that they are somehow special if they are gold, platinum, etc.