Maasdam --- Too tired or not?

[chengkp75]

4 hours ago, Sea girl 23 said:

Still though..

 

The blame (with toilet issues) tends to fall to the person in that cabin.Never(potentially)someone else....or even the crew themselves. As much as some don’t want to hear that.

Further to my comments about toilets being a "shared" system, if the toilet clogs at your cabin (no other toilet has a problem), then, yes, the fault is someone in that cabin.  That is common sense, and a certainty, since the clogged pipe only leads to your cabin.  Did someone else get into your cabin and flush something down it?  If the clog is further down the line, we have a bit more trouble pinpointing the exact cabin that caused the problem, but will know that it came from one of the several cabins that the pipe connects to.  Again, simple logic.  And, over the years, we have become very adept at determining what the item is that caused the blockage, so that helps determine blame.  Remember the bikini from the previous post?  I had that washed, put in a baggie, and shown to the guests in the cabins affected, and while none claimed it, it did provide incentive to those passengers to give the "stink eye" to each other for the rest of the cruise, trying to shame each other into not repeating the act.

 

As for crew causing toilet problems, while they do happen, we have a simple solution to that, we fire them.  They are told on their very first day on the ship, that if we can prove they flushed something down the toilet that caused a clog, they will be fired.  Have done it many times.  Unfortunately, we can't fire the passengers.  And, the crew live on the ship far longer than you passengers do, and toilet blockages from passengers can affect their toilets as well, so there is no benefit to them to cause problems with the system.

[chengkp75]

6 minutes ago, kazu said:

 

Well said.  On one cruise I was on there was a problem with the line and I happened to be walking by when the workers had the area open to clear out the line.  I could not believe what I was seeing - things you would never put down a toilet at home including a slew of bottle caps!

 

It was definitely a user problem. 😉 

I have taken swimwear, underwear, hand towels, face cloths, dinner napkins, crack pipes, coke spoons, food bones, and even 9mm ammunition out of the toilet systems.  The vast numbers of tampon applicators that get into the system is so large we don't even comment on them anymore.

 

Are there problems with toilets not related to clogs caused by careless operation?  Sure, but there are only 3 moving parts in a vacuum toilet, all of which exhibit unique symptoms when they fail, and all of which can be changed out in a 20 minute maintenance call.  Your toilet at home is the same, it has a flush valve and a fill valve, and these fail all the time, or they wouldn't have a whole wall of them at the home improvement store.

Edited October 29, 2018 by chengkp75

[dogo88]

On 10/28/2018 at 2:55 AM, Sea girl 23 said:

How to say this without getting banned.. well,imma say it anyways:

 

There is a HUGE amount of cognitive dissonance going on on these boards.Or willful “I don’t want to hear anything bad about HAL..ever.”

 

This is why I choose to cruise on the “newer”(I know the Westerdam isn’t that new but she was the last ship I was on) ships. I’d prefer not to have to deal with “ship happening”. Not that I can’t be flexible(I can) but toilets not working(*especially* toilets not working) is a deal breaker for me.

 

I’ve never really noticed shabbiness on any of the ships I’ve been on but as I said earlier,I primarily am on newer ships.

 

The takeaway here:Don’t discount people’s experiences and say  “ship happens”. That’s ridiculous.Doesn’t matter how long the cruise is.It’s unacceptable.

 

Every time the topic of “Is a ship too worn out” comes up there’s always a few people who say that say they wouldn’t cruise on those ships because of issues that they’ve had on them.I think that’s a fair comment.

 

Do your due diligence and do a LOT of research before you book a cruise(that goes without saying..) Caveat Emptor,y’all.

 

And disregard the overly glowing “(insert name of ship here” is wonderful,and I’ve never had a bad experience on her” reviews and posts on Cruise Critic.The posts that tell the truth(as much as some here don’t want it to be)are just as valid. 

 

OK,this was way rambly but I had to say it.

 

 

Not to keep the pain ongoing, but don't disagree with what you've said here and further down this thread. But you made a cardinal sin. You criticized HAL and came back for more. The small cadre of long time regulars on HAL never forget. 

 

We've sailed on HAL for most of our prior cruises but that is slowly changing as we expand out to  other newer ships. HAL has a lot we like, but as has been pointed out, here and on other threads, the older ships tend to have more issues. We have sailed on the Maasdam a couple of times. Once in her early years and a couple of years ago. On that trip we had issues that I have posted about previously with toilets and air. Both being critical items on a cruise. We also cruised on the Zaandam last May and had no major issues. And that may be the crux of the argument. 

 

For those that experience a problem on a cruise their opinion of the ship drops. For those that never had a problem they tend, many times,  to not give full credit to the poster who experienced it, since their experience was totally different. I have read many threads here on CC where someone posts about an issue and many pop up and say the poster is exaggerating. And there are those that unless the ship sunk would treat every cruise as wonderful. Bless them. 

 

So after experiencing issues on the Maasdam our position is that unless the itinerary is awesome we will not sail on her. Yet because of no issues on the Zaandam we'd sail on her in a heartbeat. It may not make a lot of sense to others, but since we've spent our money on a product, and it wasn't up to what we expected, we'll try somewhere else. 

 

    

[DocJohnB]

1 hour ago, dogo88 said:

Not to keep the pain ongoing, but don't disagree with what you've said here and further down this thread. But you made a cardinal sin. You criticized HAL and came back for more. The small cadre of long time regulars on HAL never forget. 

 

While you may have a point regarding "criticizing" HAL, I and many others on this board and other boards would disagree.  While it may be acceptable to "criticize" a product or even a person's thoughts, it is not acceptable to attack that person or product WITHOUT expecting disagreement, especially from folks who know more about the subject.

 

The OP immediately attacks the group as a whole with her "creative dissonance" verbiage.  Then she follows it up with unfounded, unverified facts of her own choosing.  Finally, she ends up attacking the veracity/knowledge of posters with personal knowledge of problems she is only guessing at.

 

So, yes indeed, she did make a cardinal sin of posting - but it is not the sin to which you allude.

 

And, BTW, I am not a long time regular of the HAL boards, but have been around the C/C boards for a while.

 

Edited October 29, 2018 by DocJohnB

[dogo88]

15 minutes ago, DocJohnB said:

 

While you may have a point regarding "criticizing" HAL, I and many others on this board and other boards would disagree.  While it may be acceptable to "criticize" a product or even a person's thoughts, it is not acceptable to attack that person or product WITHOUT expecting disagreement, especially from folks who know more about the subject.

 

The OP immediately attacks the group as a whole with her "creative dissonance" verbiage.  Then she follows it up with unfounded, unverified facts of her own choosing.  Finally, she ends up attacking the veracity/knowledge of posters with personal knowledge of problems she is only guessing at.

 

So, yes indeed, she did make a cardinal sin of posting - but it is not the sin to which you allude.

 

And, BTW, I am not a long time regular of the HAL boards, but have been around the C/C boards for a while.

 

 

Don't disagree with what you posted. But over the years if anyone posts negative on the boards they get static for fans of the line. Happens on all  the boards. And sometimes a negative review or statement is the posters perspective. Arguing with them with snarky posts won't change their mind, for them it's a valid belief. Fortunately many do respond with comments like: " Sorry you had a bad cruise".  HAL defenders just seem to be a bit more passionate in their defense. 

[rafinmd]

On 10/27/2018 at 11:34 PM, Copper10-8 said:

<SNIP>

 

To top that off, both ships' last HAL captains as well as their most recent HAL staff captains were seconded to P&O to remain in their positions with the future Pacific Aria and Pacific Eden for the following two years. HAL technical staff also spent time on P&O Oz two new ships during this two-year time period to assist their, mostly Italian, counterparts. P&O Australia knew, or shoulda known, what they were getting in those two ships.

 

<SNIP>

Have those Captains and Staff Captains now returned to HAL?

Roy

[rafinmd]

49 minutes ago, DocJohnB said:

 

While you may have a point regarding "criticizing" HAL, I and many others on this board and other boards would disagree.  While it may be acceptable to "criticize" a product or even a person's thoughts, it is not acceptable to attack that person or product WITHOUT expecting disagreement, especially from folks who know more about the subject.

 

The OP immediately attacks the group as a whole with her "creative dissonance" verbiage.  Then she follows it up with unfounded, unverified facts of her own choosing.  Finally, she ends up attacking the veracity/knowledge of posters with personal knowledge of problems she is only guessing at.

 

So, yes indeed, she did make a cardinal sin of posting - but it is not the sin to which you allude.

 

And, BTW, I am not a long time regular of the HAL boards, but have been around the C/C boards for a while.

 

I feel compelled to take you to task on one thing.  In my opinion the OP asked a reasonable question and reacted intelligently to intelligent comments.  The people attacking the group as a whole tend to be fairly frequent posters on this forum with pretty predictable comments.

 

HAL seems to have a special problem.  There are a number of people here who will take any bit of negative information about a HAL ship as gospel and will cite any flaw with a HAL ship forever regardless of what caused it or how quickly it was corrected.  My first HAL cruise was on the SS Rotterdam in 1997 as the current Rotterdam was being built so the S-class ships are somewhat over 20 years old.  For these people to be happy these ships would need to have NEVER had a mechanical issue or a toilet failure in 20 YEARS.  Not going to happen.

Roy

[iancal]

We avoid older most older ships  that have been in service for 20 plus years-especially when cruising in very warm climates.  It is no secret that   HVAC  deteriorate over time.  The same with plumbing, toilet or otherwise.  This is not a HAL issue for us.  We feel the same way about all of the mass market lines.  We have noticed  cutbacks on all lines.  

 

The very last thing that we want is to end up on a warm weather cruise in a cabin with no/poor A/C, toilet or water problems, or in cabin HVAC filters that have not been changed since the year dot because of the cutbacks.

Not saying there will always be issues but we prefer to lessen the odds.

 

We also avoid any ship that we know the cruise line has been trying unsuccessfully to dump for several years.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited October 29, 2018 by iancal
Spelling

[bcummin]

1 hour ago, DocJohnB said:

The OP immediately attacks the group as a whole with her "creative dissonance" verbiage.  Then she follows it up with unfounded, unverified facts of her own choosing.  Finally, she ends up attacking the veracity/knowledge of posters with personal knowledge of problems she is only guessing at.  .  .  And, BTW, I am not a long time regular of the HAL boards, but have been around the C/C boards for a while.

 

 

The attacks did not come from the OP, who asked an innocent question.

The rest of your thoughts are valuable, so please keep posting.

Barbara

[Sea girl 23]

Iancal you were who I was referring to when I was talking about the people who won’t go on the older ships.

 

Not just warm weather cruises,let’s be honest..ANY cruise!😂

[iancal]

Yes, we do avoid older ships on all cruises.  We will not cruise on a ship that's is, or has been up for sale for an extended period.  Really, would you make expensive capital investments  in renewing past their prime plumbing, HVAC, and other systems that require extended amounts of dry dock time if you planned to unload the old darling?

 

[Copper10-8]

1 hour ago, rafinmd said:

Have those Captains and Staff Captains now returned to HAL?

Roy

 

Morning Roy; Yes, all four have. The Captains were Chris Norman and Colm Ryan

[puli]

10 hours ago, Sea girl 23 said:

Still though..

 

The blame (with toilet issues) tends to fall to the person in that cabin.Never(potentially)someone else....or even the crew themselves. As much as some don’t want to hear that.

Sounds like you were blamed for one of those  incidents...so  I can understand better your view point. That must have been very upsetting.

[DocJohnB]

1 hour ago, rafinmd said:

I feel compelled to take you to task on one thing.  In my opinion the OP asked a reasonable question and reacted intelligently to intelligent comments.

 

You are absolutely correct, rafinmd and bcummin  I negligently misidentified who, IMO, was attacking people's responses.  It certainly WAS NOT the OP (her question was indeed quite reasonable), but Sea Girl 23.  I apologize to all but especially to the OP.

Edited October 29, 2018 by DocJohnB

[rubinstein2r]

I am the original poster.  As I said I am grateful for the information given shortly after my posting but feel that this topic has devolved into flames.  Please stop.  

[Sea girl 23]

There are strong feelings about ships(for and against).They need to be tempered a bit(especially when it comes to defending “my” ship as some do here.)